Ya know, it's funny how "they" act toward us.

[GothGuy806]

Well I'm sure you already know how most Christians act toward other religions.. well here's what just happened with me and my mom when I was visiting her.

She was going on about how she hates her sister and she says: "You know what really bothers me about her? She's a WICCAN! I WONT TALK TO HER!" she said that in a horribally nasty tone. I got kind of offended but kept my cool and asked "Well what do you have against Wicca?" She raised her voice "THEY'RE WITCHES WHO HAVE POWER FROM SATAN!" Damn you have no idea how offended and angry I get when ignorant people, namely Christians start to act like that. I said "No they're not. You have no idea at all what you are talking about." And her reply was "Oh yeah well I worked with a Wiccan and he said he was a witch and his girlfriend had powers!!" I said "I doubt he was Wiccan - Wiccans usually don't flaunt and give off threats like that, and you'll find that most of them don't even call themselves witches" and she was like "WELL THEY CERTIANLLY GOT THEIR POWERS FROM SATAN! I SAW SOMETHING ON TV WHERE THIS WICCAN WAS PRETENDING TO FEED A FAIRY TREE AND STARTED DANCINC AND DINGING BELLS AND THAT WAS ON TRADING SPOUCES" I said "First of all, do you believe everything you see on TV? Secondly that's not it at all. Infact what you saw was pretty much a mockery." She was like "So what are YOU a Wiccan?" I'm like "Yes, I am." and she started acting like I was the offspring of Satan himself. She started going off about how (we're) nothing but fairy earth-bound satan worshipers.. started attacking my beliefs.. started attacking everything! Even pretty much calling it a cult (She did the little quotion things with her fingers when she said "religion") So I'm like "You think every other religion besides Christianity is a cult, don't you?" and she said nothing.. then she said "WELL WHAT IS IT THAT YOU 'PEOPLE' BELIEVE" and I just got frusterated at that point and I said "IF YOU WANT ANSWERS THEN RESEARCH IT. DON'T GO AROUND INSULTING OTHER PEOPLE. THATS WHY CHRISTIANS HAVE SUCH A BAD NAME. THEY ARE KNOWN FOR THAT. MAYBE YOU SHOULDN'T BE SPEAKING WITHOUT KNOWLEGE? IT DOESN'T MAKE YOU SOUND VERY INTELLEGENT".

Damn. Sorry but I had to tell somone who feels the same way I do. Damn it why cant "Christians" just accept other wasy of life?!

I completely respect other people's points of views, their beiefs and their religions, including Christians. They aren't my enimy but they sure as hell act like it. I've only gotten hate toward Christians, no other religion.... and I find it funny, because Christianity is supost to be a loving religion that does not judge... but yet here we go! Sheesh. Sorry for thisbut damn this is nothing but predjudace.. from my own mother. Man I can't believe that crap.

[Amelserru_halqu]

Damn. Sorry but I had to tell somone who feels the same way I do. Damn it why cant "Christians" just accept other ways of life?!

Because they aren't Christians.

[David19]

Probably 'cause their just idiots and fundamentalist, and also, they are American (I'm guessing). Hope that doesn't offend anyone, but it does seem to be the case that the majority of Christian fundamentalists are American.

[David19]

Probably 'cause their just idiots and fundamentalist, and also, they are American (I'm guessing). Hope that doesn't offend anyone, but it does seem to be the case that the majority of Christian fundamentalists are American.

[Willow Rosette]

:hugz:

I wear a penticle ring on a chain around my neck. My daughetrs old teacher comes up and says ohhhh isnt that pretty....is it the star of david? I just laughed and changed the subject out of respect for her. But other people do really make me mad with their shallow opinions.

[Rachel]

Damn it why cant "Christians" just accept other wasy of life?!


It has nothing to do with Christianity and everything to do with them being assholes. I've met aggressively ignorant Christians, Jews, Muslims, Pagans, and Atheists. It's an ailment that does not discriminate. ;)

[GothGuy806]

:hugz:

I wear a penticle ring on a chain around my neck. My daughetrs old teacher comes up and says ohhhh isnt that pretty....is it the star of david? I just laughed and changed the subject out of respect for her. But other people do really make me mad with their shallow opinions.


Lol, I had that same experience.. this middle-aged guy who I work with asked if it was the star of david. I thought the star of david was the jewish sign? Easy to get confused though I suppose.


And yeah, your right, rachel it's not just christians.. but it seems that it's mostly christians who look down on not only pagans but all other religions too.

[Arion]

Christians and Wiccans really seem to hate each other. For some reason, they seem to be the most at odds with one another. Christians don't seem to have the same kind of issues with non-Wiccan Pagans, mostly we don't make a point of differentiating ourselves from society, like a lot of young Wiccan goths do. Maybe it's the word "witch" that scares the Christians, or maybe it's just that a lot of Wiccans are distinguishable from the rest of society. I guess if Wiccans want to be respected, they might try wiping off some of that eyeliner, going back to their natural hair colour, and not flaunting a huge-ass pentacle wherever they go.

