Are the Egyptian Gods Real/

[Silverwitch]

Are the Egyptian Gods real,(or for that matter any Pantheon), or are they the Eqyptian names for areas of the subconcious?

I would be interested in peoples opinions on this question.

[adrian]

I believe they are real, just as our conscious and subconscious selves are real. What we see in each god/goddess, i think is a point of reflection to help us achieve some spiritual advancement.
We know they experimented with altered states of consciousness and whenever i focus my subconscious mind on Anpu i am given another piece to my puzzle.
Between Anpu and Nebet-het i am being led towards something hidden from me at this time but i can "feel" the difference between now and my beginning, and i "know" and "perceive" these to be real to me.
I never could acheive this state of mind, this freedom in my "christian" path, i'm not saying it doesn't work, it just doesn't work for me.
Em Hotep

[Silverwitch]

An interesting view point Adrian. It really seems to be imaterial whether the Gods/Goddess are "real" or projections from the subconcious. If they help to further our knowledge and wisdom, and we "believe" them to be real, then they are!

[adrian]

Yes! I guess that's why so many of us have different paths although in the end we all reach the same center.
Conscious decisions to bring about change from within seems to trigger some subconscious forces we are not aware of, but they work no matter who we are as long as our search is real.
I'm new here and someone is always ending their entries with: "It doesn't matter what you believe in as long as you believe in something". This is a good way of expressing it but we also have to look at the dark side also, it too is a part of us.
So we must be very careful what we choose to learn our decisions can effect change for good or bad, i choose good as most of us do but i am well aware of my dark side....i don't care for it, which is why i remain a solitary person.

[Silverwitch]

Originally posted by adrian
Yes! I guess that's why so many of us have different paths although in the end we all reach the same center.
Conscious decisions to bring about change from within seems to trigger some subconscious forces we are not aware of, but they work no matter who we are as long as our search is real.
I'm new here and someone is always ending their entries with: "It doesn't matter what you believe in as long as you believe in something". This is a good way of expressing it but we also have to look at the dark side also, it too is a part of us.
So we must be very careful what we choose to learn our decisions can effect change for good or bad, i choose good as most of us do but i am well aware of my dark side....i don't care for it, which is why i remain a solitary person.

We do need the dark side, and have to acknowledge it and embrace it. All things dark are not necessarily "bad". Nighttime is beautiful, and winter is important for rest. We need the dark to balance us, and whilst I'm sure that we all have traits we are not to happy about, trying to push them away, only encourages them to simmer under the surfact only to erupt, generally at the worst possible moment! It's even worth examining whether you don't care for your dark side, because you have been taught that certain things were "wrong", or because you genuinely don't care or won't those traits.

Exploring the dark side can reveal a tremendous amount of knowledge about ourselves and others, and can lead to greater tolerance.

[adrian]

This is true!!! I know myself well enough to know when to put an end to an otherwise explosive encounter, i choose to focus more on the light but believe me i like everyone else embraces the darkness; sometimes a source of peace can be found there as well as in light.
Em Hotep

[Naillosotarrain]

Order comes from Chaos, and Chaos comes from Order. One Cannot exist without the other.

The mind is the most powerful thing in the universe.

[ELM]

I believe each land has different gods because they reflect something real that dwells in that land and within the culture of that people. Nature is real and I think she really appears in different forms that are our gods. All the gods make one whole which is the life force of the whole cosmos, what of other religions call simply God. But the gods of one land are not the same as the gods of another land, they are linked to make the whole, but they have a special meaning is their own realm. Did that make any sense what so ever. I know what I mean, but I think I should call it a night!

[adrian]

Originally posted by ELM
I believe each land has different gods because they reflect something real that dwells in that land and within the culture of that people. Nature is real and I think she really appears in different forms that are our gods. All the gods make one whole which is the life force of the whole cosmos, what of other religions call simply God. But the gods of one land are not the same as the gods of another land, they are linked to make the whole, but they have a special meaning is their own realm. Did that make any sense what so ever. I know what I mean, but I think I should call it a night! Yes, that made sence...LOL!!! And i believe you are right is this supposition because in every land they had Gods and Goddesses to reflect on everyday life and other things, and when we research it all we find that they do have some cooresponding traits; even when they are thousands of miles apart. On top of that many of them have been copied by other cultures so they are really the same deity but with a few changes.
And like you, sometimes i have to shut down or i think i sound daffy...LOL. thanks for the smile.

[Tigerwallah]

Egyptian Deities are often reffered to as the great ancestors. Pharohs and queens were elevated to the level of god and goddess. I believe that the gods and goddesses were once living people - It is said that Isis developed agriculture, and Osiris saw that her plans were implimented. I also believe that the gods and goddesses are "reincarnated" or more acurately different incarnates of the gods and goddess pop up during different times and in different locations...

just as our souls make the journey through time and space. I once worked a spell to see the faces of the different people I'd been, and it was like a trip to the world trade center. I saw so many faces - not all of them human. I saw so many time periods - most of them ancient, and so many races - everything from a Zulu warrior to a Dutchman in the 16th Century. Totally wild, and totally fun. It gave me a different perspective on the journey of the soul, and a clue as to how many cultures have very similar deities - they are the same, just a different incarnation. Food for thought.

[adrian]

Originally posted by Tigerwallah
Egyptian Deities are often reffered to as the great ancestors. Pharohs and queens were elevated to the level of god and goddess. I believe that the gods and goddesses were once living people - It is said that Isis developed agriculture, and Osiris saw that her plans were implimented. I also believe that the gods and goddesses are "reincarnated" or more acurately different incarnates of the gods and goddess pop up during different times and in different locations...

just as our souls make the journey through time and space. I once worked a spell to see the faces of the different people I'd been, and it was like a trip to the world trade center. I saw so many faces - not all of them human. I saw so many time periods - most of them ancient, and so many races - everything from a Zulu warrior to a Dutchman in the 16th Century. Totally wild, and totally fun. It gave me a different perspective on the journey of the soul, and a clue as to how many cultures have very similar deities - they are the same, just a different incarnation. Food for thought. :) Greetings! I have to agree with you on your research here, we are all more alike than we care to admit and i can truthfully say myself that i have a great affinity for various time periods but the one that impacts me most is the egyptian and while i don't know a lot about it i have made it a part of my spiritual life.... which is why ihaven't been around for a while.

