Catholic Mass

[Sequoia]

Okay. This is a question for any of you who have been Catholic, are Catholic, or have been to a Catholic mass (erm. . . or what it's called ^^; )

Lately I've kinda been curious as to what it's about. No no, Puma's not thinking of converting! Far from it! :p But I am curious enough (from reading about it in books about the middle ages and such) to be thinking about maybe attending a mass, to see what it's all about. It's such an old religion, it's got my curiosity spiked.

Thing is, I really havn't got a clue as to what goes on there! I imagine that maybe if I spoke up that it was the first time I was there, they might be kinda 'thused about it, and want to show me (hey. . . conversions, right? ;) ) but I still would really like to know what is supposed to happen, first. The kind of thing to expect. . . . and they wouldn't be pissed, would they?

I want to clarify - I'm not going to convert, but personally I hold a good deal of respect for the Christian God. I still pray to him sometimes. He's a pretty cool guy (with a very very strange sense of humor). So if I went to the mass, I wouldn't nessicarily be doing an act, I would be genuinely wanting to show him respect and such. I just am very curious about what exactly goes on in a catholic church, because I've heard bits and pieces, but as I said, have never attended myself.

So, do you think this would be an okay idea to try out? Do you think it would be disrespectful to go, because I'm pagan? (no, I'm not planning on standing up and announcing that to everyone :blushake: not that brave! LOL! or maybe stupid :rolleyes: ) Or do you think they'd be thrilled that someone was attending a mass for the first time? I do fully intend to show this religion all my respect and an open mind to get to experience this, because I'm very curious!

So, have any of you been, or currently are, practicing Catholic? Could you guys maybe give me an idea of what would happen during a mass, or where it would be best to start? Should I call the church and ask annoyingly incessant questions first? ;) hehe

Any thoughts?

Thankfully yours ;)
~Puma

[Blu Heather]

I'm sorta Catholic...and I have no idea what goes on in mass...lol Thats mainly cause I don't really practice Catholism but this is what I remember...

Expect alot of sitting and then standing and then kneeling and then maybe more sitting and then standing...basically everyone around you will know what to do. Just follow their lead. No one will get mad or annoyed at you for coming or not knowing what to do. If your lucky you might sit next to someone really nice and you can ask them before the mass begins if they'll help you with the standing/sitting/kneeling stuff.

Don't worry about getting all the "peace be with yous" and "lord hear our prayers" et al. right...but if your lucky the mass might be spelled out for you in a little book. Not sure though. And you don't really have to say them if you don't want. There will be a part for the communion...you don't have to go up and you wont look weird if you don't cause not everyone goes up anyways...probably cause the bread is gross :lol:

Usually(at least in my church) there are a few people standing by the door or by the mass books (?) and you can ask them...they are more then happy to help.

Thats all that I remember the last time I was in church was for a christening...and that was 3 yrs ago :)

[edited...typos :rolleyes:]

[Arzhela]

I don't think it's disrespectful--to your religion OR to theirs--to go, not at all. I've been to the Anglican-influenced church on the Harvard campus once or twice and, while the liturgy is extremely uncomfortable, the sermons are wonderful regardless of one's religion (but then, the pastors are more radical Protestant than traditional Anglican or Catholic...
I am one of my cousin's godparents--his family is Catholic--and I found both his christening and that of his brother's really difficult...but that could just be me). If you're interested in going, by all means, go.

Catholic masses I know very very little about. I only know about the taking the body of the Lord Christ in the form of a wafer. Sorry, can't help you there.

[Drisel]

I am a former Catholic. And yes it is mostly sitting, standing, kneeling to pray and repeat. The only advice that I would give is just follow along it's pretty hard to screw up but when it comes time to partake of the body of Christ give pause. This is a very important ceremony and could be taken the wrong way as to if you consider yourself a part of the church. I stopped taking communion long before I stopped practicing Catholosism for just that reason. But in all things have fun with it and if you are lucky you might even be able to ask the priest a few questions and learn a little something. :D

[MistOfTheSea86]

Not at all Sis! After all, in the end we are all praying to the same thing anyway. I have had the same interest with the baptist church at least I think it's the baptist church? The one's that sing and let you go crazy and jump around:)

[callalily]

You want Catholic info? I used to be a Franciscan nun. Ask the Lily and she will enlighten you! :D

If you go to a Catholic Mass, sit toward the middle. That way there will be enough people in front of you and on each side so you can follow them when they sit, stand, kneel, etc. If you like ritual, you'll enjoy it. Every single word and action is carved in stone, and many Catholics can attend a Mass without engaging their brain at all. I went to a Catholic funeral a few years ago and remembered 95% of everything.