[Philosophia]

Strange...all my Christian friends like me. Maybe its because I don't flaunt my path in their face or maybe I act like myself. This supposed Christian vs. Wiccan is a load of crap. I've seen people use their religion to be a**holes too many times to even identify a religion with them. Some people are just a**holes. Period. It doesn't matter what religion or spirituality they possess. I also find it funny that people use religion as either an excuse to be an a**hole or a victim.

MM, who doesn't have a natural hair color right now (its currently purple) and who loves eyeliner. :)

[BFD_Zayl]

oi, trust me i get plenty of hate from everybody...even a wiccan or two (although they called themselves wiccans, i do not think they could be called as such) so much so that i have come under physical attack, but unlucky for them i'm a unproffesional boxer... best way to deal with hate is to calm down, dont lower yourself to them, change the subject, anything is better than a confrontation.

[darkwalker]

I dont get the whole thing christians have with thinking that other religions need saving.
I mean all religions have their nutters but chirstianity seems to go a bit over the top.
dont get me wrong I'v got no problem with them as people but if one starts the whole "if you don't believe the same as us your evil" thing it just makes me wanna drop something heavy on their stuck up head, know what I'm saying?

[Fiamma]

Christians and Wiccans really seem to hate each other. For some reason, they seem to be the most at odds with one another. Christians don't seem to have the same kind of issues with non-Wiccan Pagans, mostly we don't make a point of differentiating ourselves from society, like a lot of young Wiccan goths do. Maybe it's the word "witch" that scares the Christians, or maybe it's just that a lot of Wiccans are distinguishable from the rest of society. I guess if Wiccans want to be respected, they might try wiping off some of that eyeliner, going back to their natural hair colour, and not flaunting a huge-ass pentacle wherever they go.

I am so not Wiccan. But I wear a pentacle (well, did before it decided to break.) I have fuschia hair. (No plans to dye it "normal" anytime soon. I like it too much.) With the occasional very few, very very far between weird episodes, no one's bugged me about it since I left my small-city hometown 4 years ago.

Oh, and I have quite a few Christian friends. I've spoken at a tiny, extremely-conservative Bible college in my hometown (Everyone was nice to me, no one tried to tell me I was evil or going to hell. The professor even invited me to take part in a talk about interreligious dialogue. Sadly, I ended up moving to a new city very suddenly shortly after that and it never happened.)

[KylalaKitty]

and that is one of the many reasons why I hate Christianity and their followers (referring to the very first post).

[Baobabtree]

I guess if Wiccans want to be respected, they might try wiping off some of that eyeliner, going back to their natural hair colour, and not flaunting a huge-ass pentacle wherever they go. Why? What's wrong with showing pride in your faith? I've seen many Muslims, Jews, Christians, Hindu and even Baha'i wear symbols of their faith without being attacked for it, why should Wiccans?

Probably 'cause their just idiots and fundamentalist Couldn't agree more. Most Christians aren't like this, but the fundies can usually shout louder, and drown out the opinions of the more kind, and compassionate Christians. When I have to deal with such fundamentalists I merely do what their own messiah tells me to do, turn the other cheek.

[LostSheep]

and that is one of the many reasons why I hate Christianity and their followers (referring to the very first post).

every single one of them?

:(

[OpenHands]

When people say or do things out of ignorance (and ignorance doesn't necessarily make them a bad person, we're all ignorant about some things and carry misconceptions), I think it's best to deal with it, move on and continue to live your life however you want to live it. There will always be people who won't reconsider their beliefs and they certainly have that right. *shrugs*

As a bit of a side note, I hope that folks who deal with ignorant beliefs won't succumb to ignorance too in painting all Christians with too broad of a brush. There are a lot of open-minded and accepting Christians in this world. :)

[Eternal Night]

My best friend is Christian. I think it's more about respect for other people, than what religion they are. I've met lots of people from all walks of life and have been lucky enough never to have a bad reaction. I could imagine it is quite hurtful.
I do have people takin the p**s and saying things like 'oh where's ya broom stick?' and stuff like that, but that is because they don't understand what it is I am.
I disagree with saying Christians as a rule are arseholes. That's tarring them all with the same brush, which is what quite a few people of different religions do to us.
Hopefully in time the minority of people that do still live in the dark ages will wake up and realise that we're normal humans just like them.

[David19]

Strange...all my Christian friends like me. Maybe its because I don't flaunt my path in their face or maybe I act like myself. This supposed Christian vs. Wiccan is a load of crap. I've seen people use their religion to be a**holes too many times to even identify a religion with them. Some people are just a**holes. Period. It doesn't matter what religion or spirituality they possess. I also find it funny that people use religion as either an excuse to be an a**hole or a victim.

MM, who doesn't have a natural hair color right now (its currently purple) and who loves eyeliner. :)

I agree with you, I think people are a**holes no matter what religion they are, there are Christian, Jewish, Muslim, Buddhist, Wiccan, Pagan, Hindu, Satanist, atheist, etc a**holes.

