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Akeyla
November 28th, 2006, 02:12 AM
Tanya asked this...


if we post poetry here it is "published" and therefore often inellegeble to publication in Poetry journals.... how can we get around this? I would love to share my work that I'm gooming for publication but I don't feel I can right now because of this.

And I thought I would bring it into the forum to discuss.

I once asked Jacqueline Carey the same question in regards to a story that I was writing that would have been exclusive for a site I belonged to. She said that it was ultimately up to me. On one hand, yes, once something is posted on the net it may be harder to sell to a publishing house. On the other hand, by publishing some , not all, of your work you can start to develop a fan base for your work.

I've asked a few other authors that I know for their opinions and will go ask a few publishing houses as well to see what they say. I will return with my findings so that we can clear this up as I'm sure it is a concern for many of us.

Akeyla
November 28th, 2006, 02:42 AM
I'm still looking but here is one website that discusses the laws pertaining to the World Wide Web, publishing, copyright, and many other areas that would be of concern to writers.

http://www.publaw.com/index.html

Akeyla
December 1st, 2006, 01:42 AM
One Author, who wished to remain nameless had this to say about it.


According to US copyright law, publication is defined as: "the distribution of copies or phonorecords of a work to the public by sale or other transfer of ownership, or by rental, lease, or lending. The offering to distribute copies or phonorecords to a group of persons for purposes of further distribution, public performance, or public display, constitutes publication. A public performance or display of a work does not of itself constitute publication."

Posting something on the internet for the purpose of critiquing is widely believed to fall under "public display only" meaning it is NOT publication. If you post a story on the web, you can't say "look, I'm a pubished writer!"

Every writer needs to decide this for herself, as I've said myself many times. The writer must decide whether her desire to improve through feedback outweighs her desire to protect every piece of work

The laws regarding the internet are still vague, and if one poetry journal says "I consider posting something to an online writing group to be publication" then there's no way to argue because that's their decision.

Windsmith
December 1st, 2006, 05:06 PM
My understanding has been (but I'm not a lawyer, so take this with a packet of salt) that if you post it to a site with some way of controlling who can or can't view it, with the intention of soliciting feedback and critique, that most publishers would not consider that published. So if I put something in my livejournal under friends lock, or post it to a Yahoo! group whose archives are visible to members only, then the work is less likely to be considered "published" than if I put it, say, on MW, where anyone who finds the site can wander around and look at posts.

~Owl~
December 1st, 2006, 05:41 PM
Well, as a poet and writer myself, I have my poems copyrighted at my own private web page, as well as acknowlegments to the photographer who took the picture of the owl in my avatar, as I use it univerally, and credit to Thora, for creating my banner, which links to my own Pagan Forum.

Thora knows how much I appreciate her, and we're close friends. I've aleady credited her profesionally at The Perch, I see no reason to do it here as well.

Zibblsnrt
December 1st, 2006, 06:08 PM
My understanding has been (but I'm not a lawyer, so take this with a packet of salt) that if you post it to a site with some way of controlling who can or can't view it, with the intention of soliciting feedback and critique, that most publishers would not consider that published. So if I put something in my livejournal under friends lock, or post it to a Yahoo! group whose archives are visible to members only, then the work is less likely to be considered "published" than if I put it, say, on MW, where anyone who finds the site can wander around and look at posts.

This is pretty much the safest way to handle it. If you've got plans to publish something, don't post the completed version anywhere obvious (like an unlocked LJ, a MW forum, etc). Even though posting it isn't technically considered publication, many publishers insist on having the right to show the work first and exclusively, and making it publicly available beforehand runs counter to that.

Of course, it would depend on who the publisher is, but generally speaking that's the safest route. There's some which would frown upon even that, and there's others who wouldn't care if you recited it in Times Square on CNN beforehand. Best to ask the publisher first.

Akeyla
December 1st, 2006, 07:30 PM
Ultimately it comes down to what you are comfortable with and willing to do with your work. If you'd like to post but are worried about it, then maybe just post one of two poems (not the whole thing) or an excerpt from a novel.

I belong to an Online Writing Group where we post chapters of our work but it is in a private/locked/need permission to join forum. Which is always open to hackers but that is the risk you take anywhere on the net. And the posts get deleted every three months or so. Maybe be look for a similar site to join.

Every publishing house is going to be different and you have to decide what will work best for you. If you'd like some feedback on some pieces but don't want to post them. Maybe ask some members in PM's if they'd take a look and then you can deal with emails or something like that.

I'll keep looking into this but copyright/publishing laws and any laws pertaining to the net are pretty vague at best or extremely specific on the other side.

Best of luck to all.

Miss Dana
March 26th, 2008, 07:36 PM
[quote=Akeyla;2909555]I once asked Jacqueline Carey the same question in regards to a story that I was writing that would have been exclusive for a site I belonged to.quote]

You talked to Jacqueline Carey? Do you know her personally? I love her work!

Tanya
March 26th, 2008, 09:29 PM
especially for poetry, since lots of journals are on-line and poetry is generally a pretty short piece of work, I am sticking with not posting anything here that hasn't been published... and then I guess i should put where it was first published to give credit to my awesome editors.

So... maybe we can get around this by having a PM list of folks who will read privately and give feedback...

it might also be a kinder method for begining writers who are shy about their work or a little afraid of public crital review.

Polypseudonymous Rex
February 3rd, 2009, 08:39 PM
I've thought a lot about this - especially with short works that are complete in themselves. Honestly, for me, the desire to share my work outweighs the (slim) chance that anyone will ever care to publish it. I've sent work to a lot of publishers. I don't know if there is a secret to getting them read it, but I certainly haven't found it. When they do, I just get a rejection letter. Most of the time, it's the "we love your writing but it's just not right for us" letter. Well, if there is no forum where people can read my work, and if my motivation is to share it, I'll just have to put it in a place where it's possible for people to view it. It's that or wait until I die (assuming it wouldn't just become lost anyway). So, while I remind people that I hold the copyright for my work, I still share it. I'd love to have it published, but I wrote it for people to read - maybe only a small, elite audience in many cases, but the work dies if no one can access it.

Anyway, that's just my opinion. And yes, I like the idea of having a private forum for writers on the chance that any future publishers I have might like that better.

Blessings,
Scott

SilverClaw
February 3rd, 2009, 08:56 PM
Well now that we have social groups has anyone thought of using that to share their work? I know I have my group for writers and such but I do not have it set to the private setting.