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Vincent Verthaine
March 6th, 2006, 03:29 AM
Isn't it time we erisians recognize that Eris is the TRUE Goddess of Love?
Is there anything more Chaotic then Love?
Aphrodite,Ishtar,Eros,et al,may represent the gross physical mainfestations of Love,but only Eris represents the true spiritual nature of Love.
Isn't it time we took love out of the genetic/evolutionary context(the old gods/goddesses,the pysical,G/E L),and place it into the memetic revolutionary one(Eris,spritual,M/R L)?

Genetic/Evolutionary Love(G/E L) was a product of nature to insure the propagation and survival of early humanity.
It was the DNA's creation in humanity to insurance it's own replication.It made sure that only the strong genetic stock bred with strong genetic stock(or at least try to).
It made sure that mothers feel a bound for their children,and women attracted to the alpha males of the tribe.
It made men want to take care of the women,and provide for them.It is what makes us feel(the physical) when we are in love.
It has served us well for thousands of years. But is G/E L necessary in this modern age.

Poets,theologians,scientists have through-out history tried to explain love,but to no satisfying result.
So what the hell do we poor schmucks know about love.
Too many of us mistake lust,desire,need, and wan,t for love.

We are stuck in the genetic trap.
We have these silly preconceived notions about love,and fall to pieces when it doesn't live up to them
.I've seen way too many lovely beautiful women fall for some asshole cro-mag who treats her like dirt,all because of the genetic urge to find a mate,settle down,and make more DNA copies.
I've seen way to many good men(author included) stomped own by cold cruel women,all becuase of the genetic urge to find a mate,get hitched and make more DNA copies.
I hear people talk about the ridiculous Greyface concept of "Trying to find my soulmate,trying to find the other half of my soul".
What a crock of Sh*t.
If you are walking around with half a soul,that's really lind of sad.
If you need someone to "complete your soul",you may be very diappointed. What if your soulmate(sm) is "gay",and your not.What if your soulmatem is someone you can't stand.Every women I've been with has been a soulmate of mine.In one way or another.Sometimes ijust for one night.Hopefully this time,it's for life.

Which brings me to M/R L.
It is the higher form of love.
True love.
It is the the ever changing nature of love,and the understanding and acceptance of those changes.
Love causes confusion,discord and strife.
It brings wisdom,peace of mind,and joy.
It can bring you to the dizzying heights of passion,the depths of despair(and the creamy middles of contentment).
True love is Chaos.
True Love transends the physical.
It operates in the realm of ideas,the higher consciencousness,the memetic.
True love can never be predicted or organized.
It can not be ordered or contolled.

It is what you get when you find your "lifemate".
The one who satisfies and forefills your soul,not "completes" it.
Finding M/R L in someone causes the intermingling of your souls with Eris,creating something far greater then the sum of the two parts.
It is the love of higher consciousness,the love that transend the multiverse.

Acheiving True Love (Erisian Love),we must understand that love is never stationary,and that it will always change.
Successful relationships happen when both partners change with each other in a way that compliments each other.
Like the ancient Chaoists,we must stop " needing " to love.
End the "desire" to love,and let it just happen.
Find the inner beauty in yourself,and see it in others.
We must face the fear of being alone head-on.
Being alone for the rest of your live terrifies everyone.
But what is one lifetime compared to the infinate amounts you will go through.
It is better to improve ones self first.
To find true love for yourself first.
Make yourself the best that you can be.
Stop looking for love.
And if no one falls in love with you,so what.Theres always next life.
And besides,if no one can see the inner beauty in you,then they are the fools,not you.

Crowley understood it best when he said:
Do as thou wilt shalt be the Whole of the Law ( i.e be all you can be)
Love is the Law ( the only thing that matters is Love)
Love under Will ( we are not rutting beasts but true men and woman)
Every Man and Woman is a Star. (we are all one with the Universe,we are all one with chaos,we are all one with Eris)

Eris is truly the Goddess of Love

Meabh23
March 6th, 2006, 11:20 AM
Does this mean that Eros is a child of Eris?