I also think some people will use their religion to be assholes or victims, like you said. For example, some Christians may justify that there religion is the only "true" one, but some Wiccans will use their religion to say how "persecuted" they are, using the mythic history of the "burning times" as "justification".

[David19]

Why? What's wrong with showing pride in your faith? I've seen many Muslims, Jews, Christians, Hindu and even Baha'i wear cymbals of their faith without being attacked for it, why should Wiccans?

I don't think anyone has a problem with Wiccans wearing the pentacle, it's the ones that wear gigantic pentacles that are the annoying ones or the ones that give Wicca a bad name, and the ones that go on and on about how "persecuted" they are, etc.

[Arion]

Why? What's wrong with showing pride in your faith? I've seen many Muslims, Jews, Christians, Hindu and even Baha'i wear cymbals of their faith without being attacked for it, why should Wiccans?

Rightfully or not, the pentacle has a bad reputation when it comes to the perception of the general public, and you're pretty much asking for trouble if you go flaunting it around. It may not be fair, but it's the reality. It seems a lot of witches do it mostly for the attention, anyway.

[Silverfire Darkmoon]

That's funny, most of the people I see being assholes when it comes to religion are Wiccans on the Internet.
I am, of course, referring to the first post in this thread. Why do you claim to support all religions and then rant about Christians?

[Eternal Night]

That's funny, most of the people I see being assholes when it comes to religion are Wiccans on the Internet.
I am, of course, referring to the first post in this thread. Why do you claim to support all religions and then rant about Christians?

That is exactly what I was thinking!
Like I said before lets not tarr everyone with the same brush.
It's like saying all white people are racist. or all Muslims are terrorists!
He should just put it down to a bad experience from a narrow minded person and not think all Christians are like that - because they are not!

[KylalaKitty]

every single one of them?

:(

No every single of them, mostly the 'in-your-face, your going to hell you heathen' ones, which is pretty much every single one here in KS. I haven't really met any Christians OUT of KS, so yeah.

[Annest]

That is exactly what I was thinking!
Like I said before lets not tarr everyone with the same brush.
It's like saying all white people are racist. or all Muslims are terrorists!
He should just put it down to a bad experience from a narrow minded person and not think all Christians are like that - because they are not!
Thats so true!

[Athena-Nadine]

That's funny, most of the people I see being assholes when it comes to religion are Wiccans on the Internet.
I am, of course, referring to the first post in this thread. Why do you claim to support all religions and then rant about Christians?
I was just thinking the very same thing.

I see far more pagans bashing Christians than I see Christians bashing pagans. It's sickening no matter who does it. I don't care what anyone says, there is no excuse for it.

And be very careful, everyone who would bash Christians and Christianity. It is against the rules of this site to do so. Just a friendly reminder.

[Zibblsnrt]

I see far more pagans bashing Christians than I see Christians bashing pagans.

I'll take that a step farther, and say that I've seen far more Christians bashing Christians than I've seen Christians bashing pagans.

The "they" the OP (and several others in this thread) talk about aren't the straw-man monolith a lot of people seem to continuously claim they are. Two billion people self-identify as Christian, and adhere to between two hundred and one thousand seperate denominations, sects, practices and theologies. It is a vast, ancient, vibrant, living community, with all the good and ill that implies.

Do I have a problem with people snarking off at the kinda dolts the OP mentioned, who refuse to speak to someone simply because they're Wiccan? To a point, I absolutely don't. I can tolerate fundamentalists, in the sense of people who've RTFMd and believe or understand what they've had revealed to them through it. (Two of the greatest human beings in my life, individuals who did a great deal to guide me towards meaning in my own - of a largely irreligious type - were Christian fundamentalists in that sense.) What I don't have patience with are the ones who fling around a half-understood faith and a deliberate refusal to understand anything outside it.

Such people are jerks - but they're also only a part of that larger society. They're also likely to be the type who refuse to speak to someone simply because they're Muslim, too. Or Jewish. Or Mormon. Or Roman Catholic.

[Athena-Nadine]

I'll take that a step farther, and say that I've seen far more Christians bashing Christians than I've seen Christians bashing pagans.

The "they" the OP (and several others in this thread) talk about aren't the straw-man monolith a lot of people seem to continuously claim they are. Two billion people self-identify as Christian, and adhere to between two hundred and one thousand seperate denominations, sects, practices and theologies. It is a vast, ancient, vibrant, living community, with all the good and ill that implies.

Do I have a problem with people snarking off at the kinda dolts the OP mentioned, who refuse to speak to someone simply because they're Wiccan? To a point, I absolutely don't. I can tolerate fundamentalists, in the sense of people who've RTFMd and believe or understand what they've had revealed to them through it. (Two of the greatest human beings in my life, individuals who did a great deal to guide me towards meaning in my own - of a largely irreligious type - were Christian fundamentalists in that sense.) What I don't have patience with are the ones who fling around a half-understood faith and a deliberate refusal to understand anything outside it.

