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mabarnyorga
July 15th, 2005, 10:37 AM
Im actually writing this on behalf of a support group I belong too, birthrites. We have national caesarean wareness day coming up in september and we are looking for ideas of what to do to commerate and also facilitate some healing.

The women in the group underwent c sections, emergency and some were coerced into electives. Many of the women have suffered since with post traumatic stress, depression and isolation. Many feel ripped off having their dreams of a natural birth taken from them.

Does anyone have any ideas on a group healing idea for the day?

Many are hoping to have a natural birth next time round.

any ideas greatly appreciated

blessings

BlueMoon13
July 15th, 2005, 12:52 PM
Not trying to be rude or minimize anyone's feeling that they "missed out on the birth experience", but why don't you try focusing on the fact that you have live healthy children that may not be here if not for the c-section. In 13 years in maternity/neonatology I never once saw a "co-erced" section, however I did see one baby die and many babies nearly die and now continue to suffer brain damage from their mothers' refusal to have one. In my own family, my now 21 year old niece has never forgotten when she was 12 and her mother (my sister in law) announced to all present that "she could never love Jeannie as much as she loves Stacey and Wesley because they "took" her from me" :hairraise . Jeannie nearly died after her mother was is labour for 38 hours with no progress and her heart rate declined and my brother had to beg my sister in law to have the section rather than let their baby die in utero. So please consider the possible emotional and psycological damage you may be doing to your children by mourning that the did'nt get here "naturally".

DragonsChest
July 15th, 2005, 02:48 PM
My two kiddos were c-sections. I love them more than my life. I'm sorry that some women feel they "missed out" on childbirth. I have healthy children, and I'm a mother, no matter how they came to be. No regrets and no problems with having had c-sections here.

Nighthawk
July 15th, 2005, 02:51 PM
Gryphongirl had her two this way also.

SSanf
July 15th, 2005, 03:00 PM
Good grief! I had one vaginal delivery and one c-section. I will take a c-section over a vaginal delivery ANY day of the week!

At least, with a c-section, you can sit on your fanny the next day without that stupid donut!

Take it from one who has been there and done that both ways. Natural childbirth ain't all that glamorous! In fact, I think one might accurately say it's a real pain in the butt. Definitely one of my least favorite ways to spend my time.

And, gee, I kind of think the fact that I felt so much healthier and spunkier after the c-section than I did after the vaginal delivery made it a whole lot easier to bond with and care for my baby.

DragonsChest
July 15th, 2005, 03:15 PM
Don't mean to make it sound like I'm dissing your idea of having a healing for those who feel they need one. If they feel that they were stressed by their experience, then I certainly hope they find the support and help they need to get better.

SSanf
July 15th, 2005, 03:32 PM
OK, I guess, I am the insensitive one.

It never ceases to amaze me the things people will choose for self pity. They could have been forced by society and nature to go through a pretty unpleasant natural childbirth that might have endangered both them and their child. Instead, they got off easy and had a nice clean c-section and got a nice healthy baby.

And, for that they are all full of self pity!!

They should be greatful and fall on their knees and bless the deities night and day for living in a time and place where such help is available.

Dang! What is the matter with people! Someone ought to give them a good shake.

Maybe, it is just post-partum depression.

MerryBe
July 15th, 2005, 10:26 PM
Good grief! I had one vaginal delivery and one c-section. I will take a c-section over a vaginal delivery ANY day of the week!

At least, with a c-section, you can sit on your fanny the next day without that stupid donut!

Take it from one who has been there and done that both ways. Natural childbirth ain't all that glamorous! In fact, I think one might accurately say it's a real pain in the butt. Definitely one of my least favorite ways to spend my time.

And, gee, I kind of think the fact that I felt so much healthier and spunkier after the c-section than I did after the vaginal delivery made it a whole lot easier to bond with and care for my baby.


I can see where some Mother's might feel robbed of the event, BUT, not every birth is the same, and not all are without complications.

