North Node vs. MC?

[banondraig]

So far as I understand it, both the North Node and the MC indicate the direction in which one should be heading. What if they are in conflict? Is a compare/contrast possible?

[RedRose]

Hi Banondraig,

The whole scope points to how we can live better and better. It is all a big jigsaw puzzle, where different aspects and energies conflict in our lives and that is OK. People with lots of squares and/or with Grand Crosses are always juggling multiple important parts of ourselves, and we get lots of resistance from outside forces too...this is simply the climate we live under all the time...so we get used to it and it make us strong. We chose challenging lives and we are just the sorts that become good jugglers of paradoxes and contradictory internal and external needs and desires. These skills are needed.

That said, The NN is about your Soul's agenda. The MidHeaven, or MC, is about how you show up as a celebrity or non-celebrity. Are you a private person or a publich person? Will you be famous? How do you wish to be remembered? What will you be known for.

The Rising and Ruling planet are also KEY to living your life close to your Divine purpose. See the Ascendants thread for more on this subject.

RedRose

[RainInanna]

Here's info about the midheaven

http://www.elysian.co.uk/midheaven.htm
http://artcharts.com/learn_astrology/midheaven.html
http://janetboyer.com/Astrology_Midheaven.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Midheaven

My midheaven is in Libra. I found many different interpretations for this, generally suggesting one who is focusing outward on society and their place within it, as well as balancing personal goals with family.

The influence of Libra on the tenth house is an indication of the need for you to strike a balance between home and family and your career or long-range goals. Your destiny is to have both of those directions satisfied and equally represented in order to achieve true happiness and success. It doesn't mean you have to have a career but in addition to family responsibilities, you must establish (and achieve) personal goals that help you realize your potential as an individual. The reverse is also true, your career or personal goals must not be accomplished at the expense of family relationships.

This interpretation was the most "fitting" to me, because I've often had to work on balancing career and family.

[punxzen]

hi banondraig,

do you have em in conflict? i have em in opposition. i think the NN represents the way you need to stretch or flex your soul in order to get all the kinks out. like youve been hunched up in your SN for so long, your gonna be all creaky unless you reach toward the NN.

for me, with my SN conjunct my MC on the 9th house side, it seems important for me to make sure i dont stay hunched up in my isolated tower philosophizing and plotting my course. and so, conversely, with my NN conjunct my IC on the 3rd house side, its important that i remember to actually make connections and reach out to others in the here and now.

redrose made an important point. your whole chart is really the direction you should be heading if you really wanna loosen the kinks and untie the knots in your life, to understand and use the potent energies you have available.

[banondraig]

thanks punxzen!

mine are not ~quite~ in opposition, but very much like yours, NN in 3rd house, SN in 9th, same sign as MC.

[RedRose]

Dear punxzen,

Speaking of getting involved, could you help me a bit? I would so love to know your insights into Interceptions (see our Topic Discussion thread).

RedRose

Dear All,

Having NN or SN conjunct your MidHeaven/IC axis means you are fated to be famous, according to astrology. Or maybe just known in your field. A leader.

Having NN conjunct the IC or Nadir (cusp of the 4th House) means you were well known last life and SN conjunct the MidHeaven means that is going to be the case this life too, the two lives are linked in this way.

RedRose

[banondraig]

ack! i don't wanna be famous!

[punxzen]

me neither! though ive always had this feeling id have to be some kind of leader someday.

[RedRose]

B and P,

Hmmm...maybe this shyness of the spotlight has something to do with NN on your Nadirs? Maybe if the NN were conjunct your MH you would feel different? yip yip

But NN/SN on you MH/IC axis may simply mean "respected in your field" - what sign in on your MH? If it is Leo, give me a break! You love it! If it is Cancer, well....gosh....I don't know what to say about you having to go public, except I am sorry and..uh...thank you.

The big point here is that this life your soul is here to find success on it's own terms. Think about it. Is it REAL success when others believe you are successful? Nah...real success is success on our own terms. Don't settle. Do your passion.