Such people are jerks - but they're also only a part of that larger society. They're also likely to be the type who refuse to speak to someone simply because they're Muslim, too. Or Jewish. Or Mormon. Or Roman Catholic.

Yes, that's true. Christians are much nastier towards each other than "outsiders." Heh. And Wiccans tend to be nastier towards other Wiccans. People are people are people.

The fact is, Christian, Wiccan, Atheist, whatever, there are people of all faiths who are more interested in being self-righteous than in actually practicing what they preach. People really should spend less time worrying about what others are doing and more worrying about their own actions.

If someone jumps down your throat for just being a different religion (or for any other reason), by all means, address that person and those actions as necessary. My personal issue is with anyone who would tar all members of a given group with the same brush for no better reason than bitterness and spite, especially since it shouldn't be done at all.

[Meadhbh]

I think a lot of what people have againist wicaans rather than other pagans is this. And I don't mean to offend any body here but wiccans seems to be one of the more out spoken groups againist christains. I've been in situations like the first post, who here hasn't. But I didn't respond in the same manner I simply change the subject and never even get into the fact I happen to be pagan. One person isn't going to change a fantics mind and by getting upset you doing exactly what they want you to do by looking like your attcaking them.

[HadouKen24]

I really can understand some pagans' having a bad sense of Christianity if they live in the Bible belt. There are a lot of bigots here, and because the majority of Christians are Protestant Evangelicals, the bigots get a lot of airtime and not a lot of public denunciation.

It's not all Christians, sure, but I can see how you could get the impression that it is all Christians.

[LordHelmet]

Very true, very true.

[David19]

I really can understand some pagans' having a bad sense of Christianity if they live in the Bible belt. There are a lot of bigots here, and because the majority of Christians are Protestant Evangelicals, the bigots get a lot of airtime and not a lot of public denunciation.

It's not all Christians, sure, but I can see how you could get the impression that it is all Christians.

I understand what you're saying, and I can have a bit of sympathy for the people who live in the Bible belt, but I don't believe that every single Pagan that complains about Christianity or Christians lives in the Bible belt, if that were true, for one, the amount that complain would probably mean the majority of people in the Bible belt were Pagans.

That said, Pagans who live in the Bible belt aren't forced too, if it's that bad, they could move out.

[David19]

I was just thinking the very same thing.

I see far more pagans bashing Christians than I see Christians bashing pagans. It's sickening no matter who does it. I don't care what anyone says, there is no excuse for it.

And be very careful, everyone who would bash Christians and Christianity. It is against the rules of this site to do so. Just a friendly reminder.

I agree with you, there seems to be more Christian-bashing going on than I've seen Pagan-bashing going on.

Personally, I don't see why Wiccans (or any other group for that matter, Christian, Pagan or whatever) feel a need to broadcast their religion to the outside, for example, by wearing a pentacle, cross, etc, if you want to wear them, cover them up, religion should be kept inside your home or your own heads, not "out there".

[LordHelmet]

That said, Pagans who live in the Bible belt aren't forced too, if it's that bad, they could move out.

Um... think about this.

1. Many of them really don't have much of a choice. Even if they are adults and living on their own you have to take into consideration their jobs, family ect.

2. If there's a bunch of people you don't like where you live and so you move, you may very well find that your greener pastures have their own thistles. Theirs a**holes everywhere, just most places they're not generaly ignorant christians.

3. I've never had a big time christian be actualy rude to me, but they're generaly strong and opiniated views accompanied by ignorance still bother me. I'd still take those people over true a**holes anyday. Anyone who will admit that they see your beliefs as sending you and anyone who folows you to hell, then offer both prayers and practical help when things go wrong in your life scores pretty low on my a**hole meter, I'd take them for a neighbor over the guy who bums a cig off you then busts your car window for the pack after you leave. From what I know there's a considerable lack of this type of people in the bible belt.

[Taliesyn]

a bigot is a bigot. plain and simple. give them something different, they'll make fun of it, tell you it's wrong, find a way to feel better about themselves. that's what they are really doing. folks that say "he's a so & so, isn't that dumb" or "look at HIS hair!" are just insecure.

I'm Wiccan. my hair is natural, I wear earth tones, and I wear my pentacle, under my shirt, most of the time. I speak the truth as i see it as much as i can, and the folks around me- all christian, some fundies- respect me for my integrity.

I think this is the key. if you want respect, give it. I don't mean you have to change for anyone, but you shold be polite- and if anyone- especially your Mom, asks you "so what do you belive?" - tell them the truth. honor their view, expect that they will honor yours. If you can talk to them without the anger and negativity, then you'll be surpirised what can happen, with most people.

[AussiePagan]

I've never had any problems with Christian's and my religion. That said I don't advertise my faith, or look particularly weird, which probably helps :p If asked about my religion I explain it, otherwise I just keep it to myself. Some of my best mates are Christian,and one is even a hardcore Mormon missionary; he didn't even flinch when I explained my religion to him.

