dear gods. . .

[Sequoia]

Why is it my fault my mom quit her job, and now we have no money? Why is it my fault that my mother can't find a job? Why am I so evil for refusing to let her on my computer (after letting her on several times - every SINGLE TIME no matter how much I explained or demonstrated, EVERY TIME my machine crashed and I had to spend time fixing it, and I have no clue how she did this, she seems to have a knack with opening hundreds of internet explorer windows on pages that don't spawn, or freezing the machine, or things like this)?

I am appearantly also an ungrateful, lazy, cruel, mean, unappreciative. . . *shakes her head*

Now, on the other hand - she willingly spent $280 on plane tickets for my birthday (this, after quitting her job, because she was insistant on doing something special for my 18th birthday), she spent over $400 on my little brother for school (this is not clothes or supplies - this was for his yearbook and football gear, both of which I might add are optional, but not for the little jock, it's his life.), spends who knows how much shelling out lunch money every day to him, gives him money to buy things like a big thick silver chain, dress shirts, cologn, slacks, etc so he can impress the girls (who then call at like 11pm and 12am not to mention all evening because he's the 'nice guy' and they need to talk to him, and wake up the rest of us). Meanwhile, I'm bad and anti-social and need to get out more, seeing as how I don't have any "real" friends. They live out of state. Hey guys, guess what, you aren't 'real'! Wow!! I am so shocked. Like, let's go to neverland. Or maybe www.neverland.com

She quit her job, can't find a new one, won't get hired back for at least another month (policy), and it's appearantly my fault. Because "you kids" (used 90% of the time when my brother is not around, or when he is, it is directed at me) are ungrateful little brats, refusing to help mother dearest out, refusing to get a job (for what, 20 days before I leave? This is real plausable, mom.), demanding lots of money (the fsk? I "demand" my internet access, and maybe a few calories every once in a while. Jesus pogostick Christ, she shells out $5-10 every day for my brother for school, spends god knows how much on cigarettes (what are they in cali, like $5 a pack?). . . . and then yells at me because I don't have a job and I eat and wear clothing. Damn. I'm sorry. Would she like to sell my clothes, and I'm sure I can live a little while not eating. This is fsking enough to make me want to cut myself. What the hél did I do? I'm 17, for god's sakes, my birthday is in two months, I'm travelling ACROSS THE COUNTRY in less than a month and she won't even have to DEAL with me for a whole freakin month, but I bet you, I bet you I will get letters and shiat sending me money and blaming me for problems. Does anyone see the irony?? Sending the money, AND THEN blaming!? JUST KEEP THE FSKING MONEY, I'D RATHER STARVE OR WEAR UGLY OLD THINGS OR JUST CURL UP AND CRAWL TO PENNSYLVANIA, IF IT WILL KEEP YOU FROM BLAMING ME FOR YOUR LIFE!!!

And she makes cracks about my boyfriend, who hasn't been here because he got a job and is working his arse off. First she complained and teased about him not working. Then she complained and teased and had the nerve to say he was using me, because he couldn't see me more than once a week because he was working himself to exhaustion so that he can pay his bills and maybe, just maybe, save up enough money to do something with. And so, since he hasn't been able to visit, he's neglecting me or using me or some shiat like that, and i can't even figure out what the hél she means by that. Oooh boogie boogie. He's working, so he must be using me. Then she has the nerve to say I quit my last job because I wanted to have free time to sleep with him, and so I didn't have to spend my money on him.
W. T. F. If any of you remember that big huge thread that got me into a bunch of trouble back in like march or so, the one about rape, that was why I quit my effing job. Because I was stressed beyond belief, had a bitch of a boss, was being totally screwed over from multiple fronts, and just needed time to crash and burn. And pick up the pieces.

but appearantly, I'm an ungrateful daughter with no friends who doesn't do anything but costs way too much money who needs to go out and do something instead of lying around fsking her lazy bum boyfriend who is just using her while working his ash off 6 days a week and recovering that seventh, who also appearantly needs to get a job for the whopping 20 days she's going to be here, so that mom can wallow in her self-pity for being over 50 (and hence a fat, ugly, old woman, despite everything her daughter says to the contrary) and unable to find work because of that, and the fact that her computer skills are outdated (but of course, that doesn't mean that it's her fault the computer crashes whenever she uses it - it's the computer's fault.)