[Tigerwallah]

Glad to see you back. I missed you.

[Naillosotarrain]

As for my previous post in this thread I had stated that the mind is the most powerful thing in the universe. Are the gods real? Or are they just part of our subconsciousness? If you look at any civilization, you will notice that they all have gods and goddesses. How did these entity's come into being? Did they create us or did we create them? Gods and goddesses have been around since man has existed. Why you ask, because man needed something to believe in, so he reflected everything that happened on being the purpose of a higher entity; and without realizing it, actually created these higher entity's through his thoughts alone. Therefor, yes the gods and goddesses are real, just as you and me are real, but they were created by man. As I said, the mind is the most powerful thing in the universe. If only one mind can create a god without knowing what it is doing, then try to imagine what a highly tuned and fully trained mind would be capable of doing...

[adrian]

Originally posted by Tigerwallah
Glad to see you back. I missed you. Hey! hope all was well, sorry i was away so long but i had to really reconnect , kind of like taking a spiritual retreat. Plan on taking one every month, camping and meditation on me and the direction i want to take in the second half of my life.
Can't wait til it's warmer. Good to hear from you!

[adrian]

Originally posted by Naillosotarrain
As for my previous post in this thread I had stated that the mind is the most powerful thing in the universe. Are the gods real? Or are they just part of our subconsciousness? If you look at any civilization, you will notice that they all have gods and goddesses. How did these entity's come into being? Did they create us or did we create them? Gods and goddesses have been around since man has existed. Why you ask, because man needed something to believe in, so he reflected everything that happened on being the purpose of a higher entity; and without realizing it, actually created these higher entity's through his thoughts alone. Therefor, yes the gods and goddesses are real, just as you and me are real, but they were created by man. As I said, the mind is the most powerful thing in the universe. If only one mind can create a god without knowing what it is doing, then try to imagine what a highly tuned and fully trained mind would be capable of doing... Hail Naillosotarrain!
I would be inclined to agree with you somewhat but...after researching this thought i see that it may be flawed for me to believe in, my research materials are the bible which speaks of the Neflilm in Genesis and for those of alternate theoretical minds,
there is the theory of Zacharia Stichin whos work is becoming truth for a lot of people. Yes, the mind is the most powerful thing in reality but you have to ask that if we were left on our own, how far would we have evolved so far? If at all...

[Naillosotarrain]

And that is why man envisioned (and unknowingly) gave birth to the first gods. As man needed help and something to believe and help him on his journey, he envisioned higher entities and through his dreams gave birth to the first gods that would help him along his journey. Why? Because without man, gods would not of existed.

[Tigerwallah]

Originally posted by Naillosotarrain
And that is why man envisioned (and unknowingly) gave birth to the first gods. As man needed help and something to believe and help him on his journey, he envisioned higher entities and through his dreams gave birth to the first gods that would help him along his journey. Why? Because without man, gods would not of existed.

I don't think that the gods were born of man's brain, but of man, and beast alike. I believe that as we evolve in our lives we become more god-like, until eventually, after many many lifetimes, we acheive perfection and become part of the god-power. In this respect, the gods were born of man, however, man did not imagine the gods. I believe that these early gods were around for a very very long time, and may have often roamed the earth, but acheived this perfection and acheived the status of deity.

I think that these gods lived their lives on other planets and were sent to help us evolve. I totally believe that they provided the missing link between modern man and the neanderthol.

That's my story, and I'm sticking to it!!!

[adrian]

Originally posted by Tigerwallah


I don't think that the gods were born of man's brain, but of man, and beast alike. I believe that as we evolve in our lives we become more god-like, until eventually, after many many lifetimes, we acheive perfection and become part of the god-power. In this respect, the gods were born of man, however, man did not imagine the gods. I believe that these early gods were around for a very very long time, and may have often roamed the earth, but acheived this perfection and acheived the status of deity.

I think that these gods lived their lives on other planets and were sent to help us evolve. I totally believe that they provided the missing link between modern man and the neanderthol.

That's my story, and I'm sticking to it!!! I'm inclined to follow this train of thought also...because i think if mankind were left to his own devices, we would never have acheived the present state of evolution in so short a time. This is why i have to question the Bible sources in the first place because it seems to me that they are not telling us everything.

[adrian]

Originally posted by Naillosotarrain
And that is why man envisioned (and unknowingly) gave birth to the first gods. As man needed help and something to believe and help him on his journey, he envisioned higher entities and through his dreams gave birth to the first gods that would help him along his journey. Why? Because without man, gods would not of existed. So in effect what you are saying is that man was in that ancient time before time, envisioning a higher being than him/herself a being that would grant him favors as well as destroy his works whenever he got out of line?
No...i think i will stick to the outside influences that had nothing to do with us until they chose to bring together the best of two beings in the hopes of creating something they needed.
My question to you is this...If we dreamed or invisioned our gods and goddesses, why dream them to destroy us and our accomplishments? If we were capable of dreaming something greater than ourselves, why not just dream ourselves into perfection and skip the teachers?

[Yvonne Belisle]

You have a very valid point. I'll ask Naillosotarrain after this movie when I give him back the computer. It is the great thoughts in this thread that has brought him back to the computer, normally I just read threads to him and he lets me know what to type under his name. For you he tossed me off to type himself.:D Thank-you it gives us great thoughts to ponder and discuss.

[adrian]

Originally posted by Yvonne Thomas
You have a very valid point. I'll ask Naillosotarrain after this movie when I give him back the computer. It is the great thoughts in this thread that has brought him back to the computer, normally I just read threads to him and he lets me know what to type under his name. For you he tossed me off to type himself.:D Thank-you it gives us great thoughts to ponder and discuss. I should thank you two, i as you love the discussion of "thoughts" and how far we can take them.
I choose to research the various sources and while i am not an expert or cannot translate the languages, i do love to read everything i can get my hands on, on every culture that has ties to my research; and i am finding that most cultures do have some kind of connection with egypt and the gods/goddesses.
I thank you again for this moment to ponder the secrets but i fear i must get some rest so that do not get daffy on you guys. Please, let us continue this discussion at another time.
Em Hotep friends

[Yvonne Belisle]

:D With great pleasure. See you again soon.