Only person to have a go at me was an Atheist, but he was having a go at everyone who was not Atheist, so :lol:

[Eternal Night]

Only person to have a go at me was an Atheist, but he was having a go at everyone who was not Atheist, so :lol:

Exactly!! proves most peoples points on here!

It isn't just how 'they' Christans treat 'us'.
It's how everybody from all different walks of life and all different beliefs treat other people.
It's all about respect.
The op should've just shrugged it off as a bad experience and not just naturally assume that every single Christian in the world is like that.

[Enlightenment1]

The word ignorance comes to mind. Nothing to do with Xtianity or any other religion (inc Paganism), it's just people like this are ignorant to other peoples faith and beliefs. Don't take the bait, I know it must be hard but it's not worth it, seriously!

[aluokaloo]

Lol, I had that same experience.. this middle-aged guy who I work with asked if it was the star of david. I thought the star of david was the jewish sign? Easy to get confused though I suppose.


And yeah, your right, rachel it's not just christians.. but it seems that it's mostly christians who look down on not only pagans but all other religions too.

well on the flip side- alot of pagans get self righteuos about christians and satanists, witchvox! Aye yai yai! That place has become nothing more then an all out **tchy-fest! **tch-vox, I've started calling it. Christians this and christians that, and satanists give us a bad wittle name! boohoo! Oh shut up! They sound dead-on like the people they rail against. it's easy to slip into that groove, where you point fingers and hate everyone though. Frighteningly easy!!. My friend has a good saying though, "Everyone has opinions just like they have $$$holes, and there usually stinky! Some just happen to stink more then others. Mine in the last few hours have come off like roses!

[ladyraven]

Ignorance is basically a plaque and no one is immune at times. I live in the heartland of the bible belt and all Christians, actually most are nothing like that. I have been asked questions about me religion when I tell them of it, and they do ask arrogent ones, but it's because they are fed that line of bs and have been for years. There's as many narrow minded Christians as individuals who call themselves witches and theink they can shoot lightning from their fingers. They're silly and you should keep your calm and try to give them what information you can, and if it doesn't work, just walk away. You being angry and argueing isn't going to help anything.

[Spirit of Balance]

Well, lets put it this way. I myself am in fact Christian and see nothing wrong with this particular religion. To be honest, there are times I prefer it over the one I have. I have friends from all different walks of life and I don't care what their religion is, it's all cool with me. My mom on the other hand is a little closed-minded and would probably kill me if she found out about this so shhh, lol.

Now I know a lot of Christians who say anyone who hasnt found GOD is lost or that Pagans are devil-worshipers, my mom included. This was before I came to this site, but even then I knew that not all pagans were devil worshipers and I corrected her on it.

So not all of us are @$$holes, just the really old and clsed-minded ones! :P

[alwaysfallingup]

I just wanted you to know that when I "came out" to my mom (I felt that I had better do that before I opened a metaphysical business!), she was stressed out and worried for me. Because she honestly believed I was going to hell. But, I sent her lots of information, links and books, and encouraged her to take the time to read them. She did, and then we dialogued about my beliefs, and what witchcraft is and what it isn't. She still worries about me, but I know that she always will because I'm her daughter and she loves me. However, she does not preach to me and even does things like say, "I gave your business card to someone today. He was wearing a pentacle and was very nice." :D

It takes time for people to get over their shock and worry for you. In the meantime, just don't push buttons. Maybe someday you two can talk it over and be good with it. If not, just refuse to participate in a conversation that upsets you.

[Willow Rosette]

I had a very funny situation happen to me today. It made me think of this thread.

Im driving down the road minding my own business. Now mind you I have a Goddess On my back window and on my bumper the "witches Parking" sticker. But Im still minding my own business. This woman in a truck honks at me and is saying something while pointing to the sky. At first I was like huh???? And then I realised she is trying to preach to me! :lol: Her window was up so I couldnt hear anything so all I could do was laugh at her.

LMAO Stupid woman if you want to say something at least roll down your window so I can hear you.

[Wolfpoet]

It's not just Christians.

I'm a follower of a Nordic path, admittedly a fringe path of a fringe religion.

It's a dark, fatalistic, pragmatic and above all, realistic religion. Based on the principle that my fate is written in the skein, it can not be changed. Fate is out to screw me royaly, life is nothing buyt a long list of painful experiences.

This is entirely the bloody point, nobody grew by having an easy life. It is only through trial, adversity and pain that we can grow. Odin suffered greatly for his wisdom and we mortals can not expect to gain wisdom without suffering in turn.

On this very site I've encountered bashers, people who have a very 'fluffy bunny' interpretation of paganism and reject anything that doesn't match that mentality. I've even encountered one person who dragged up passages from Norse sagas and interpreted them in a way to justify her viewpoint.

Imagine my annoyance at a self-confessed wiccan trying to tell a Nordic pagan how his religion works. I could pick up a bible, select a view choice passages and 'prove' that to be a proper christian you need to be a murdering rapist, doesn't make it true.