Not that I think turning off one's brain during ritual is a good thing, necessarily. Now that I'm well out of organized religion, I find I engage every possible cell I can when I pray/worship/meditate.

The others here are right about Communion. If you're not a Christian, then I'd advise against going up to receive it. Catholics believe that that tasteless little wheat-and-water wafer is actually the body (yup, in the flesh) of Jesus of Nazareth. Some priests are being trained now in the old anal-retentive ways of the Mass -- once they consecrate the Host (large wafer) (there's certain words they use), they don't touch ANYTHING with those 4 fingers till they do a ritual cleansing. As you can see, it's THE BIG ISSUE.

I'll quit now. But if anyone wants to know more about Catholicism, just ask. Having been clergy, I know some of the insider stuff. :p

[Psyche Ague]

As a former Catholic (and Catholic schoolgirl...uniforms and all! ;)), I would have to agree with all said here about the sanctity and reverence placed on the Eucharist (Communion, bread, wafer thing). Catholics believe (well, I didn't, but you're supposed to) that the bread and wine they give you is the actual physical body and blood of Jesus Christ. Don't take it unless you actually convert to Catholicism. Just make way during that part of the ceremony for people to get by you.

The ritual part of the Mass is what bored me. For most, however, the ritual part of any religion (be it Pagan, Christian, Islamic, etc), puts one in a meditative state conducive to worship, reflection, prayer, meditation, etc. For many people, the Catholic Mass is all about tradition and belief and ritual to show god their love and faith. These traditions have been passed down for a reason: they have worked from the very beginning of Christianity!

While I don't believe anymore, I see nothing wrong with broadening your horizons. I'm sure any priest would LOVE to answer any questions you have. They live in the rectory probably next to the church and while they volunteer and stuff like that, they also have free time to counsel and preach. Go talk to them. I'm sure they also wouldn't be offended or taken aback if you mentioned you're Pagan. I also don't think they'd try to "convert" you, either. Catholics, unlike Protestants, don't place heavy value on "saving the sinners." They definitely didn't at the church where I went. We left well enough alone. Catholics are the ones who insist that good works as well as faith can only get you into god's good graces. They're not going to make your life miserable.

So, go for it. May She guide you to whichever path is right for you.

[buttercup]

Puma-
I think it's a great idea to attend all kinds of different churches and experience what others believe in. You have a very open mind and heart.
My husband is catholic and my children attend a catholic school. I used to be a very active catholic until my heart led me in a different direction, but I still go to mass with my family. I enjoy the ritual of the mass and still find it to be a very spiritual experience. If your looking for the meaning behind what's going on, I can give you a quick run down. You may also want to ask someone there for any information you're looking for. There is usually an usher or parish administrator around before it starts. The following information is to the best of my knowledge.
One of the first things you'll notice is that when people go into their seats, they kneel and make the sign of the cross. The priest at my daughters' school calls it the bob-and-cross. Don't worry about not doing it, a lot of catholics don't either. Once the mass starts they will have a general blessing and most churches will say the Act of Contrition. It is basically a prayer everyone says asking for forgiveness of sins and asking everyone there to pray for each other. During all of this, you are usually standing.
Now, you'll sit. There will be a reading from the old testament, a hymn from the psalms, a reading from the new testament. Stand. The priest will now read the gospel, which is a teaching directly from Jesus. That is why you stand - it is considered showing respect for his words. After, (you sit)and the priest will do his homily (sermon). After he is done, there is a collection of money and then someone brings up the "gifts". Unconsecrated bread and wine.
This is the important part to catholics. Listen to the wording. It really is a ritual. Everyone will kneel during the consecration of the gifts. This is basically a reinactment of the Passover that Jesus had with the disciples. The priest will ask for God's blessing on the wine and bread. He will hold each up, separately, and say the words that are believed to be what Jesus said at the last supper. Catholics believe that during this ritual the bread and water become the flesh and blood of Jesus. That is why you kneel here. It is also why they only allow catholics to take communion. When you go up, the person handing it out will say, "The blood (or body) of christ". You would reply "Amen". Meaning, "I believe". To a point, I understand the reasoning behind it. On the other hand, the teaching is that Jesus' death was a freely given gift for everyone and yet the catholic church puts stipulations on receiving it. Anyway.........there are plenty of people who won't go up for communion so don't feel out of place. When everyone goes back to their seat, they will usually kneel until the place where the hosts are kept (a small, usually domed container behind the altar) is closed. Then there is a final blessing and a song. The end.
I hope this is what you were looking for. If you have any questions, feel free to ask.