. . . christ, can I just cry?

No. I can't. Because then she'll see me crying and tell me to knock it the hél off, because I'm being dramatic or I've been up too late (which is true, because I hate sleeping anymore and have been having nothing but nightmares, a product of extreme stress in me, that we've seen since BIRTH) or I'm trying to get attention or something.

God. Gods allmighty. It's enough to make a person want to do bad things to herself. I am so damn stressed. I want to go to fantasy land.


Thanks for listening to me rant.

Puma, over and out.

[Yvonne Belisle]

Big hugs just keep thinking less than a month and you will get a vacation from all of this. We will just have to make sure it is a good one.

[Old Witch]

You know I've had a really bad day......I'm 51, three grown children and sometimes children can drain the life right outta you.........There's 2 sides to every story..........I ain't too freakin' great on the computer, spent a fortune on HS rings, yearbooks, graduation, hauled their asses to school for 20 years, paid for this computer, cars insurance, fed them, clothed them and done without for many a year..........Gave up my weekends to take them to all manner of sports events, nursed them when I was ill, pretended to be happy when I sent them off on trips I couldn't afford.......... 2 sides to every story....... Don't expect sympathy from this Mom.....cause I'm pretty sure you're not so perfect yourself......... and Yes, saying all that, I love them with all my heart.........your Mom probably loves you too.......But guess what? She's human.................2 sides to every story.................

edited for spelling.......

[Sequoia]

look old witch, I'm very sorry, I konw my mother loves me, but I really do not need to hear about how aweful a child I am for requiring nessecities such as food and clothing. Yes, she was angry about that. I do not ask for trendy clothes or brand-name foods. For the love of god, the last food I requested was a box of cheerie-os. I have told her many, many times not to buy me something, to buy herself something instead, that I did not need this or that, and that she did. I have questioned her when she seemed upset, or didnt' eat dinner. I have encouraged her when she was down, gone and gotten her the paper without fail every morning, walked the dog when it belongs to my good-for-nothing brother, have rubbed her back when she cried and tried to brainstorm for her when she coudlnt' think of things for work. I am not just some teenager bitching about her mother. But thanks for putting it in perspective for me.

I'm utterly thrilled that you can see the other side of the story, and I'm very sorry you have had a bad day. Thanks for bringing me back to reality.

No more need to respond, anybody. I guess I understand now. Thanks.

[Danustouch]

Sorry Puma, I just have ONE eensy weensy little question. Who bought you the computer? And oh..wait..didn't you mention she pays for your internet access?

[Sequoia]

. . . . . Fine danu. Fine.

For your information, the computer was purchased by my father, for a graduation from high school present when I was 15.

The internet is not being charged right now, as it is a free AOL trial thing.

I am very glad everyone is rushing to my mother's rescue. Maybe I should have her come read your posts. I'm sure she'd be happy to see the support being given her.

[Yvonne Belisle]

When you quit your job and don't have another ready that is not someone else's fault simply because they exist. As a parent it is part of my job to pay for food and clothing and basic living expenses and I would be a pretty crappy parent if I resented giving my children those things. The little extras that she does she didn't have to do. Yes she may have wanted to do them but she chose to do them you did not ask her to do so that makes it her choice and she has no reason to make you feel like shit over it. A child is not selfish simply because they exist. Yes there are two sides to everything but for those who have read these threads from you in the past we know this has been a constant thing and that is verbal child abuse and does a very large amount of damage. As a matter of fact the damage done is worse than striking your child.

