Holy Spirit? What are your views?

[Ninjakitten]

I know there are different views among us Christo-Pagany types on who or what the Holy Spirit is. I honestly keep wondering who it is myself. Is it the Goddess aspect of the Divine, like the Sophia and/or Shekinah? Is it the presence of the Divine guiding you? Is it the aspect of you that gives you a direct connection to the Divine, thus making you an aspect of the Divine? What are your views? Right now, I'm kind of thinking of it as the feminine Divine that speaks to and through us, and was basically the Sophia downplayed by the Church to just be some impersonal presence of God, and only masculine as part of the Holy Trinity, but that Godde could be seen as triune, but in both it's male and female aspects, and that the Holy Spirit takes a place in the triunes of both aspects... or something like that. Like I said, I'm still trying to figure it out....

[LacyRoze]

I'm still figuring this out for myself so please bear with me...

To me the Holy Spirit is both the feminine aspect of the divine but also the presence of the divine guiding me. I call on the Holy Spirit when I need guidance and clarity. Often when I just need to feel comfort it is the Holy Spirit I feel, like a mother holding a child.

[Cyzarine]

Just popping in during my silence to check on classes. Anyways, Holy Spirit to me, is female in nature...but then again it is a spirit and most spirits of the nature are genderless but take on either feminine or masculine traits. One thing I do believe is that the Holy Spirit was the spouse to the Virgin.

[Christo Pagan]

I view Deity as being dyadic, consisting of the Heavenly Father and Mother (in my case, Sophia or the Holy Spirit). I definitely view the Holy Spirit as the feminine half of the divine source, imparting wisdom and grace.

I believe it's through the symbolic marriage of Christ, as Knowledge (the Bridegroom), and Sophia (the Bride), as wisdom, that one find gnosis and fully realizes their divine potential.

[fatimah2001]

i like him! hies a nice spirit although i dont think hes really been inside of me

[MariThorn]

the Holy Spirit to me is part of Godde . . . not female or male . . . more later

[Silver Ivy]

the Holy Spirit to me is part of Godde . . . not female or male . . . more later

I agree with this, I don't associate the Holy Spirit as being either male or female ... rather as one of the expressions of grace from God ...
Hope that makes sense .... :)
I will be interested to hear your views MariThorn

[MariThorn]

Sorry about the short answer, I had to run out of the house and couldn't expound. :) The Holy Spirit is intricately linked with Godde, and in fact is one of Godde's facets. It is the comforting and empowering part of Godde. It is not a seperate entity and I don't see it as having a gender. I do see it as a manifest spirit, but it doesn't think or do things on it's own.

I know that some see the Holy Spirit as Sofia or Wisdom, however to me this is selling Godde itself short. When Wisdom is spoken of in the Bible it is referring to all three parts of the Trinity . . . not just the Holy Spirit. Also, I have never seen the Holy Spirit spoken of in a female way, except in Gnostic texts. Which doesn't negate that possibility, however for my own path I don't feel convicted that it is correct.

As for the Holy Spirit being the bride groom of Mary, the Mother, she never married it . . . she vowed herself as a Virgin to Godde. I read this in the Proto Evangelium of James the Lesser. Mainly, because I was intrigued by what the Catholics had always known . . . that Mary never lost her virginity, and that as a child of three she was dedicated as a Virgin to Godde's service. The Holy Spirit is merely the extended arm of Godde in this case, as in others . . . it is Godde itself she pledged herself to. She became Godde's Mother by giving birth to Jesus . . .

Not sure if any of that made sense :) But there you go

[Christo Pagan]

I should point out first that I myself am not a Trinitarian, but Dyadic. My beliefs come mostly from the Gnostic viewpoint who saw both masculine and feminine sides of God together. Considering that the early orthodox church attempted to remove all feminine aspects of God's nature (to ensure a male dominated hierarchy), much of the Holy Spirit's feminine aspects were discarded - and the Gnostics branded heretics. I see Deity as being androgynous, containing both male and female apsects, and, much like the Tao, together they form a whole that can't exist without the other. That is why I don't agree that acknowledging a feminine side to Deity (by applying the myth of Sophia to the Holy Spirit) is in some way selling God/dess short.

I also don't agree with wisdom not being referenced as feminine in the Bible, which in fact, it was quite explicitly. The Hebrew concept of God's wisdom is written in the feminine form throughout the Old Testament (see the first 8 chapters of Proverbs as an example), as were the "Wisdom Books" from the Greek Pentateuch. "Sophia" itself is the greek name for "wisdom".

The concept of the the bride & bridegroom (as both Paul and the authors of the Gnostic scriptures wrote about) were largely believed to be symbolic of the coming together of knowledge (masculine) and wisdom (feminine) within oneself - which the Gnostics believed brought about Gnosis. It's not in reference to either the virgin Mary or Mary Magdalene, but the unity of the Holy Spirit and Christ. Even many within the early church applied a feminine form to the Holy Spirit (including Paul) during the first two centuries, AD.

Just thought I needed to clarify what I wrote if it caused any confusion. :)

[charmedkisses1]

Female counterpart?

[LadyCelt]

I feel the holy spirit is maybe hte female side of the holy trinity to me. I feel it is a force that doesn't necessarily move you like crazy like you might think, just a little hand being lifted. It is the presence of the Lord and Jesus to me.

is the holy spirit the sae as the holy ghost?

[MariThorn]

I also don't agree with wisdom not being referenced as feminine in the Bible, which in fact, it was quite explicitly. The Hebrew concept of God's wisdom is written in the feminine form throughout the Old Testament (see the first 8 chapters of Proverbs as an example), as were the "Wisdom Books" from the Greek Pentateuch. "Sophia" itself is the greek name for "wisdom".

The concept of the the bride & bridegroom (as both Paul and the authors of the Gnostic scriptures wrote about) were largely believed to be symbolic of the coming together of knowledge (masculine) and wisdom (feminine) within oneself - which the Gnostics believed brought about Gnosis. It's not in reference to either the virgin Mary or Mary Magdalene, but the unity of the Holy Spirit and Christ. Even many within the early church applied a feminine form to the Holy Spirit (including Paul) during the first two centuries, AD.



Yes, I apologize, you are correct. The Hebrew and Greek word for wisdom is feminine. Most witches, however see Sophia and the Hebrew word, I cannot recall right now, as seperate entities and Deities. What I meant was that I see the Holy Spirit and Wisdom as part of Godde, which I see as Truth. I, too, apologize for any mistaken ideas. :)

And yes, the Holy SPirit is the same as the Holy Ghost.

[Christo Pagan]

Most witches, however see Sophia and the Hebrew word, I cannot recall right now, as seperate entities and Deities.

I had to look it up myself, the Hebrew word for wisdom is "Hokmah" which translates to Sophia in Greek. Were you maybe thinking about the Hebrew Goddess Asherah (who many believed to be Yahweh's wife)? If so, I'd love to hear your thoughts. I know that many have assumed that she and Sophia (as a Goddess figure) were the same and I have been trying to find an historical connection.

[Silver Ivy]

Sorry about the short answer, I had to run out of the house and couldn't expound. :) The Holy Spirit is intricately linked with Godde, and in fact is one of Godde's facets. It is the comforting and empowering part of Godde. It is not a seperate entity and I don't see it as having a gender. I do see it as a manifest spirit, but it doesn't think or do things on it's own.

I know that some see the Holy Spirit as Sofia or Wisdom, however to me this is selling Godde itself short. When Wisdom is spoken of in the Bible it is referring to all three parts of the Trinity . . . not just the Holy Spirit. Also, I have never seen the Holy Spirit spoken of in a female way, except in Gnostic texts. Which doesn't negate that possibility, however for my own path I don't feel convicted that it is correct.

As for the Holy Spirit being the bride groom of Mary, the Mother, she never married it . . . she vowed herself as a Virgin to Godde. I read this in the Proto Evangelium of James the Lesser. Mainly, because I was intrigued by what the Catholics had always known . . . that Mary never lost her virginity, and that as a child of three she was dedicated as a Virgin to Godde's service. The Holy Spirit is merely the extended arm of Godde in this case, as in others . . . it is Godde itself she pledged herself to. She became Godde's Mother by giving birth to Jesus . . .

Not sure if any of that made sense :) But there you go

That's really interesting, thanks for sharing :)

[MariThorn]

I had to look it up myself, the Hebrew word for wisdom is "Hokmah" which translates to Sophia in Greek. Were you maybe thinking about the Hebrew Goddess Asherah (who many believed to be Yahweh's wife)? If so, I'd love to hear your thoughts. I know that many have assumed that she and Sophia (as a Goddess figure) were the same and I have been trying to find an historical connection.

Yes, the word is Hokmah or Hokkma, or Chocma . . . all are Hebrew for Wisdom. When translated into Greek the word becomes Sophia (Greeks don't have f's in their language.) Hokmah was with Yahweh from the beginning. You can take it as an allegorical figure, as simply wisdom, or as a demi goddess. Proverbs and Ecclesiasted in particular have Hokmah talking about being with Yahweh from the beginning, being his delight, and at one point his wife.

Hokmah is not the same as Asherah, Ashtoreth, or any of her other synonyms. Asherah was one of Yahweh's consorts though. Her symbol was a Tree, and she was seen as a Mother figure. I don't see Hokmah as the Holy Spirit because the Holy Spirit is more than just wisdom . . . it is the giver of souls, the bringer of comfort, and the giver of spiritual gifts. Just my opinion, but I can see where those who seek a Lord and Lady could use Hokmah or Sophia as Yahweh's mate, but not himself . . .

