Divination Weekly Topic ~ Can you spot a con?

[Hope]

Ok the weekly topics are a great place for everyone to share their thoughts or questions on a certain topic about divination. Hopefully we can learn or share something new for ourselves or others.


This week:

How do you know a con artist when you meet one, what tips can you offer to others so they won't be a victim of a person who uses divination concepts, just to fleece folks for their cash?

If you have a suggestion for a weekly Divination topic, please PM me.


love
hope

[SwordsFlameSong]

How big of a rant do you want?

Okay. This is not flaming.

I once belonged to a coven. I had been solitary for years and years and got it into my head that it would be nice to hang with others like me and do stuff together yeah.

Turns out there was this New Age store in town. I check it out one day. Get to know the owner - or so I think - and eventually decide to take the 100 level class because that was the only way to get into the coven.

Things I learned:

1) When the coven members are all recovering addicts with low self-esteem there could be a problem.
2) When someone claims to be adept at all sorts of pagan things and calls themselves a HP and can't provide adequate proof. Question some more.
3) If someone is charging you 250.00 plus for a class the odds are they are in it for the money.
4) When someone claims that they can tell you about your past lives for 300.00 question.
5) When someone charges 200.00 for a pet aura cleansing. Question.
6) When someone charges 100.00 for a tarot reading. Question.
7) When someone tells you that your experiences and abilities are not important unless you take their classes. Question.
8) When rituals are comprised of the coven members facing the HP - not in a circle - and the HP goes on and on about how she is divine and why we should worship her. Question
9) Keep in mind that New Age also = $$$$$$. Question.
10) If you get bad vibes off someone don't tell yourself you are imagining it. Listen and get out.
11) Tarot readings is mostly psychology. Listen to a reader once and the questions they ask - a good reader will help guide you they won't tell you that this is this without including you. (IMHO)
12) When someone claims to be a ghost hunter and shows you pictures of the spirits they have captured. Question - especially if the "ghost" appears to be her friend with her hair greased back.
13) If someone isn't willing to provide references. Question.
14) If someone tells you that they need to do multiple sessions with you and each one is priced separately. Question

On lunch at work so that is all I can come up with for now.

[Hope]

12) When someone claims to be a ghost hunter and shows you pictures of the spirits they have captured. Question - especially if the "ghost" appears to be her friend with her hair greased back.



ROFL umm ok when i can stop laughing LOL i will be back lol

(((hugs))) i do adore you swordsflame song

lol


love
hope

[Mercedes]

Well, I'm definitely no expert at catching who is a con and who isn't, but just to play it safe, I almost assume that everyone may be a con. I don't mean that I think badly of people; it's just that I don't take what everyone says as a "law" of some sort.

I stay away from people who charge money period. I don't usually need someone else to read my cards for me.

[SageofThyme]

Well, I'm definitely no expert at catching who is a con and who isn't, but just to play it safe, I almost assume that everyone may be a con. I don't mean that I think badly of people; it's just that I don't take what everyone says as a "law" of some sort.

I stay away from people who charge money period. I don't usually need someone else to read my cards for me.

:yayah: I'm so glad I'm not the only one who trusts nobody....in my experience the ones who blow their own trumpets the loudest are the biggest con (including some well known/celebrity people I've come across) if they are good they won't need to advertise

Actually the best readers I've met was a doorman who wasn't official allowed to give out readings as a psychic fayre (therefore didn't charge and I can't name him or he'll lose his job), a woman from the local spiritualist church (who again didn't charge and gave me me a private reading then a reading during her demo) and a local guy who did charge but was the cheapest I've ever seen and offered a full refund if I was unhappy (well actually didn't take the money til after the reading and I said I was happy to pay him)

[SageofThyme]

ohh just mthought I did get a reading from a semi-celebrity witch....but again didn't pay and didn't ask

So my advice would be trust nobody until they have proved themselves

[SwordsFlameSong]

ohh just mthought I did get a reading from a semi-celebrity witch....but again didn't pay and didn't ask

So my advice would be trust nobody until they have proved themselves

Fine advice.:cheers:

[SwordsFlameSong]

ROFL umm ok when i can stop laughing LOL i will be back lol

(((hugs))) i do adore you swordsflame song

lol


love
hope
I do aim to please. Though each thing listed is something I have experienced. Good thing I was too much for her. Not much of "Yes M'am" kind of person. I tend to think first.

I can also say - if someone tells you the Goddess has spoken to her and told her that your newborn daughter will suffer from a serious and near fatal stomach ailment by the age of five and only she can save her. Not traditional methods and she will make sure you can afford it. Run like heck.

For the record the only stomach issue my daughter has had (first grade now) is keeping it full. She has hollow toes I tell ya.

Oh, and if you have a cute spouse who is handy with building things - and he isn't a practicing pagan and made welcome and you catch the HP patting his butt and offering to give him a special life reading at low cost. Trust me another question mark.

Not meaning to flame on covens but this experience deepened my cynical nature no end. I have a problem with charlatans.
A really big problem with charlatans. _wedgie_

She has made ALOT of money off the susceptible, the ones needing hope. She isn't anywhere near what she says she is.