My first was a Natural birth, My Baby was born blue, and had no heartbeat!
They did save her life, which is the most important thing. Mind you, the doctor had no idea she was in such trouble at the time.

It was anything but a good experience when she was dragged out by forceps. Poor baby was bruised for weeks!

My second and third, were both C-Sections. They arrived in this world without a scratch on them.

I would bare the pain of a C-Section any day to prevent any one of my children to go through a birth like that again.

I do find it odd, that some people can think they cannot love their child as much as another that was born naturally. They ALL grew in the same womb! I love all my children, would fight for them and die for them.

I do hope that those who feel cheated get the help that they need, who knows, it might be a case of post partum depression. Whatever the case, I hope they make peace with themselves and revel in the fact that they had healthy babies.


Couldn't pass this one up,
Brightest Blessings,
MerryBe

BlueMoon13
July 15th, 2005, 11:41 PM
Don't mean to make it sound like I'm dissing your idea of having a healing for those who feel they need one. If they feel that they were stressed by their experience, then I certainly hope they find the support and help they need to get better.
_handclapp

GryphonGirl
July 15th, 2005, 11:49 PM
Gryphongirl had her two this way also.


Yup, I did . My first in 1979 and my second in 1980. The first was an "emergency", my then husband and I were without health insurance although he was employed. I went through a public health organization and never saw the same doctor twice during the pregnancy. I was 19 and pretty uneducated about my situation....neither I nor any of the health care professionals involved (not) in my case were aware that I was dangerously overweight ( I gained nearly 60 pounds) and I had developed a condition called Pre-eclampsia. Some folks know that this and Toxemia are the result of a pregnant woman's body basically reacting adversely to the pregnancy hormones and rejecting the fetus. Unattended, a woman may suffer severe bloating, dizziness, irregular heartbeat and more - including seizures and possibly loss of life. Anyway, I was a week overdue and had been told that if I did not begin labor in another 3 days, I would be admitted to a hospital and doctors there would induce labor. That night my water broke and I endured nearly 22 hours of an impossibly non productive labor. Doctors had also missed the fact that my size precluded any possibility of a vaginal delivery.
I do not need to say any more here because the point would be missed. C-sections were intended to save lives. Unfortunately there are stories about planned C-sections whose medical necessity might be questionable. I will say for myself that that which saves a life is to be cherished. I cannot regret that my son came into the world in a manner that nature did not originally design.

ravenmyst
July 16th, 2005, 09:56 AM
I am sorry some are tramatized by this procedure, it baffles me some, but I realize my experiences arent everyones. I too, was 10 days late, they induced monday morning, by tuesday afternoon, my daughters heart stopped, and I was stuck in contraction for 1/2 hr, that c-section saved both our lives. My second, I wasnt even concerned with trying, I had had enough. I do not feel less of a woman or mother for having missed the natural birthing method, and if I loved my kids anymore, I couldnt bear it. To hear that a woman would say something like that to their child, is sickening

Brighid's Seeker
July 16th, 2005, 01:07 PM
I can see both sides of this coin. When I was pregnant with my son, I avoided even taking the C-section "class". I was going to have a natural vaginal delivery. Thirty six hours later.....with me pushing like mad my son was firmly wedged in my pelvis (His head was too big, and I have an issue with my pelvis that we hadn't considered). His heartrate was dropping, and if they hadn't done a C-section I wouldn't have him. I was so depressed afterwards. All that work! All that "going to my happy place" during labor to avoid drugs. I felt so defeated, but when they explained that he would have died, I was happy to have had it.

With my daughter, I told the doctor from the get go. I want a C-section. I do NOT want to be in pain. I just want it over and done with. As it was my labor with my daughter was so painless, that I didn't even realize I had gone through transition or was even IN labor. I tried to have her vaginally, but she wouldn't come. I was exhausted from pushing, she was no where near where she was supposed to be, and so, off we went to the operating room. It was fine.