RedRose

[banondraig]

ah, whew.

my mc sign is taurus.

[punxzen]

mine is capricorn

i can dig the respect thing so long as the cameras and spotlights stay well away.

[RedRose]

Shatril,

Concerning your son's NN conjunct MH (what sign was that again?) :

What was his first Saturn Return like? What happened 7 years later and at the opposition (has he had that yet?).

RedRose

[RedRose]

Dear Banondraig and Punxzen (like your yellow logo thing),

Earth signs on the MH mean you don't have to do anything just get up each day and do your thing. You will become an authority as a natural sprouting effect in perfect timing. Taurus MH means you need to bring VALUE and ethics and simplicity and transformed economics that are a blessing to all...win/win/win dynamics. Also coziness, comfort, good food, sex education, NATURE loving, Gaia work....

MH in Capricorn (me too...). You will fail as well as succeed. Late in life it will all come together nicely. Just keep climbing that mountain and don't look back, nor care about public opinion. When success and failure feel the same, that is real success for Capricorn MHs.

RedRose

[banondraig]

ah, horticulture would then be a good choice of course of study?

[Shatril]

Shatril,

Concerning your son's NN conjunct MH (what sign was that again?) :

What was his first Saturn Return like? What happened 7 years later and at the opposition (has he had that yet?).

RedRose

His NN is Aries, as is his MH and Sun.

Saturn Return was monumental, and it was all good. The list is:


Had first child
Got way serious about working
Became a responsible adult instead of a big child
Got his first home without Mom or Grandmother in same residence
Generally grew into his body


7 years later well his life went to hell in many ways. He and the children left his woman because she was an alcoholic, and was really a waste of space. She had left him in really bad financial trouble. He and the kids moved in with me for a while. The kids got healthy cuz they were eating well and sleeping normal hours. Then the woman go sober, and everyone is living happy ever after. I still have the cat, muwahahahaha.

Hasn't had the opposition yet, that is in Oct 2011.

well that is it.

:hugz: Shatril

[punxzen]

MH in Capricorn (me too...). You will fail as well as succeed. Late in life it will all come together nicely. Just keep climbing that mountain and don't look back, nor care about public opinion. When success and failure feel the same, that is real success for Capricorn MHs.

sweet, i love the way you put it, success and failure feel the same. i think i have been heading in that direction for years now, but til now its been vaguely defined. thank you redrose. i feel so invigorated now :smile:

[RainInanna]

Just catching up on some of the threads I was posting in, and I looked back on this and realized ever since I was in college balancing career and family became a huge concern. I kept miscarrying and trying to concieve, and didn't want to start a career, even though my fiance at the time kept pushing me. It was like a constant balancing act and after several years I realized I was focusing too much on the family part. Now I hesitate to find a new job from maternity leave as we are bringing my nephew into the home and I will become a mother of 2. I worry about balancing their care and my new job along with responsibilities in the house.

But really when they ask what you want people to remember you for at your funeral, I can say I want people to remember me both as a hard worker and upstanding citizen as well as a loving mother and strong supportive family member.

[RedRose]

RainInanna,

During our 1st Saturn Return (like you are experiencing) we suddenly start to integrate our life experiences to date. We have a mini-Life Review. Saturn (the teacher) has made it all the way around your scope, so now you can look back over your life and see what there is to see. Keep questing here. You are right on track and a great example to others about what Saturn Returns are like.

RedRose

Banondraig,

Are you asking if Taurus make good farmers? Yeeeeep, none better.

Is your chart around here? Your Rising describes the genre of life movie, your Sun sign is your personality and the Moon is your heart. NN and the cusp of your 12th talk more about your soul's agendas. MidHeaven is about your "calling" and public self. Put it all together.....

RedRose

Punxyen,

You go!

RR

[RainInanna]

Thank you. I have to admit as I examine the years past I realize I have accomplished many of my goals. They aren't fully realized but more of them have a foundation then I knew.