But as noted - there are some good ones out there. And the honorable ones will give you an out and their services will be affordable.

[Hope]

we have had some really excellent answers so far!


and it is so true that things that may seem amazing, can be said with great seriousness by a con

some other signs are things like at the last minute of your reading telling you a "tease" of something BIG so you need to come back (and pay again) for the "rest of the story"


or when they need you to tell them the whole story so they can tell it back to you

smiles

this was a great topic choice i think

love
hope

[SwordsFlameSong]

we have had some really excellent answers so far!


and it is so true that things that may seem amazing, can be said with great seriousness by a con

some other signs are things like at the last minute of your reading telling you a "tease" of something BIG so you need to come back (and pay again) for the "rest of the story"


or when they need you to tell them the whole story so they can tell it back to you

smiles

this was a great topic choice i think

love
hope

Or they don't practice what they preach. So to speak.

The interesting thing about tarot - and I have been doing readings for about 24 years - it's mostly psychology. And intuition. For those who are sincere in what they are doing.

I took some courses in college that dealt with the psychology of religion and symbolism. The human mind associates things with symbols. And if you have watched a tarot reader you will note that they ask many leading questions. For a sincere reader this allows them to deepen the meanings of the cards, and the layout for the inquirer.

For an insincere reader or a con, it is as you noted Hope, they parrot it back at you and really tell you nothing.

When I do a reading for someone I don't want to know what their question is. I don't ask questions either. Though I will ask if they are comfortable with my rendition of each card etc and ask if they need more information. I tell them in depth what each card means in regards to it's symbolism and where it falls in the layout. I also tell them how they work together. 99% of the time they leave saying I nailed it on the head and the issue seemed clearer. I am not the person who nailed it. Their perception of the issue and how the symbolism of the cards apply to it is what nailed it on the head. Whatever it was in the reading something was clarified for them.

I don't charge normally. Though one Samhain - at work - I was talked into doing tarot readings during the day and I charged a dollar each and that dollar they had to put in our charity casual day kitty that was the next day. We have charity casual days. That casual day our department gave over twice of what we usually give

[Anubis]

If people start asking you questions.. ie: Is there someone in your family or someone you know who's name begins with an "M"... run away.. (I mean who the heck doesn't know someone?)

If they start with common ailments... "I feel a pressure around the chest area.." .. well.. duh?.. A large number of people die from heart attacks or injuries to the chest area.. or another good one.. "there was something wrong with their blood" they will use that to explain everything from heart attacks to kidney damage.. and if they start telling you about back pain.. uh.. please....

"I see an older person around you.. could this be a loved one who has passed on?" .. no.. it's the milkman... or a telemarketer who just won't quit

And I LOVE the ones who offer to do a spell for you... especially when they start telling you that you have been cursed... oh yeah.. we have all been cursed (mainly by our mothers who wished that someday we would have a child of our own who acts just like us to deal with...)

When they start asking to hold a personal item then tell you that someone you love has been cursed.. heck if they mention a curse period .. run away

anyone who has a 900 #... yeah..I have alot of faith in those guys...

anyone who insists that the death card is a warning that someone you love will die... well.. unless they are all immortals they're gonna die sooner or later.. so TECHNICALLY they are right... (and no that isn't what the death card menas)

anyone who has the "over the top spooky super witchy fortune card palm reading tea leaf reading" reading room set up to do readings.. these are the ones who have a crystal ball prominently displayed (and have no clue how to scry).. mood lighting and the new agey music playing quietly in the background along with all the other super cool witchy palm reading stuff... or better yet a human skull next to their tarot cards (ok.. so some of us like the funky cool stuff.. but when it's called "the reading room"... run.. besides in my family "the reading room" was the bathroom.. and it's not where I would recommend to do your readings)

you're better off going to the cat lady down the street cause she's probably more of a witch than the one with the big neon lighted palm out front (hand type.. not plant type palm for those of you who may need some clarification)

Anyone who is on tv claiming that their's is a gift from god and charges big bucks to do a reading over the phone...

Anyone on tv who has their own show...

Anyone who starts telling you about your past lives and comes up with things that do not jive with history or are just plain bizarre... run away.. no we were not all Cleopatera... and no, chances are you were not a sparkling pink fluffy fairy who lived in a land of rose colored skies...

And there's more.. but I'm just starting on my first cup of tea

[tarotgirljess]

Anyone who says their way is right and if you don't follow their advice exactly you are wrong/cursed/doing it wrong ect don't rely soly on them.
Anyone who tries to over stress the importance of themselves or the mundane, be leery of. for example. no you can't read your own tarot, only *I* can. BS anyone can pick up a deck and learn to read.

[Hope]

you guys are awesome, and do you realize how many new folks you are helping

and those that feel like something is wrong....but they arent sure and they dont know so.................



i know it was said before but when you get that funny feeling, it is there for a reason...

LISTEN to it


love
hope

[Amber Wynd]

Ditto on the curse issue. You wouldn't believe how many of my clients have sent cash, watches, jewelry, silver coins.......everything but their first born child.......to "psychics" who tell them there is negative energy or a curse around them. One lady who talks to me put $5,000 in her jewlery box and mailed it, along with all the jewelry, to someone who said she would cleanse the curse and bury all that stuff for her. I always tell them to call the police.