Vincent Verthaine
March 6th, 2006, 04:21 PM
Does this mean that Eros is a child of Eris?
Sure,why not.

Who says we erisians have to believe what the ancient greeks did.

I'm all in favour of a corporate restructuring of the Greek pantheon.

Baron von Hoopla
March 6th, 2006, 05:05 PM
I'm all in favour of a corporate restructuring of the Greek pantheon.


I heartily endorse this idea.

Little Billy
March 6th, 2006, 08:14 PM
Isn't it time we erisians recognize that Eris is the TRUE Goddess of Love?


Well, if love = burning down a city just for kicks, sure.

Cain
March 6th, 2006, 08:18 PM
I dunno LB, the old Eros (Archaic period) wasn't some cherub lovey dovey kid. He was the third being to come into existence, one of the primeval forces of the Universe. The concept of Eros was that of destructive, overpowering and all consuming love. Like most of the Greek tragedies (only one happy marriage, remember). Even in Apollonius' epic Argonautica, which represented Eros as the child version, there were hints dropped about his more violent and lively past.

Little Billy
March 6th, 2006, 08:38 PM
I dunno LB, the old Eros (Archaic period) wasn't some cherub lovey dovey kid. He was the third being to come into existence, one of the primeval forces of the Universe. The concept of Eros was that of destructive, overpowering and all consuming love. Like most of the Greek tragedies (only one happy marriage, remember). Even in Apollonius' epic Argonautica, which represented Eros as the child version, there were hints dropped about his more violent and lively past.

And? Eris never loved ANYBODY. Hell, she didn't even LIKE anybody.

Don't get me wrong...Eris is pretty cool (as Gods go), but she isn't the loveburger happy children dancing in the wildflowers hippie some maker out to be. She's a vicious, spiteful...geez. No wonder I like her...

Cain
March 6th, 2006, 08:43 PM
And? Eris never loved ANYBODY. Hell, she didn't even LIKE anybody.

Don't get me wrong...Eris is pretty cool (as Gods go), but she isn't the loveburger happy children dancing in the wildflowers hippie some maker out to be. She's a vicious, spiteful...geez. No wonder I like her...

Well yeah. I'm just saying I can see echoes of that Eris in the old Eros, the original Greek love god. They complement each other in terms of attitude and actions to a degree that is staggering. I had an interesting chat with a professor on it one day. Apparently Eros made the relationships and Eris broke them (on the command of Hera, once) in popular myth. Eros could be destructive, impulsive and was thought of as very powerful, just like Eris.

Little Billy
March 6th, 2006, 08:59 PM
Well yeah. I'm just saying I can see echoes of that Eris in the old Eros, the original Greek love god. They complement each other in terms of attitude and actions to a degree that is staggering. I had an interesting chat with a professor on it one day. Apparently Eros made the relationships and Eris broke them (on the command of Hera, once) in popular myth. Eros could be destructive, impulsive and was thought of as very powerful, just like Eris.


Sure. But that just reinforces the fact that Eris is not a God of love.

Vincent Verthaine
March 7th, 2006, 06:43 AM
Sure. But that just reinforces the fact that Eris is not a God of love.

Nah,we know what Eris said about trusting the ancient greeks with historical accuracy.Indigestion you know.
What the Ancient Greeks and the Modern Erisians's say about Eris aren't necessarily the same thing.
If the Ancient Greeks don't like the way we Modern Erisians view Eris,they can tell us themselves.

Faery-Wings
March 7th, 2006, 07:22 AM
Isn't it time we erisians recognize that Eris is the TRUE Goddess of Love?
Is there anything more Chaotic then Love?Holy crap, that is one of the simplest yet most profound statement. So many of us are spoonfed the "Hallmark" version of love. Let me tell you- that ain't the way it works. 13 years of marriage to my "soulmate" depeicts it more like a frickin rollercoaster ride through heaven and hell, sometimes at the same time.
Which brings me to M/R L.
It is the higher form of love.
True love.
It is the the ever changing nature of love,and the understanding and acceptance of those changes.
Love causes confusion,discord and strife.
It brings wisdom,peace of mind,and joy.
It can bring you to the dizzying heights of passion,the depths of despair(and the creamy middles of contentment).
True love is Chaos.
True Love transends the physical.
It operates in the realm of ideas,the higher consciencousness,the memetic.
True love can never be predicted or organized.
It can not be ordered or contolled. Lately I wonder why I am in this relationship. Then-sometimes I read or hear something that brings something to my awareness *why.*
True love isn't roses and champagne (although they area nice treat on occasion). It really is Chaos.

Baron von Hoopla
March 7th, 2006, 10:29 AM
Also, chaos involves all concepts, including love.

Eris is the goddess of everything, but in her unparalleled modesty she allowed other gods and goddesses to believe they had something to do with anything.

Did that make sense?

No?

Good.

Meabh23
March 7th, 2006, 03:32 PM
Well, if love = burning down a city just for kicks, sure.


Eris burned down a city?

She is truly the best!

Baron von Hoopla
March 7th, 2006, 03:34 PM
Eris burned down a city?

She is truly the best!


That's one of her big things.

Meabh23
March 7th, 2006, 03:35 PM
That's one of her big things.

If that's not love, what is?

Cain
March 7th, 2006, 04:25 PM
Eris burned down a city?

She is truly the best!

Not just a city, the greatest city in all the world (if "the world" means the Aegean).

Meabh23
March 7th, 2006, 04:30 PM
Not just a city, the greatest city in all the world (if "the world" means the Aegean).


We're not talking about that provincial town called "Troy" again, are we? I tend to think the idiots lied and then blamed Eris for that act.

Besides. The whole town was full of nits.

Cain
March 7th, 2006, 04:32 PM
We're not talking about that provincial town called "Troy" again, are we? I tend to think the idiots lied and then blamed Eris for that act.

Nah, she was actually there. Dragging dead Greeks and Trojans about the place. She helped bring the walls down. Troy deserved it though. Imagine having someone as vain and shallow as Paris as future king. It would be like having Paris Hilton installed as Dictator for Life.

Meabh23
March 7th, 2006, 04:33 PM
And as I said before:

The whole place was crawling with nits.

Someone had to torch it.

Arion
June 27th, 2006, 10:51 AM
Actually, Aphrodite is sometimes equated with Chaos:


Chaos

Her name means 'yawning' likening her to the cavern-wombs at sacred sites all over the world. Chaos was the mother of everything in the universe, from all the deities to the tiniest particle, but she was not literally a womb. In fact, she was a homogeneous mixture of the four elements: earth, air, fire, and water. Therefore Chaos was both the beginning and ending of the universe, invoked especially in divination systems like the Tarot, when the elements were symbolically mixed in order to predict the future. The Greeks weren't quite certain what to say about this Goddess, and seem to have forgotten what she symbolized. They struggled to give her a mother, usually Kaligo 'darkness' or Achlys 'eternal night.' Then again, the Greeks tried to make Chaos male, but in view of the Classical Greek gender system in which women were blocked from being a part of ordered society at men's insistence, and then feared because they were liminal outsiders, it is no surprise that this resexing never stuck. Ultimately, Gaea, Nemesis, and Nyx all arise from Chaos — and presumably Aethera, Pyris, and the Hydra as well.


from http://www.moonspeaker.ca/Aphrodite/venus.html#chaos

Eros was born out of Chaos in one creation myth, so Eris being his mother is not far off.

Vincent Verthaine
June 29th, 2006, 02:48 PM
Actually, Aphrodite is sometimes equated with Chaos:

from http://www.moonspeaker.ca/Aphrodite/venus.html#chaos



Chaos

Her name means 'yawning' likening her to the cavern-wombs at sacred sites all over the world. Chaos was the mother of everything in the universe, from all the deities to the tiniest particle, but she was not literally a womb. In fact, she was a homogeneous mixture of the four elements: earth, air, fire, and water. Therefore Chaos was both the beginning and ending of the universe, invoked especially in divination systems like the Tarot, when the elements were symbolically mixed in order to predict the future. The Greeks weren't quite certain what to say about this Goddess, and seem to have forgotten what she symbolized. They struggled to give her a mother, usually Kaligo 'darkness' or Achlys 'eternal night.' Then again, the Greeks tried to make Chaos male, but in view of the Classical Greek gender system in which women were blocked from being a part of ordered society at men's insistence, and then feared because they were liminal outsiders, it is no surprise that this resexing never stuck. Ultimately, Gaea, Nemesis, and Nyx all arise from Chaos — and presumably Aethera, Pyris, and the Hydra as well.