[Tigerwallah]

Originally posted by adrian
I'm inclined to follow this train of thought also...because i think if mankind were left to his own devices, we would never have acheived the present state of evolution in so short a time. This is why i have to question the Bible sources in the first place because it seems to me that they are not telling us everything.
Adrian, I totally agree. The bible certainly makes no concessions for the neanderthol. We have proof of the existance of the neanderthol man, and in fact, the two types of humans shared the earth during modern man's earliest days of existence. Scientists believe that we killed off our less refined cousin, but also, that we evolved from him. How would this be possible if not for some divine intervention?

[Naillosotarrain]

Who ever said that it was the gods and godesses who destroy us and our accomplishments? For after all, part of human nature is to destroy, is it not? Just look at a history book. No, man did not exist in the "ancient time before time" as you call it; but then again what exactly is time? Man has broken time down into seconds, minutes, hours, days, weeks, months, years, decades, generations, centuries, millenia, even eons. All that is a break down just to give time a 'definition', when in fact, all time really is, is a repetition of events. Now, back then when man first rose along the evolutionary chain, they were broken down into tribes. Each tribe creating there own gods. Not all the tribes got along with each other, and they fought. So they created war gods, and bingo. You have gods now that destroy and undo what man has accomplished. All it really is, and ever has been, is an on going game. Once the gods realized how they were created, they were not entirely pleased with the fact that lesser beings could hold so much power, so they began toying and playing with man. As for the fact of why man would simply not just dream himself into perfection and skip the teachers; remember this, perfection is the only perfection. Simple law of nature, perfection can never be achieved; and when it is achieved, it always backfires, therefor becoming imperfect.

[Tigerwallah]

I see what you are saying. I used to believe that too. Then I had an experience with the ghost of my great great grandmother. I didn't know her, and I didn' make her up. I did make her more powerful by acknowledging her. I think it is the same way with the gods - they were there, we called them and they became powerful by our interest, belief and acknowledgement. Just a thought.

[Yvonne Belisle]

With that thought in mind could it then be argued that the Gods/Goddesses were ghosts that were worshiped and there for empowered by the first humans? Or could an older entity have stumbled upon us in our infancy and helped us along and in the process became revered as Gods/Goddesses? It's an interesting line of thought. I will need to ponder this one.

[adrian]

Greetings! I have been thinking of all we have been talking about and we know these are some of the great questions that remain unanswered. I point out that in Genesis, The deity destroyed mankind with a flood; this was a world wide occurance because in almost every ancient culture there are stories of destruction by a flood. The story of Nimrod, who wanted to build a stairway to heaven, the creation we built was thrown down and we were dispursed to the four corners of the planet because they were afraid.
Genesis is full of stories like this, they were real and they became afraid of their creation, so they left or were absorbed into our physical matrix " the sons of god/daughters of man" we all know the story.
I believe that when we combined with them we became more than the ancient tribes of brute neanderthols, we became a being
with the ability to dream, to create, and to destroy.
We are Gods and Goddesses, but only because of that divine intervention of long ago and who knows; mayby they are still there watching, watching but not interfering this time.

[adrian]

Originally posted by Yvonne Thomas
With that thought in mind could it then be argued that the Gods/Goddesses were ghosts that were worshiped and there for empowered by the first humans? Or could an older entity have stumbled upon us in our infancy and helped us along and in the process became revered as Gods/Goddesses? It's an interesting line of thought. I will need to ponder this one. I can remember in my research of a story of ghost like beings that inhabited this world before us, would they be the "spirit" we talk so much about? After all, we are a being of symbiotic cells, all unique within us and all "needed" in order to be that perfect being. There are many theories but only one can be truth, or maybe i should think about a combination of theories???

[adrian]

Originally posted by Tigerwallah
I see what you are saying. I used to believe that too. Then I had an experience with the ghost of my great great grandmother. I didn't know her, and I didn' make her up. I did make her more powerful by acknowledging her. I think it is the same way with the gods - they were there, we called them and they became powerful by our interest, belief and acknowledgement. Just a thought. I too had an encounter with the ghost/spirit of my mother, and she protected me. I saw a smoky shadow that floated across the floor and went through a door that i "felt" was my mom; i felt at peace and i "knew" it to be her...I don't think we make them powerful but i do think that by acknowledging them we give them free reign to do things here.
When my mom died i didn't want to look at her and for a long time i never wanted to "see" a spirit/ghost and i never saw them but they have always been with me as shadows, it is my own fear that keeps me from actually seeing their features...i think once i come to terms with that fear they will manifest.

[adrian]

I wasn't going to say this but i feel i must... all my life i have heard that man is not perfect and can never be perfect.
I disagree.
I believe that i am perfect, i am perfect in the sence that i am a being living as i was created to perform, i do not think i am better than anyone but in some cases i am better "off" than some as some are better "off" than i. I also believe that if a child were to be brought up in complete love being taught all it can learn and constantly being told that it can do certain things andbeing taught those things that it would grow into something totally different from us but in essence still "us". Perfection? To me it is a state of being we all are in, but what level depends on that person.
I am God.
I am perfect.

[Tigerwallah]

Originally posted by adrian
I wasn't going to say this but i feel i must... all my life i have heard that man is not perfect and can never be perfect.
I disagree.
I believe that i am perfect, i am perfect in the sence that i am a being living as i was created to perform, i do not think i am better than anyone but in some cases i am better "off" than some as some are better "off" than i. I also believe that if a child were to be brought up in complete love being taught all it can learn and constantly being told that it can do certain things andbeing taught those things that it would grow into something totally different from us but in essence still "us". Perfection? To me it is a state of being we all are in, but what level depends on that person.
I am God.
I am perfect.


I think I understand what you are saying. I always figured that when I reached perfection, I would become part of the goddess energy. I feel I have much of the goddess in me, but still have a few things to iron out. I'm working on my last great fear right now. But, in a sense I see what you mean. We are perfect in that we are creations fulfilling a purpose. Interesting.

