Noumenia Question

[seekerofknwoledge]

Okay, so here's a question for all you Hellenistic Recons out there...I've studied the various Greek festivals an their calendar quite a bit, but I keep coming up with two answers (or really one vague one) on the actual date of noumena in a given month. I know it is supposed to signify the first of the month, however, does it fall on the night of the new moon, or the day after? Mostly I just find references to it being a celebration of the new moon, however in several places I find it title the celebration of the "visible new moon." I usually celebrate it the day after the new moon, because technically that is the beginning of a true new moon. Even in the resourced I found stating that it's a festival of the new moon, they're vague about when it is really. From other accounts I can gather that they mean new moon in the context of the actual new one, as in visible. Any thoughts?

[seekerofknwoledge]

I think I kind of found my answer..but I'd still like to hear what others practice as well!

[Fiamma]

Okay, so here's a question for all you Hellenistic Recons out there...I've studied the various Greek festivals an their calendar quite a bit, but I keep coming up with two answers (or really one vague one) on the actual date of noumena in a given month. I know it is supposed to signify the first of the month, however, does it fall on the night of the new moon, or the day after? Mostly I just find references to it being a celebration of the new moon, however in several places I find it title the celebration of the "visible new moon." I usually celebrate it the day after the new moon, because technically that is the beginning of a true new moon. Even in the resourced I found stating that it's a festival of the new moon, they're vague about when it is really. From other accounts I can gather that they mean new moon in the context of the actual new one, as in visible. Any thoughts?

I've always understood that the Noumenia is celebrated at the first sighting of the new moon.

[Theres]

that is my understanding too.

the dark of the moon was celebrated as Hekate's Night (on the 30th, regardless of how many days were in that particular month), with Noumenia following.

[seekerofknwoledge]

That's how I look at it, and certainly how it makes the most sense, but I got a few mixed signals shall we say when I looked it up. Thanks for the help!

[Kadynas]

The confusion is due to the fact that astrologically or astronomically (depending on what kind of calendar or almanac you have) a New Moon is when the Sun and Moon occupy the same degree of the zodiac from our perspective here on Earth. Thus this is going to be during what we would call the "dark moon", because astronomically the New Moon is when it's all the way dark and then begins it waxing cycle anew. :)

As an astrologer, the term "New Moon" is always going to mean Sun & Moon at the same sign of the zodiac for me. So when dealing with Hellenic calendars & practice, I just use the term Noumenia for the first day of each month, knowing that the ancients considered it the first sighting of the Moon after it's dark period, and make that notation in my almanac like I do for the rest of the Hellenic calendar. :)

[Tim]

I've always understood that the Noumenia is celebrated at the first sighting of the new moon.

that is my understanding too.

the dark of the moon was celebrated as Hekate's Night (on the 30th, regardless of how many days were in that particular month), with Noumenia following.

Yes... when the first sliver of the new moon can be seem.

[patch]

Yepyep, I agree with the above.
And hekates supper is on the last of the previous month I believe?

[Gede]

Interesting. When I first starting celebrating the Noumenia in the Greek way I just went with the date of the new moon that is on my astrological calendar? So that is the dark moon and in fact Hekate's celebration. Is this correct?

Khairete~

[Theres]

Interesting. When I first starting celebrating the Noumenia in the Greek way I just went with the date of the new moon that is on my astrological calendar? So that is the dark moon and in fact Hekate's celebration. Is this correct?

Khairete~
yes, pretty much.

the Greeks saw the new moon as the beginning of the month, which is a liminal point. Hekate is the goddess of these liminal points. therefore the last night of the month (the night before the new moon) is Hekate's night, or the end of the prior month.

Noumenia celebrates the beginning of the new month.