I Badly Need Insight And Solace

[Graelwyn]

(This IS a LONG post... I hope someone might have the patience to read through and help me).

To briefly recap, I recently, totally by chance, ended up in only my second real life relationship with someone (I have had mostly internet relationships thus far and this did come about through an ad seeking 'friends only' for coffee and chats).

Anyway...one of the reasons I kept away from any chance of a real life relationship was I have some borderline personality traits, especially the abandonment fears and the lack of trust (which has been made worse by the fact that every single man I did have anything with, lied to me, in one case to the point of it being conpulsive lying).

Well, this new man has his own issues. When younger, he had some of my issues...the deep pain when feeling abandoned, and self harming etc. He claims he just shut all the pain off, shut his issues off. But he drinks. Before meeting me, he would drink himself to sleep on beer. When he met me, he did stop, but since then, whenever we have had conflict, he has turned back to drink.

The issue is this. His tendency, if he senses anything of a bad atmosphere, is to just gather his things and go to leave. My instant reaction to that...and my inability to talk/ask him to stay...is to get totally engulfed in pain and fear and to do very impulsive things, such as cutting, smashing things, hurting myself. IT is almost impossible to control as the pain is so great. And when he is in that state of mind, he seems to become totally deaf to my feelings...cold, almost hard. At other times, he was always so eager to protect me, and to comfort me and to stay with me when I needed him, so I cannot understand.

Anyway, we had 2 very bad nights where he just totally lost his temper. On Tuesday night, I had told a small lie to him. He had asked if I had hurt myself, and I lied and said 'no' several times before saying I had. I dont like to always admit to it. Got past that, then we tried to discuss it again, and he said something that touched a nerve in me and I stormed off leaving him at the swimming pool we had gone to. He had a few double alcoholic drinks before coming back and just packing his stuff. I reacted by grabbing the kitchen knife and cutting my arms in front of him and running out the door. Totally irrational, yes. But I felt so trapped and so voiceless and so unable to do anything with the hurt I felt.

He restrained me, but he was so furious he was shouting and stabbing the knife into the kitchen worktop in his anger, which scared me. Finally, after he had shouted a lot, and I had just frozen up and become mute from that, he continued gathering his stuff, ignored my distress ( I was trying to smash my window) and walked out. I took an overdose later on and called my mother to try and see if she could say anything to help me process why he had become so angry with me, just over a small lie.

Anyway, I spent the night in hospital, he refused to come with me in the ambulance, but did phone and turn up there at almost 4am to see how I was. We had a calm night the next night, then again on friday night, chaos ensued because I told him of some fears I was having about a wedding he was going to the next day. I was calm and told him I was worried he would find someone else there (another woman) and tried to explain.

One thing I did right from when he first knew me as a friend, was to explain the issues I have, the trust issues especially so he was aware. And he was. He said he became a couple with me, knowing I had issues and accepting I did.

Yet, on Friday night, he got really furious, while maintaining it was nothing I had said, and decided to go home again. He said he has done all he could to make me feel safe and to offer me a chance at happiness, and that I had not taken it. That I refused to believe in him etc.

Basically, after less than 2 months, he was giving up to a degree, because I could not yet throw myself in head first and give him all my trust.

That hurts. Because I already have issues believing I am loved. How am I to process the fact that in his anger, he left me in a terrible state? That he got angry at me because I cannot overcome my issues in the space of 2 months enough to never have doubts and fears?

Yeah, he came back. I woke on the Saturday morning to him letting himself in to check I was alright. He has always texted or turned up to make sure I am still in one piece. He didnt go to the wedding in the end. Said he couldnt have gone without making sure I was alright.

But nevertheless, I am on edge now, as whilst he has said he worships and adores me when things are calm, he does seem to think I have it in myself to simply 'drop' my doubts and fears and totally trust him. As it is, I am finally seeking some professional help for my issues, and it was on the very day that I did seek this help that this last row erupted.

I need help understanding why he has gotten so angry with me when he knew from the start of my fears and when I have been calm and careful when bringing up my fears he might cheat on me, or that I am not good enough for him. He says he is sick of seeing me not treating myself as a human being etc, but I do not see that as reason to get that angry with me.

[SSanf]

Let me cut to the chase. Love is not supposed to hurt. This relationship is causing you a lot of hurt. It is not for you.

