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Mithrea
May 28th, 2008, 11:43 PM
I don't even know if I spelled that right!

Anyway, I was looking over some old notes from a Goddess Craft class I took and there is a part about a Fourfold and Fivefold view of the Goddess that break down like this:

Fourfold Model: Maiden, Mother, Queen and Crone
Fivefold Model: Maiden, Amazon, Mother, Queen and Crone

My question though, is twofold. Hehe :weirdsmil

Where did I pick this up? I've got some memory problems since my car wreck two years ago and these notes are much older than that. I have a notation about "The Women's Wheel of Life" by Elizabeth Davis, but I don't remember even ever hearing of that book, much less reading it.

Second, what are your thoughts on this? Since I'm not a Mother, and at 32, don't think I ever will be, the Fivefold model appeals to me. What are your thoughts?

Philosophia
May 29th, 2008, 12:01 AM
I found this website (http://www.mrob.com/pub/std/archetypes.html) that goes into the "maiden, queen, mother, crone" but I have heard of this. Somebody once told me and, if I remember correctly, I think it may have come from Zsuzanna Budapest but I'm not 100% sure.

Shawn Blackwolf
May 29th, 2008, 12:36 AM
In my Tradition...

Maiden , Mother , Crone , Virgin...

The Virgin , was the Eternal aspect...unchanging...

As we say : "Woman is born anew , each day"

Maiden , Mother , Crone , were three cycles , within
cycles...each contained in each other , thus ninefold...

One of our ancient symbols , was three trines , all
connected together , points inward...the Virgin was
the center point of their meeting...

Ninefold Cycles , Four States...the Thirteen...

An auspicious number , to us...:thumbsup:

Mithrea
May 29th, 2008, 06:50 AM
I found this website (http://www.mrob.com/pub/std/archetypes.html) that goes into the "maiden, queen, mother, crone" but I have heard of this. Somebody once told me and, if I remember correctly, I think it may have come from Zsuzanna Budapest but I'm not 100% sure.

That's a really interesting website! Doubly so because it puts the Queen before the Mother, which is counter to what I was able to find. A bunch of books on Amazon point to the Queen as being between Motherhood and Croning -- like perimenopausal women.

RainInanna
May 31st, 2008, 11:12 PM
Personally Queen makes me think of Mothers, and Mother can even be Amazon (especially when it comes to protecting the family). Queen makes more sense to me than Mother, given current issues surrounding fertility and bearing children. I still feel often more towards Maiden than I expected despite having kids now.

Maybe it's time to use a whole new set of roles?

CloeOtter
July 7th, 2008, 06:20 PM
I personally had to think about this for a moment.... we live in cycles right? Childhood, adulthood, then our crone or aged years later in life toward death and rebirth.
Within those ages/cycles we will each have different and similar rites of passage. Now as not every women will have children, nor adopted or rise children...let all will still live through those ages/cycles as a adult women or how about a"Lady"?

So if we were to divide up the cycles in to three:

maiden, lady, crone (or wise one)

I personally like to work and think in three's, but when it comes to deity... Goddess... I tend to thing of her as the Earth, Mother Nature, the Lady at any or all stages or cycles of life.

So as one: The Lady ~all cycles/ages. Skills, abilities, & types of living.

just a few thoughts not my whole feelings and beliefs on this Question...

Faeawyn
July 7th, 2008, 06:37 PM
If we think of the Maiden (or Virgin), the Mother and the Crone (or Wise One) as the cycles of live, then how exactly do the Amazon and the Queen fit in? What would the description of those cycles be?

Tigerlily
July 10th, 2008, 02:35 PM
I'm confused as to what "Amazon" and "Queen" mean.:confused:

Clare-Dragonfly
July 25th, 2008, 09:18 PM
I personally view the Goddess as having four aspects: Maiden, Mother, Crone, and Dark. It's not necessarily a life-cycle thing--it's more to do with the four faces of the moon. The Dark Goddess is death, destruction, rot, etc. (natural parts of life!) but also anything that doesn't fit in with the other three. So Amazon would probably be Dark to me, and I guess Queen too, though I don't know what that means. The Dark Goddess is particularly applicable to modern women now that we are able to break away from the fertility paradigm if we so choose--for example, a woman who is married but not planning to have children (or waiting) would probably be Dark. Persephone is my favorite example of a Dark goddess.

RainInanna
July 25th, 2008, 09:35 PM
If we think of the Maiden (or Virgin), the Mother and the Crone (or Wise One) as the cycles of live, then how exactly do the Amazon and the Queen fit in? What would the description of those cycles be?

Personally I see the maiden and amazon as the same - both virgins - and the mother and the queen as the same energies as well (could also be considered creatrix or what-have-you).

David19
July 30th, 2008, 07:23 PM
I found this website (http://www.mrob.com/pub/std/archetypes.html) that goes into the "maiden, queen, mother, crone" but I have heard of this. Somebody once told me and, if I remember correctly, I think it may have come from Zsuzanna Budapest but I'm not 100% sure.


That's a really interesting website! Doubly so because it puts the Queen before the Mother, which is counter to what I was able to find. A bunch of books on Amazon point to the Queen as being between Motherhood and Croning -- like perimenopausal women.

Like Mithrea said, thanks for that interesting site :).