i was hoping someone could help me in astral

[StaticX]

See I am really interested in projecting myself. I need someone to explain how to get an out of body experience.

[Lady Raven]

Hi, for Astral Projection I used http://www.tanega.com/astral/astral.html, Astral projection Webpage and Spiritweb with the Treatise on Projection : http://www.spiritweb.org/Spirit/projection.html . Good luck!-raven

[CondurerMan]

Thenks for the sites Lady Raven

I have some wierd things happen while i was trying to get out of my phisical body usually i end up not being able to move in phases, like first my lags then hands then head and i get freaked out and return to my body.
A-lot of times i returned to my body still in the astral body starting the all proccess again....

But the sites you wrote-down are really helping thenks

Quate from the first site:
"Catalepsy Or Sleep Paralysis. Your physical body will "go to sleep." It will be heavy and you will not be able to move it, except with great effort. Attempting to move at this point will likely terminate the experience and result in discomfort. Some people panic the first few times they experience this paralysis. Relax, soon you will learn to enjoy it. And it is an excellent sign of your progress. yay i'm making progress:)))

[Artemis84]

D.J. Conway has a book called "Flying without a Broom" that is practically the bible of astral projection. It gives you the basics for starting out and then gets into the more difficult things like time travel and bi-location. I had that same feeling when I started astral projecting too. I got scared because I couldn't move my body. So I came out of my meditation too quickly and gave myself a major headache. Ouch! :) Good luck!

[Wandererz]

you can also check out

http://www.astraldynamics.com

has some good texts you can download and print out and read at your own leisure.

Wandererz

[icedrop917]

I am new at Wicca and I want to start out with small magick. ANy suggestions, like flame controlling? And where can I get it on the net>?

[Myst]

Flame controlling isn't "small magic" of Paganism. Visualization, grounding, centering, meditation, etc. are - so click the thread labelled Lesson 1 in this forum, also try Help for New Pagans and Where to Start in this forum.

[CondurerMan]

Flame controling?
thats the first time i've heard that phrase..
what execly is it about?

[Myst]

I assume he means magic used to control a candle flame, as you'll see in movies/television.

[CondurerMan]

You mean like using my finger as a flame througer
;)

[Sequoia]

what he might also mean is talking to a fire elemental and making it answer questions or something. . . in essence, controlling fire.

this is NOT small magick - done it once, by accident. It can be very dangerous, especially if you don't know what yo'ure doing, and especially if you're new to magick. It's capturing an elemental and questioning it. . . bad idea, in any cercomstance. I think it's not a good place to begin.

Try meditating on a candle. Stare at it, watch it, sense it. Listen to it. See what you get from that experience. Take notes if you feel like it, or a journal, or an entry in your book of shadows.

don't use candles if you are too tired; you could fall asleep and it could catch things on fire. Don't attempt to summon stuff or "control" things you don't understand, or are too new to really be able to handle. Try meditation.

I think there are few people who can really physically manipulate items, at least, consiously manipulate items, without touching them. This goes for fluid things doubly, such as water or fire.

^_^ of course, if you're wanting to cast Fire2. . .

[SoulCatharsis]

Come on now, Puma, let's at least start with Fire1. :^)

[Lavender]

Originally posted by Puma Hime
what he might also mean is talking to a fire elemental and making it answer questions or something. . . in essence, controlling fire.

this is NOT small magick - done it once, by accident. It can be very dangerous, especially if you don't know what yo'ure doing, and especially if you're new to magick. It's capturing an elemental and questioning it. . .

This is interesting. I would love to hear more on this, Puma. Can you expand more on this?

[phoenixsong]

Originally posted by Puma Hime

^_^ of course, if you're wanting to cast Fire2. . .
Or Fira or Firaga? :D

[Sequoia]

Originally posted by Wildchild


This is interesting. I would love to hear more on this, Puma. Can you expand more on this?

sure. . . . :)

let's see. . . well, it was something I did by accident, and not by a spell or anything, so I'm a bit unsure of how to explain it.