[Yvonne Belisle]

If your mother is having that many issues paying for your basic needs then she needs to talk to your father or emancipate you so you can take care of yourself. IF she can't afford to pay for food to feed you and your brother she needs to do something about it not you and it is not your fault you need to eat.

[PrincessHLHofMW]

puma i can understand...maybe because im just a 17 year old myself...but my father would do the same thing...im not made out of money!!! why dont you get a job???....well sweet father maybe cause im in school and trying to find a job...get off my damn back and tell you lazy 20 year old son to get a job or get out...or even get to school or get out...ARRRG!!!!!!

I can understand your anger at your mom....its not fair to give you a hard time cause she is having one...its not your fault

[SerenityMoon]

listen to me. none of you know beth (puma hime) better than i do. none of you. this battle with her mother has been going on for years. do you hear me? this is the same woman who punches her daughter, lets her brother chase her with a knife (YES. A KNIFE. and beth was blamed for this), shoot her with a bbgun and laugh it off, slap beth for crying, and who then turns around and cries becuase her daughter doesn't understand how she can punch her then turn around and dish money onto her.
two sides to every story my ass. i've HEARD the other side. you have not. this young woman's mother treats her son like gold, and treats beth like crap. i've visited these people in california and STAYED in her home. her mother is psychotic. so she buys beth a few shirts every now and then..so she buys her food. she's SUPPOSED to provide for her children in TWO ways: physically, and EMOTIONALLY. seems one is missing, eh?
so the hell what if beth quit her job? she's not the parent here. she's the child. yes, CHILD. if her mother insists on supporting her, then why does she also insist she gets a job? she tells beth it's all right one minute, then turns around and smacks the girl for "being lazy". beth has tried going to school and can no longer go becuase her dad hasn't paid for it. she's tried working and has either had no way to get there or was raped by her boyfirend and had to suffer the stress. do NOT get onto her about there being two sides, becuase you truly haven't heard either one. you read one post and immediately turned her into this whining brat. how dare you claim there are two sides when you have clearly seen only one without asking questions? what a bunch of hypocrites.

[WandererInGray]

If it's truly that bad, she should be moving out.

*shrugs* I may come off as the heartless adult here.....but let me remind you that there are A LOT of children out there who would kill to have back the parents that were taken from them a year ago today.

There are worse things in life than being bitched at by your mother.

If it's *that bad*.....get out.

[PrincessHLHofMW]

yikes and i thought it was bad here....i really was shocked to see the way most people responded to puma's release of anger and call for friends....:(

[Old Witch]

We have only heard Pumas side of the story, not a word from her Mother................Not that I am doubting anything she says, but I'm about the same age as her mother, and have raised 3 sons, teens exaggerate, and no matter how mature they are, they are not adults........no expert here, but maybe we could give her Mother a little consideration.......Of course, If you have some knowledge we don't have about the situation, then you know best............

[SerenityMoon]

wanderer: she is 17 years old. she does not need to be cast on the street, she needs love. are yo usaying it's all right for this woman to punch her daughter, let her son chase her with a gun and a knife, simply becuase she's her mother? you consider this "bitched at"? that's sickening. it really is.
old witch: i just provided your "Information" about her mother. have some fun with it.

[PrincessHLHofMW]

Originally posted by WandererInGray
If it's truly that bad, she should be moving out.

*shrugs* I may come off as the heartless adult here.....but let me remind you that there are A LOT of children out there who would kill to have back the parents that were taken from them today.

There are worse things in life than being bitched at by your mother.

If it's *that bad*.....get out.

wanderer...as many of us know and puma stated she is only 17...meaning right now she cant just "get out"...i was lucky enough to have my mom come back o get me out of my dads house...anyways at 17 you cant just "move out"

[Emerald Oak]

I can't give any advice from experience, but I can give advice, none the less.

Have you tried talking to your mom? Maybe if you throw a little logic her way, she'll give in and stop being such a harpy. If that doesn't work, closing yourself off from the world won't help at all (THAT little pearl IS from experience). If things are extreme enough, therapy/counseling may be a good alternative. On BOTH of your parts, not just you or her.