When my friends found out they were pregnant, it became obvious right away that this was a high risk pregnancy. Many of us offered healing touches, praryers, rituals, candle ceremonies, and such to get this little one here. I was present during labor, giving foot rubs, smoothing lotion over irritated skin, keeping dad together....the nurses buzzed around the room, when they left I stepped outside myself to get a breath of air, only to over hear, 'WHy are we wasting our time setting up for a vaginal delivery, you know Dr. ___________ only does high risk pregnancies, and she always does a C-section. She never does Vaginal deliveries." The other nurse said, "We do the set up to keep the mom calm."

Brighid's Seeker
July 16th, 2005, 01:08 PM
Oh, and sometime in the future when we are in our own place, and money is stable again....Mr. RowanRavyn and I are going to try for one more...and I am going to try for a VBAC

mabarnyorga
July 16th, 2005, 09:42 PM
Wow, thanks for sharing everyone. Although it wasnt meant to turn into some political debate, I can all to well understand the emotions that revolve around childbirth.

Let me just state here and now that Birthrites is not anti- csection, Im not sure where that assumption came from, and apologies if my original post was not written well enough for that to come across. Birthrites provide information about informed birth choices, csections, natural birth and all in between for those that are about to have a baby. They also provide information relating to exercises etc to do AFTER a csection to ensure that a mother returns to optimal health as soon as possible.

Birthrites is about EBACS, meaning empowered births after a csection, whether that be another csection or not.

While many are happy with their experiences with csections, many are not, and I fail to understand the sentiment of "just be happy with your healthy child" thus implying that a mother who is unhappy with her birth experience somehow loves her child less. This is most often not the case, the ill feelings come from the birth experience and involves that experience and the mother - and has very little to do with feelings about the baby as such. They are seperate. Its to do with a womans experience as a woman about to bring her child into the world.

Every womans experience of birth is different, and no two birth experiences are ever the same. Im happy that many of you have had great birth experiences, but let us not be insensitive to those who have not. Traumatic birth can happen naturally or by csection - never judge a person until you have walked a mile in their shoe - is that not how the saying goes.

Please feel free to visit the birthrites page and read more.

Not all hospitals have csection classes I might add, a csection is something that happens only in an emergency in some places and the woman does not understand the procedure or what she will experience afterwards.

Back to my original posts, am looking for ideas for expecting mothers and for those healing from a csection - physically and emotionally. Any ideas? We have just done a blessing way for an expectant mother.

Thanks everyone again for sharing, wishing you all happiness and for those that have indicated to me, a wonderful natural childbirth experience in the future.

bulya

MerryBe
July 17th, 2005, 02:35 AM
Wow, thanks for sharing everyone. Although it wasnt meant to turn into some political debate, I can all to well understand the emotions that revolve around childbirth.

Let me just state here and now that Birthrites is not anti- csection, Im not sure where that assumption came from, and apologies if my original post was not written well enough for that to come across. Birthrites provide information about informed birth choices, csections, natural birth and all in between for those that are about to have a baby. They also provide information relating to exercises etc to do AFTER a csection to ensure that a mother returns to optimal health as soon as possible.

Birthrites is about EBACS, meaning empowered births after a csection, whether that be another csection or not.

While many are happy with their experiences with csections, many are not, and I fail to understand the sentiment of "just be happy with your healthy child" thus implying that a mother who is unhappy with her birth experience somehow loves her child less. This is most often not the case, the ill feelings come from the birth experience and involves that experience and the mother - and has very little to do with feelings about the baby as such. They are seperate. Its to do with a womans experience as a woman about to bring her child into the world.

Every womans experience of birth is different, and no two birth experiences are ever the same. Im happy that many of you have had great birth experiences, but let us not be insensitive to those who have not. Traumatic birth can happen naturally or by csection - never judge a person until you have walked a mile in their shoe - is that not how the saying goes.

Please feel free to visit the birthrites page and read more.

Not all hospitals have csection classes I might add, a csection is something that happens only in an emergency in some places and the woman does not understand the procedure or what she will experience afterwards.