[Lessarey]

i know this isn't goiong to go over very well, but here goes anyway...you need professional help. you need a psychiatrist and a therapist. coming from experience, trust me. also' if he wants to make the relationship work, he'll go to a couple of the therapists visits with you. there's a chance he really loves you and cares for you but its hurting him seeing you with all these fears adn anxieties. i know from my marriage, it was killing my husband to see me like i was, so i took it on myself to seek help. now we are doing much better, and damien makes damn sure i can make to my appt, and that i take my meds. even my relationship with my friends and parents has gotten better.

[charlinr17@sympatico]

So many women go through what you going through. Its a great start in getting professonal help. Remember to love yourself first no matter what if it isn't working learn from your lesson and move on. I know it is easier to say than do but dig deep into your own strenghts and you will see how easy it is to fly when your wings are free.

[GEBS]

I am proud of you for seeking professional help. I would have a talk with your doctor about being evaluated for medication. It sounds like you have a problem controlling your emotions. Medication may help with that until you are better equipped to deal with them alone.

I believe that no matter how honest you are about your issues up front a person getting into a relationship with an unstable person has no idea of what is to come. He may have thought that he was able to deal with the issues that would come up. Maybe his anger comes from his inability to help you. It sounds like he does care about you but feels helpless.

He may be codependent (http://www.codependents.org/foundation-docs-patterns.php). He may need to talk with someone too.

If you intend to continue this relationship I would be very careful (if I were either of you). Both of you have traits that could lead to an explosive relationship. This relationship will take a lot of work and patience.

Please don't stop seeking help. Life can be so much better than what you are living now.

[Graelwyn]

Thankyou all for your advice. I am also diagnosed bipolar, thus it is not easy for me. I have come a certain distance with my issues and have a lot more control in being able, most of the time, to explain my worries rather than lashing out in pain, but it is difficult because the last time I did calmly explain my issues and anxieties to him, it did lead to his getting angry and a row, which left me totally confused and not understanding why he couldn't see that I was just trying to keep calm and let him know what was distressing me. To me, that was me trying my best to overcome some of my issues...ie, lashing out without thinking first.

I can understand his frustration, but so many times I have tried to explain to him that I need calm explanation or some warning if he needs space, not for him to simply start gathering his stuff to go. That always seems to hurt me and panic me so greatly. I have equally explained from the start that my trust is going to take time and work to build and my issues will take time and work to overcome, but he seems to lack the patience, saying he knows I can just 'let it go' if I choose to...which is not true or I would have done it. It is no good his telling me he 'sees so much more' in me and not accepting me as I am, right now, and that I am doing the best I can, given I have come out of a net relationship that involved lie after lie after lie, to the point I was waiting for this guy to arrive in london on the plane and he was still in the USA all the time, having told me he was on a plane...how cruel can you get?

How ironic I have an IQ of 155 but cannot think my way out of this, much as I have tried. Certain triggers just result in chaos, the main one being someone just upping and going with no attempt to explain nor calm me down a little. However, whereas before when I felt the other might be cheating on me, I would simply have lashed out and thrown the accusation out blindly, I do now try and calm down and simply gather their explanation for their lateness/change of plans etc.

[watersprite]

You are going to get tired of seeing this. You need professional help. And so does he. Time to break off this relationship, move, change the locks, just get away. And find yourself some help. You can get it sliding scale at a great deal of places. And you MUST be single for a while, so that you don't fall in to that same trap. You have to grow within yourself before you can be a partner to some one else. And that means a Healthy partner.
:hugz::hugz::hugz::hugz:.
Now get moving. Your friends will always be your friends here.:thumbsup:

[GEBS]

Thankyou all for your advice. I am also diagnosed bipolar, thus it is not easy for me.

I wondered if you were. My mother is. I sympathize. I know it's not easy for you. Have you been treated in the past? If so, did it help? I have seen the drastic differences between someone being treated and someone suffering on their own. (and you are suffering!)

Either way, you have support here. There are others on MW that are dealing with bipolar issues. And others that deal with other mental issues. I deal with agoraphobia, panic disorder and I am codependent. I am also hyper-vigilant as a result of PTSD.

My personal experience with therapy and medication is wonderful. I live a drastically different life than I did when I was untreated. I hope that you have the same experience as you adjust to professional help.



To me, that was me trying my best to overcome some of my issues...ie, lashing out without thinking first.

I applaud you for that. Don't give up trying. It does get easier. He may not understand how hard that is but don't let his lack of understanding keep you from recognizing your accomplishment. You did well.



he knows I can just 'let it go' if I choose to...