[Sequoia]

WOW!! All of this sounds so fascinating! I am a bit excited! :D I'm not sure what questions I'd ask, but I've always been quite curious about it - the only churches I'd ever been to were seventh day adventists (*shudders* baaaaaad experiences there) and presbytarian. (sorry if I misspelled either of those) But Catholic churches always looked so beautiful, and I'd heard little bits and pieces, but not known what it was about. So I thought perhaps now is as good a time as any to find out!

I don't think my own personal beliefs would really change, but I am curious and would love to feel that sort of. . . . that sort of feeling you get when a bunch of people get together to love and worship, no matter what religion it is. :)

So now I just need to look in the paper, hehe. . . gotta find the times! I know where there's a Catholic church near here, there's even a school right there ^^ I used to see the kids wearing uniforms and wish I could, too, when I was younger. 8O

Hmmm. . . . should I wear something nice? A dress? Or do they expect you to be casual? *blinks* I don't know about that part, either! 8O

thank you all so much for what you've told me so far!! I am really twice as curious now. . . o_o wow. . . the body and blood? *blinks* I am not sure how to take that! That's interesting. . .

[SnowStar]

Ok, I'm not Catholic, no one is my family is Catholic, and no one to my knowledge that I'm related to has ever been Catholic. However, I go to a Catholic school, and have attended mass at least 5 times a year for going on 6 years now. So I'm thinking I've got the idea down. As for most of the stuff, its been covered already. A few more little things are that if you have a friend who is Catholic and understands why you want to go to mass, they'll probably help you out as when to stand, sit, kneel, etc. But as everyone's already said, its not too hard. I honestly think that's how they keep the church-sleepers awake. ;) Anywho...the sign of the cross thing...do it if you want, but you don't have to. I think our campus minister put it best when he explained it as a Catholic saying to God "Hey man, listen up, I've got somethin' to say down here!" Also, during communion, if you're not Catholic and if you feel like it, you can go up for a blessing. I've never bothered with it myself, but that's simply because I usually am pretty unmoved by the whole thing. A lot of the ritual stuff is cool, though, and when you're in an actual church everything is really pretty and occasionally you'll get one of those warm, fuzzy feelings even if you don't 100% connect with it all.

[WtchyChick13]

You want Catholic info? I used to be a Franciscan nun. Ask the Lily and she will enlighten you!

NO FREAKIN' WAY!!! :lol: Wow! Learn something new every day! :)

Well, I've read all the other posts and being a former rebel catholic-turned-almost born again-then turned pagan type of person I will say that I agree with the others in that you shouldn't receive communion as it is HIGHLY disrespectful. However, I think it's cool that you are interested enough in other religions to go and check them out first hand. I've done a bit of studying myself on the various religions, but never thought of actually attending a service.

Good for you! :)

[Chibi-Fallon]

I'm planning on going to a Catholic mass which is half in latin for history. The teacher is catholic (with a little "c" as she says) and gave us all these rules and stuff so we don't look stupid or are rude. If you want all the stuff I can find it and post it (or you can PM me or something).

[Psyche Ague]

Puma,

While it depends completely on the church, you should definitely wear something nice. Khakis would work, or a modest skirt. I know people who go in jeans, though, so don't fret too much about it.

[Danustouch]

I think most churches are THRILLED to have new members/visitors to their services. Just follow with the flow. Wear something respectable (nice slacks, decent skirt, nice blouse, no tshirt and jeans). Since you are new, and don't know all of the protocol, perhaps it would be best for you to sit in back, so if you do screw up a little (with the kneeling, "peace be with you's," etc) you won't distract the other attendee's too much. Basically, you should treat them, how you would expect to be treated, were you to invite one of THEM to one of your circles. Meaning...you'd kind of expect them to try and go with the flow a bit. To not distract, to show respect, etc.

The only thing that I would add, is that if they DO offer communion, I wouldn't take it. Not because it's not a fulfilling experience if that's your thing, but because in the Catholic Church, you are supposed to be baptized, and receive your first holy communion before ever taking communion. Plus, you are supposed to make confession prior to receiving communion. (Anyone can correct me if I'm wrong). Relate that to any Mystery Tradition. If you are not initiated into a certain level of the Tradition, there are certain rites you cannot perform, out of respect for that tradition. I think Catholics kinda view it in the same way.