Back to my original posts, am looking for ideas for expecting mothers and for those healing from a csection - physically and emotionally. Any ideas? We have just done a blessing way for an expectant mother.

Thanks everyone again for sharing, wishing you all happiness and for those that have indicated to me, a wonderful natural childbirth experience in the future.

bulya


Pardon me, but, now I'm confused?


Blessings,
MerryBe

DragonMom
July 19th, 2005, 01:00 AM
I am sorry some are tramatized by this procedure, it baffles me some, but I realize my experiences arent everyones. I too, was 10 days late, they induced monday morning, by tuesday afternoon, my daughters heart stopped, and I was stuck in contraction for 1/2 hr, that c-section saved both our lives.

Due to work circumstances, I never was able to take pregnancy classes, so I wasn't looking forward to the birth. But I had a similar (but less traumatic) situation... When I was about five months along, I started having terrible sciatica down my left leg. It got so bad that I was walking only with a cane, and having to lie flat with a pillow under my legs - lying on either side increased the nerve pain. :nuhuh: Bad DM, I know. My doc gave me Tylenol #3 - it didn't kill the pain but dulled it enough to sleep. When I got to 8 mos, he told me that lying on my back had driven my blood pressure to a dangerous point, so if I didn't start contractions ON my due date, I'd have to go into the hospital to be induced. So there I was, forced to lie on my side - which only made the pain worse - for TWO SOLID DAYS of nothing. I kid you not - not even one centimeter. My ob finally told me, "It's starting to look like we may have to do a c-section... or do you want to wait & try one more day?" My reaction? "GET HER OUT OF ME NOW!!!!" :)

Getting back to the debate, don't kill me for this... but I truly do not understand why anyone would WANT the pain of childbirth - but then I'm a wimp. ;) Why does it matter HOW your child was born? S/he is still your child, right? Grown in your womb, right? I once knew a woman who was preggers with twins... she was 5'2" and barely 100 pounds before she was preggers, and she told me the boys were about 5 lbs EACH. Towards the end of her pregnancy, she was feeling fingers at her sides. I don't remember right now, but I believe she had a planned c-section - it was the only way both babies and mom were going to survive. If there's a health problem, why should the method be an issue???

Sorry if I got all soapbox-y... like I said, I never understood why this is a debate! lol

SilverClaw
August 9th, 2005, 02:42 AM
Well i know I felt let down that I could not have my kids natuarlly, and it is something I battle with, but on the same side my 3 c-sectons brought me my biggest 3 blessings and if it was not for having them my first and third one would have been born dead.

1- 3 weeks late - 31 hours in labour, then ti ws decided a c-section took another two hours ot have it, I caught a nasty virus in the operating room.

2- Handled the pain and such for 11 hours this time and thought I was not goin to wear my self out like the first one, and decided itw as for the best to have another c-section since I did not dialte any further then my first pregnancy.

The guy who did the epidural made a msitake and put the neelde int he wrong spot and while I had a contraction that was not plesant and as a reuslt I am still ahving problems now with pain in that spot.

3- Becuase of my two previosu pregnacies being c-sectosn i had no choice to have the thrid one. So it was planned a week ahed of the due date to rpevent any contractions from happening, and lesen the chance of any problems on my existing two scars.

And by techncial terms my son was born still full term, but for whatever reasons his lungs were still not fully developed. And an hour after he was born he went down hill fast and I almost lost him... his lungs were filling up with fluid and he was slowly drowing as it was put to me.

So with that I think if it was not for having him a week earlier what would have happend and did not have the c-section?

Even though I do not like the look of my scar and get down on my appearance cause of having a hard time loosing post pregnancy weight. And the fact I wanted so bad to have a natrual birth at least once, I just try to focus on the fact that I have 3 beautiful children and leave it at that.


On a side note if I could have had my kids naturally I would have more likely not caught the virus with my first c-section and lost my daughter to Foster care. But what is now in the past is in the past.

Oh and in my first prenatl class I went to it had information for both natural and c-section births so that the parents were preapred for either event.