Same with any psychic who claims 100% accuracy. On a good day, I maybe nail 80%. Maybe. I do feel like the cards are very accurate, but I'm human and often miss subtle nuances or just plain misinterpret what the cards are trying to say.

You also have to watch out for people who deliberately word their answers in such a way that you're left with more questions at the end. It's natural to have new questions come up during a reading, but some readers do it on purpose to generate more business. Same with psychics who try to drag the reading on and on. They don't have respect for how hard you work for the money you're paying them.

Edit: I almost forgot. It's not only unethical, but also illegal for any psychic/tarot reader/etc to diagnose the status of your health and/or to give you medical, legal, financial advice or to sell you lottery numbers. If you tell someone you're not feeling well and ask what's wrong, and they don't respond by recommending you go see a dr, they don't have your best interests at heart. Likewise, if you tell them you just got beat up by your partner and they don't advise you to go somewhere safe and call the authorities or at least call a domestic violence hotline.

[Autumn Clair]

:wave: I'd like to join in here. Great discussion! First I don't believe anyone who charges money. I'm sorry if it's a calling it's a calling not a money maker.

Second when they are asking you small guestions as your sitting down their get tips on how to reply to you. If asked how are you? And you say fine. Well most likely your going to get I see a stranger coming into your life. They went to make you feel something your not at this time in your life.

Or how about looking at your hands for a ring. These simple little things give them responces for you. It's fun to do yes.

Ask yourself this if there where that many prophets in the world why are there wars, and why are they using 900 numbers?

[stella01904]

MM ~ The aforementioned "curse" people. Classic example: "You got people jealous of you. Two women and a man. They're burning black candles on you. That's why things are so hard for you right now. I can take it off but I need $300.oo - for the candles." You hear this, just leave, hang up, whatever. They will keep it up if you let them: "This curse is tougher than I thought. I need another $500.oo and you got to bring your bank book..." These are usually palm readers - the people with the sign outside their house. They are fun and inexpensive and can tell you how many kids you are going to have, but not much good for anything else. If you go in a group, they will give everyone a straight reading but the one that looks the most prosperous - that one gets targeted.

People who tell you that you are coming into BIG MONEY soon - but you need their services to access it! I made the mistake of giving my email addy at Sara Freder's site once and now there are always emails like this from her in my bulk folder. "Stella I have been trying to get in touch with you, this is your last chance..."

Telephone 900-number "psychics" a la Miss Cleo, Psychic Friends, etc. are ALWAYS fake.
BB, Stella

[stella01904]

:wave: I'd like to join in here. Great discussion! First I don't believe anyone who charges money. I'm sorry if it's a calling it's a calling not a money maker.MM ~ I'd have to respectfully disagree with that. People should be compensated for their time and effort. Doctors, lawyers, even the guys who scrub the toilets at McDonalds are paid, what makes a reader somehow "less" than them?

I don't mind doing an occasional free reading but people who expect it irk the crap out of me. I don't have a sign on my forehead that says "go ahead and use me". People who come for readings are often at wit's end, we are a last resort, they have no other ears left to pound on and there are very sticky problems to be dealt with, in a sympathetic and diplomatic manner. I would much more enjoy spending time relaxing with my family than trying to advise a married woman who is seeing another woman's husband and wants to know why he hasn't called her this week. Speed bumps work for free. I don't.
BB, Stella

[RunningRiot]

I think con-artists are extremely funny.. And I mean I can roll over myself laughing about it.

Usually you can tell who's a con and who's not by asking; cons usually know just enough to pass a curious person; but if they try to talk to someone who really knows what tarot or magic is, they falter.

[HummingbirdSong]

Just out of curiosity....what should a legitimate reading go for?

[LisaT4P]

anyone who has the "over the top spooky super witchy fortune card palm reading tea leaf reading" reading room set up to do readings.. these are the ones who have a crystal ball prominently displayed (and have no clue how to scry).. mood lighting and the new agey music playing quietly in the background along with all the other super cool witchy palm reading stuff... or better yet a human skull next to their tarot cards But Anubis... all those things are FUN! :bad:

My $0.02: Anyone who will not give you a straight answer when you ask for credentials.

I don't mean "are you a member of a society...?" but more of "how long have you been doing this?" or "how long have you studied?" or maybe even "where did you get your ministerial credentials?" (for the whole coven thing). ;)

[Hope]

Just out of curiosity....what should a legitimate reading go for?

just to let ya know i think this will be our topic this week

love
hope

[HummingbirdSong]

just to let ya know i think this will be our topic this week

love
hope
[newbie alert]

Where do I find topics of the week?

[/newbie alert]

[Hope]

Each week on Thusday I post a new weekly topic, here in Divination, and you can also found the announcement to each weeks topic (with a link too!) in the Wicks Announcements that are here: ....http://mysticwicks.com/forumdisplay.php?f=239


love
hope

[HummingbirdSong]

Thank you Hope! :)