Hope this helps, and if you need a shoulder to cry on, you've got me, Yvonne, everyone at MW, and any other friends that apparently don't exist :D

[SerenityMoon]

amen, princess. amen to that.

[WandererInGray]

Sweetheart.....today of all days is not the day to call me an idiot. I'd watch yourself if I were you.

17 years old is old enough to make decisions on one's own.....if the situation is ABUSIVE....you get out. That's the bottom line.

[SerenityMoon]

*raises eyebrows* now you're threatening me? heh. some mother.
not if you don't have money, a place to stay, or a means to support yourself.

[Yvonne Belisle]

Um Old Witch I believe you ment to address Serenity Moon not me. I wrote directly to Puma not to you at all.

[Sequoia]

. . . . okay.


I can see where this is going.

You know. . . . I really thought I was respected as an equal here. This is mystic wicks. People usually respected, and sometimes even agreed with my ideas and opinions. Someone up there even saw fit enough to say "hey, she could make a good moderator."

And now, because I am a teenager, it is quite obvious to everyone that because of this, I am remarkably adept at exaggerating and somehow completely disreguarding my mother.


Let me spell this out to you.

I have held my mother while she cried. I have taken care of my brother, have dealt with my mom being drunk before, have let wants and wishes go to the side, and not complained, because I knew she could not help this. I have patiently replied, every time, hearing her say she was old or fat, that no she wasn't fat, that no I thought she was beautiful, that I envied her hair, that I was proud of her, and by all the gods, I meant it.

Don't tell me about the other side of the story. I've lived it. I've had to hold my mother's hand through it. And I understand that.

But I do not need to be told that I am some whining teenager, when I come here because I am having such a hellish day. I really do not need everyone to suddenly assume I am making a big deal about nothing, because I am younger than you and it's in relation to my mother.

I'm glad that any respect I had can be so casually disreguarded. I have been told more than once, here, that I am thoughtful. Why shouldn't this extend to my mother? Or my brother? The monster that has tried to kill me, on more than one occasion, and confessed this to my mother, who promptly still blamed it on me? The times I have given what little money I had, because she didn't have any, and he needed money for lunch? The times I've given up the little promise she gave me, for her or for him?

Dont' tell me about these things. I grew up with these thigns. I've been a partner in my own raising since I was a young child.

Go ahead. Think me a spoiled brat. I just simply cannot belive the outpouring of support here. . . . support for my mother, and distrust for me. This is. . . shocking. Simply amazing.

[Yvonne Belisle]

Making threats even vague ones is NOT respectful. Mol has asked one thing of us and that is to respect each other. I realize many people are having problems today but we do need to remember to respect each other.

[WandererInGray]

Ah yes...and calling me an idiot was the high of respectfulness.

It wasn't a threat...it was a request for some respect.

And I have no idea where you, Serenity, got the idea I was a mother.

If a person posts things on a public board, they should be prepared for others to post their opinions on the subject as well. I saw no one being disrespectful to Puma, merely stating that they could perhaps see where her mother was coming from. (and remember....all they had to go on was her post...nothing else).

Serenity jumps in with attacks upon us for being "uncaring" and then calls us idiots. :rolleyes:

I'm done with this "discussion".

[Old Witch]

Puma, I don't do guilt trips...........Go to Childrens Services yourself......... Take charge of your life .......Get away from your brother.......... You can do that.............You're the only one who can do that. Don't sit there and whine Woe is me......Act!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Yvonne Belisle]