Everywhere you go you will find people who are so fanatical in their beliefs they HAVE to make everyone else follow their superior party line.

[darkwalker]

the biggest problem at least where I live is noone knows anything bout pagans. theres nothing near here that I know of that has anything to do with pagans. But far as I can tell most people are scared of pagans no matter the path. So they make things up.
One guy I spoke to said pagans where evil devil worshipers while another called us treehuggers. depends who u talk to really

[DarkDancer]

I just listened to the most recent episode of Deo's Shadow (http://www.deos-shadow.com/) (The second coming of Kirk Cameron) and for some reason it made me think of this post......

Oh, it sem that there is something wrong with this episode (32a) if you listen to it from the web page everyone sounds like chipmunks. If you download the mp3 or listen in one of the other possible ways it sounds fine....

[Lunar Raven]

In reference to the original poster...It's hard to believe that some people can become so brainwashed. I don't mean brainwashed into believing a religion (although that does happen), but brainwashed into believing that everything around them that's notably different is "bad" or "evil". Some people just live in fear..and I myself, would hate to live that way.

Really though, there is no "they". There are ignorant people from all religions, races, areas, etc. For most of them, it's not even really their fault..it is how they grew up, and what they were taught. It's not to say that people can't break free from what they were "taught" all their life, but to say the least, many people are stuck in their ways, and unwilling to budge.

Anyway...if "they" was a reference to Christians, that's just a false stereotype..because there are many diverse individuals within the Christian community (and others)...and not everyone is ignorant or intolerant ;). Blaming a group of people for your personal issues only fuels the war between (insert religion vs religion here).

[wolfjan1]

There are people out there with closed minds and closed hearts who call themselves "Christians." They are not. They hold hatred in their hearts in the name of "their" higher power and are no better than the terrorists that threaten us every day.
I read the bible, as a reference book and I am not Wiccan. I follow my own path as an eclectic witch. I DO try to do no harm.
These people, dear one, are not to be taken seriously in their rants, except that they are dangerous and follow a mob mentality.
Continue to study and find your own path. You appear to be a person who needs to study, No matter what your age, everybody must find a way to grow, every day.
Best of luck to you. You are included in my worldly prayers and meditations.

[wolfjan1]

Excellent! Thank you for your support of a young person who needs a bit of encouragement and understanding.

[Skadi]

It's a dark, fatalistic, pragmatic and above all, realistic religion. Based on the principle that my fate is written in the skein, it can not be changed. Fate is out to screw me royaly, life is nothing buyt a long list of painful experiences.

Now that is an interpretation I have yet to hear. Interesting.

In any case, I always find it funny that as much as you hear Pagans talk about acceptance, they are usually the first to jump at someone else's throat over religion just as much as the next non-pagan. It isn't fair to say, Christians are this or Christians are that, based on a few experiences. I find it funny that so many posts in this very thread are to complain of being bashed by group A, and then go on to bash group A themselves. Hypocritical much?

In any case, other people in this thread have made some very good points.

[LadyCelt]

I'm a Christian, but I don't feel like lecturing people on how they live. I have friends who've done divination and tarot. I won't touch it, but I don't feel it is right to lecture them. I feel it is wrong to reperesent Christ as a hateful thing. I also feel it is important to educate yourself on different beliefs and faiths before jumping to judge people. I was into Paganism a while ago as a possible path too so that is part of how I know things on it.

I also feel lecturing people on the devil and Hell can show ignorance towards Paganism and Wicca. It also ticks me off when people talk about people and who goes to Hell. For me, nobody is God, so they really can't tell someone something so big as where their soul is going. I just don't see how a person can know hwere another person's soul is going. It is very mean and judgemental to me.

For me, I take how people do that very personally and in a way a re-crucifying of Jesus and what he stands for. I feel Jesus commands his followers to love one another and not to give them Hell for who they are.

[LadyAquamarina]

I agree with those who have said it is not just a certain group of people. Ignorance and intolerance exists everywhere. I have found it easier to just smile at them and send them on their way rather than get upset about it. when you try to argue back with them it is just giving them the argument that they are looking for. Show them who the better person is.

[Shaw]

I wear the six pointed star and let people think what they want, besides it was the Seal of Solomon before David came along. I don't go on and on about what I believe in some crowds, hell most of my family doesn't know. My parents and sisters family do, plus some cousins. I still don't mention it unless asked a question. That "To Be Silent" took me awhile to figure, but now I know why it's important. Protects your sanity and soul from those fundamentalists of any belief system.

[Aina]

I am Christian, and i'm also a witch. I have Wiccan friends, and although I dont think it was right for your mom to yell at you and stuff, people are open to their own feelings.
Not all Christians are crazy Bible-thumping people going around condeming everyone who isn't saved or whatnot. I think lots of people get the wrong idea about us, because they see the Penacostal churchs..now THOSE are crazy peoples...o.o;;.
I wear a pentacle, under my clothes, my hair is natural, and I wear jeans and a t-shirt. I don't give away "signs" that I'm a Christian, or that I'm a witch. Personally, it's not anyone's business.
Maybe if you talk to more Christians and stuff, more OPEN MINDED Christians (yes there are some of us out there :) ) you'll see that were not all Holy Water throwing crazy people. ROFL.