[Tigerwallah]

Originally posted by Yvonne Thomas
With that thought in mind could it then be argued that the Gods/Goddesses were ghosts that were worshiped and there for empowered by the first humans? Or could an older entity have stumbled upon us in our infancy and helped us along and in the process became revered as Gods/Goddesses? It's an interesting line of thought. I will need to ponder this one.

Maybe, in a sense. I do believe that the gods/godesses were living once. I think that they acheived their perfection and are here to guide us. I also believe that someday I will acheive that same level of perfection and become part of that energy. I do think, as Naillosostarrian said, that they do play with us, occasionally. I think it is part of our lessons, and probably a little fun for them. I think I would do the same.

[adrian]

Originally posted by Tigerwallah


I think I understand what you are saying. I always figured that when I reached perfection, I would become part of the goddess energy. I feel I have much of the goddess in me, but still have a few things to iron out. I'm working on my last great fear right now. But, in a sense I see what you mean. We are perfect in that we are creations fulfilling a purpose. Interesting. Many people believe that we can never reach perfection and with that thought we will never reach any kind of closure in our live but in my experience, my creators created the perfect being; i have the potential to become anything i wish to create simply because i was created that way...i am one with my creators.
I may not be on the same level spiritually/mentally/physically but i am one as we all are one. And to continue to iron out our fears, differences, prejudices, etc. is where the spiritual growth comes in...i think. Is this too deep? I should stop, i starting to loose myself...LOL!!! love and light.

[Yvonne Belisle]

Deep is good it provokes us to think! In a day and age where information is so easy to get we need to think far more than we used to!

[adrian]

Originally posted by Yvonne Thomas
Deep is good it provokes us to think! In a day and age where information is so easy to get we need to think far more than we used to! Thanks yvonne, sometimes i think i go too deep for some people but i have noticed that for me to focus my thoughts in this way i become more openminded as well as pointed in new and exciting directions in my life.
For me this is a good thing but it tends to alienate me from others
who are less inclined to thoughts such as these, i have been told many times that i should just forget all that and have fun; well i tried that and it was an experience i don't care to repeat, lets just
say it was a waste of my time and somewhat destructive. Now i really enjoy myself....spiritually, in a purely paganistic way.

[Tigerwallah]

Originally posted by adrian
Thanks yvonne, sometimes i think i go too deep for some people but i have noticed that for me to focus my thoughts in this way i become more openminded as well as pointed in new and exciting directions in my life.
For me this is a good thing but it tends to alienate me from others
who are less inclined to thoughts such as these, i have been told many times that i should just forget all that and have fun; well i tried that and it was an experience i don't care to repeat, lets just
say it was a waste of my time and somewhat destructive. Now i really enjoy myself....spiritually, in a purely paganistic way.

Go for it Adrian!!!!

[adrian]

Originally posted by Tigerwallah


Maybe, in a sense. I do believe that the gods/godesses were living once. I think that they acheived their perfection and are here to guide us. I also believe that someday I will acheive that same level of perfection and become part of that energy. I do think, as Naillosostarrian said, that they do play with us, occasionally. I think it is part of our lessons, and probably a little fun for them. I think I would do the same. I don't want to believe that i'm being played with, i can accept the lessons from teachers & guides but for someone/something to play games with my existence seems childish and immature; maybe that is just the way we perceive it...i would be pretty pissed not to mention depressed if i found out i'm just a peice in a childs game but then what could i do about it...LOL. that's not funny.

[Tigerwallah]

Originally posted by adrian
I don't want to believe that i'm being played with, i can accept the lessons from teachers & guides but for someone/something to play games with my existence seems childish and immature; maybe that is just the way we perceive it...i would be pretty pissed not to mention depressed if i found out i'm just a peice in a childs game but then what could i do about it...LOL. that's not funny.

Well, I'm not saying all of them, but there are some gods that just seem predisposed to being naughty and playful - like Loki, and I suspect Bes, he looks like he tends to get a little playful. Many believed that the Classical gods used humans like Chess peices. I'm not so sure about that, but I'm sure that we do amuse them from time to time.

[Yvonne Belisle]

I think they get bored too. After all aren't we reflections of them? If we get bored I would imagine they would too especially after eons. However I don't think all life is a game to them merely that from time to time they like to have fun too.

[Tigerwallah]

Originally posted by Yvonne Thomas
I think they get bored too. After all aren't we reflections of them? If we get bored I would imagine they would too especially after eons. However I don't think all life is a game to them merely that from time to time they like to have fun too.

I agree!!! That's it in a nutshell.

[adrian]

I don't know...is it them or perceiving it in such a way? kind of like nervous laughter, I can perceive them as certain principles to live by and to enjoy and also as trials to overcome....i just had a thought...we live each moment in connection with each other, our every move affects someone else (such as this conversation) and sometimes someone dies for no apparent reason, is there a reason behind that? Did that person serve their purpose here and was taken out of the equation? I can relate to the classical gods/goddesses, they were more humanlike than we were human at that time....maybe i need to go back and reconsider what Naillosotarrian said. Did we create the gods/goddesses?
Our minds are powerful but are we capable of this?
Ok...gotta check out for awhile this stuff can fry the brain...see you guys later.
Em Hotep

[Naillosotarrain]

The fact that Tigerwallah makes mention to the belief of the classical gods using humans like chess pieces kinda surprises me. I was going to make mention to something along those lines much earlier in this thread and I guess now I will. When viewed upon from a certain point of view, life is like like a giant, ongoing game of chess. Now, every person has his/her own purpose in life to fulfill. When they obtain and meet that purpose, they move on. For some this takes longer than others, and for some it takes less time than others. As I stated before, the mind is the most powerful thing in the universe; and impossibility is the only impossibility. Things that seem impossible are only seen so in the eye of the beholder. What is impossible for one may not be so for another.

[adrian]

Greetings Naillosotarrian!
may we walk in light.

When i think about the way life works it seems like it is truth what you say here, many times i have wondered what my purpose here is and when i finished that purpose would i move on to other things...not knowing what that purpose is, is madening. We can go at any time and never know anything, or would we remember everything here once we're gone?
Boy! This concept can be really depressing if you let it...

[Tigerwallah]

Originally posted by adrian
Greetings Naillosotarrian!
may we walk in light.

When i think about the way life works it seems like it is truth what you say here, many times i have wondered what my purpose here is and when i finished that purpose would i move on to other things...not knowing what that purpose is, is madening. We can go at any time and never know anything, or would we remember everything here once we're gone?
Boy! This concept can be really depressing if you let it...

I believe that the key is being able to laugh at yourself. I try not to ever take anything too seriously, even the serious stuff. Sometimes I feel like fate, or the gods, are playing with me, but other times, I feel like they do my bidding. It's all in the way you look at it. Maybe I'm maddening to them, because I kinda enjoy the games. Like, I learned that I had to be VERY specific when asking Isis for anything, because I would always get exactly what I asked for, nothing more, nothing less. When I asked for a stupid guy for an exclusively physical relationship, well, you can imagine what I got. Let's just say it was exactly what I asked for, but not at all what I wanted. After a few times of this kind of thing, I learned that I needed to be detailed in my requests. No generalizations. Eventually, I figured out the game, though. And all worked out. She had her laugh at my expense, but now I know how to control it.

[adrian]

Originally posted by Tigerwallah


I believe that the key is being able to laugh at yourself. I try not to ever take anything too seriously, even the serious stuff. Sometimes I feel like fate, or the gods, are playing with me, but other times, I feel like they do my bidding. It's all in the way you look at it. Maybe I'm maddening to them, because I kinda enjoy the games. Like, I learned that I had to be VERY specific when asking Isis for anything, because I would always get exactly what I asked for, nothing more, nothing less. When I asked for a stupid guy for an exclusively physical relationship, well, you can imagine what I got. Let's just say it was exactly what I asked for, but not at all what I wanted. After a few times of this kind of thing, I learned that I needed to be detailed in my requests. No generalizations. Eventually, I figured out the game, though. And all worked out. She had her laugh at my expense, but now I know how to control it. I too learned to laugh at everything weather it was serious or not especially myself, in the past it was a nervous laugh but today it is really a joy to be able to face things and laugh at them because i now have the knowledge that nothing is important enough to loose control or to worry about too much...I've also felt that i was being guided when i needed something/someone in my life and specifics were foremost in important...be careful what you ask for you might get it...now i don't ask for anything except for spiritual guidance and i find that i am meeting people who have similar interest.
I don't look for them but they are there and when we meet we talk for hours and never want to leave the conversation, it feels so stimulating to feel this way, to know that i have people in my life who don't want anything except to connect spiritually and re-energize then move on. It is amazing how the "game" is played
and *NOW* i understand!!! it is a game we play here isn't it???
Life is just one big board game with gods/goddesses watching us and guiding us towards what we need in order to...what???
I'm a little slow but i can see what Naillosotarrian was saying, i resented that there may be gods playing with us but in a way that's exactly whats happening...while i may feel that i control my destiny, they do hold all the cards. This i can laugh at because it's beyond my control and i can't do anything except to continue to ritualize and recognize them for who and what they are, not to mention i need them in my life; life is so much better with them than without and i am a better more loving person for it.
I give thanks to you for helping me through this...you too yvonne and naillosotarrian, you guys are great!!!
may we continue to walk in light
Em hotep:D :D :D

[Yvonne Belisle]

Thank you from both of us. We are glad to have provided the right questions for you at this time in your life. Keep pondering the deep thoughts they are worth thinking and sharing.

[Tigerwallah]

Originally posted by adrian
I too learned to laugh at everything weather it was serious or not especially myself, in the past it was a nervous laugh but today it is really a joy to be able to face things and laugh at them because i now have the knowledge that nothing is important enough to loose control or to worry about too much...I've also felt that i was being guided when i needed something/someone in my life and specifics were foremost in important...be careful what you ask for you might get it...now i don't ask for anything except for spiritual guidance and i find that i am meeting people who have similar interest.
I don't look for them but they are there and when we meet we talk for hours and never want to leave the conversation, it feels so stimulating to feel this way, to know that i have people in my life who don't want anything except to connect spiritually and re-energize then move on. It is amazing how the "game" is played
and *NOW* i understand!!! it is a game we play here isn't it???
Life is just one big board game with gods/goddesses watching us and guiding us towards what we need in order to...what???
I'm a little slow but i can see what Naillosotarrian was saying, i resented that there may be gods playing with us but in a way that's exactly whats happening...while i may feel that i control my destiny, they do hold all the cards. This i can laugh at because it's beyond my control and i can't do anything except to continue to ritualize and recognize them for who and what they are, not to mention i need them in my life; life is so much better with them than without and i am a better more loving person for it.
I give thanks to you for helping me through this...you too yvonne and naillosotarrian, you guys are great!!!
may we continue to walk in light
Em hotep:D :D :D

[Naillosotarrain]

Yes, the lives we live are in fact nothing but a simple game. However, we don't always have the gods/godesses watching over us or guiding us all the time. For as I said before, they were not entirely pleased with the fact that such an inferior being could hold so much power. The universe is full of mysteries that science will never be able to unravel. Some of which I've only started to discover. I am only 20 years old; and for 16 of those years I was raised as a christian and to worship only one god. It has been only in these past 4 years that I have come across these realizations. My body may be young, but my mind is far from it. As Yvonne likes to say, "I am a 90 year old man in a 20 year old body"; and to a certain extent, that is true. If you ever get a chance, read The Swords Series by Fred Saberhagen. Yes, it may be Sci/Fi Fantasy writing, and a lot of make believe stuff; but there is some truth inside those covers, but please be sure to read them in order. Actually, you'd be surprised at what kind of things you can find truth in now a days. As for what our purpose in life is, we all have a different purpose, no 2 are a like. But how we obtain that purpose is our own choice, not the choice of any deity. We have a goal that has been set upon us by fate and it is our job to obtain that goal no matter what the cost.

[adrian]

Originally posted by Naillosotarrain
Yes, the lives we live are in fact nothing but a simple game. However, we don't always have the gods/godesses watching over us or guiding us all the time. For as I said before, they were not entirely pleased with the fact that such an inferior being could hold so much power. The universe is full of mysteries that science will never be able to unravel. Some of which I've only started to discover. I am only 20 years old; and for 16 of those years I was raised as a christian and to worship only one god. It has been only in these past 4 years that I have come across these realizations. My body may be young, but my mind is far from it. As Yvonne likes to say, "I am a 90 year old man in a 20 year old body"; and to a certain extent, that is true. If you ever get a chance, read The Swords Series by Fred Saberhagen. Yes, it may be Sci/Fi Fantasy writing, and a lot of make believe stuff; but there is some truth inside those covers, but please be sure to read them in order. Actually, you'd be surprised at what kind of things you can find truth in now a days. As for what our purpose in life is, we all have a different purpose, no 2 are a like. But how we obtain that purpose is our own choice, not the choice of any deity. We have a goal that has been set upon us by fate and it is our job to obtain that goal no matter what the cost. I would have never guessed you to be twenty, Yvonne is right you are far in advanced of your years here but then i'm starting to meet a lot of younger people that enlighten me on many matters and as they say; age is just a number. Your maturity shows here. I agree with you when you say that science will never unravel the mysteries of the universe, our present thought patterns are too shallow and we tend to seperate a lot of the fields of study such as: Astrology,Astronomy, Physical health, spiritual health, etc...i believe some of these field of study should be combined. I used to read a lot of sci-fi but now i don't have time for reading it, i'm trying to live it!!! At least from a metaphysical point of view.
Only twenty yrs. old, now that's going to take some getting use to, Only kidding; i respect your knowledge and patterns of thought and i thank you for being here at this time.
Em Hotep

[Yvonne Belisle]

His maturity is one of the reasons we get along so well. Even though I'm 31 I tend to prefer to play rather than take things seriously, he tends to take things too seriously forgeting to play. We balance each other out. He has a very old soul and if you look in his eyes it's easy to see. I was rather surprised to find such an intelligent, level headed, mature being looking at me from his eyes when I first met him. He truely is an interesting man.

[adrian]

Originally posted by Yvonne Thomas
His maturity is one of the reasons we get along so well. Even though I'm 31 I tend to prefer to play rather than take things seriously, he tends to take things too seriously forgeting to play. We balance each other out. He has a very old soul and if you look in his eyes it's easy to see. I was rather surprised to find such an intelligent, level headed, mature being looking at me from his eyes when I first met him. He truely is an interesting man. I think you're lucky to have found someone like that, it's not often that we find someone who compliments us spiritually as well as physically and mentally and you two seem to have all three. I envy you, i'm still looking but then i shouldn't say looking because i'm much too busy to be looking; if someone did come along they would probably have to drop a ton of bricks on my head to get my attention..LOL. I am grateful to have you both here in this moment as i am the older of you two 45yrs. but age doesn't make a difference, it's the spirit that counts.
Em Hotep my friends

[Tigerwallah]

Originally posted by adrian
I think you're lucky to have found someone like that, it's not often that we find someone who compliments us spiritually as well as physically and mentally and you two seem to have all three. I envy you, i'm still looking but then i shouldn't say looking because i'm much too busy to be looking; if someone did come along they would probably have to drop a ton of bricks on my head to get my attention..LOL. I am grateful to have you both here in this moment as i am the older of you two 45yrs. but age doesn't make a difference, it's the spirit that counts.
Em Hotep my friends

Adrian, if someone dropped a ton of bricks on your head you wouldn't be looking for anything anymore, except maybe the place one goes to plot out their next life. ;)

[adrian]

LOL. that's true! But they would a least have to yell, wave their hands in my face,stomp on my big toe...i'm not very good at reading between the lines, never have been i'm more of a straight-up person; say whats on your/my mind and my eyes are at least opened enough to notice. But then maybe i should stick to the "ton of brick" method because like you i haven't been exactly lucky in relationships it seems a lot of old school women are not into this pagan stuff and the younger ones want someone less serious. Me? I just want to research/study, camp, fish, go to an occasional play or cultural event, research/study, and travel to places i want to see with my own eyes.
So far so good and i am enjoying the present time because i meet so many interesting people...present company included!
Em Hotep

[Yvonne Belisle]

I wish a friend of mine was a little less christian. Sounds like you would be great for her if she could get past trying to save your soul. Then again if she is trying to save yours she'd back off on mine :) If I meet anyone fantastic I'll bring them here for you to meet. Who knows it's worked for others.

[Tigerwallah]

Originally posted by adrian
LOL. that's true! But they would a least have to yell, wave their hands in my face,stomp on my big toe...i'm not very good at reading between the lines, never have been i'm more of a straight-up person; say whats on your/my mind and my eyes are at least opened enough to notice. But then maybe i should stick to the "ton of brick" method because like you i haven't been exactly lucky in relationships it seems a lot of old school women are not into this pagan stuff and the younger ones want someone less serious. Me? I just want to research/study, camp, fish, go to an occasional play or cultural event, research/study, and travel to places i want to see with my own eyes.
So far so good and i am enjoying the present time because i meet so many interesting people...present company included!
Em Hotep

Adrian, I get what you are saying. You can rarely expect a woman to use the straightfoward approach. Women tend to be much more "wait and see if he likes me", and when the man is like that....Well, it's hard get two people out on a date if niether will ask the other out. I don't think you are too serious. There are a lot of women who are attracted to the deep, intellectual type. You just need to find them. Most of us here are like that. It is hard to meet other Pagans out in the "real" world, though. I'm pretty straightfoward about my religion and belief system. It has worked to my advantage to be that way. I have had many a boyfriend show interest in my opinions on spirituality even though they may consider themselves to be atheist or Christian.
I always, eventually, drag a man to the Met. Then I get to see what he's made of. One of my last boyfriends wanted to touch everything and became ill-tempered when the guards asked him not to. Needless to say, that did not work.

I think you are an incredible guy. You will definately make some woman very lucky. Go to Isis this weekend. I have had much luck with this for other people, and not for myself, but..I've had other things miraculously pop into my life following this simple prayer/spell at the temple. When you enter, pay homage to the seven statues of Sekhemet for her divine protection over Isis. Then, sit facing the temple, thank Isis for something - as I believe her to be mother nature, I usually thank her for the day, or the beautiful trees that you can see in the park, etc. Then calm your mind - for me it helped to count backwards red seven, orange 6, yellow 5, green 4, blue 3, indigo 2, and violet one. The colors harmonize with your natural frequencies and help to bring you to a state of higher consciousness. Anyway, then I tell her what I want, and imagine it. More than not **poof** it happens. Just remember to be very specific. Good luck!!! Wish I still lived in NY. I'm envious.

[adrian]

Originally posted by Yvonne Thomas
I wish a friend of mine was a little less christian. Sounds like you would be great for her if she could get past trying to save your soul. Then again if she is trying to save yours she'd back off on mine :) If I meet anyone fantastic I'll bring them here for you to meet. Who knows it's worked for others. Yvonne!
NO THANKS! The thought is well accepted though, i know a lot of people including my brother who met people that way and they were all a disaster...so...no thank you very much.

[Yvonne Belisle]

:D sometimes it works too. The advantage of Mystic Wicks is that you become friends and if something more grows great so be it if not hey friendships are just as priceless:) Hello friend see that wasn't so hard. Was it?:)

[adrian]

Originally posted by Tigerwallah


Adrian, I get what you are saying. You can rarely expect a woman to use the straightfoward approach. Women tend to be much more "wait and see if he likes me", and when the man is like that....Well, it's hard get two people out on a date if niether will ask the other out. I don't think you are too serious. There are a lot of women who are attracted to the deep, intellectual type. You just need to find them. Most of us here are like that. It is hard to meet other Pagans out in the "real" world, though. I'm pretty straightfoward about my religion and belief system. It has worked to my advantage to be that way. I have had many a boyfriend show interest in my opinions on spirituality even though they may consider themselves to be atheist or Christian.
I always, eventually, drag a man to the Met. Then I get to see what he's made of. One of my last boyfriends wanted to touch everything and became ill-tempered when the guards asked him not to. Needless to say, that did not work.

I think you are an incredible guy. You will definately make some woman very lucky. Go to Isis this weekend. I have had much luck with this for other people, and not for myself, but..I've had other things miraculously pop into my life following this simple prayer/spell at the temple. When you enter, pay homage to the seven statues of Sekhemet for her divine protection over Isis. Then, sit facing the temple, thank Isis for something - as I believe her to be mother nature, I usually thank her for the day, or the beautiful trees that you can see in the park, etc. Then calm your mind - for me it helped to count backwards red seven, orange 6, yellow 5, green 4, blue 3, indigo 2, and violet one. The colors harmonize with your natural frequencies and help to bring you to a state of higher consciousness. Anyway, then I tell her what I want, and imagine it. More than not **poof** it happens. Just remember to be very specific. Good luck!!! Wish I still lived in NY. I'm envious.
O.K. first. i am not looking for anyone at the moment at least not seriously, she will have to be pretty special to put up with my eccentricity (spelling?) and also be open minded enough to accept my pagan ways. I like where i am right now, i can come and go as i please and i do have some friends i date when i need someone to talk to and hold me, but other than that. And i agree with what you say but in these days i find women are all too eager to ask me out, i don't mind that it just shows that she isn't afraid to go after something that interest her, that's cool. i will take your advice and pay homage to Sekhmet she is powerful,strong and fearless in protecting Isis/Aset, although Aset/Isis is my goddess of magic and knows the secret name of Ra (may she always protect me) she is also the mother of life and eternal life. I'll have to commit these colors to memory but if not then i guess i won't look too stupid sitting there reading a small peice of paper while mumbling softly...LOL...i guess your friend won't be the only one being escorted out the door..LOL. I will have to think about what i want i usually just go for the things i truly need right now.
Em Hotep my Friend

[Tigerwallah]

Originally posted by adrian
I'll have to commit these colors to memory but if not then i guess i won't look too stupid sitting there reading a small peice of paper while mumbling softly...LOL...i guess your friend won't be the only one being escorted out the door..LOL. I will have to think about what i want i usually just go for the things i truly need right now.
Em Hotep my Friend



Roy. G. Biv = red, orange, yellow, green, blue, indigo, violet

smart to just ask for what you need. I asked Isis last week to help me stick to my diet. This week I'm suffering from Gall bladder attacks (I've had gall bladder disease since 1987, but have not had an attack since 1997). I'm pretty much unable to eat anything but some bread and jello. I was hoping for will power. Sometimes she does take things to extreams. It's stick to my diet or suffer 18 hours of torturous pain and vomitting. Yeesh!

[adrian]

Now i have something to ask for...i'm really sorry to hear of your illness, i shall pray for your recovery as you have a shinning spirit that is bright even here...and thank you for that little...Roy G. Biv
that is really helpful.
As i must rest so must you, may sekhmet embrace you sharing with you her strength.
Em Hotep

[Tigerwallah]

Originally posted by adrian
Now i have something to ask for...i'm really sorry to hear of your illness, i shall pray for your recovery as you have a shinning spirit that is bright even here...and thank you for that little...Roy G. Biv
that is really helpful.
As i must rest so must you, may sekhmet embrace you sharing with you her strength.
Em Hotep

Thanks, Adrian. You are a great friend.

[LaDaya]

:eek: :D I know it's not funny... lol... but be careful what you wish for... You just might get it!! Although in my case the God/ess(e(s) don't seem to be in any kind of hurry to help me with my diet plans... sheesh.... Although I don't think I would want to have gall bladder problems... no thanks... I'll stick to trying to get the willpower to work out more than once a year.... :rolleyes: :uzi:

[widukind]

I seem to have , yet again, discovered an interesting thread at the final stages... dang.

Oh well, here goes.

In my opinion, the Gods and Goddesses of the now are not those of the past. I believe there is very much truth in the Inca prophecies that the gods have died but will once again become real when the first new Inca arises.

When I say dead, I don't mean dead-dead. I mean lingering spirit rather than incarnated spirit. How I see it - and this is recurrent in most mythologies, the Gods were first very powerful beings, the Inca, that could use their energy to its full potential, being able to change reality as they saw fit, living in harmony with nature's energy flow and its cycles. They walked the earth like humans did (like in Viking mythology) and were recognisable because of their energy fields, auras, energy bubbles, call it what you will. At the end of their lifespan, which I believe to be at least four times as long as any human's, they died and their energy got sent out into nature.

At this present time, the dead Gods are nature spirits, and are in fact androgynous, because they are 'merely' spirits without a material body. We feel their presence and they can awaken wisdom, insight and power in us. They still protect and serve the balance of nature, as they did before.