[RedRose]

Hi Shatril,

Studying Saturn is so fun because it is so concrete and clear; and important.

Regarding your son: "His NN is Aries, as is his MH and Sun."

And also his Saturn ia conjunct his NN/MH.

So we know he is here to embody the positive Aries qualities in a very public way. At his 1st Saturn return he was shown his Way:

"Saturn Return was monumental, and it was all good. The list is:

* Had first child
* Got way serious about working
* Became a responsible adult instead of a big child
* Got his first home without Mom or Grandmother in same residence
* Generally grew into his body"


At his next Saturn Square, he got tested very hard. (Note his first Saturn Square was at age 7, and that may have also been very hard. How did he handle age 14 - his first Saturn Opposition?)

RedRose

[Shatril]

Hi Shatril,

Studying Saturn is so fun because it is so concrete and clear; and important.

Regarding your son: "His NN is Aries, as is his MH and Sun."

And also his Saturn ia conjunct his NN/MH.

So we know he is here to embody the positive Aries qualities in a very public way. At his 1st Saturn return he was shown his Way:

"Saturn Return was monumental, and it was all good. The list is:

* Had first child
* Got way serious about working
* Became a responsible adult instead of a big child
* Got his first home without Mom or Grandmother in same residence
* Generally grew into his body"


At his next Saturn Square, he got tested very hard. (Note his first Saturn Square was at age 7, and that may have also been very hard. How did he handle age 14 - his first Saturn Opposition?)

RedRose

This whole period between age 7 and 14 was one of growth for both my son and myself. It is a little hard to know what was directly his stuff, and what stuff I was spewing all over him. In that time I had my Saturn Return, and BOOM there was an explosion of SHYT all over the family. As a result, my son became rather independent, and I let that happen. He was a handful at that time, and I just let him happen on his own with little interference from me. As long as I didn't get a call from the police or anything like that I let it go. The whole time period was a blur of work for me, and self-indulgence when I did take time for myself. When I came to, my kids were grown and I was sad. So I really can't tell you what was going on with him, because I was steeping in my own crap.

He is an interesting person now. I can honestly say, that I don't really know him well, but I do know that he is always there when you need him. His kids are jewels and are a great reflection on their father. They are the best kids I have ever seen. They are polite, loving (12 year old will still sit on Grandma's lap cuz he knows I like it) and really quiet when in the house. We have fun exploring the farm and learning about the flora and Fauna, and I think the yougin' is a budgeoning pagan. He just doesn't know what kind. I guess I know more about the grandkids than my son, hummmmmm should take some time to find out who he really is.

[RedRose]

Hi Shatril,

I relate very much to what you are saying. I had a dramatic breakdown along the way too, which is hard on children, but like your case, they have seemingly turned out well anyway. Thankfully there is only the NOW and your son has a fascinating chart and Cancer Rising folk are here to serve the children 7 generation down. The whole mini generation with Uranus/Pluto conjunct are warriors and very independent. Composite charts of him and your grandkids would be interesting.

RedRose

[RedRose]

Merry Merry,

Everyone getting the hang of the distinctions between the Midheaven and the North Node? The Midheaven is more about what your personality wishes to do and your NN is about your soul's agenda for your life. I am not wishing to create a spirit/flesh split here, because you need to do BOTH - and don't forget to apply yourself to Saturnian issues as well. Astrologers see it all in one syncronized whole when we view a scope; but the way we learn is by taking it in little bits.

So lets practice here. Run some scales, practice a couple chords.

KEishin has her NN at the beginning of Libra in her 4th House. Her MH is Pisces.

Monk has NN in the 11th House in early Sagely-Aware-ious with a Scorpio MH.

Kadynas has NN in early Libra in the late part of her 4th House with Pisces MH (yes like KEishin...three noted MW astrologers have almost identical charts- too weird)

RedRose has NN conjunct Venus in early Capricorn in the 8th and a Capricorn MH (thanks to Cancer/Capricorn duplications).

So what do these mean when put together?

RedRose