Good luck
Bright blessings!

-Aina-

[Vodkaesque]

you know, i have been in your shoes before.
when i was in highschool, i went to a small school. everyone knew me as the weird girl who 'worshipped the devil' or 'cast spells'. the whole school seemed to despise me. people would walk behind me in the halls singing "jesus loves me" in my ear. people would warn their friends not to walk near me on the way to classes because i might "turn them into a frog".

people would read bible verses to me... even teachers would lecture me about jesus and god... and then when my mom found out about my beliefs, she flipped out on me.

she asked me if i was going to start sacrificing family pets. whenever we got into an argument, she'd say in the most hateful tone, "are you gonna go cast a spell on me now?".

so i understand how easy it is to be bitter. when your own mother is against you, it can seem like the whole world is against you.

i used to be so hateful. i used to retaliate by wearing t shirts with hateful messages geared toward christians. i used to be bitter and angry.

but over the years, i've grown up so much and matured. i've realized that just because those people are ignorant and rude and hateful it doesn't mean that they all are.

and in retrospect, throughout my trying to retaliate, trying to express my anger and make the people that hurt me feel as bad as they made me feel, in the process of doing that, i was hurting people that had done nothing to me at all. i never even thought about friends i had that were christians--the very friends that stuck up for me when people called me a devil worshipper.

i'm ashamed of how i let their ignorance and hatred get to me. i let them drag me down.

i no longer hate anyone, i no longer look down on the christian faith. and it feels so much better than all that bitterness and hate. i feel so much more at peace with myself and the world. not everyone is hateful. not all christians are so close minded, even if it seems that way sometimes.

the very best way to react is with peace and understanding. a good way is to show your mom, or a christian trying to convert you that the pagan/wiccan religion is not so different from christianity.

both believe in karma, treat people as you want to be treated, love thy neighbor, etc. if you show them these things, they might understand that the religion is not evil.

i wish you luck, and i hope that all these replies and mine will help you to keep from becoming bitter toward the christian faith, like i was bitter.

another tip is to not get offended at small things. pick your battles. for example, last christmas, my father got me a bible for a christmas present. at age 15 this might have offended me; but at age 21 i was not at all offended. i thought his reasons were thoughtful; he said he thinks everyone should have a bible. and i will keep the bible he gave me on my bookshelf among all my pagan books, as a reminder that in order to encourage others to have an open mind, you must also have an open mind free from bitterness, anger, and hate.

[blueangel]

This isn't directly linked to paganism but this show was on in the UK recently about a family in the USA. They are Christians with REALLY strong views. You can see clips here (http://www.bbc.co.uk/bbctwo/noise/?id=louis_theroux). Scary stuff.

[Lunar_Dragonfly]

It's for precisely reasons like this that I'm still in the closet.

My father is an honest to god bible thumping fundamentalist, and proud of it too. So is the lady who lives next door to my parents. My mother is slightly more open minded but she'd take dad's side over mine in a pinch and wouldn't be too happy if she knew about my spiritual interests. But the thing is, they're not bad people. Misguided, maybe, but good people who believe that they are doing the right thing in the eyes of the divine. I don't tell my dad about my path because I think he'll suddenly start spouting fire and brimstone and proclaim boldly that he has no daughter, but because I really think it would break his heart. And really, the poor guy has got enough problems without adding "My daughter, the infidel" to his list of grievances.

I do not consider myself Wiccan. I draw a lot of my influence from wicca, and I have a strong interest in studying it from an academic standpoint, but it is not what I am. I draw my faith from a variety of religions, Wicca and Christianity included, and I'm still in the process of sorting out what I believe in and what I don't. In the end, I say that the divine is the divine is the divine and I don't consider my path better or worse than that of my bible thumping family -- if only I could convince them the same! I wear a pentacle, but it's not very obvious. It's sort of made of celtic knotwork, and if people ask about it I can just say "It's a celtic star thingy, isn't it *neat*?" and leave it at that. I have a more obvious pentacle but I don't wear it because it's too big and, frankly, goth-y. I used to have a triple goddess symbol that I wore, but it broke. When either Christians or pagans asked about it I could say "It symbolizes the trinity" and they'd think I was agreeing with them *snerk*

[MagickalHack]

To all the people who keep saying 'just hide the fact you are pagan':
1.] Why should I have to worry about what I feel is right to practice? Are we living in WW2 Germany? No. I distinctly remember that in the US and Canada we have Freedom of religion.
2.] Being that passive about your religion will do nothing to help people accept anything different, it'll only reinforce their opinion of being right. That being said, I am not saying throw your beliefs/religion[or irreligion for you discordians] in their face.

@OP: I have run into similar problems. My step-father flipped when he found out I was a practicing Wiccan. He even got to the point where he threw something at me.

