Shamanism

[MoonRat]

Are there any Shamans here? Or people with knowledge of Shamanism?

It's something that I feel drawn to, though I don't really know if I can handle the pain aspect...

But surely this path has a lot to offer, if only to learn from.

[semi]

I know a little bit. Feel free to PM me or post here. A few other folks here are very skilled in shamanism. You'll find them.


And pain is good. Makes you strong. Makes you learn.

[lonewhitewolf]

I started toward the shamanistic path last August. I was interested in it for a while. I discovered the New Age store by me was having a Shamanism Journey Circle. So I went. After my first journey, it felt like I had come home. For a long time I had wondered what my path was and now I knew. I now go every month.


-Jessica [aka Whitewolf]

[Bix]

Is a shaman somebody that does a lot of trance work and works with their ancestors a lot?

[SkySilver]

I would love to practice Shamanism. Just figuring out where to start is the challenge for me now.

One question for semi: :) When you guys talk about "pain"... what sort of pain are you referring to? Keep in mind I've only read one book on Shamanism. So I'm still very much in the "baby stage" of learning now.

[semi]

I am not an expert. This is just based on personal experience and conversations with others.

Many people drawn to a shamanic path have had some sort of trauma, be it a sickness or a violent event or whatever, that has left them wounded spiritually and/or psychologically. This breaking of the person seems to open them up a little, or a lot, to shamanic skills. In more primitive days, a shaman-in-training would go off into the wilderness alone for awhile or have to endure various hardships, all forced on the young one by the mentor. But most people don't live in societies like that anymore. It's hard to find training and initiation.

So life itself is the initiation. People undergo hardships and choose to react to them in certain ways. Sometimes it hurts a lot, but choosing to accept these things as gifts meant to make you strong and help you grow is necessary, in my opinion, to pursue this path. The destruction of the Ego is a popular way of defining this process. When the self is shattered, the unnecessary bits of the self are more easily removed. Without trauma, you might remain whole, but often this type of wholeness is more like a fully plugged up drain than a healthy way of being. It's like dead stagnant energy. Pain helps break this up and frees energy and allows you to gradually reshape yourself into a healthy whole being.

So the pain that I mention is just the process of initiation brought on by simply being alive and pursuing a particular path. Instead of going out into the wilderness, a person may exist in a more personal wilderness, like feeling alone and distant from everyone else. Many people have many complaints about how difficult life is, about how they just want to be happy. Well, happiness comes with being healthily whole. Sometimes you can't become whole without being destroyed first. Even though you may be working alone with no mentor, you are still being initiated and it usually hurts. It's the method of payment to obtain the skills. They're not free.

I hope this makes sense. I'm very sleepy right now.

[SkySilver]

Yes! it most definitely makes sense.

I relate to the pain you're talking about having been through a few painful experiences in life. There is one particular experience that comes to mind for me where I felt totally shattered. Rebuilding has been a mission ever since! It was an abusive relationship.... mostly verbal abuse. The part that was traumatic for me was when I began to lose my sense of self. I was empty inside for a long time. I lost the ability to love and the ability to notice when love was being directed at me. Shattered is a perfect word for how I felt. Even though this happened to me years ago, I never really was able to deal with the pain. I have recovered a lot since then but there is still lots of work to do.

Maybe my attraction to Shamanism is a spiritual calling. The very word seems to pull at me. I would really love to pursue this. Like I said before I've only read one book on the topic. I know there are many books out there but if there are people here on this forum that I could chat with, I'm sure that would be very helpful as well.

Thanks for the explanation. I knew I could count on you to give me a clear answer about the pain thing. I always enjoy reading your posts. :floating:

[SnowyMoon]

*bump*

There has to be more on this path around here. I am interested in learning more. In fact, "my shaman," who came to me in a dream years ago, was what first prompted me to take a good look at myself and then change directions; it is when I first began to study Paganism.

I was born with very poor eyesight (LASIK is wonderful!) and have endured a very hard childhood. I have also had to deal with physical and spiritual illnesses. This path seems to keep calling to me.

[Shanti]

*bump*

There has to be more on this path around here. I am interested in learning more. In fact, "my shaman," who came to me in a dream years ago, was what first prompted me to take a good look at myself and then change directions; it is when I first began to study Paganism.