MariThorn

[Dancing Sky]

I am very, very new to this path (as in within the last 24 hours), but I believe that the Holy Spirit is the Spirit of Nature. I've always sensed something sacred in Nature, a Divine presence, something ancient, holy, and powerful. It was that presence that convinced me that there was a God (or Gods).

If I understand it correctly, the Holy Spirit's job is to tug on our souls, to guide us, and lead us to God. That is what Nature does for me. I believe that the Holy Spirit transcends gender and anthropomorphic forms. It's the essence of God on earth.

Of course, what do I know. I haven't been a Christian in 15 years. :lol: I have a lot to learn!

[Ninjakitten]

Interestingly enough, Dancing Sky, I've found that it's easier to be a good Christian type when you've been elsewhere first. That way, you don't just grow up with one way of being Christian and think that's the one and only way. You don't have to "relearn" how to be a Christian. I grew up not even knowing what the death on the cross was even about at all, or that Jesus was considered to be God, yet I was supposedly raised Christian. The ones who have a lot to learn are the ones who can learn. There's no teaching a closed mind. Oh, and let the Holy Spirit guide you in your walk, and that will help you find out more about the Divine and about the true nature of Jesus. That's why the Bible tells us to be like children, because children learn the world without preconcieved notions. Welcome to the group!

Oh, and Jesus was a ninja :p

[CleftOfLight]

Ummm I am not to sure what I believe about the holy spirit.I never thought about it.From what remember about being told about it,the holy spirit is simply knowing,or feeling the Higher power within you and all aroud you.The Holy Spirit in a sense is the Force (as in star wars).But I will meditate on this and get back to you all.

[TarotCanada]

The Holy Spirit is the Paraclete which has an interior and exterior aspect - I think that the HP and the Hierophant represent the internal and external aspects of the Holy Spirit. The indwelling Glory is called Shekinah (hp in the tarot). Shekinah is the feminine face of God.

Cheryl

[Christo Pagan]

Here's a really good article I found entitled "Biblical Affirmations of Woman", which delves into the scriptures regarding "Hokmah"/"Sophia", the worship of Asherah and even the beliefs regarding the feminine nature of the Holy Spirit. Enjoy. :)

http://global-dialogue.com/swidlerbooks/biblical-affirmation.htm

[Silver Ivy]

I am very, very new to this path (as in within the last 24 hours), but I believe that the Holy Spirit is the Spirit of Nature. I've always sensed something sacred in Nature, a Divine presence, something ancient, holy, and powerful. It was that presence that convinced me that there was a God (or Gods).

If I understand it correctly, the Holy Spirit's job is to tug on our souls, to guide us, and lead us to God. That is what Nature does for me. I believe that the Holy Spirit transcends gender and anthropomorphic forms. It's the essence of God on earth.

Of course, what do I know. I haven't been a Christian in 15 years. :lol: I have a lot to learn!

This is a good point Dancing Sky, I like your take on the Holy Spirit - very insightful, I feel much the same way about it too ;)

[Dancing Sky]

Thanks Silver Ivy, it kind of makes sense to me. I just did a Google search, and according to the Bible, the Holy Spirit is symbolized by a dove, water, wind, fire, and light. These are all part of Nature, or even forces of Nature. I like that. :)

And Ninjakitten, thanks for the welcome. Great name, by the way. :lol:

[Ninjakitten]

Thanks Silver Ivy, it kind of makes sense to me. I just did a Google search, and according to the Bible, the Holy Spirit is symbolized by a dove, water, wind, fire, and light. These are all part of Nature, or even forces of Nature. I like that. :)

And Ninjakitten, thanks for the welcome. Great name, by the way. :lol:


I love ninjas so much, I collect them, am one, date one, and now I made my Saviour one :lol:

[Tobias]

According to Evangelical doctrine (Dispensationalism, I think), the Old Testiment era was the time for the Father to do His work. Jesus came, and did His job, and is now seated in heaven at the right hand of the Father. Since then, during the Church Age, it has been the Holy Spirit's turn to work.

From the begining of Genesis and throughout the Bible we see that God is One, yet somehow plural. This is where the doctrine of the Trinity comes into play. But how many exactly are there? Just because only three are mentioned in the Bible, does that mean there are no others?

In the Gospel of John Jesus prays to the Father asking him that we could be one, just as he and the Father are one. He also asked that we all be one together; the same kind of oneness expressed in the belief that God is One.

Obviously "one" doesn't mean "individual", but more like "having single purpose". Jesus spent much of his ministry talking about the Kingdom of Heaven, and how it applies to life today here on Earth as well as afterwards. I think that God is offering to us the chance to join forces with him, become a part of his kingdom, and do whatever it is that he does for people.