You know if someone posted quit whining in the 9/11 threads you would be all over them hey wait someone pretty much did and got attacked for it. Why can't a member who is having major issues express themselves without getting jumped for it? If you are having a bad day and don't want to hear someone whine don't read the thread. A member came to us for a shoulder to cry on not to get kicked. If you want to kick her then don't reply it is that simple just remember how you felt when you come to the people you think care and just think about the fact that maybe they don't feel like listening to you either. It happens no matter how good a friend someone may be sometimes they just don't feel like hearning it. With a bbs you have an advantage if you don't want to hear it you can just not read the thread. To Puma many of us are her family as well as her friends she comes to us because she knows some of us give a damn if you don't then don't bother to reply. If you think she should just get out would you like to provide her the money to do so or the place to go? Will you let her use your couch while she finds work? Will you feed her and clothe her till she can do it herself? In California she is not going to get the help she needs from childrens services she is too old they aren't going to go threw the paperwork for a kid who turns 18 in November. So unless you have a place for her the option of just leaving is not viable. Plus the parents would be more than willing to press charges if you did help her so she is stuck.

[PrincessHLHofMW]

My God! I can't believe most of you! YES! today is september 11! That doest mean just worry about your problems...you have to be their for those you care about! Its a time to be there for EACHOTHER...not say anything that would show disrespect for some one this is appalling!!! Your friend came to you for support...if you cant offer it then dont reply....its a hell of alot better then disrespedting someone....*gets off the soap box*

[SimplyStrange]

I just poked my head in to hug puma... {{{{{{{{{{{{{{PUMA}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}

I'm having problems with Jim. Er... my dad, that is. I swear I'm thisclose to just not ever going back there. Maybe once my car title goes in my mom's name? Hell... I don't care about the car anymore. I just want out.

Just remember Puma, we're always here for you...

...and we are real. ;)

[Danustouch]

Ok..first of all. Puma, you didn't log on telling us about your mom punching you, or any of that OBVIOSLY abusive stuff. You logged on posting about how you were mad that your mom was yelling at you about her financial problems. Parents DO get stretched sometimes, financially. And sometimes, they DO see their children as the source of their financial woes. Is it fair? No. Is it human? Yes. What Oldwitch was trying to point out (before hearing these horror tales of abuse) was that sometimes, a simple..."God, mom, I'm sorry your day stunk so bad. Maybe if I did a load of laundry for you, or cooked dinner, you could go in and take a nice long bath and relax.." works wonders. As much as kids feelings need to be understood by their parents, sometimes, parents feelings need to be understood by their kids. Especially when those children are old enough to understand, that everyone has their bad days, and everybody bursts out sometimes.

As for MY questions, hey hon...i'm just trying to get the whole story down, so I can give accurate advice. I'm not going to side with you, without knowing your mom, and without knowing all the details, am I ?

As for Azure's advice, ya know what...she's just plain right. If your mom is BEATING you...Get the Cops, Get yourself into a halfway house, or a teen shelter, or something of the sort. I don't know about California, but around here, you can stay in them until you are 19. And they WILL help you. With clothes, food, and even finding you aide for college. You don't stay in a house where you're being beaten...PERIOD.

And puma, I hate to say it, but some of us have given you this advice before, only, about your brother. Remember? Be mad at us, all you want, Rant to us, all you want. But the simple fact is, we're trying to see both sides of the story. Especially since the ONE side we're being presented with, is an all out angry rant. It's kind of hard to slow down and take in the whole picture, when the person is on a tirade. So..we're trying to do just that. Slow you down, and have you explain the whole story to us. But..ya know what..after most of us having our arseholes ripped out in this thread because someone didn't like our advice, or our questions, I doubt we'll bother helping out.

[Djiril]

If you buy something for your kid, you shouldn't throw it back in their face later. If you want it to be conditional, then you should make that clear at the time you buy it, not the next time you're feeling angry or frustrated.

And no one should ever be yelled at for crying. It happens all the time in my house, and I hate it.:mad:

[Old Witch]

Apples and oranges 9/11 and this are entirely separate things............In one breath she's a mature adult....in the other shes a helpless kid.... Try an abused womens shelter, anything.....I'm out of here with Wanderer..........

[Sequoia]

alright. Fine, guys.

I'll go find my own solutions, then.