I was born with very poor eyesight (LASIK is wonderful!) and have endured a very hard childhood. I have also had to deal with physical and spiritual illnesses. This path seems to keep calling to me.
Yes there are but in my case there isn't anything to talk about. I didn't pick it as a path I was given it. I died, got jump started by the docs and ever since its a part of my life. As having it given to me I cant help anyone find their way as I didn't find mine.
The help I have encountered for my understanding and growing within the skill, came from direct one on one guidance through another.

Sorry but I don't feel its right for me to share much as there isn't much I know how to share.

[Childof_theMorrigan]

funny this thread comes up again...

I just had a psychometry reading on Sunday and she in a nutshell said I should look into shamanism. I'd be interested in what others have to say about this path, books to read etc. and if anyone tells me to read anything by D.J. Conway I'm going to run for the hills.... :P

[Silver Crow2]

Is a shaman somebody that does a lot of trance work and works with their ancestors a lot?


Shaman(s) tend to do a lot of trance work. So do other folks.

Ancestors (and other dead people) optional :hahugh:

If you attempt to walk down a path that includes shamanistic practices (for lack of a better set of terms) you will be confronted with your own shadows.
Shadow work isn't optional - it is required.

enjoy the journey

Bill

[Silver Crow2]

funny this thread comes up again...

I just had a psychometry reading on Sunday and she in a nutshell said I should look into shamanism. I'd be interested in what others have to say about this path, books to read etc. and if anyone tells me to read anything by D.J. Conway I'm going to run for the hills.... :P

anything by Kristen Madden

http://kristinmadden.com/

[Childof_theMorrigan]

anything by Kristen Madden

http://kristinmadden.com/

thanks!

[SnowyMoon]

I am in my shadow self confrontation phase now. Scary $%#$% stuff!! Led me down through the depths of the darkest depression. I did not choose it, it chose me as well.

I have yet to pick up a book on Shamanism. I have heard The Way of the Shaman is a good one. Any thoughts on that particular book?

[Silver Crow2]

Excellent book, Way of the Shaman. Primarily based on south american experience, with some cross referencing of other traditions.

Madden's works I have already recommended. She is of Sammi (lapland) descent.

It is entirely possible you don't need any books :)

[Tabbykitty]

Are there any Shamans here? Or people with knowledge of Shamanism?

It's something that I feel drawn to, though I don't really know if I can handle the pain aspect...

But surely this path has a lot to offer, if only to learn from.

Hi MoonRat,


I think someone posted this link on MW before, but its does provide some interesting information about classic shamanism vs core shamanism....

URL Link: http://www.cauldronfarm.com/writing/shaman_compare.html

where i come from, shamans are usually born shaman... as in it is their fate and karma and very very few of them actually want to be in this kind of life, but usually they have no choice because they are somehow compelled to take it up either by the spirits they serve or because they can see no other solution.

Hopefully the article link can shed some light on shaman beliefs.

[Silver Crow2]

Speaking of the Way of the Shaman.....the author (Harner) has a drumming CD out now. It is most excellent! I highly recommend it. I journey better to drumming - that is, someone else drumming. Now someone else can be the cd player.

[omar]

I have Shamanic Drumming by Kenneth Meadows & Shamanic Journeying by Sandra Ingerman,both on CD's & Soul Retrieval Journey by S. Ingerman on cassettes.

[~Owl~]

Sorry, I know I really should read through all the post first before I reply to most questions, but to answer a question such as yours, I believe is up to the individual, and not based upon the subjective attitude he or she (she in my case) may get from reading others' answers.

That said, I am a witch. I also practice Shamanism, and have some moderate knowledge of it, and hold high respect for it. Years back, I had met with a Shamaness through my place of employment, when the first day we met, we looked each other straight in the eye and both of us knew, knew, that there was...something about the other that was something... different about the other.

Within a month, we had become best friends...exchanging books and knowledge, she had always wanted to study REAL witchcraft, not the commercial "Wicca" that was being sold at the stores, not that there is anything wrong with it, (well...) just that after reading the same material in a different book time after time, she knew that there was something more, that wasn't being spoken of. I happened to point out to her the similarities in some of the "best" books on Shamanism, and modern Druidry. She let out a heart felt, and sympathtic laugh, and it was then that I could tell she was the real thing, a rarety nowadays...

She agreed with me on many, many things. We spent a good many year, after year, talking about such Mysteries.

Strange how close the tapestries of Life are so closely woven together, and how they cross stitch each other's experiences, binding them together, whether it be for just a moment, or a lifetime, or anywhere in between...