As in the Inca prophecies, below and at the third circle, all of us fear and serve the Gods. This was the case in medieval times, and is still the case in some communities. Then, at the fourth circle, we learn to perceive the spirits as our friends and guides. We can request things of them, and they of us, but we are no longer determined by their presence, we are free to do as we wish, but by keeping the friendship with these beings, we live in harmony with nature's ways.

The Gods can become corporeal once again, when humans find a way to move to their level of conscience, descried as the sixth circle in the prophecies of the Q' Eros, the last descendants of the Inca. At this level, we will be able to become the new Inca, and we will be complete. We will be nature and nature will be us, we will be energy and energy us. All of our potential will be unlocked.

That's how I view things, I'll leave you to judging its veracity.

Brightest Blessings!

Widukind

[Mythrel]

Naillosotarrain I have read the entire Sword Series and Lost Sword series by Fred Saberhagen, excellent books. And I tend to agree with the thinking that the mind is the most powerful thing in the universe. I also tend to think that in a way, we created the gods/goddesses and then destroyed them when we didn't like them anymore. Be it through Crusades, genocide, or just not caring anymore, I believe that humans can weild such immense power. I like the last post by Widukind, it makes me think...imagine that... I like the part about being one with energy and energy being one with us. I have my own beliefs about who I choose to worship(not going into it now) and the major thing that I truly believe in is Energy! I believe we can control energy in benifical ways as well as detrimental. I believe that we can tap energy from just about any source, be it a desk or from a plant, etc. I believe that because of this, people unconsciously willed the gods and goddesses into existence but also managed to destroy most of them. I think few gods and goddesses exist right now. But then I start to self examine and I find that I can't believe in a big bang theory. I still believe some entity created the universe and us. I can't believe that for no apparent reason, nothing became something without any help. Anyway, I have typed way too much, I think I have lost what was left of my mind....

[Mythrel]

I am back again, I posted the last at work and on the way home from work I was still thinking about this thread. I remembered a lot being said about perfection. This caused me to think about gods and goddesses to determine if they were all perfect, the answer NO. This leads me to think that in a way we did create the gods and goddesses due to the fact that we are not perfect beings, and therefore the deities also were not. Look at most ancient pantheons, the gods and goddesses were petty, fought amongst themselves, toyed with humanity, had flaws of character and of physical appearance in some cases...I don't know, I am starting to ramble...later

Mythrel

[Tigerwallah]

I have difficulty believing that humans, as imperfect as we are could recognize perfection. Look at nature. Nature is perfect, but we destroy it trying to improve upon it. I believe that the goddess (In my case, Isis) created nature and is of nature, therefor, is perfect. I don't believe that the human mind created the gods. I believe that the gods reveal themselves to us in such a way that it could appear that we "invented" them, but in actuallity, they just whispered in our ear.

[Mythrel]

Interesting Tigerwallah giving me food for thought...

[Naillosotarrain]

Is Nautre really perfect, or is it just so close that one might actually have trouble discerning it? For if it was, then why would it let us destroy it in such a manor? And, as Tigerwallah said, "I have difficulty believing that humans, as imperfect as we are could recognize perfection." If that is true, then how how would you be able to discern whether or not Nature is perfect? For as I said before, "Perfection is the only perfection, it can never be achieved, and whenever it is achieved it always backfires, therefore becoming imperfect." A paradox of life, but quite true if you think about it.

[ELM]

We can not destroy nature. We do not destroy nature. We destroy areas of natural beauty and when we do this nature responds by inventing new deterants, diseases, etc. If we invent a pesticide, she makes the pests more resiliant. If we misuse our resources she refuses to feed us. What ever produce of hers we destroy, she continues to produce and destroy. If the human race die, and all the other living creatures on this planet, and all the trees die, nature will continue, nature can not die.
Just a point.

[Tigerwallah]

I have a geologist friend who insists the same thing. Whenever I lament over our mistreatment of the earth and nature she reassures me that nature forever replenishes herself. We lose species and then new ones are discovered, we lose rainforest, but history has shown that areas that were desert can become rainforest and areas, like ancient Egypt, which were lush in vegetation could become barren desert.

Naillostarrian, you are correct that I am only assuming that nature is perfect. However, I am certain that all of the inventions of man to improve on nature do not improve anything but our standard of living, and even that I am uncertain of. Frankly, I think all of our inventions just make our lives easier so that we can work harder and longer hours. Not an improvement if you ask me.

Back to the gods, It seems that most of them are of nature, and yet there are many that are more like us, forever trying to find something better. The Dahli Lahma says that one will only find true happiness when he/she learns to appreciate what they have, and not yearn for more. Maybe that is also the key to recognizing perfection, and attaining it.

[mol]

Originally posted by Tigerwallah
I have difficulty believing that humans, as imperfect as we are could recognize perfection. Look at nature. Nature is perfect, but we destroy it trying to improve upon it. I believe that the goddess (In my case, Isis) created nature and is of nature, therefor, is perfect. I don't believe that the human mind created the gods. I believe that the gods reveal themselves to us in such a way that it could appear that we "invented" them, but in actuallity, they just whispered in our ear.



Very good point. I usually see us as not trying to Improve nature, so to speak, but to make it more Convenient for us. In which I usually think, 'What price for convenience?'

[Tigerwallah]

Originally posted by mol


Very good point. I usually see us as not trying to Improve nature, so to speak, but to make it more Convenient for us. In which I usually think, 'What price for convenience?'

Exactly. Even our convenience has a price for us. These days, it seems as if we create technology to make our lives easier so that we can pour more of our time into working to make the money to buy more things to make our lives more convenient and allow us to spend more time working. Yeesh!!! That's why I quit corporate America last year.

We try to make nature more suited to human needs and forget all else. Yesterday my local radio station interviewed an older couple who remembered life without the convenience of air conditioning, a device we can't live without. They both said that they didn't remember it being so bad, and that we've all gone soft. Funny, we didn't need it until we had it.

[Brigittesag]

Silverwitch ,I am a 12 year old girl and think that they are real.If u don't think they are real,then are your Gods real.I don't meen to be mean but peopel worship them still.