Therefore, sitting in the back would also make you LESS conspicuous for not taking communion :)

[Garnet]

Puma...I grew up Catholic & still occasionally attend Mass (funerals, etc.). You don't have to kneel. I don't, though I do sit & stand. I sit during the Communion part. People will be going to the front of the church & the choir might be singing, but there's no preaching & not much else going on.
There are different 'shades' of Catholic.
My kid brother belongs to a church completely different from the ones I attended growing up. Their choir (with a band) is great, & do gospel, & even religious-themed show tunes. At the risk of sounding sacriligious, it rocks. Full-immersion baptism is done, in a hot-tub right in church. The priest gives his sermon while wandering through the church so he can shake hands, pat kids' heads, etc. The first time I went there, I wondered if I had wandered into a fundie/evangelical church by mistake.
My Dad belongs to an old-fashioned church. Baptism in a font, choir singing Catholic hymns, a priest giving his sermon while anchored to the stand. I go there & it's as if I never missed a Sunday.
Catholics don't fuss about strangers anymore. I was allowed to be my nephew's godmother, & they all knew that I'm not Catholic or Christian anymore. (though they don't know about the Pagan bit, just the Jewish part).

[kblackthorne]

Well, Callalily, I wasn't a nun. But I was going to retreats and trying to select an order when I graduated from Catholic School!


Then I went to a public University for a year, and read a book my mother gave me by a fellow named Scott Cunningham. :devil:


OK, Puma...

When you sit down, there will be a littl paper book in the rack in front of you. Inside, you will find the "stage directions" for Mass: What the priest says, what the people respond, and when they stand/sit/kneel. In a separate section (usually with a dark border on the edges) you can usually find the readings. Music will probably be in the back, though there may be a separate hymnal.

As has been said -- do not approach the altar for communion. There is an initiation process you must go through first. ("First Communion" is a big deal.) Simply sit back in the pew as others get up -- no one will think anything of it.

As for dress and such.... this is California. The standards are pretty laid-back here. Dress "nice" -- no holy jeans, no pentacle t-shirts.

Where I grew up, jeans were considered... inappropriate. For most things. Since moving to CA, I haven't seen that attitude -- no one seems to even have heard of it. So I wouldn't sweat too much.



Some notes:

You will see people dip their fingers in the holy water & cross themselves as the enter. (The formula is {touching forhead}"In the name of the Father {touching sternum over heart}and of the Son {touching left shoulder}and of the Holy {touching right shoulder}Spirit. {bringing hands together in front}Amen." One always crosses oneself with the right hand.

As they enter the church and take their pews (and sometimes as they move around the church), you will see people genuflect. The proper form for the genuflection -- as taught to me by Sr. Doris Bergeron of the Sisters of the Assumption:

One drops one's right knee to the floor, while making the Sign of the Cross. (In practice, many knees never touch the floor, and the Sign of the Cross is often omitted.) This is done out of reverence to the Physical Presence of Jesus Christ in the consecrated Eucharist found in the Tabernacle. (There is a special candle -- often red -- called the "Presence light" that indicates there is concecrated Eucharist -- and thus Divine Presence -- there. See if you can find it.)

Also, just before the Gospel reading, people will make a weird gesture with their right thumb:

They'll touch their forhead, lips, heart. Why?

One makes a tiny cross with one's thumb, thinking "Know the Word" (for head) "Speak the Word" (lips) "Love the Word" (heart)

If you want to score points, wear a hat. (The rule about women's heads being covered was never actually taken off the books.)

Hmmm... I know there's more I could arm you with... this will have to do for now.

[kblackthorne]

Hah! I knew I could find it:

Order of Mass (http://clawww.lmu.edu/~fjust/Mass.htm)

There it is -- the whole Mass (minus readings & homily{sermon} and songs) online! :D

You can look through it before you go, so it's not all 100% strange.

BTW -- they list the Nicean Creed & The Apostle's Creed. Unless you go to a Baptism, they'll be saying the Nicean. (The Council of Nicea was convened to put down the heresy that Jesus was Man, not God. Hence the emphasis on his Divinity in the Nicene Creed.)

[Sequoia]

oh wow!!! again! :D

Yes, I wouldn't presume to take the holy communion, since it is so special and important to them, especially if I havn't gone through all the intiations and such as they have, and maybe don't share the same beliefs (well I'm sure most of them probably don't quite see it from my eyes. . . *giggles* then again, I don't think anybody sees the world quite like I do. . . :D). . . it would be just rude and disrespectful of me to do so. I know I am a guest, and I am there to learn, not to anger them!

(wasn't planning on a pentacle! *chuckles* I only 'own' one, and it was a gift and a talisman, that I rarely if ever wear anymore.)

Goodness. . . . so much in one sitting? That's really incredible. . . but it sounds very special, indeed!

Should I do the whole "crossing oneself" thing? Does everyone drop to their knee? Will I anger anybody if I don't? Will I anger anybody if I do?

Okay. . .wear something semi-nice. hmm I'm sure I can come up with that! A hat. . hmm. . . that's a little harder. . . what kind of hat? Is jewelry of any type okay? Do they have a thing against pierced ears?

The thing I'm mainly concerned about is, I don't want to y'know lie and pretend I'm completely immersed in the belief and faith, because that wouldn't be truthful to them or myself. But I am interested, and I don't want to insult anyone! hmm. . . a good idea would probably be to arrive a bit early, and talk to one of the people standing outside, wouldn't it? (I've seen them there, waving hello or goodbye to people and talking. . . they'd probably be able to give me a few pointers, right?)


. . . ahh! NOW I'm feeling nervous LOL do you think that this is an okay thing to do? ^^;;;;

[callalily]

Puma, don't be nervous! From what I remember, most Christian churches want & expect visitors. Some of the "cradle Catholics" may not understand Paganism, so you might not want to mention that till you get to know people. My mom, for example, would pitch a hairy fit if she knew just how far away I am from Catholicism!

Yes, there are ushers who are there to help, and if you get there about 10 mins early you'll be able to read through the prayerbook & stuff, if the church has them. Most do. IMO, do not feel obligated to genuflect before the tabernacle (the little domed thing where the Hosts are kept), do not feel obligated to kneel during Consecration, do not feel obligated to cross yourself -- IOW, feel free to just watch the ritual.

I've seen many newer churches, and frankly, they don't impress me. My office building has more style and grace. There are 2 churches near me that look like concrete bomb shelters somehow built above ground. I'd suggest finding an older church, one that still has art on the ceiling, statues of Mary and some saints in niches with lots of little candles in front of them, that faint smell of incense that never seems to go away. The church I used to belong to has all that and more -- it was declared a historical landmark. It's a delightful trip back in time.

[gunner]

"NOW I'm feeling nervous LOL do you think that this is an okay thing to do?"

yes, puma, it is an o.k. thing to do, part of being a pagan is learning and how others believe and their rituals is worth knowing. you're approaching this with an attitude of respect so i don't think you can go very far wrong. you don't, as the others have said, take the communion. that is for the initiates who have made holy communion. i think that likely if you quietly attend and draw no attention to yourself you won't even be noticed and at worst you might be thought a "small c" catholic who hasn't been to services in a long time and has forgotten some of the ritual but it's not "enemy territory" these days.

[Emaleth]

Well, being Polish, where 90 per cent of population is Roman Catholic (cause you have to remember that there are other branches of Catholicism, too), you know the mass by heart before you are 10 or so;) . I still go to mass occasionally. For most people going to the mass means sitting, standing, kneeling and reciting the proper words in proper places, without even thinking about them.

Much depends on the fact whether you will go to a big congregation or a small one. In Poland during one mass in a large city church there can be a couple hundred people, most of them don't know each other and they wouldn't notice any stranger. Just do what everybody else does and you'll be fine:p .

Dress customs also vary in different places. In Poland wearing jeans and t shirt to a mass wouldn't surprise anyone. And in Italy you have to wear a long skirt and a blouse, even if you only come as a tourist.

So don't worry, you'll be OK;) . Catholics don't bite, I have really great Catholic friends (of course they don't know I'm Pagan). Good luck!

Blessed Be

[StarryDancer]

Gracious goodness, Puma! most catholics are just like everyone else. There are no "rules" about what to wear, what to eat, etc. And as someone said earlier, each church might tend to have a different level, from very conservative to very liberal. Wear what you would wear to school or work.

If you have a choice, rather than going to a parish church, see if there are any monasteries, seminaries, or "faith communities" in your area. They all tend to open their doors to visitors without question or judgement.

The Sunday service currently is referred to as "Liturgy" or "Celebration of the Eucharist", though there is an increasing tendency to revert to the old "Holy Sacrifice of the Mass", or "Mass" for short. If the congregation is predominantly white Irish/Italian catholic, there will likely be some not-so-great music which no one sings. A mixed cultural background community, or independent "Faith community" will tend to be livelier, will sing some rock, folk, or gospel style music with gusto, and will be more touchy-feely at the "kiss of peace". In any event, you are encouraged to participate to the extent that is comfortable to you.
At the Faith Community where I attend, all comers are welcome to participate fully -- we even have a "juice" option at communion for those who are recovering alcoholic or just do not wish to take wine with the bread fro whatever reason.

Check it out, and check out other churches as well. It's an excellent idea to learn as much as you can about all religions -- it's amazing how similar they are.

[kblackthorne]

Puma,

None of that was meant to scare you -- I was just trying to act as "tour guide".

No one will think anything if you don't bless yourself with holy water, don't genuflect, don't know the parts. :-)

When I go (though usually it's to the Episcopal church, which shares many of the same customs), I cross myself & genuflect -- and throw Energy into my responses -- because it is how I was raised and still holds meaning for me.



Some years ago, my "brother" -- who was raised Fundie & went Pagan -- took an interest in the Episcopal Church. When he decided to go for the first time, I went with him out of curiosity. Christmas Vigil was our first visit.

We walked in, & I started looking through the "program" I was handed with increasing frenzy before I whispered, "These people are Catholic: Do what I do, say what I say!"

Some of the things (gestures, etc.) I explained to you are things that he asked about because they were new to him. I figured they might also be new to you... and somewhat confusing! He had (because of his CM training) a regretable tendency to do the Sign of the Cross backwards at first... and then once I taught him the correct order, found out the only words he knew for that version were "Spectacles, testicles, wallet, & watch" -- the punchline to a "Rabbi & Priest" joke!

(When he finally ended up converting, I was his Confirmation Sponsor... and frequently questioned him on what he was learning, and sent him back to his priest {Pastor Betsy -- I love the Episcopals!} whenever I thought he didn't understand something correctly.)

No, there are no taboo's about pierced ears... though body-piercings might get you some odd looks. But then again, my (all-girl school) Valedictorian had orange spiked hair and a nose-ring. ~shrug~ (Wonder whatever happened to her?...) Jewelery is fine. And forget what I said about hats if you're not a hat person -- that was mostly for scoring "points" with old ladies. :D I haven't worn a hat to church since I was 10. (And I was still quite Catholic by 18.)


You'll do fine.



It's OK not to know or say the words.

It's OK not to make the gestures.

It's OK to stand in the wrong place -- or to stay sitting in your pew through the whole service.

You'll not be the first to do any of these things. You won't even be the first person in that church this month to do them.

Frankly, I like the sit, stand, kneel thing for a perfectly practical reason: It's tiring to stand for too long, and tiring to sit in a pew for too long. So the changing physical positions is comfortable for me. And kneeling is very restful for my lower-back.

(BTW -- you don't kneel on the hard floor. There is a little padded kneeler in each pew that folds up out of the way when you stand, and you hook down with your foot to kneel on. You'll see it. My first trip to a Protestant church was very confusing, because I couldn't find the kneelers! :nonono: Plus, although I'd been told I SHOULD take communion, the difference wasn't explained to me... and I tried to swallow the piece of hard cracker without chewing it!:ugh: Didn't want to masticate the Body of Christ.)


I agree with Calalilly about the modern-building thing.

A properly performed Mass is a ritual of potent Magic. In its declining years, (most notably since Vatican II and most notably in the US) the Catholic Church has tried to "revive" itself by becoming more Protestant in some regards. Out with statues of the Saints, enter austere architecture. Exit plain-song chant, enter the "three-guitar Mass". And funny, but the power raised isn't the same.

This is the reason I prefer the more traditional Churches. A lot of meaning has been lost from the more progressive ones.


Lemme give you a "for instance": Wiccans "traditionally" incorporate a meal at the end of ritual. Not at the beginning. Why? Because it is believed that the act of eating "grounds" one, making it harder to achieve an altered state of consciousness. You go to ritual on an empty stomache to make altering consciousness easier, and eat afterwards to help re-establish "normal" consciousness.

In the Roman Catholic Church, fasting before Eucharist used to be a big deal, for pretty much exactly the same reasons. (I'm not saying everyone knew why they had to fast, just that this WAS a factor in the custom.) The length of the fast was gradually shortened, until it is now impossible not to meet the requirements if you show up to church on time. But that means that for the entire hour-long ritual designed to alter your consciousness, you're basically head-blind... or at least not really able to participate fully.

So the problem these days is finding someplace where the Priest is truly capable of perfoming the Mystery. It does make a difference.