Basically what happened was I said "I wonder". . . ^^; one of the most common ways I get myself into trouble. I had been thinking about how on several occasions, I "listened" to a bonfire or fireplace or even a candle. . . bonfires and fires in fireplaces seem to roar, even scream, if you "listen". . . like they were yelling with hundreds of thousands of voices, all in confusion or fury or rage or even calling. . . . And even a candle has so many of those voices, I was thinking to myself "I wonder what just one fire would sound like?" . . . and then I wondered, well if even a candle, or a spark, had several if not hundreds of "fires" in it. . . then how would I even get one? Maybe I could call up just one, "summon" if you will. . .

something I've noticed is that, if nobody's told me I can't do something, and I'm not thinking about it. . . voila, I can do it. It's kind of weird, and maybe a bit silly, but it's just something about me. So I put my finger and thumb together and tried to just reach out and pull a fire, from anywhere, just get one to come.

Now, I couldn't see anything. But I tell you, I sensed it there. Just one. Too tiny to see or put of heat, but I know it was there, kind of how you know when a spirit is around.

and the weirdest thing - because it was only one, it wasn't howling. It wasn't raging or screaming or going completely insane. It was calm, about as calm as fire gets anyway. . . and I discovered if you ask it a direct enough question, it'll tell you the truth. But it also jokes a lot, twists words, and generally makes it so you'd be better off consulting tarot or runes or something. Fire is quite insane. Quite insane.

so then I basically let it go, it left in a hurry. . . I havn't really done it again. I mean, why bother? Besides, it was kind of creepy and I havn't had any reason to. I wondered, I got my answer ^^;

But I have the feeling it could be very very dangerous indeed. I was probably quite lucky. It's probably not a good idea to mess with elementals. . . I think that's what it must've been that I called. A fire elemental. Does that make sense?

[Myst]

That's really weird.

You'd think the spirit of fire would burn one's fingers.

Or, especially if it's insane, try to start you on fire or something of yours on fire for capturing it.

I wonder why this epitome of fire would be so calm and just go away... Weird huh?

[Sequoia]

well the thing was, it was so tiny it wouldn't automatically burn one, or set things on fire. . . unless you've seen it or done it, it's really hard to explain.

but why would I make such a story up?

[MistOfTheSea86]

What PUma refers to is a spirit of fire, Not literal fire so therefore couldnt burn her fingers off. It very well can happen and can exist, if you channel the right channels and know what you are doing things can occur. Spirits are everywhere and can be summoned, but it is not a wise choice to do so. Nor is it a wise choice to question anyones credibly in their past tales.

[Myst]

You know, I don't see "I don't believe you" or "I think you made that up" or "you're lying" in that post there, do you?

To me it's still odd. I'm well aware "spirits are everywhere", Mist; I happen to be a channeler/medium, as I've mentioned various times around MW.

To me an elemental is the spiritual embodiment of an element, therefore to me an elemental is the epitome of said element. Therefore, to me an elemental is going to look like and feel like as well as appeal to the senses as said element would. I just thought it was weird because it didn't go along with my idea of elementals. It's like "oh that's weird, I never thought of it that way". For instance, when I call an elemental to the circle, I think of the physical responses the element evokes, while calling on the spirit of that element. To me, they are one and the same, not separate "spirits" and "elements", but the actual spirit of the element. *shrugs*

So no, it wasn't "I'm questioning your credibility", it was "I don't know, that's not really what an elemental is to me".

There's nothing wrong with thinking differently around here. :D :)

[Sequoia]

hehe elaboration usually makes more sense. . . I get what you're saying now ^__^

well what I mean is that it was fire. . . but it was so tiny, like. . . comparibly, the size of a molecule or soemthing. . . . that it didn't really put out enough energy to burn or anything. And it wasn't REAALY calm. . . just calm compared to what I'd seen before (which was raving and crazy and fast and aaaah ^^; ). . . I still say everyone has a different universe and we all just communicate somehow. . . ;) hehe everyone views differently.

[MistOfTheSea86]

Originally posted by Myst
You know, I don't see "I don't believe you" or "I think you made that up" or "you're lying" in that post there, do you?

To me it's still odd. I'm well aware "spirits are everywhere", Mist; I happen to be a channeler/medium, as I've mentioned various times around MW.