[WarriorZhanna]

Now I do not classify myself as a Shaman, I could but it's hard to be a Shaman between four walls if you know what I mean. I do use some Shamanic techniques in healing though, and I have quite a lot of knowledge of Shamanism. Feel free to PM me if you have any questions regarding this path, and yes indeed it is not an easy path to follow.

Also, if you are interested in Shamanic music, try listen to an album called "Shaman" by Phil Thornton, it has truly inspired me with the sound of nature, animals and the drum.

Blessings and Light,
~Moonchild

[~Owl~]

Now I do not classify myself as a Shaman, I could but it's hard to be a Shaman between four walls if you know what I mean. I do use some Shamanic techniques in healing though, and I have quite a lot of knowledge of Shamanism. Feel free to PM me if you have any questions regarding this path, and yes indeed it is not an easy path to follow.

Also, if you are interested in Shamanic music, try listen to an album called "Shaman" by Phil Thornton, it has truly inspired me with the sound of nature, animals and the drum.

Blessings and Light,
~Moonchild

Instead of breaking up these quotes, I have decided to leave this intact.

With that said, would you mind clarifying a bit more on your post?

Some quotes that I don't necessarily agree with are:

..."It's hard to be a Shaman between four walls..."
"I have quite a lot of knowledge of Shamanism"Now, please don't be offended, Moonchild, for I do not necessarliy like labels, although I myself could list a page of them if I wished to identify myself, but the mention of being difficult to practice a shamanic path between four walls, and having "quite a lot" of knowledge of such a path seems rather contradictory to me, therefore I would like you to possibly re-examine how you wrote this, for I don't believe it was intentional.

Indeed, it would be more comfortable to practice out in the open, outside on a hilltop surronded by a circle of stones, a feather, a vessel of water held in a wooden cup, etc... yet the same thing could be said about practicing witchcraft, although we have been doing it for centuries, even when it was/is possible to practice outdoors.

Paths such as Druidry, Shamanism, and witchcraft, in my opinion, are not bound by space (matter) or time.

You will note that I prefer NOT to cap (capitalize) witchcraft with a W, for one, I do not believe it to be a religion per say, as is Wicca, and I am not Wiccan, although I know many who DO cap witchcraft for many reasons, such as the opinion that they DO consider witchcraft a religion, consider it to be the same thing as Wicca, and so on.

Even my own former mentor, who initiated me over 20 years ago, and taught me the orally taught, oathbound, secretive, nearly 100 year old(as it is known, anyway, possibly much older) Tradional Pictish withcraft, after myself being brought up in a family of folk magic, healers, psychics, seers, etc... he believes it to be this way, and to this day we still argue about it, ;), but we still respect that each other, as well as everyone, even if we disagree with them strongly, we respect the fact that they are each, and ALL, are entitled to their own opinion.

In Shamanism, vision quests are a large part of ritual practice.
I too, do not consider myself a shamaness, yet I practice many different paths in my spiritual life, including witchcraft, shamanism, voodoo, hoodoo, etc.

As well as Astrology, many different areas of divination, I Ching, Tarot, Psychometry, etc.

Therefore, as my primary disagreement is that being physically bound by 4 walls somehow 'hinders' your shamanic abilities, is not unlike saying that many Gardnerians, Alexandrians, and their offshoots practice skyclad, (nude) for clothing 'hinders' their magickal abilities. Now, to me, I find this notion...well, disagreeable. Let's leave it that.
Everyone is entitled to their own beliefs. But since you have written such an opinion as a stated fact, as I read it, I ask you, therefore, to possibly clarify it for me, and to any other readers, especially those just starting out on the path, who might take your opinion AS fact.

[~Owl~]

I would add an edit to my previous post, but since I had re-worded, and re-spelled many a word in the last two posts, ( I know, people, I'm a TERRIBLE speller on the keyboard- I CAN spell, just that I happen to be a LOUSY typist! I'm fast, just not very accurate, especially since this keyboard is so old now, that the space bar, is practically defunct, so I have to SLAM down on it with my thumb to make it space right sometimes, and many of the letters on the keyboard are now missing, so I have to rey on my sense of knowlege of typing class all the way back in High School back when I was a sophomore!!!

OK, now I'm rambling...what was it that I was going to say in the first place???

OH! OK, now I remember...