Eros was born out of Chaos in one creation myth, so Eris being his mother is not far off.

I recently asked Eris about all this ( One of the benefit ofs being the Omnibenevolent Polyfather of Hedonism in Black of the Church of Eris,is that i get to have her cell phone number) and this is what she said:



Eris,Goddess of Chaos...
How dare that two bit slut try to muscle in on my turf....err...I mean..Chaos ALways Was,Chaos Is,Chaos Will Always Be.
And I am Chaos.

I then asked if she can clarify her geneology a bit.Her reply was:



Eris,Goddess of Chaos...
All is Chaos.I Was Before I Manifested This Universe,and I Will Be Long after this Universe Ends.And I am Chaos.All Things Spring From Me,All Things Are Shaped By Me,And All things Eventually Return to Me.What you talking monkeys call me,how you worship me,what you think my geneology is,thats your personal hang-ups.I'm to busy being the Underlining Source of the Multiverse to really care.

I then asked her about the views of the Ancient Greeks about her and her relationship with the Olypian Gods...




Eris,Goddess of Chaos...
Look,I really liked the Ancient Greeks,but contrary to a lot of Pagans beliefs,they didn't know everything.
All that Olympian Heirarchy of the Gods is the creation of humans trying to explain me.
I personally had nothing to do with that.You guys named Aspects of Me and shoved them in a corporate heirarchal system.
I just went along for the ride.
It was funny also.

The Olympian Pantheon herarchal System is only valid for Ancient Greeks and Modern Hellenic Paganism Reconstructionists.
Plus anyone else who wants to follow it.
The Children of Eris are under no obligation to follow the old corporate hierarchal system, which was:

Zeus-King of the Gods
Hera-Queen Of the Gods.

Posiedon-Lord of the Ocean
Hades-Lord of the Underworld

The rest of the Gods.

The New Corporate Hierarchal Chart of Olympus,Inc. (Which we of the Church of Eris follow) is:

Eris-Mother of the Multiverse(or whatever name you choose to call her)

The rest of the Gods.

Now if you excuse me,I have a luncheon date with Loki.
Ohh,are you and Buddha still on for mixed doubles tennis next week.I hope you guys are ready to loose to me and Loki.


Yeah,right.Me and Buddha are going to wipe the courts with them.

Arion
June 29th, 2006, 11:58 PM
HAHA!! Eris makes some very good points.
I love this quote:

Eris,Goddess of Chaos...
All is Chaos.I Was Before I Manifested This Universe,and I Will Be Long after this Universe Ends.And I am Chaos.All Things Spring From Me,All Things Are Shaped By Me,And All things Eventually Return to Me.What you talking monkeys call me,how you worship me,what you think my geneology is,thats your personal hang-ups.I'm to busy being the Underlining Source of the Multiverse to really care.

Very true, very true.

All that Olympian Heirarchy of the Gods is the creation of humans trying to explain me.
Agreed.

I recently asked Eris about all this ( One of the benefit ofs being the Omnibenevolent Polyfather of Hedonism in Black of the Church of Eris,is that i get to have her cell phone number)
Yeah, I imagine that is pretty handy.

Vincent Verthaine
June 30th, 2006, 04:18 AM
The drawback of having her cp number is that she has mine.

Nothing fills me with dread like being called at 3 in the morning and its Eris on the other line saying she's bored and it's time for a road trip.

The last time that happened it ended up with me being chased by some evil cultists who's human dna is very debatable,and something really big and nasty that would give HR Giger nightmares.Did manage to close the portal though.
And all we did was attempt to go to the Super WalMart for beer and munchies.