And yes, by the way, the last time I tried to go to child services or the police about it, they told me to go home and be a good little girl. Appearantly, getting hit with a broomstick really isn't what it used to be. I limped to the payphone, called them, they came, took me home, and told me to stay there. You see, my mother is good at acting for people.

I have tried to go talk to someone at a 'shelter' thing before, even just for counseling. I was met with skeptisism and the same kind of reaction of "oh, you're just not giving your mom a chance."

I do do things for her, I don't treat her like shit as my brother does. . . and yeah. I guess you have heard some of this before. So that makes it worthless now. I see.

At least you guys helped with one thing. You got me to cry. I couldn't do that before. So. . . thanks.

All I wanted to was to vent, maybe to hear "Hey I know how it feels, but things get better with time."

I give up. If you don't want to hear about this, you won't anymore. I'll be perfectly happy Puma.

Well. . . thanks again. Take care.

[PrincessHLHofMW]

well puma sweetie im here for you....IM me anytime...you've got the name

[*~*Chary*~*]

Puma,

I can see what you are going through. Nope i amn't gonna say its your fault or stick up gfor your mom and i have no buts. I think what is happening must seem dreadful, and all i can say is, if you want to talk i'm here. Hugs hun. It will get better

Love
Chary xxx

[Yvonne Belisle]

Also yes the quit whining would count in the 9/11 threads because unless you lost someone in it then it didn't directly affect you in that tramatic a way what Puma is going threw is directly affecting her. The emotions she feels are just as valid as those who haven't gotten over the shock of 9/11 so I do not understand the mentality that says it is ok for someone who only has delt with the tragedy of 9/11 threw the news to be hurt and upset but it is not ok for someone going threw emotional abuse to vent on it.

[PrincessHLHofMW]

Originally posted by Yvonne Thomas
Also yes the quit whining would count in the 9/11 threads because unless you lost someone in it then it didn't directly affect you in that tramatic a way what Puma is going threw is directly affecting her. The emotions she feels are just as valid as those who haven't gotten over the shock of 9/11 so I do not understand the mentality that says it is ok for someone who only has delt with the tragedy of 9/11 threw the news to be hurt and upset but it is not ok for someone going threw emotional abuse to vent on it.

i completely agree....besides if we have learned anything from the horrible events that happened last year isnt the one most important to be compassionate to our friends and loved ones and to be there and tell them we love them?

[evilslinkycat]

{{{{puma}}}}

Trust me, it does and will get better. I've been trhough this when i was growing up. Yes its horrid, but things change sweetie. I know its easy to say and at times impossible to believe but it is true.

If you have to fight tooth and nail to get someone to help you then do it, it may not be an easy thing to do, but it can be done.
If you need someone to vent to i'll listen....

[Tammy Sullivan]

Puma, we are a community here, and as such you are loved. Just remember that. (((((PUMA)))))

[Scarlettvixen]

{{{{{{{{{{{{{ PUMA}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}
sorry hun i just stumbled across this thread, and even tho i dont know you well i feel for what you are going thro.

I know where you are coming from - I managed to get out at 17 by finding a job that gave me somewhere to live.

I am shocked at some of the responses from people - people who's opinions i usually respect.

Telling an abused child to get out is the same as telling an abused wife to just leave - its great advice but it aint so easy in real life!

I am sending positive thoughts to you puma, have a good break, and when you get back try and get work and get out of there before you are killed or all yr self-respect is destroyed

[Yvonne Belisle]

You know I have found that dispite having very little myself that the more I give the more I find I have to give. For many people that works just in emotional and untangables but for me it is more than that. When I share my food I find I always have enough to feed one more person if they need it. I am willing to open my home and my heart to people and I have found that when I need help I always find it. I don't do the things I do to feel better about myself or to make others give me compliments I do it because to me it is what is right when you have something another needs and it won't hurt you to share to me it is right to do so. This is not just something I extend to strangers I do this with my children too. I am by no stretch of the imagination a perfect person I have a bad temper I get hurt easily and I can be selfish too. However I will NEVER tell my kids it is thier fault that we don't have things because I have to provide thier basic needs. I don't have nice things because many times they get broken I can live with that and yes I will point that out to my kids but I do not grind it into them which is what Puma has had to live with. I truely hope should I ever behave in that manner that someone hits me really hard. Puma maybe if your mother opened her heart and was not so bitter about everything she would have more.