Bullshit. This is a mental condition. This is not something you can just let go. Telling you that you can just let go is not helping you at all. If you are at all like me it is making you feel worse about yourself. I was told the same thing and it made me feel like there was something more wrong with me because I couldn't just let go. Rationally, I knew my issues didn't make sense. My logic told me to stop being that way. But something in my brain wouldn't let that happen. The panic took over and logic went out the window. That's part of the reason I knew I needed medical intervention. My body wouldn't listen to what my mind was telling it.



I was waiting for this guy to arrive in london on the plane and he was still in the USA all the time, having told me he was on a plane...how cruel can you get?


There is no excuse for that. What an absolute cruel heartless person.




How ironic I have an IQ of 155 but cannot think my way out of this, much as I have tried.

Again, that is evidence that you need help. Make sure your doctor or therapist knows this. I would guess you have a chemical imbalance.




I do now try and calm down and simply gather their explanation for their lateness/change of plans etc.

Again, I applaud you for that. Don't forget to acknowledge these small steps towards recovery. You deserve recognition for your effort. It is not easy living with a mental disorder. It is a terribly difficult thing to deal with, especially when you are as intelligent as you are.




Now, you may not what to hear this but I would reconsider being in a relationship at this time. I know some benefit comes from having the support of a loving partner. But you have only been with this guy for 2 months. He has issues of his own. And he doesn't understand what you are going through.

If you want to continue this relationship I would suggest sharing information with him about your disorder. Ask him to be educated on bipolar disorder. If he intends to stay with you he needs to know what he can do to support you.

[SolitaryScholar]

In response to your long post, here's a long reply. ;)

The majority of my relationships as well have been online rather than in real life. I was diagnosed with BPD about four months ago, so I truly understand your pain about that. The monophobia (fear of being alone and abandonment), the SI, lack of trust, moodswings - the whole kit and kaboodle.

Oh girl... the cuts, you're all right? (Sorry, I understand how horrible it can be to be all bashed up and just look at yourself and wonder what the hell you did it for...) Ambulances, knives and all of that really, really scare me (independant fears - being crazy, being in a speeding car, etc), so I can't imagine the stress you were under.

When I spaz out I take Klonopin, what are you on? (If anything.) And for mood stabilizer I'm on Depakote.

It sounds like your guy has some very serious anger management problems - or maybe a personality disorder (you never know) of his own. You've been together for two months, consider carefully the possibility that this guy is too impatient to help you?

You did say that he turns to drinking - if he can't cope with his own problems and stay stable, I'm not sure how much help he is going to be to someone like you or I.


I'm sorry, hon. I can only hope that he gets better of his own will, and that you choose what is best and safest for yourself.

[Graelwyn]

To try and respond without doing a load of quoting, I am not on medication yet.
When I was younger, I had anorexia for many years (a decade actually, on and off) and at one point, after my parents split up and I had taken on a high pressure work experience job, stage managing in London, I hit rock bottom and ended up in a sort almost psychotic state. I have OCD as well, and probably Aspergers Syndrome so I have a hell of a lot to contend with on a daily basis.

Back then, I was forced to stay in a private psych hospital (capio nightingale) for 6weeks and was basically kept in my room 24/7 and medicated on anti psychotics. I have been on prozac when I was a teen, and for sometime I was on tegretol and chlorpromazine. I hated them. It gave me a real loathing of medication, and the side effects, as I always thought that maybe that psychotic episode had been a part of the medication, tho I do get similar issues now when under intense stress...

I have basically not been on any medication for psych issues now in over 9 years. I was only diagnosed with bipolar about 7-8 months ago. The borderline was diagnosed when I was 23. The OCD, social anxiety etc were also diagnosed 7-8 months ago.

Anyway, I have stayed away from all relationships until now... not just with men, but even friendships. I am pretty reclusive for the most part, but I had that yearning to find someone who was like me enough to understand me, and I have, in a way, found them.

I do intend on showing him important parts of a book I have on borderline personality, as I think that is the disorder causing the most problems. The problems only come badly when his reaction to any slight disharmony, is to try and leave rather than discuss or calm down, and to grab cans of beer... I hate the smell of beer, and I hate the fact it blinds him to what he is saying, how he is acting, at times.

Yeah, he does have his own issues, but on the other hand, since he met me, he has gone from having 8-9 large cans of 8.4% beer a night, to having none most days, bar the occasional can of guinness. He hits the beer big time if things erupt badly between us and he doesn't do it in my presence, although he does often come back an hour later to check I am 'in one piece', as he puts it.

