Magic and the Mundane

[AlleyCat]

Does magic have a place in the mundane things in life or should it be kept in reserve for things that are of deeper meaning and spiritual purposes?

e.g. money spells vs. honoring deity ritual

your thoughts?

[Shanti]

Theres a differance in mundanes!! Money can be greed or it can be survival. It all depends whats behind it. Yet, some people are greedy cause that is their path in this life and its not wrong for them.

Its totally up to the individual. One mans good is another mans bad.

[MalPixie]

I guess it is just prefrence and opinion. It just depends on how you feel!

[mtpathy]

i voted other,as my personal experience has lead me to the belief
that any form of magick that isnt done for personal realisation
then must be directly towards the manipulation of others in one
form or another.

[AlleyCat]

I personally feel that it shouldnt be used for every little tiny thing as an excuse to actually not put any effort into it and if it doesnt turn out then the blame can be placed upon the working or that it wasnt meant to be..I don't mean prayer work by that either because I constantly talk to them upstairs, I just get annoyed at my "friends" who have a "bad life" because they are too busy blaming them upstairs and spell workings that havent worked yet they wont go out and put resume's around and expect everything in life to be handed to them on a silver platter without working for a thing...

[jcldragon]

Always remember the Law of Diminishing Returns.

Now while I suppose it is possible to light a candle purely by using Magick, it would require an enormous effort, and years & years of training. On the other hand, it is a simple thing to use a match.

The means you employ to effect a change, should vary according to what you are trying to accomplish. Spiritual means alter the context of a situation. Mental means clarify knowledge. Astral means produce psychic changes in atmosphere. Physical means affect physical objects. So depending upon which Octave of Reality you are dealing with, choose the appropriate method.

In dealing with obstacles, (especially related to health), it is best to employ means from each of the four Octaves of Reality. No obstruction can stand up to that.

[Cindlady2]

I guess it depends on your definition of what is mundane to you!
Getting the perfect cup of coffee is mundane to me... someone who's been drinking crappy coffee at work to the point that they can't stand it anymore might not seem so mundane! (if they tried other means first) I've helped people get into the house or apartment they wanted... to others that might seem mundane... to them it was important!

[brymble]

i voted other. from what i know of power, it's not a question of doing magic for mundane things as it is so much a question of doing mundane things with magic, in other words, with awareness, power, and intent.

[blindfaith^_^]

I see no problem with using magic for mundane purposes as long as they aren't greedy. If one is having money troubles, there's nothing wrong with a ritual to help raise energy that will help one gain a job faster.

Again if one is moving into a new place, I see nothing wrong with one wanting to purify and protect his or her new home.

There is a difference between mundane uses of magic and selfish uses of magic. Trying a money spell when one is rich, that is an abuse of power. Trying to hurt others or purposely targeting someone (a love spell) is wrong. One shouldn't manipulate free will and one shouldn't try to control others or their world, just place energy where it is needed most.

[Nitefalle]

Why not??? It's like using the internet. Some people use it to jack around or put up bad websites, etc. But it can also be an educational tool, a means for someone to talk to others when they have no other avenues, a venue for minority groups (cultural, socioeconomic, political, etc) to find others of like mind. But just because there's bad stuff out there too, I'm not about to cancel my service. Magic is there, whether we use it or not. How we use it is up to us. I'm not going to judge people who use it for "mundane" things because that's a subjective term. And while I may not agree with people who use it to, say, "find the perfect cup of coffee", I'm not going to use that as a reason to stop using it myself, either.

[Cassie]

Theres a differance in mundanes!! Money can be greed or it can be survival. It all depends whats behind it. Yet, some people are greedy cause that is their path in this life and its not wrong for them.

Its totally up to the individual. One mans good is another mans bad.

I totally agree with that.
Besides, magic isn't only spells and rituals. In my case I very rarely do actual spells. Magic is an approach to life; a way of living in harmony with the elements and the creative forces/deities (however you percieve them to be). In that sense, I don't think you can separate it from the mundane.

[Meadhbh]

Cassie has a good point. There really is no diffrence between the magical and the mundane. Its really up to each person if they want to use it for everyday mundane type things or not. I've do, often I don't really mean to its sort of happens in a weird sort of way.

[EternalMaiden]

Between this post and especially considering what jcldragon has to say, I voted 'Other'.
i voted other,as my personal experience has lead me to the belief
that any form of magick that isnt done for personal realisation
then must be directly towards the manipulation of others in one
form or another.

Agreed, though I think that manipulation is a term that coincides with creativity also. And the ripple effects truly depend on your relations with higher powers, and your seeded intent.

Do I think you should use magic for everything? No..because we do alot in our daily lives that is mundane, it's not extra special...some of it doesn't hold spectacular meaning, nor would we want it to if we thought carefully about it. With magic comes responsibility, and I think any true witch would honour that.

I still voted 'other' because I think it's normal and natural to test the bounds of any gift or revelation. I dance with energy, I send signals to cosmos... And I've had to be taught what is apropriate and what isn't. The body in it's natural state is an understandable, co-existing thing. When we try and become too controlling, manipulative or coersive, The Gods no longer acknowledge us and we can receive alot what is like a 'punishment' or bad karma.
Or, a lesson.

[Windsmith]

I agree with what others have said about the magic and the mundane not being discrete entities. Especially, I agree with what brymble said: it's not a question of doing magic for mundane things as it is so much a question of doing mundane things with magic, in other words, with awareness, power, and intentIdeally, I would do everything in my life that way - not just the so-called "magical" things. Because who gets to decide what's a magical use and what's not?

[Aidron]

If one intends to practice magic, they must be confident. If they do not have the confidence to decide when and how to use their magic, then they shouldn't be practicing. Mundane or not, you have to be your own judge and carry enough conviction to have faith even after the course of action is taken, and that is all I feel I have to say about this.

[Meabh23]

I totally agree with that.
Besides, magic isn't only spells and rituals. In my case I very rarely do actual spells. Magic is an approach to life; a way of living in harmony with the elements and the creative forces/deities (however you percieve them to be). In that sense, I don't think you can separate it from the mundane.

You took the words right out of my mouth.

Magic is everything around us. We feel it and call it life. For me there is no distinction between mundane and sacred. The whole show is sacred. Doing a spell for money is fine, just remember to look for a job too, because that is part of the ritual.

[Tabbykitty]

What follows is just my own opinion based on personal experience...

While I agree there is no difference between the mundane and that which is spiritual, because one's spirituality dictates how one lives, I don't think that magic is everywhere or that it is an approach to life.

Magic is a system, a tool. Although it has wide applications, it doesn't quite provide a philosophy of life. It doesn't provide ethics or principles of living, it is the value system of the magician that provides the ethics of when and how to cast or not to cast spells.

Magic is a force or element that is present in the universe, not necessary completely natural to earth as we know it. Although all magicians understand the 4 elements and understand how to manipulate them, they don't necessarily live in harmony with the elements. Certainly it would be beneficial for them to do so, but I know quite a lot of them who simply don't choose to do it.

In the end, magic is neutral. You can use it to do good or not, you can use it to help or not. You can use it for mundane means or not, its all up to you.

[Aidron]

While I agree there is no difference between the mundane and that which is spiritual, because one's spirituality dictates how one lives, I don't think that magic is everywhere or that it is an approach to life.


Theurgical magic can be used to achieve mundane and practical matters, seen as flowing down from the less dense spiritual plane to the denser material plane. In turn, thaumaturgical magic can be used to achieve spiritual and philosophical matters, seen as flowing from the denser material plane up to the less dense spiritual plane.

Food for thought.

Magic is a system, a tool. Although it has wide applications, it doesn't quite provide a philosophy of life.

It can, perhaps not for you at this time, but in understanding the laws of magic and other fundamental principles, it can be interpreted in such a way.

It doesn't provide ethics or principles of living, it is the value system of the magician that provides the ethics of when and how to cast or not to cast spells.

Again, it can, it's a matter of perception. It has no inherent morals, that much is true, but you can certainly form your own morals by being inspired by magic.

Although all magicians understand the 4 elements and understand how to manipulate them, they don't necessarily live in harmony with the elements.

This is likely because not all magic nor all magical practitioners recognize or accept this system of elements. In many cases though, it is simply a lack of balance.

[Spirited]

If I'm using my own energy for something that is important, either to me or to someone around me, I don't see what the problem is. It is taking no one's time and energy but my own.

[sari0009]

Voted "other" because there is no sharp and clear division between magic and mundane, in my practice. Both contain many of the same ingredients (knowledge, purpose, discipline, imagination, clarity, will, energies of various sorts, and so on) .

The answer to the question would depend but overall, using common definitions, it's mundane first and magic second (as an extra umph and back up) for me.

This works well because the homework for the mundane lends so well to magic.

[DebLipp]

Voted "other" because there is no sharp and clear division between magic and mundane, in my practice.

Very smart. What is "mundane" and what is "magic"? If you define magic as "not mundane" all you've done is create a logical loop.

In Wicca, we work to become whole beings,fully connected to nature, to ourselves, to the universe, to the Gods. Dividing ourselves up into little bits (this is the magic bit, that is the mundane bit) is counter-productive.

Thus, we should work on all levels that make sense towards what we achieve. Take, for example, a job search. You must work on the mundane level, otherwise your magic won't work, because you are disempowering it. You must put out the resume, show up at interviews wearing a nice suit, make the follow-up call. You should bring all your skills to bear to make sure you get the job. That might mean doing a spell as well.

Often a spell isn't necessary. It's coals to Newcastle. I can't stand when people ask for spells for things like bronchitis. There's already a perfectly good spell for bronchitis: It's called Keflex.

Crowley defined magic as "the art and science of causing change in accordance with Will." He purposely didn't distinguish between the "magical" and the "mundane" because there is no distinction; not in Hermetics, not in Thelema, not in life. Keflex causes infections to clear, which is your Will, so it is magic. If the Keflex doesn't help, then perhaps a spell will. This is also magic. Every morning, I do a spell to help me wake up and be alert; I call this spell "brewing coffee."

Use the magic that makes sense and is efficient. Sometimes this is a spell, sometimes not.

[RunningRiot]

I think magic should be used for whatever the caster whats it for.

[Rae ShadowWolf]

I voted other, as I view Magic as a focus tool more than anything, and if you look at it in a certain light, everything is Magic. :)

[Akhkharu Asgard]

I voted "other" because I personally do not believe in the existence of magic as everyone here does. But I won't get into that. Another post for another time!