I have NOW read through all the posts on here, and merely wanted to add that the book, Way Of The Shaman, is an EXCELLENT book, and that I would highly recommend it for anyone wanting to learn more about Shamanism.

Also, since a huge part of the path is working with your animal sprit guides, or "Totems", as my Primary one is the Great Horned Owl, obviously, a link you might wish to visit to understand more of the virtues of the different totems, (and BTW, I would recommend you find your totems first and/or have some type of awareness or interest in a certain animal, as that is more than likely your prominent totem trying to reach out to you, before you read through this site) is this:
[Totem Animal Spirits Index] (http://www.geocities.com/RainForest/4076/index1.html). Simply click on this link, and scroll through the various different animal spirits...after much studying, and asking different individuals what "their" favorite animal was, then looking up the most popular virutes, there you will find everything from the otter, to the cockroach, even the virus, and bacteria, I believe!


-EDIT-

I HIGHLY recommend that you read and scroll through ALL of the sites information that it has. If you look at some of the site's authors, contributors, and general maintainers, you JUST might notice one or two familiar "names". ;)

[Eldred Grimm]

I don't really know if I can handle the pain aspect...

with out pian there is no growth
the pain is a just gift an offering to the spirt world so they will know we are werthy

[Vigdisdotter]

Are there any Shamans here? Or people with knowledge of Shamanism?

<raises hand>

I've only recently started calling myself a Shaman as it's a title others have given to me.

But I'm happy to try and answer what questions you might have.

My shamanic practise is closer the European form then the North American, if that matters.

[Vigdisdotter]

I would love to practice Shamanism. Just figuring out where to start is the challenge for me now.

Why not start with figuring out what version of Shamanism works best for you?

One question for semi: :) When you guys talk about "pain"... what sort of pain are you referring to?

I'm not Semi obviously but I'll answer this.

Pain is the signal that the mind, body and soul give us when we're doing something wrong, something that hurts us.

When you start on the shamanic path you will NOT do it all right on the first try. There will be a lot that is "wrong" and hence it will manifest as pain: Physical, mental, and emotional.

One thing to keep in mind about this path is that Shamans are called the wounded healers for a reason. The best way to be able to address another's pain is if you've experienced it yourself and can relate to the space they are in. It is then that you can help them find the way out.

Then of course you have the concept of shamanic death but that's a biggy and might need it's own thread.

Keep in mind I've only read one book on Shamanism. So I'm still very much in the "baby stage" of learning now.

Which book? I've got a few I could recommend if you like :)

[wolf]

YMMV, but ... Harner's notion of "core" Shamanism removes the cultural spiritual elements from Shamanic practice, to the point where it becomes unusable.

For good, basic information, it doesn't hurt to start with Sun Bear's teachings.

[Vigdisdotter]

and if anyone tells me to read anything by D.J. Conway I'm going to run for the hills.... :P

<blinks innocently> but DJ Conway is GREAT <coughcough> :P

The three I would suggest are Shamanism by Tom Cowan, Singing the Soul Back Home by Caitlin Matthews, Stone Age Wisdom by Tom Crockett.

[Vigdisdotter]

I have heard The Way of the Shaman is a good one. Any thoughts on that particular book?

It's a decent enough book, but I was disappointed that after having styled itself as "Core Shamanism" it had a decidedly strong focus on North and South American practises and thought.

[omar]

Writers on Shamanism-Harner(oldest),Madden,Wolfe, Sarangel,P. Vitebsky & Ken Meadows.

[Eldred Grimm]

there is a grate manizen called Samans Drum
you can order on line I think check it out

[SnowyMoon]

Well, I finally acknowledged the call and accepted my path. Of course, this is only the beginning and yet it is not, as I have really been on this path since the start of my life (I see that clearly now). I am in training, and yeah...getting things wrong in the beginning. Ouch. :weirdsmil I am reading some books, but my main teaching is being done by spirits. It is amazing to find things in books that relate to what I have already experienced or have been doing automatically.

Thank you for the drumming CD recommendations. I love having an iPod for such things, since I don't have a drummer...for now, anyway.

[MonSno_LeeDra]

I don't claim the title myself but have been called one by others so I guess to some extent I am.

Pain takes on many forms and can be experienced in many venues. One form that seems to be frequently over looked is that of sensory depravation. I recall instances of people being wrapped in blankets or hides and then left to have their mental journey used as a release to acheive their realm walking journey.

The fact the blanket or hide is smoothering in nature and binds the body and apendages makes it one form of sensory depravation that can be used to great extent.

Ironically, water can be used if you blind the eyes. The very fact that the water touches everything makes it depriving for you don't then know what is real or wht is imagined. You don't know what it was that just touched you so have to project outward with the mind or let the "Speculation" run rampant and imagine what it was.

A sweat lodge or sweat ceremony is another form of sensory depravation that can be painful. Most of the time the sweat is done with steam and hot rocks but I have seen it done with smoke. Figure in the burning in the lungs, the burning and tears in the eyes, the heat, the disorientation from smoke and vision reduction and you can get picture.

I will advice don't use smoke without caution for it can kill if done wrong.

One thing that did stick out was another poster spoke of life fragmenting. It maybe different for others but I was taught that is not Shamantic or pain in a shamantic concept. The fragment is like the journey to the shadow self where one must look at the whole picture of "self". Yes it is painful in that it reveals things about ourselves we often wish left unseen or buried but that then becomes part of our exploration of self.

My teacher told me any pain inflicted by self or threw self action was a step in self realization. Any pain inflicted by another or greater power was part of the preparation for awakening the "Sleeper" that resided within. If it threatened the very essence of life then it was the door being opened to reveal the bridge of realms.

Three sources of pain, three different purposes for three different results. The totality of the whole the Shamanic life path.

This is of course just my opinion so others may agree or disagree. But the mere fact you have read this places one more silver thread in action.

[Lupabitch]

Well, I finally acknowledged the call and accepted my path. Of course, this is only the beginning and yet it is not, as I have really been on this path since the start of my life (I see that clearly now). I am in training, and yeah...getting things wrong in the beginning. Ouch. :weirdsmil I am reading some books, but my main teaching is being done by spirits. It is amazing to find things in books that relate to what I have already experienced or have been doing automatically.

Thank you for the drumming CD recommendations. I love having an iPod for such things, since I don't have a drummer...for now, anyway.

*nods* I'm going through the same thing, primarily spirit-trained with some books for context. I also enjoy talking to other shamanic practitioners, which helps give me more focus on what I'm doing.

What are you reading, if I may be ever so nosy?

[SnowyMoon]

I am reading The Way of the Shaman by Michael Harner first. I have Beyond 2012 (A Shaman's Call to Personal Change and the Transformation of Global Consciousness), by James Endredy lined up after that, as it deals with the time of cleansing that I have been sensing and a few others I have had contact with have been sensing. Looked like a great book. After that, I have Shamanic Spirit by Kenneth Meadows. I just picked up that book yesterday. That book came with a CD of drumming, which I am really happy with. There are only 2 journey drumming tracks on there, but they are very efficient, IMO. I like them. :hahugh: They will do for now.

I want to read as many books as I can eventually, and I am just going with the flow. The spirits are the teachers, the books are just the supplementary text study for me--um, an addition to the main course, so to speak. :)

[Lupabitch]

James Endredy is made of awesome--you need to read Ecoshamanism, too! I haven't read his new one, yet, but it is on my list.

I have some other suggestions on shamanism at http://lupabitch.wordpress.com/category/shamanism/ and if you're interested in totemism and animal magic, there are reviews at http://lupabitch.wordpress.com/category/animal-magic/ .

The books I consider essential are Ecoshamanism, as mentioned, The Shaman by Piers Vitebsky, Shamanism by Mircea Eliade, and The Spirit of Shamanism by Roger Walsh. However, that's just for starters.

For me, the books give me theory, and the spirits help me through practice. I do find it exceptionally helpful to trade note with other shamanic practitioners, though, because sometimes they come up with perspectives I never would have thought of. It's especially crucial in my situation, since I live in a culture where there is no inherent cultural shamanism or shamanic cosmology--there's core shamanism, but I find it insufficient for my needs (though it's fine for other people). I know what Harner was trying to do, but I think there needs to be more to it, if that makes sense.

Are you on Livejournal at all?

[SnowyMoon]

Thank you for the book recommendations. They are on the list. They all really look good and just what I need to read.


For me, the books give me theory, and the spirits help me through practice. I do find it exceptionally helpful to trade note with other shamanic practitioners, though, because sometimes they come up with perspectives I never would have thought of. It's especially crucial in my situation, since I live in a culture where there is no inherent cultural shamanism or shamanic cosmology
Yes! I know what you mean by what you have written there. Also, where I am there is no Shamanic culture either...at all.