To me an elemental is the spiritual embodiment of an element, therefore to me an elemental is the epitome of said element. Therefore, to me an elemental is going to look like and feel like as well as appeal to the senses as said element would. I just thought it was weird because it didn't go along with my idea of elementals. It's like "oh that's weird, I never thought of it that way". For instance, when I call an elemental to the circle, I think of the physical responses the element evokes, while calling on the spirit of that element. To me, they are one and the same, not separate "spirits" and "elements", but the actual spirit of the element. *shrugs*

So no, it wasn't "I'm questioning your credibility", it was "I don't know, that's not really what an elemental is to me".

There's nothing wrong with thinking differently around here. :D :)

Of course their isn't, I just got the wrong feeling from your post. I apologize.

[Myst]

Besides that, if we believed everything we read and didn't ever question we'd all think we're Satanist baby killers huh? So no I'm not gonna say "yeah it *is* unwise to question something". I wouldn't just accept a story and change my beliefs without thinking about it from anyone, not even my best friends.

It's not meant to be insulting, that's just who I am. I mean :lol: it's not like I expect everyone at MW to just believe and agree with everything I say. heh!

That said..


Originally posted by Puma Hime
well what I mean is that it was fire. . . but it was so tiny, like. . . comparibly, the size of a molecule or soemthing. . . . that it didn't really put out enough energy to burn or anything. And it wasn't REAALY calm. . .

That makes me think of elements in certain terms - water, earth, and air can be thought of as substances, right? You know water is H20, and that earth is sand, dirt, decaying plants and animals, stones, etc. In essence, water is far simpler then earth. Meanwhile air is oh, oxygen, nitrogen, carbon dioxide, etc. So air is more complicated then water too. You couldn't just have one molecule and say "yeah that's earth", or "yeah that's air", but you could with water.

Then, fire isn't really a substance at all, but a reaction. Fire is something reacting with oxygen and a spark.

Then you think about spirit, which unites the natural elements, among other things. Oy!

So how does that relate to the elementals? What you said about the fire elementals being kind of excitable makes sense to me. Since the elemental (to me) is the epitome/spirit of the element, then the elemental is going to be like the archetype of fire - hot, excitable, passionate, furious, chaotic. Whereas, say, an undine (water elemental) is going to be flowing, emotional, strong but in a methodical flowing way rather then chaotically like fire (most of the time that is, we all know water is in waterfalls and white water rapids too, like the strongest emotions).

Meanwhile gnomes (earth) would be wise watchers, usually quiet, nurturing, strong, and fertile/prosperous. And sylphs (air) would be creative, also flowing, quick but not destroying, kind of transparent and wispy. So again, to me, the elemental is going to "feel" like the element. This is an important part of circle calling for some people - you think of the feelings of the element when you call the element or the elemental to the circle.

To me spirit is the key; the final element that unites everything and gives it life. So, I might think of an elemental as the unity of an element with spirit. Then one goes into thoughts about souls, what makes something alive, etc. and it gets pretty mind boggling.

But hey this gives me ideas about those element classes some people have suggested!

[Lavender]

Originally posted by Puma Hime
But I have the feeling it could be very very dangerous indeed. I was probably quite lucky. It's probably not a good idea to mess with elementals. . . I think that's what it must've been that I called. A fire elemental. Does that make sense?

Yes, playing around with elementals, if you don't show them the proper respect can be dangerous. Same as dabbling with anything else.

Thanks for sharing your experience, Puma. I wasn't quite sure from your earlier post what you meant by "capturing a fire elemental". It sounds like it was more like you've invited this fire spirit to communicate with you. That is something that some do when drawing their circles.

[Epona44]

No so's you'd notice, aneeway.

One thing I have noticed about fire. I frequently photograph fire as part of my job. Fire, believe me seems to have life.

I was attending a night bonfire on July 3 a few years ago and I took a lot of pictures. It was the weekend so I didn't bring them to our staff photographers to develop, I took them to an hour photo-stop shop.

When I got them, I took them out of the envelope and threw them on my desk. Being not chronically neat, I spilled them on the floor, and when I picked them up, some were upside-down.

I couldn't believe it. I saw faces and human forms in the fire. I showed them to the other people in the office, who thought it was equally weird.

So, fire elementals? It's just possible. What are they? You got me.

Also, I learned Astral Projection through Oliver Fox's book of the same name. I didn't have to strictly follow the ritual, but modified it for my situation.