What is Wyrd?

[David19]

This is something that I've seen on lots of Heathen sites but I'm a bit confused by what it is. Some people seem to suggest it's like the Heathen version of karma, others say it's a law of cause and effect, etc, but is it really like karma (like would it mean doing something "good" will get good coming back to you, and vice versa with doing something "bad"?), is it like Fate (like saying something is destined to happen), as that's something that i've seen a lot of people say too.

Any help you could give me would be great.

Thanks.

[happyheathenmom]

This is something that I've seen on lots of Heathen sites but I'm a bit confused by what it is. Some people seem to suggest it's like the Heathen version of karma, others say it's a law of cause and effect, etc, but is it really like karma (like would it mean doing something "good" will get good coming back to you, and vice versa with doing something "bad"?), is it like Fate (like saying something is destined to happen), as that's something that i've seen a lot of people say too.

Any help you could give me would be great.

Thanks.

The way I understand it, Wyrd (which is the Old English word, Old Norse is Urd -- but with the odd shaped "d" pronounced 'th') is sort of like fate.. but not exactly. Your Wyrd (or Urd) is determined by your past, and present. Such as you could be born with a high risk of diabetes in your genes, but you can avert that by eating right and excersizing and thus your risk is lowered. So it is somewhat like cause and effect. Your Orlog is your individual strand of Wyrd (urd) as I understand it.

Those videos on YouTube by Mike Smith ("What is Asatru?") have helped me out a lot understanding things. His fifth one "Concepts of Time" talk a lot about Urd (Wyrd), and the Norns, and Orlog. I posted the link to the first one in another message (Something Worth a Darn on Youtube).

[plumedsnake]

I understood Wyrd to be like Fate or Destiny. It is presided over by 3 sisters (past, present ,future?). But this is coming from a dillettante.

[Twig]

Aside from being a Rune with a blank face that has caused no end of heated debates from runemasters....actually it is the perfect representation of the word.

Wyrd is about the unknown quality that is presented in any situation. The power of the Gods to turn your reality into something you had no idea would turn out as they do/did.

Ex. I met my mate as a one night stand.....10 years ago. Wyrd how that happens!

That help?

Peace

[skilly-nilly]

I understood Wyrd to be like Fate or Destiny. It is presided over by 3 sisters (past, present ,future?). But this is coming from a dillettante.

The Fates are/were Southern European and, I believe, different from both 'Wyrd' as 'Fate' and the Norns as like the Fates.

I see Wyrd as being 'what is possible' (as opposed to 'what is ordained/fated').

I read the blank rune as 'you're not in change of everything but you're in charge of your own actions'

That is:
things happen--that's fate
those things affect you--that's Wyrd
you react to/respond to/factor in those happenings--that's free will.

Your Wyrd (as opposed to general Wyrd) is what you are sent to do---but you can always choose to accept your Wyrd or not.

The Norns I perceive as 'what was' (Past) 'what is' (Present) and 'what may be' (the future interaction of Wyrd and your free will).

[Lolair]

The Fates are/were Southern European and, I believe, different from both 'Wyrd' as 'Fate' and the Norns as like the Fates.The Fates snuck their way into many cultures including those of the British Isles, both singularly and in groups. Th Greek Moirae, the Germanic Norns, The British/Scottish Habetrot (and her mysterious companion spinners), and the Etruscan Parcae. I have heard some describe the Norns as the weavers of Wyrd, but historically they marked men's fates by carving on sticks - possibly rune carvings, but not by weaving or spinning as the Moirae are well known for.

wyrd1 [] 1. f (-e/-e), n (-es/-) fate, chance, fortune, destiny; Fate, the Fates, Providence; event, phenomenon, transaction, fact; deed; ge~ condition; pleasure; [weorðan]; 2. f (-e/-e) verbosity
wyrdgesceapum [] adv by chance
wyrdnes [] f (-se/-sa) condition, state
wyrdstæf [] m (-es/-stafas) decree of fate
wyrdwrítere [] m (-es/-as) historian, chronicler

Also here's a link to a good Wikipedia article on it: Wyrd (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wyrd)

I think I've recommend them to you before David, but in case anyone else is intrigued, Brian Bates' books The Way of Wyrd and The Real Middle Earth give the reader a very good understanding of what Wyrd is.

[Vigdisdotter]

Wyrd is the web of life, past and present but not future. We set the future of our Wyrd through the actions of past and present. As such Wyrd is quite chanagable.....if we bother to pay attention.

Think of a spider's wed. If you pluck one strand, you'll make the entire thing reverberate. If you cut a strand, or bind it to another you've change the shape; same as with spinning a new strand. All actions have an impact, how great or small that impact is tends to be a matter of perspective.

Now, Oorlog. The difference here is that Oorlog is what you are born with, what you live out and what you die with. Sounds pretty static and grim, right? It's really not. While Oorlog is set, the shape it takes can vary.

For example: so-and-so's Oorlog is to be a teacher. This DOES NOT mean that so-and-so is destined to teach 9th grade math. It could mean that he is meant to be writing poetry which he reads in to local coffee shop and his poems inspire others to understand their own lives. I could mean that he gets involved with high risk youth and shows them an alternative to their dangerous paths. It could mean getting together with friends in an open teaching circle in someone's basement. Yes it's set, but the possibilities are endless.

I honestly find the concept of Wyrd and Oorlog far more useful then that of Karma.

[David19]

I think I've recommend them to you before David, but in case anyone else is intrigued, Brian Bates' books The Way of Wyrd and The Real Middle Earth give the reader a very good understanding of what Wyrd is.

Thanks for those book recommendations, and they are definantly ones I want to get, especially The Real Middle Earth (and also the Way of Wyrd, which they had in my local Borders a few months ago but I don't think I've seen it there since).

And, also, thanks for everyone else who replied, I think I understand a bit more about what Wyrd is.

[Eldred Grimm]

The way I understand wyrd it is all about chooses and those choose lead to more choose. Like what we choose today will define what chooses we well have in the further
The sisters control wyrd the choices that we have made are part of urds control
What verdandie controls what we choose now
And sculld is what is owed to us or what we owe others or the cosmoses
Wyrd comes in layers what has become is leads to what is becoming to what is owed
It’s leaner like past present and future
I see wyrd as a northern European version of karma

[Tranquility]

Why is Urdr/Wyrd associated with the past then? I understand this concept of the web of wyrd, and how actions affect each other. We have all of these possibilities, and they may vary based on our reactions (which also take into account Verdandi and Skuld). But why then would Urdr be associated with Wyrd, which is associated with the past events? I'm a bit lost here.

Is it illustrated as such because of the important interplay that the previous Norns have in the shaping of the future?
I just get really tied up thinking of it as "fate/destiny" because to me that necessarily implies what WILL happen, not what has happened.

[happyheathenmom]

Why is Urdr/Wyrd associated with the past then? I understand this concept of the web of wyrd, and how actions affect each other. We have all of these possibilities, and they may vary based on our reactions (which also take into account Verdandi and Skuld). But why then would Urdr be associated with Wyrd, which is associated with the past events? I'm a bit lost here.

Is it illustrated as such because of the important interplay that the previous Norns have in the shaping of the future?
I just get really tied up thinking of it as "fate/destiny" because to me that necessarily implies what WILL happen, not what has happened.

There's actually no set future in the concept of wyrd and orlog, just as Voluspa foretold events that COULD happen at the end of the world, it doesn't necessarily mean it will happen as predicted. However, the way things were going at the time it was predicted, it was 'in the cards' so to speak.

In other words, my present actions are affected by not only my actions, but the actions of my parents, their parents before them and so on. It doesn't mean I can't change what my future is. That's where the past comes in: How you make your choices. For instance, say you are starting a difficult course in college, and you intend to follow through. However, maybe you decide it's too difficult half way through and drop out, or you plan to get a tutor and study harder and make it through. Now, let's just say that the actions you take in finishing this course could have an impact on your career. If you finish it, you have a better chance of getting a job you like (or get a raise in a current job), and if you don't finish you don't get the raise, or have to settle for a job that might not be as good as the one you could've gotten, had you finished this college course.
Those actions could impact your future, and your offspring's future.

That's (sort of) how the past relates to the future. The future is not written in stone and can be changed/prevented.

Hope that helps.. did the best I could with the analogy...
HHmom

[Tranquility]

So isn't fate very different from these concepts then? When I think of fate, I think of a person being completely predestined for some event to occur. How then, did wyrd even get equated with fate? Are Wyrd and Urdr even comparable then?

Your explanation made tons of sense, thank you. At the same time, I'm trying to put these spatially in time.

When I think of fate, I think of the three fate. "This and that will occur in the future, end of story. You were doomed from the start."

So is Urdr related to Wyrd or the same thing? Or do we know that they were just ROUGHLY the same. It gets confusing to me when we say that Urdr and Wyrd are the same exact word from different cultures/locations. Becaues obviously the classical feeling of Wyrd I get is from something like Beowulf, etc etc. <=== Is that just another example of how society completely deranged a word in its translation? Or, am I just lost in time.. Urdr implies it is constantly changing and interplays with the past, affecting the present and future - but it dwells in the past and immediate present. Yikes.. What'd I get myself into?

[S_Wodening]

So isn't fate very different from these concepts then? When I think of fate, I think of a person being completely predestined for some event to occur. How then, did wyrd even get equated with fate? Are Wyrd and Urdr even comparable then?

Your explanation made tons of sense, thank you. At the same time, I'm trying to put these spatially in time.

When I think of fate, I think of the three fate. "This and that will occur in the future, end of story. You were doomed from the start."

So is Urdr related to Wyrd or the same thing? Or do we know that they were just ROUGHLY the same. It gets confusing to me when we say that Urdr and Wyrd are the same exact word from different cultures/locations. Becaues obviously the classical feeling of Wyrd I get is from something like Beowulf, etc etc. <=== Is that just another example of how society completely deranged a word in its translation? Or, am I just lost in time.. Urdr implies it is constantly changing and interplays with the past, affecting the present and future - but it dwells in the past and immediate present. Yikes.. What'd I get myself into?

Urdr is Wyrd in Old Norse. Wyrd is Old English. So yes, they are the same, essentially the same word from different languages.