Being Pagan...what's it mean to U

[The Crone]

After catching up on all the talk...this setence caught in my grey matter.....I can't get it out....so I will post it away~~~~~

Being Pagan is all I have known, tried a little Methodist in my youth cause they had good teen dances..... but Pagan is what seems to fit.

But then Pagan is such a wide range.......Webster says ; country dweller.....hmmm ok I do live in the country...or Webster goes on; a follower of a polytheistic religion hmmm must think about that one....and look up polytheistic LOL (means many Gods) and the final one...get ready...one who has little or no religion and who delights in sensual pleasures and material goods....

I think many people (most christian types) think the final one is what Pagan is...or would like it to be. Thinking if one does not worship and study UNDER the Leader of a CHURCH it doesn't count.

Well, the leader of my "Church" is bigger than their leaders and so full of love... I will be thought of "As having little religion" .....cause what being Pagan to me means is the FREEDOM to worship my MAKER the way I feel is correct for me.

[SerenityMoon]

^^; not much cuz..i'm not pagan o_o; LOL

[Journeyman]

... never having to do penance for the "sin" of lusting in your heart!

[The Crone]

Journeyman VERY COOL! LOL

Never thought about it...but that would be a burden...cause this ole girl does more lusting these days than she use too LMAO

[Journeyman]

During my obligatory stint as a Xtian, all those "good girl" types in pretty dresses used to give me rampaging stiffies the whole time I was in church.

:devil:

[paygun]

Crone, I never thought about it that way before, but that word freedom does have a lot to do with how I feel about it. I grew up in a Christian church, and there, there was a lot of importance placed on a personal relationship with god. As I grew up, that started to sound more and more like marketing rather than purpose.

To me, it's more about a world view than dogma or affiliation with a group. I think it's really sad that so many like-minded people with common goals can disagree over some petty details. I think group identity is really important to some people, maybe that's what derails the whole thing.

Anyway, I think this is a very important question for people of any faith to ask themselves. A lot of time gets wasted in any religious community dickering over dogma and peripheral issues. People should ask themselves more often, "Why do I believe, what I say I believe?" For me, my pagan view of the world is reinforced almost daily, by experiencing the world around me. I can't deny that all living things are connected, and that there is a divine force at work in the world. That divine force has no gender, but our human minds can best relate to it with personifications like Goddess and God. Our interaction with that force is the basis of Magick. To me, the rest is details. A person's mileage may vary, but it's more important that the person ask these questions for themselves, and come to some answers, rather than we all agree.

Thanks for this post, it made me think.

[Radocs]

Along the same lines as paygun's answer, being pagan means being free to me. I live by my own standards and act how I want since I'm pretty much going by my own rules.

Yeah, freedom has a lot to do with.

[)O( ~ Khara~ )O(]

I have enjoyed in my lifetime being able to be conservative politically, I have been to churches of almost every faith, got kicked out of 3 different PTAs (it's a good story find me in chat sometime:p ) I have friends of every race, creed and color. I have a family who loves me and respects me and children I adore. Through it all being raised in the craft has allowed me to be open-minded about everything. To know that open-minded and just plain stupid are two very different things. I understand good and evil and recognize both as powers to be praised or reckoned with. I know the truth from a lie and understand the shades of grey. In that I will go back to the best compliment I ever received and have spen the time since trying to live up to it.

In my Senior HS yearbook where everybody signs and stuff, this one guy wrote......

"Thank you, for you have a heart full of love and understanding, the ability to withhold judgement, and a terrifying ability to lull one into a sense of worthiness. After 4 years I have never seen you ask more than you are willing to do, always take less than what you have given and always listen with undivided attention.
To grace under pressure I toast you queen of them all!"

I do not think I have ever before or since known that my beliefs and ideals show through me than the moment I read that.

[Raevyn]

I think group identity is really important to some people, maybe that's what derails the whole thing.

I agree - who's "in", who's "out", who's "us" and "them". Even if it isn't about being cool outside of highschool, that mentality is still there it seems. And it does often end up on losing out on sharing of information and connecting with others. So much "us" and "them" and who's "right" and who's not that that I feel many people lose out. Someone tries so hard to validate their own beliefs they end up trying to invalidate others. It shouldn't be about classifying; it should be about coming together in spiritual fulfillment.


People should ask themselves more often, "Why do I believe, what I say I believe?"

What you say is probably very obvious in theory to people, but I agree, people don't think about it - why follow this principle or ethic, why believe in this deity or that; I think a lot of people don't take the time to consider their own theology and philosophy.

[Raevyn]

And on topic again - what is Paganism? By modern definition a Pagan is someone who follows a religion that is non Christian, Jewish, or Islamic, and self identifies as Pagan. One usually follows a polytheistic religion and often tries to reconstruct ancient religions and cultures and/or works with new age techniques and practices including divination, gemstones, reiki, meditation, etc.

As to a world view - I think that's an important point as well, however the idea of freedom thing isn't something I've seen in all Pagans or even many, and I think people tend to forget atheists and agnostics are often also very interested in freedom of belief etc.

It's important to remember, at least in my mind, that Paganism is a group of religions - we have different faiths, paths, and beliefs. It's hard to find an idea of Paganism that isn't too exclusive and yet isn't too broad. I can tell you what my spirituality is to me, even what I take from various Pagan belief systems, but what Paganism is, at least outside of the dictionary and logical definitions, is harder to nail down.

[The Crone]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Raevyn

however the idea of freedom thing isn't something I've seen in all Pagans

Raevyn...I found this very interesting that you do not see FREEDOM in the Pagan People around you..but that could depend on if you practice in a Coven...I have seen many Covens turn into organized groups and have the same troubles other organized religions have.....

Some High Priests/Priestests seem to think their way is the only way and seems they fall into the same traps as other organized groups.....

I am a Solitary so since I have no sheep that follow me nor do I feel the need to follow someone else...I see The Freedom all around me....and I LOVE IT!


Thanks everyone for all your posts..it has got the grey matter moving and I love to have to think about things!

[Journeyman]

Paganism has been extremely liberating for me also. It means having a worldview and a theology which is not based on shame, guilt, and unworthiness. Having gods and goddesses who do not consider humanity to be the equivalent of an interesting science experiment, like an ant farm, to be destroyed if it's not going so well.

[Semele]

Funny you should pose this question,as I have been thinking about it a lot lately. To tell the truth I am beginning to despise the very word pagan.

Don't get me wrong, I feel quite comfortable using it with you all here, in this medium, but to tell someone I am Pagan brings on more questions than I am comfortable dealing with in the few short minutes we may have together. I don't really have a desire to explain it to them at all....I prefer to let my spirituality show rather than be told to others. I hate names and labels.

In my days as a Christian, I tried very hard to find my spiritual path and would come so close, yet be overcome by the grief and guilt I felt because I wasn't doing everything right, as the Bible stated. I didn't feel close to God in church, but rather at home when I prayed and thought of him...my first attempts at meditation before I knew what it was. Yet the guilt programmed into me ruined any of the spiritual high I felt and so I was turned off of religion for a long time.

When I began searching for another "religion" because I did feel something missing, I was interested in Wicca and then my reading and interests branched further and further. Somewhere along the way, I began to feel a little guilty again because I hadn't sat down and planned out all the Sabbats and rituals to go with each one etc. It began to feel a lot like I felt when I was in church. I longed for a closer relationship and connection to God, yet felt I had to do all these things first to get there. Thankfully I have finally figured out, for me, the answer lies not in an organized ritual or knowledge of what each Sabbat has meant over the years. The answer is inside me and my ability to just increase my awareness and open my eyes..literally and see God all around me.

I firmly believe that we are all searching for the same thing and we have our own way to find it. Just as children all have different learning styles, so do we. The only thing I know for sure is that it has taken me a lifetime and maybe longer to figure out the most important revelation.

RELIGION is a very big, if not the biggest, roadblock on the road to SPIRITUALITY.

[The Crone]

Semele...I know what you say about not using the term Pagan out in the surface world of humanity.....so I say....when asked WHAT CHURCH DO YOU GO TO....cause I live in the almost Bible belt and that is like saying Hello Neighbor...anywho...I have said for many years...Oh...I study the OLD WAY. usually they either ask more questions...or get a look on their face like..OH OK......

I also hear you on the Everyone is searching for the same thing...just going about it different! I see it as.....we are on a path climbing a mountian......when we are at the bottom of the mountian we are all so far away from each other we can't see anyone else...the further and higher and more learned you become the paths begin to get closer and closer...and at the top we get there and say...WOW

Crone trying to draw a picture with words.....Crone has trouble spelling words and more trouble painting with them!

[Arzhela]

I was going to post a reply in this thread, but I think Semele said everything that I was going to say far more eloquently than I could have done:)

[Eeluna]

For me, it's definitely about the freedom to believe and worship as I choose--the freedom to be who I truly am and relate to Divinity in the way that is closest to my heart and my soul.

[PeleRising]

Originally posted by The Crone
I see it as.....we are on a path climbing a mountian......when we are at the bottom of the mountian we are all so far away from each other we can't see anyone else...the further and higher and more learned you become the paths begin to get closer and closer...and at the top we get there and say...WOW


Oh My Crone.... That is how i feel... almost exactly..... We are all on paths towards the same thing... but just going at it differently... and when we are at the highest pinnacle... we will finally see that we were all on the same journey all along... just different paths.... :D

[Gwion]

being born in a state of original grace; not hard considering my mother is a Goddess