New Major Parental Issue

[WpingWllow]

If you've read my last post, you know about my parental issues, and how they force me into Catholic mass on Sundays, complete with Sunday School. Well, I'm in 11th grade, and therefore starting Confirmation classes. What do I do?! I refuse to get confirmed into a relegion I believe NO aspects of, just to please my parents, but every time I bring it up I get the cold shoulder for weeks! It's so hard. :( I don't WANT to be confirmed, it's disrespectful to their path and my own. I'm so confused right now, and upset. Opinions and help welcome and much appreciated.

Thanks.

[Radocs]

When my parents wanted ME to get confirmed I just went along with it. Now, years later, it doesn't mean anything to me and they accept that I'm a pagan.

It might be easier on you to just go along with it.

[Blu Heather]

I'm sorry your having a tough time *hugs*

You're parents should realize that a person's spiritual beliefs should and are personal. Whether you want to be Mormon, Jewish, Buddhist, Hindu, Muslim, or Pagan. The title should not matter to them.

Maybe you need to compramise. Tell them, why you don't want to be confirmed. You don't want to disrespect them or the church by not actually believing their beliefs. But tell them that you want to wait. You want to be able to see what kind of religion you want to belong to. Maybe you'll go back to catholicism or become jewish or maybe stay pagan. Maybe if they don't see it in their eyes as you just going against them they might understand or give in a bit.

Whatever you do...good luck :)

[st0rm]

just play along.....

[WpingWllow]

But is it not disrespectful to Paganism to get confirmed into this other relegion, when I believe no apsects of it?

[Methanespirit]

Wping willow :No, it is not necessarily disrespectiful, but I'd just go along with their program because you are almost of "legal age" and apparently, still attending school. I know it is not what you want, but try to be patient and do not upset the "apple cart" because being in a state of family non-conformity will cause more problems than it solves - at least for another year.


......methane.

[Jenett]

The first thing I'd suggest is talking to the priest at the parish your family attends.

When I was confirmed as a Catholic (which I was at the age of 16 - I'm now 27, and was actively and pretty devoutly Catholic until I was 22/23), the priests at our parish made it *very* clear that they took confirmation seriously, and that they didn't want to force anyone to be confirmed who was not ready for that commitment and obligation (and willing to take it on.) They also made it very clear that if we had problems with our parents as a result, they'd back us up.

(As well as the local priests, you might talk to whoever is in charge of religious education or things like that...)

Now, your parents might still want you to attend confirmation *classes* in the hopes you might change your mind. But that's not going to kill you, quite honestly, and a deeper understanding of other religions is something that I think can only be helpful in later life.

As far as it being disrespectful, here's something to think about: one of the basic theories about why magic works is that you have a trained will and use it and reinforce it by things like doing what you say you will. If you make a big promise (like confirmation) falsely, what does that say about *your* ethics and the value of your word or will?

It's also disrespectful to people who honestly do believe in their confirmation promises and their meaning. Would you be very happy if someone said they were Wiccan just to fit in, but didn't believe any of it, or want to follow common ethics or anything? You'd probably be annoyed that someone wasn't taking something you took very seriously at all seriously.

If your parents continue to give you trouble, you might point that out to them - that you *do* have respect for their faith, and you don't want to disrespect the seriousness of confirmation by going through the motions without meaning it. Point out that not being confirmed now doesn't mean *never* - if you decided to change your mind in college or as an adult, you could always go through the process then.

I hope this helps.

[st0rm]

so what if u get confirmed or not... i wouldnt see it as a decision for life... But u should take the classes u learn a great deal (of course some is total bull but what more to expect). Maybe you will make some new friends? theres always a positive side to everything...

[Tammy Sullivan]

Can you look on this as an exploration? It never hurts to know a little more than you did before. And until you go through the classes, can you be 100% sure that you won't find one little nugget of information that helps you define yourself even more? Maybe in the ritual area? Or the knowing yourself? Try to make this into a positive experience, and learn from it.

[Haedis]

I like the idea of asking to think about it some more. Continue showing them that you're mature enough to make your own decisions. Maybe in that time you could talk it over with them and reach an agreement everyone can live with.

I dont know much about your situation but if I were in that place I wouldnt get confirmed if it didnt feel right, but I would continue studying Catholicsm to be both respectful of their wishes and because you can use it as a learning experience (as Jenett mentioned). It gives you an opportunity to compare and contrast your beliefs with something different which will most likely give you a better understanding of where you stand on relgious issues and why.

[Emaleth]

I agree with what most people said. I used to be Catholic, too, never devout tough, and I was confirmed when I was 15. Now I work with 15 year olds and it terrifies me how it is possible that such kids are forced to make those serious decisions about faith. 80% of them don't take it seriously, yet they are confirmed, they get along with the whole procedure, cause everybody does that.