[MistOfTheSea86]

And I will not name names, I Have heard many of you claim to be empathatic, claim to be able to recognize emotion when you see it. A cry for help, a cry for friends and though you may have been trying to just express your opinion, it came out as a badgering insult. This can happen and it does happen, as Danus put it. It's human.

I think alot of times everyone, not just teenagers, forget the social superioty. When it gets down to it, everyone can be as irrational as the next person. Yes, Puma may have exaggerated facts. Now put yourself in her shoes, just don't quickly dismiss it based on prior biased opinion, actually put yourself in her shoes. Feel what she is feeling and then come back here and say what you said. It's not that easy.

I have known Beth, my sister, for a long time. I love her dearly and I know the past problems she has had, and she has come to me telling me exactly what you are telling her to do. She knows what has to be done, and she has been trying to take steps to get out of it. She is far from incapable and far from not trying.

I find it odd, and very interesting that the very people Beth put her trust in are the very people who block themselves from understanding. She stood naked letting out her heart to all of you, and I am sure you all know what it is like to have that spat back in your face. Now again it may not have been your intention but that is how the majority of the replies came out.

Please everyone, be the compassionate community I know you can be, and again, don't forget to imagine what it must be like for someone else. And if you know then offer your insight, not your malice or misled accusations.

[phoenixsong]

(((((((((Puma))))))))

I cannot believe how some people acted towards you in this thread. I have never, ever seen anyone behaving like that at Mystic Wicks.

[Yvonne Belisle]

Thank you Mist sometimes people don't see what is right in front of them.

[mol]

Hmm.

Another case of someone wanting to vent or have some support and getting slammed.

Well, let me say this. If you questioned Puma then you probably could have left your comments out of this thread. If the other side needed to be explained or, maybe the other side wanted some support then perhaps another thread would have been the best course of action.

The only thing I see here is ugliness on all sides. And as such Im going to close this thread.

Puma, Im sure that those who will give you support will be in contact via pm.

And to the other side, I guess the same applies.

[Semele]

Well, this is a sad thread to read, for many reasons. I see a lot of pain from many of the members who have posted. I have been re-reading a great book by Sonia Choquette entitled The Psychic Pathway. It is a great book that speaks very loudly to my soul. It talks about walking lightly and being more aware..of both the world around you and of your own spirit. I just wanted to share a couple of exerpts from the book.
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We are all human and thus make human mistakes, horrible, evil mistakes that hurt ourselves and those we love. People will always make such mistakes and let us down, we just have to learn that our lovability and worth doesn't come from others, but from ourselves.

Forgiveness opens our awareness to the soul more than anything. When you can see those who have hurt you through the eyes of truth, you can understand how so much of the pain came from your own misperceptions about who they were and what they would or could do for you.

People who hurt you are only people hurting themselves. When you forgive them, you take your power back from them.

Forgiveness and acceptance are niether weak nor passive acts. They are acts of great courage.

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Maybe we can all read something in these words and truly hear the message. Today is an emotion filled day anyway, so we are highly charged, many of us. We may have said things we regret to someone, not just in this thread, but everywhere. We all, I am sure, have someone to forgive. Take a moment to think about someone you can forgive and make your walk a little easier.

Puma, I do understand and I offer you love and energy, but in the end it is you who has to make the changes. I am not speaking of shelters or leaving...just to rise above it and find a way to forgive. It is very much worth the effort.

I am closing this thread now...lets all just try to forgive and love our friends and families and be thankful that we have them. On this day especially, I am reminded of those who may have missed a chance to forgive and love someone very close to them.