Guilt

[Niamh]

I was thinking about guilt this morning, and was wondering how other people around here deal with it!
I was raised in an Irish Catholic family where guilt runs high. You're supposed to feel guilty for everything, it seems!
This guilt thing, while feelings have decreased for me over the years ( I know longer feel guilty for finishing the last of the milk) I still have trouble coming up with good, constructive ways to deal with it.
Does anyone have thoughts on the subject? Suggestions? Similar feelings?

[Carmelo]

That's a good question...

I, myself, was raised in a Roman Catholic family that taught guilt as a way of happiness. I would constantly be bombarded by guilt from family members as a way to control me. "You should feel guilty that your cousin was a drug-abuser who nearly lost his life because of it...and you're not!" "You shouldn't be happy that your family member barely made it out of eighth grade" "You should feel guilty that you look like your father...I never liked the bastard"! :uzi: :shot:

Those are just a few of the examples of what I was exposed to...though they may not be as harsh as anyone else's.

Remember that, sometimes, guilt is a way to control the individual it is being bestowed upon.

How have I dealt with it? Let's just say that it's okay to laugh at the stupidity of someone else, but that's it. That was what I learned in the Corps. If someone made themselves bleed because they were swinging their bayonet around like a toy...it was their own dumba** fault. Just remember to let that person know(though they may already have an idea) that you laughed at the sheer stupidity and not them. After all, you wouldn't want to cure your immense guilt by making someone else feel guilty.

Do remember this, though...guilt can be your friend. It does have a way of pointing out your stupid human tricks so that you will venture away from doing it again.

In short, we need guilt...as much as we don't need it! The only way to feel alive is to feel both sides of life!

[rantnraven]

The initial ex. used was about finishing the milk. Was that WRONG? NO! Thus, no guilt!!

Did you pour that milk on your brothers head? If yes, then guilt may apply.

If you just dumped it down a drain while there are hungry paople in this world then, YES, guilt applies.

If you are Wiccan, just remember the Reede.

If you are not, then maybe you could apply it:

An it harm none, do as thou wilt!

If there is no harm, then there should be no guilt.

RnR

[Niamh]

Yes, I understand the logic... sometimes I get upset at things I feel guilty about. But I suppose it's just going to take some time to "de-bug" as it were!

[rantnraven]

Originally posted by Niamh
Yes, I understand the logic... sometimes I get upset at things I feel guilty about. But I suppose it's just going to take some time to "de-bug" as it were!

Debug, you mean, As it IS. Correct?

As a recovering Baptist I too understand guilt. I believe it to be the foundation of institutionalized religion, Here, however, you can let your hair down. There are no rules, save one - Harm none, and that means anything and everyone; including yourself.

Trust yourself to your God/dess and you will prevail.

Light a candle tonight. Red, I think, if you have one; though pink would work. I will burn one as well and think of peace and happiness. Together, we might be able to quil this guilt thing.

Anyone that wishes to join is welcome, I'm sure.

RnR

[Kalima]

Debug, you mean, As it IS. Correct?

As a recovering Baptist I too understand guilt. I believe it to be the foundation of institutionalized religion, Here, however, you can let your hair down. There are no rules, save one - Harm none, and that means anything and everyone; including yourself.
RnR

Hmm ... as a recovering Catholic myself, I think perhaps you have underestimated the length to which 'guilt' becomes engrained in the psyche through the rituals and practices of that particular faith, raven...

Harm none? There is no such thing - I cannot live without harming another, IMO. Because I count the things I eat as doing harm to them, the little tiny organisms I kill each time I move, are harmed, aren't they? And if I become involved with a person, and have some sort of disagreement (as does happen, no matter how hard you try) - there is emotional harm there.
And although I see he harm none rule as a guideline more than an absolute, there is still guilt there.

The way that I deal with it, however, is to consider balance ... in Nature, there is always the balance between life and death, doing harm and leaving be. So I strive for that balance, as a way to overcome my guilt, niamh. :)

[rantnraven]

Perhaps my wording was off and thank you for pointing out balance. Yes, we cause harm in daily life but we do not wish for it. We can only do what we can and believe in that.

I think what I was trying to point out is that "intentional" harm is what we should avoid. Guilt is something we live with - as part of that balance - but, we all need to learn to get passed it.

Guess I haven't been much help here.

Blessings,
RnR

[Dextra]

Heh. I got it from both ends. Y'see, I was raised Irish Catholic (Dad's side) and Southern Baptist (Mom's side). I don't have that much of a problem with feeling guilty over little things anymore. However, the times I have done some really bad stuff, I'm confessing like you wouldn't believe. I am the world's worst liar, which is a good thing, don't get me wrong.

However, I don't feel guilty for some of the views I have on life (and I'm often told I should). I don't feel guilty for opening my big mouth and saying what I want, even though my mother is constantly begging Carmelo to "make me stop." She means it jokingly. She, nor anyone else has ever been able to get me to shut up! :D

I guess guilt is something you grow out of eventually. I never really thought about it until now. The way I look at it, if I'm not doing anything to hurt anyone, then I have nothing to feel guilty about.

Now, if you want to get on the subject of worry, well then I'm full of that. I often tell people that the day I run out of things to worry about is the day I'm gonna keel over and die!:p

[Carmelo]

Guilt. Let's look at that a moment.

Okay, stop looking. Now think.

Those who teach guilt are the ones who (and I have to quote a movie here) 'mourn their religion'. So, what better way to spread the message of love, peace, and joy than to use guilt. At least, that's what I used to think when I strictly followed Christian views.

As I said before, guilt can be useful. It let's you know you have a conscience about what you might feel guilty about. That is...if you SHOULD feel guilty at all.

Don't beat yourself about the head and neck trying to figure guilt out, but, rather, ponder what made you feel guilty and then try to prevent yourself ever feeling guilty about it again.

[bluecat]

My mother, whom I still love, is one of those GUILT QUEENS we all know them and have a few in the family. In some families it almost seems like a requirement to have at least one. Perhaps that is why I am so hard on myself sometimes, but I do not feel the "guilt" part (that really came in handy with some of the things I did for Uncle Sam ... they like guys like me).

I'm not saying that I don't feel remorse, that's different. If I wrongfully hurt someone, either physically or mentally, and it did not intend to then I do try to set things straight. But that is not the same as guilt, and I do not do it because I feel guilty, but because it would be the right thing to do.

Would I feel "GUILTY" if i intentionally set to harm someone? If my personal history is an indicator of behavior, then I probably would not. I know this may sound harsh and cruel, but I would rather have a sense of remorse than a sense of guilt. For me remorse can be applied in a corrective manner while guilt is just a wasted emotion.

This is all just my interpretation and application; it may be just a manner of splitting hairs and semnatics, but believe me (there are those in this community who can relate to this) it has gone very far in helping me keep my head about me on many occassions. Also, I am by no means an "Angel", or can I be called guilt free by societal norms, but that is a different moral or legal standard of guilt. I just do not feel the "internal" guilt that others may or would have me feel.

BlueCat

[Niamh]

I understand the way you explain the differences between guilt and remorse. I think some of us tend to get the two confused most of the time, myself included.
While guilt can be useful in reminding us of our conscience, etc. it can sometimes feel like a wasted emotion. We all deal with it in different ways...

[Carmelo]

Originally posted by bluecat
but I do not feel the "guilt" part (that really came in handy with some of the things I did for Uncle Sam ... they like guys like me).




BlueCat

Hear, hear on that, brother. I lost that part of me after going over seas on those galvanized ghettoes and seeing the horrors that I never really imagined. I didn't, and still do not, feel guilty for some of the things neccessarily done...but I do have a little remorse.

That was a great differentiating explanation on remorse. *scratches his head walking away* why didn't I think of that?

[Ozymandias]

Guilt is tricky stuff. It has often dragged good men down and been used to amass followers for those that leach off others. Mostly I don't think anything I've ever done is wrong. But we all have our sins. And guilt is my constant companion.