He always lets me know before he comes to see me, if he has had a drink, so I have the option to suggest he doesn't come, so it isn't like we live together and I get no choice.

This whole thing started as friendship, where both of us, having had bitter experiences, had decided to give up on the idea of love and romance. We got on well... he took me aback with his decency (from the beginning he insisted on walking on the side closest to the road, and insisted on helping with my bags, paying for our coffees and called me and offered help if something was upsetting me). This wasn't a thing that I just threw myself into in desperation for companionship, as in fact, I am quite a loner who needs a lot of her own time and space.

For the first 3 months of knowing one another, it was close to perfect. We didn't disagree, we met in the middle on everything, he managed to deal calmly when I bought up my fears and doubts etc. It is only in the last month we seem to have had a bad run of it, interspersed with flare ups and losses of emotional control. He has lost his temper 3 times, I would say, since knowing me, all of that in the last 3 weeks, 2 of the times resulting in my overdosing.

I have to add that, he has been worrying while at work, worrying at night in case I get a bad moment, and going to work 6 days a week on less than 5 hours of sleep for the last 3-4 weeks, and I did wonder if that had all added up. He has admitted in past, he gets resentment building up at the worry he experiences, and the fear. He has said that he has only ever shown me love and caring and tried to make me feel safe, yet I have not tried to believe that and accept it. He does not understand why I just suffer and suffer instead of simply letting all my fears go, and being happy...and I wish it did work like that, but the issues he had when younger come from a different source to mine.

Sure, he used to self harm, attempted suicide after a failed romance, got himself caught up in analysing and analysing incidents until it hurt etc, but I don't think it comes from the same thing as my issues do. Also, he claims that his issues 'died'...well, I don't think they did or he would not need drink at all under stress and he would not react so badly to my suffering?

Either way, it may be only a few months we have been a couple, and 4 months we have known one another, but in that time, we became close incredibly quickly. I am not willing to simply quit on it, because I still have issues, because if that is the case, I would have to accept being single the rest of my life, because I am always going to have some issues, I believe.

I always explain them as thoroughly and honestly as I can to anyone I meet, and I always continue to try and explain them as they arise. It is not as if I am constantly flaring up or showing violence. Thus far, he has shown the most understanding of those I have known in my life. He remains in constant contact, even while at work (texts 3-4 times during the day), he sees me all but one evening a week (though I have wondered if maybe this is too much time together for it to be healthy?) and he does calm me when I am starting to get angry (as an example, I sleep on an inflatable mattress as I have a phobia of normal mattresses and it died the night before last... he knew it would upset me and make me want to lash out at myself, and comforted me until I had calmed down).

I might consider his coming with me when I see a new psychiatrist , as maybe the psych might be able to enlighten him a little more about bpd, but in truth, I despise the label... I have read enough horror stories of how some women who have it behave to feel it to be a massive stigma, and to make you less than human... and that may be why I do tend to treat myself as less than human...because of the borderline label. I had hoped that in staying alone, I could just exist, and pretend I never had that label. I am pretty sure it comes from sexual abuse as a child and from a mother who had her own issues.

But I have never slept around or swung from person to person, I don't cut people out of my life once things fall apart, as a lot of bpd'ers seem to, and the only times I have lashed out physically at a partner has been when they have totally ignored my distress in a cruel way (as my ex did when I had panic attacks wall to wall). My main bpd issues are the terror of abandonment, the inability to have any constancy when the person is not there, and the paranoia that I am being cheated on/lied to. (after all, I have been cheated on and lied to, so these are not unrealistic fears, are they?)

I want more than anything to be able to have a future with someone, and to find happiness and security, and for the most part, I feel very secure with this man, but I do know that if it were someone who went out with friends a lot, or who wanted a lot of time apart, I would end up losing the sense of connectedness and would only be able to regard them as a friend. It is horrid really. Myself? I have to say, on the one hand, I am eager for some time to myself, but on the other, I am afraid he will drink if he has more time alone because he has less interests, less of a home, than I do. And he can, at times, take it a little personally, if I suggest more time apart, instantly trying to leave and saying he feels 'unwelcome' and as if he is 'intruding'.


Oh girl... the cuts, you're all right? (Sorry, I understand how horrible it can be to be all bashed up and just look at yourself and wonder what the hell you did it for...) Ambulances, knives and all of that really, really scare me (independant fears - being crazy, being in a speeding car, etc), so I can't imagine the stress you were under.