I once read an article for teenage pagans. It was told there that you should do what your parents want you to do until you are 18. I know it's not easy, but then it won't last forever. Someday you'll have the full right to practice your own religion and your parents won't be able to make you do anything. So I'd advise you to treat the whole experience as a trial, a lesson of patience, wait till you are old enough to do what you want and try to learn something from this situation.

Blessed Be

[Caelin]

I think I go with what someone said about speaking to the priests and your parents about it. In the Catholic faith its a really big thing to be confirmed - theologically they wouldn't want you to go through with it if you didn't want to, because the whole point of confirmation is that you are saying, as an adult, that you want to be a Catholic. You don't have to tell the priests why you don't want to be confirmed, if you don't want to or it might cause problems, but if you say you're not sure of the commitment and don't want to be confirmed, then they should really respect your view. But, like Jenett said, there's nothing wrong in going to the confirmation classes - without being confirmed - as that might placate your parents, and more knowledge, no matter what the subject, is always a useful thing.

:)

[Journeyman]

Do what I'd do: constantly compare/contrast the two theologies.
For example -

Priest: And now we'll discuss Easter...

Wping Willow: Did you know that the early church adopted Easter (Ostara, Astarte, Ishtar) as their resurrection holiday because they couldn't stamp out the Pagan beliefs around which the holiday originated?
Priest: :bug:

[phoenixsong]

There was an article on Oldways.com, where the author gave advice to teenagers in the broom closet and being made to go to religious services of religions they don't believe in. I don't have the link but the gist of it was: If you were allowed to go see some religious ceremonies of, say, shamans or such in a foreign country, you would. So why not treat the church services you have to go to as a learning experience: find out about the beliefs and practices from an objective viewpoint rather than thinking "Noo, noo, I don't want to go to church".

Won't help with the confirmation issue though...

[Journeyman]

It seems that if her parents were forcing her to study for, and complete, a Satanic initiation she didn't want, we wouldn't be telling her to just go ahead and make a pact with Satan and then ignore it when she turns 18.

Or would we? :confused:

Are we more willing to dismiss a Xtian initiation than any other?

Just discussion fodder...


bb,
jm

[Phoenix Blue]

**Ponders** Good question. Of course, since you don't imply any harm done in either context, my answer would be, "Yes." :) A legal contract isn't binding on a minor in any event, so why would a spiritual contract be any moreso? In addition, a spiritual contract must carry the conviction of belief to be valid - without that, you're simply "going through the motions."

So, yes, I would tell her, "Go through the motions." After all, her parents do have every right to dictate what her religious education will be--Atheist, Christian, Satanic, whatever--as long as she's under the age of majority and as long as the education is not in and of itself harmful to the individual.

[Jenett]

That's why I was suggesting "Go to the classes, but don't become confirmed"

I think it's really disrespectful to other people (who believe whatever religion it is) to dismiss serious promises. Yes, a teen's parents have a right to determine religious education" but *not* their child's actual beliefs or promises made about those beliefs.

The point I made earlier also concerns me: as a witch, my word is very important to me. I said some things when I was 14 which I'm still seeing repercussions from. Mostly they're good repercussions, but I knew what I was saying then, and I was old enough to take responsibility for them.

I have *very* little respect for someone who would make a serious spiritual promise falsely (except under extreme circumstances, like actual threat of harm or something like that) when they're old enough to know what they're doing.

That's not someone I would want to take as a student if/when I start teaching, nor someone I would want to be in circle with, because I'd be wondering if they'd take the 'easy' way out in future.

However, there is no physical harm in attending confirmation classes (like there might be in some cults), nothing bad is going to happen from sitting and listening for an hour or so once a week in that setting.

If going is going to make things easier for dealing with parents, and it's going to provide a stronger arguement for the decision (because someone has taken the time to listen and pay attention, and *then* decided not to be confirmed) then I think attending classes is certainly not going to cause any harm, and might well help.

I also don't agree that being disruptive in class is good (by bringing up the Pagan side of things). The other students in the class aren't there to learn that information right then - they're supposed to be there to learn what they need to know to make an informed decision about a serious commitment. Interfering with that is rude and unnecessary. (Private commentary inside your own head is a different issue: that isn't going ot distract anyone else.)

The teacher is almost certainly a volunteer who is doing this out of the goodness of their heart because they think providing those classes is important.

If we wouldn't like someone showing up at Wicca 101 or Seeker classes, and saying "Oh, but that's not how we view it, Cathlolics do X this way" when we're trying to convey basic concepts that are important to understand, then we shouldn't do the same thing to others.

There are certainly times and places for comparative religion discussions - and I think they're an excellent thing to do - but instructional classes specifically aimed at a given religious path are not the place for that.