[Lunar_Dragonfly]

Yes, this is a free country, but some of us do not want to alienate our loved ones just because our religious beliefs do not coincide with theirs. Certainly in an ideal world we'd all just accept each other, but this is not an ideal world and years of deeply ingrained beliefs cannot be erased overnight. Sometimes it's just better to avoid confrontation than to ask for it. I'm not saying lie about your beliefs, I just think its sometimes wise to be less than obvious about it. Also, it's 1% what you say and 99% how you say it. While still hard to swallow for the average fundie, saying "I honor both the male and female aspects of the divine and commune with them in a more hands on way" is bound to get a much better reaction than "Hey guess what! I'm a witch!" At least, that's how I see it.

[MagickalHack]

Yes, this is a free country, but some of us do not want to alienate our loved ones just because our religious beliefs do not coincide with theirs. Certainly in an ideal world we'd all just accept each other, but this is not an ideal world and years of deeply ingrained beliefs cannot be erased overnight. Sometimes it's just better to avoid confrontation than to ask for it. I'm not saying lie about your beliefs, I just think its sometimes wise to be less than obvious about it. Also, it's 1% what you say and 99% how you say it. While still hard to swallow for the average fundie, saying "I honor both the male and female aspects of the divine and commune with them in a more hands on way" is bound to get a much better reaction than "Hey guess what! I'm a witch!" At least, that's how I see it.

I am of the firm belief that there is something seriously wrong with a person if they are going to alienate a family member for following a different path. I'm not saying that you shouldn't use tact is some situations, but as a close friend of mine once told me: If you are going to do, say, or be something, don't hide it. Otherwise you don't mean it.

Whether someone is going to crawl down my throat about it or not, I am going to hold my head high, and not hide who I am. Now, I don't go about shouting that I am a pagan. But I am sure as hell not going to hide what I believe, and if someone doesn't like that, too bad for them.


I've even come close to telling supervisors at places I've worked for trying to tell me NOT to wear my pentacle[before it broke], when they told me that they wouldn't ask anyone wearing a cross to remove it. I did however politely say no, and that was the last i had heard about it.



:rant:

[Mitsuko]

My story:
I wear a pendant with a pentacle on it, and I keep it under my shirt out of respect for people who'd find it offensive. One day, at my grandmother's, she noticed the chain sticking out of my shirt and made me show the necklace to her. When I did, she asked me if I was a witch, and started telling me it was impossible for me to be one, as I was a born again Christian. Then she told me "You can wear it outside your shirt, you know, its just a star, people will think you're being partiotic".
Does that count as self-delusion?


I don't like the way people take shots at each other's beliefs, it doesn't matter whether they're Christians or pagans, or anything. My fiance and one of my friends (who's Pentecostal) get into it all the time because he's always challenging her views and beliefs.

[Whitewolf]

I'm lucky in the fact that my parents know I'm a pagan and are okay about it. I really don't like discussing religion with strangers. If someone asks me what I believe in I just tell them I worship nature and leave it at that. I have a friend who is a christian and she happens to be the most open minded person I know. She is like another member of my family. Not all christians are close minded.

[Autumn-Forest]

To all the people who keep saying 'just hide the fact you are pagan':
1.] Why should I have to worry about what I feel is right to practice? Are we living in WW2 Germany? No. I distinctly remember that in the US and Canada we have Freedom of religion.
2.] Being that passive about your religion will do nothing to help people accept anything different, it'll only reinforce their opinion of being right. That being said, I am not saying throw your beliefs/religion[or irreligion for you discordians] in their face.

@OP: I have run into similar problems. My step-father flipped when he found out I was a practicing Wiccan. He even got to the point where he threw something at me.

I totally agree with this statement. If Christians can practice openly, if anyone gets to practice their religion, why can't Witches and Pagans be included? We can be! You should be proud to be a part of your faith/path/religion! You shouldn't have to hide! And you don't have to! If someone asks you about it, just tell them the truth about what it is! How else will people become educated and understanding? If they get mean or try to convert, just leave the situation. Atleast you would be answering their question, and if they were being evil about your religion you were the better person to leave the conversation/situation.

I openly wear my pentacle with my Goddess pendant and my ankh. People have asked me, and I have told them. Usually people are alright when I explain it to them, although I do live in a TIGHTTIGHTChristian community. Usually they say "I was just curious, I thought you liked worshipped the devil or something. But you don't!" You just educated someone if you have told them if they ask. I don't ever try to convert, each to their own faith, but if you want to know, I will tell you the truth.

My parents hated it for years, my dad especially, but later they realized that I wasn't evil. They are open to me being a Witch. Sometimes they even ask me to do a spell for them, if they need help with something. I give them card readings often too, my grandpa even gets readings from me! But it has taken a long time for them to realzie that i'm not evil. Want to know why? I educated them, when they would call me a devil worshipper, I would tell them that I beleive in a Goddess, a God and the power of the Earth. They eventually got it.

blessings,
autumn-forest