The Holy Spirit(s) then, are the spirits we come into contact with that are likeminded and united with God. They are "Holy", because they've found that pooling their strengths with other's and submitting to God's leadership provides the most effective means to accomplish what they desire to see done.

Anyway, that's what I hope to accomplish with my life. Being a member of the Kingdom of Heaven has it's perks. But it has it's responsibilities too. I'm being careful to make sure this is what I really want. I don't think hell is the only other option if I choose not to commit ;) .

[CleftOfLight]

I view the Holy Spirit as an angel.

[CleftOfLight]

I also don't believe in the trinity and I do not see the holy spirit as God or apart of God.

[adrianne]

I am also not a huge fan of the Trinity. I see Jesus as a deity, God the Father as the Christian form of the unifying force (much like Brahman or Netjer), and the Holy Spirit as conscience.

[Lovehound]

The Holy Spirit is that of God in everyone.

It is the breath of life.

The Inner Light spoken of by George Fox (Quaker founder).

::whispers:: I saw it once...

[ViolinGoddess]

I know there are different views among us Christo-Pagany types on who or what the Holy Spirit is. I honestly keep wondering who it is myself. Is it the Goddess aspect of the Divine, like the Sophia and/or Shekinah? Is it the presence of the Divine guiding you? Is it the aspect of you that gives you a direct connection to the Divine, thus making you an aspect of the Divine? What are your views?

For me it's hard to explain what I beleive about the Holy Spirit. My beleif about what the Holy Spirit is is pretty close to scripture. I beleive that the Holy Spirit is the divine guidance you recieve from God. It is also the holy ecstasy you recieve in divine inspiration. There are a few more things that I think the Holy Spirit does, but I can't put them into words because they are not all that clear in my mind.

Violin Goddess

[Neosnoia]

According to Evangelical doctrine (Dispensationalism, I think), the Old Testiment era was the time for the Father to do His work. Jesus came, and did His job, and is now seated in heaven at the right hand of the Father. Since then, during the Church Age, it has been the Holy Spirit's turn to work.

My idea of the Trinity does have a tendency to be a bit "modalist." God as Father is transcendent. God as Christ (Wisdom, the Word) is the archetype/pattern upon which we were made (and in incarnate form, that which we should emmulate). God as Holy Spirit is immanent, indwelling.

From the begining of Genesis and throughout the Bible we see that God is One, yet somehow plural. This is where the doctrine of the Trinity comes into play. But how many exactly are there? Just because only three are mentioned in the Bible, does that mean there are no others?

I think that all life is part of the plurality of God (in Oneness). Boy that sounds vague, doesn't it?

[Neosnoia]

The Holy Spirit is that of God in everyone.

It is the breath of life.



Yeah, that. :)

[Neosnoia]

I beleive that the Holy Spirit is the divine guidance you recieve from God. It is also the holy ecstasy you recieve in divine inspiration.

Yeah, that, too. :hahugh:

[plumedsnake]

What can we say about spirit? Hardly anything. There's no telling where it's coming from or where it's going. Like the wind, all you know is when it flows past you know it's flowing past.

In other words when you experience it there is no doubting it, yet there is really very little else that can be said about it.

[LordHelmet]

I see the holy spirit as being our connection with God. First off, I think of it in the neognostic way where God is the being that experiences being all of us. In this view Christ symbolizes our individuality and finite uniqueness while coming from God. This way everything that exists does so through him perciving it in some way.

Basicly like this picture this is a slice of a circle:

God (center)
H
O
L
Y

S
P
I
R
I
T
Christ (outside edge)

The Holy Spirit could describe our subconscience or higher self or anything else that is between us in the form of the Christ and God.

[TheWanderer]

I see the Holy Spirit as a definate part of the Trinity (but that is my Catholicism coming through).
Interestingly enough, my father (a SoBap who converted to Catholic) has always viewed the Holy Spirit as a woman (woah!). And, a movie produced by the Catholic Church in the early 70s called Jesus BC portrays the HS as a woman named Grace (Again, woah!)
I don't know if any of you have gone through Confirmation, but I felt a definate feeling come over me as I was being annointed.

[Aina]

Personally (also what i've been taught+ some of my own belifes) I think the Holy Spirit resides in all of us. (aka our souls, lol). As for the Holy Spirit being male or female, who knows, really? Godde (God) is omipotent. Godde is everywhere, neither male, nor female, or both! We where created in Godde's image. But, (and this is if you believe in the Adam and Eve story) God also created man first, out of dust, and women later, out of man's rib. So...is God both male and female? Er, so many questions, lol. As for the Holy Spirit, I haven't gotten through the first chapter yet of the New Testmant to even being to discuss whether or not the HS is male or female or Sophia..etc etc....

Bright Blessings.

-Aina-