No stitches were needed, but I did need hospital twice for the overdoses. I just... pure panic, pure fear, and pure confusion in my head when the person just stops communicating and starts putting their things in a bag. The pain is indescribable really, when there is such discord and when I see the other person with such angry eyes, such cold and angry voice... all I can think at that time is 'they aren't hearing me, they don't love me anymore, they hate me, they wouldn't care now if I did die...and after all the wonderful things they said before'. That confuses me so much. And hurts me so much. I cannot comprehend that someone can love you, yet be so overwhelmed by anger that you can no longer see that love anywhere in their face or hear it in their voice.

Yet, once he had calmed down, he always either came back to check I was still ok, or called the hospital, or tried to reach me on my phone. He has never simply gone off and made no effort to check on me. And he has met my mother, and has had conversations with her so he does have her number if things go wrong, and he does have keys to let himself in if he cannot reach me.


Someone suggested we go to relate... but not sure that would help.
Only know that I have next to no support right now... I have no friends here in this city, and I lost touch with a lot of my online friends over the years.
I could really do with some sensible outsiders to be able to listen when things get really bad.

[SolitaryScholar]

I'll gladly be here for you to talk to if you need me. My MSN, AIM and Yahoo are posted (but I'm hardly ever on Yahoo :/) if you want to get in contact with me. If not, you can send me PMs or leave messages on my profile.

As a girl with BPD I know how stressing it can be and how reactive it is - all thought just leaves when you react to things. It's scary, and it is a burden. I hope you'll be all right and that counseling goes well for you. Just remember, you aren't always to blame.

His lack of healthy sleep certainly isn't helping him out when he tries to calm you down. Cranky people tend to get a bit impatient. Maybe you are seeing a little too much of each other - my suggestion would be to back off of each other just a little bit so you have time, and room, to breathe. So that you know when you next talk to him, a lot more about your feelings and your thoughts and how to deal with that.

All in all, I wish the very best for you. :uhhuhuh:

[Cloaked Raven]

:hugz:

[watersprite]

:hugz::hugz::hugz:

[Graelwyn]

Thanks for the hugs, Sprite and Raven, and thanks for saying I can message, Scholar... shall add you to msn since I am on there mostly... I have come to dislike yahoo.

[Darkest Eve]

People have different ways of expressing their anger... just as they have different ways of expressing their 'issues'.

Put one foot in his shoes for a moment: Imagine not feeling trusted, believed, admired for the fact that you are happy and willing to deal with these 'issues' to be with someone you love - that you went into the relationship aware of these issues and STILL went into the relationship when you could have turned and run (screaming, even) the other direction, as far and as fast as you could.

Nobody's perfect. ;) If they claim to be... well... they're lying. :lol:

Trust issues are one of those things... if you have them, they are really really REALLY hard to get over, even if the other party does absolutely nothing to arouse suspicion. When they do actually do something that arouses your suspicion or make you feel insecure in your relationship... well, it is obviously that much more difficult for you to let go of those fears.

If I've learned one thing in all my years of dating and relationships, it's this: Let go and have fun. You're going to get hurt sometimes, but if you worry about it now and it never happens, you've worried needlessly. If you worry about it now and it happens, you've worried twice as much as you need to. Live in the moment and enjoy every possible second that you have - life is shorter than you think. (Ok, that's like 3 things, but you know what I mean.)

Worries and niggles of doubt are going to creep in from time to time. Deal with it and move on. It's the hanging on to them that is the problem... not the having of them. If you constantly THINK something is going to go wrong, eventually it probably will, which just reinforces your mindset and attitude and approach to the relationship.

Your beau is right - alot of it is (and can be) a mindset. You know those motivational stories that say you choose your attitude? You can, if you put your mind to it. Focus on happy, not worry. Focus on love, not lies.

If he lies, if you lie - fess up, move on. If you are unhappy, find something that makes you happy. If the relationship isn't beneficial (and sweetheart, it really doesn't sound like it is - but I don't know either of you other than what you've posted, so that's not my call to make)

It sounds easy, right? It's not an overnight process - changing the way you think and feel takes time, effort, work, and encouragement from the people that care about you. It's a lot easier to sit in doubt and fear than it is to risk and do what makes you happy sometimes. (Been there, done that.... trust me, I know its rough)

My question is: Are you really going to let that stop you?

PS: :hugz: