Getting sick of Christianity

[Cunae]

Got to tell you guys, I am burned out on my own faith. I am sick to death of the blood dripping from the cross and being washed in it (yuck!), so I can gain some mansion on the street of gold. What kind of perversion is that?? I am not sure I believe in any of that right now or if I want to ever again. I want peace of mind and this god's not doing it for me. I long for freedom from this Creator Being who demands attention and praise...who thrives on making humans suffer then beg for forgiveness. I don't even want to believe in him anymore.

This is not some period of withdrawal or disaffection, nor is it some crisis of faith... I wouldn't drag you into something like that. I guess I am kind of sharing why I have been so silent and seldom getting involved in discussions about Christianity anymore. Frankly, I don't care about Christianity! I wish I could escape it in my own life, but I am married to an effing pastor.

Well, that's my heart tonight. Sorry if it comes off as anything but sincere.

[Vampiel]

We all go through this, and the marriage part I can't help you with. Thats a completely different beast and I have a lot of questions about the concept of marriage.

I will say this though, what has worked for me in concerns to peace of mind and everyone has their own view on it. Just be honest with yourself. If Christianity doesn't work for you their is nothing wrong with that just as it didn't for me but it does for some people. My personal view is that god is born from the human mind and its an answer that can be given to any questions we have. Dont know the answer? Well its god. Why did such and such happen, its in gods hands. God has a plan, its a comfort of the human mind and born from it. Thats how I see it and that viewpoint makes the most sense to me in the most honest and critical way. My mind is at peace from that conclusion just as many other people their mind is at peace from a completely different conclusion. Just be honest with yourself and what makes the most sense to you, that is YOUR own truth.

I hope you can find peace within yourself, and just know that this is something that most of us go through. You are not alone.

[CatsAreGods]

Might as well try cats...looks like you're halfway there already! :uhhuhuh:

[Chicory_Witch]

Leave it! I had a similar feeling years ago and came to the conclusion that "God" didn't want me screwing up his plans and people so I would just leave the terrible prick well enough alone.

Find YOUR truth and revel in it.

[Tanya]

you can quietly find your own path without causing a stir, surely you can find a path that respects your husband's calling without being untrue to yourself.
I used to be with a very fervent Catholic, he was so sincere and thoughtful about his faith and I respected that.. but that doesn't mean it is going to work for you.

As far as forgiveness stuff.. how can a god who made us have made us so wrong that we need to be totally appologizing for ourselves? I think its not Christianity's basic tenents that are broken so much as that the focus has gotten a little messed up... have you explored the Unitarians?

They are a lot less'washed in the blood" and while not particularly Christian, they are b respectful and respectable....

[Tobias]

<sympathetic hug>



...but I am married to an effing pastor.


Are you able to discuss with him how you feel? My wife has *never* wanted to become pagan, but over time she understands what's going on with me because we talk about it. I don't drag her through everything with me, but as the foundations of Christianity are chipped away bit by bit in my life, she knows and has time to adapt to the changes that are taking place.

[Twinkle]

I found myself in the same boat a few years ago.

In order to reject something, I think one has to know *what* it is they are rejecting.

Is it Christianity as a whole, or just parts? Is it the Dogma you don't care about anymore? Christ? What is it specifically that has burnt you out?

I'm not asking you to say anything here - but these are things to consider before walking away.

[john.a]

I agree completely with Twinkle. There are other philosophies and theological perspectives to explore within Christianity. If God was just a love-starved egoist with sado-masochistic tendencies, I would vehemently oppose Christianity myself.

[Cunae]

Thank you for the understanding posts! Not sure what my next step will be but I will take you up on the advice! :uhhuhuh:

[DoktorSick]

Some people might say try other philosophies or religion. But I say this. Give all of that break and just be who you want to be. When it's all said and done it comes down to you finding your own path.

[LostSheep]

Do you still feel any connection with Jesus in terms of his actual message and teachings, rather than the image that the church constructed of him, to fit around its notions of original sin and redemption? Perhaps if you do still feel some connection with him, it might help you to keep one foot on the ground of what you're familiar with, instead of being completely cut adrift. It can be very difficult if you're feeling that the whole world that you've been accustomed to is beginning to slip away from you, or you from it, but perhaps it might be possible to concentrate on the core figure rather than let what the accumulation of what others have made of him and moulded him into over many many years drive you away from him completely.

[Avanti]

I've never had a problem specifically with God. I found God myself through reading a children's bible as a child. I was never raised with any knowledge of christian dogma or all that terrifying stuff about not sinning etc. I only found out about that stuff later.

Due to not being subjected to any of that, I was able to form my own concept of God. My concept of him is very different to what the churches portray him as. I guess my point is, find out who God really is to you. Not from what the bible says, but from your own personal experiences with him. If you really believe he is a vengeful unforgiving jealous being, than I don't think you really know him.

[Infinite Grey]

I'm guessing your husband is a Calvinist? Assuming he holds similar views as yourself concerning homosexuality, and considering the fact that you post on a Pagan chat board, he may be of the more errrr open minded variety. hopefully.

[ninurta2008]

I know exactly how you feel, I felt the same way when I decided enough was enough. Then I became agnostic then jumped faith to faith. Though the marriage part I am unfamiliar with, I'm sorry I can't be of help there. Though I can relate to you.

Are you going to seek another religion? Another christianity? Or you going agnostic or atheist? Or what?

[aluokaloo]

:hugz: for wherever your journey takes you. i believe tons of people some famous some not said that peace is found within and not without.

[Spica]

Mystic Christian, perhaps you should look in to Gnosticism? I think it's the most helpful path for a Christian tired of Christianity to take. There are many different sects with different belief systems, all having a pretty similar view on the creator...But Christian Gnostics still believed in Jesus, just not the Jesus that most believe in. Hehe. Look in to it! You might find something you like. :)

Besides, I believe that knowledge either strengthens faith or it destroys it, thus showing you what is real and what isn't. Good luck! It takes courage to walk a path that is not written down in a book for you to follow.

[Tom Terrific]

Find YOUR truth and revel in it.

There's lots of good advice in this thread, but this is my favorite.

[Cunae]

I'm guessing your husband is a Calvinist? Assuming he holds similar views as yourself concerning homosexuality, and considering the fact that you post on a Pagan chat board, he may be of the more errrr open minded variety. hopefully.


Sorry to say, he is a pretty much a fundamentalist. He's grown (regressed?) that way during our marriage... over 11 yrs. Funny (or not) thing is he has a lesbian daughter. I've worked hard to help him understand where she is coming from and I think he makes that his exception on homosexuality. He would still tell you he thinks it is sin, however.

I come to MW for relief from my religion! A breath of fresh air in my otherwise stale life. :thumbsup:

[Cunae]

I know exactly how you feel, I felt the same way when I decided enough was enough. Then I became agnostic then jumped faith to faith. Though the marriage part I am unfamiliar with, I'm sorry I can't be of help there. Though I can relate to you.

Are you going to seek another religion? Another christianity? Or you going agnostic or atheist? Or what?

I am not sure. It would be very difficult to do this "officially" if you know what I mean. I don't think I will ever go atheist because I know that Christ exists... I just almost hate Christians right now. The religion is making me feel ill.

[Cunae]

Can someone tell me, in a nutshell I can understand, what is an agnostic? I have never understood what this means.

[Caitlin.ann]

Can someone tell me, in a nutshell I can understand, what is an agnostic? I have never understood what this means.

Agnostics basically don't know whether or not there is a deity or not. For me, I kind of clue this into my beliefs, as in I feel that the devine is unknowable. I don't know what the divine is, etc.

[Tom Terrific]

MC,

I was raised Christian fundamentalist, migrated to the Catholic church, and left from there. I, too, knew that Jesus was real; but I wanted to know if the Goddess was real, also. (Obviously, I learned that she is.) I didn’t have the animosity toward the religion that you have, so I tried to walk both paths for three years. Then I was told to choose. It was an amicable parting.

The most important thing is to find your truth. This is a life-long quest; we do the best we can as we toddle down our individual roads, changing our relationships and refining our beliefs until we’re done. So, I guess “finding your truth” means being true to yourself, your inner vision, more than anything else. And as your vision gets clearer, your thoughts about it will change.

Friendships come and go. Sometimes relationships have to end, but that doesn’t mean they have to end bitterly. And sometimes relationships that have ended are re-established; there’s always that possibility.

Someone else has pointed out that leaving Christianity and leaving Christ are two different things. I wouldn’t ignore that possibility.

If you do decide that your friendship with Jesus has to end, you will probably want to find another face for the divine. I knew the Goddess only as “Goddess” for two years before she manifested to me in a particular aspect. That didn’t stop that time from being wonderful. And you can always put out a general call, along the lines of: “Will the deity I need to be with please let me know?”

Pagans have been keeping their beliefs and practices secret from others in their families for a long time. It is hard to hide such an important part of oneself from those one loves; but what else can you do when they simply won’t understand? I kept my change of religion from my father until he died, because I knew that, with his limited frame of reference, he would conclude that his son had gone insane, and it would have broken his heart. Sometimes you have to let people believe what they want to believe.

Blessed be!

[Cunae]

MC,

I was raised Christian fundamentalist, migrated to the Catholic church, and left from there. I, too, knew that Jesus was real; but I wanted to know if the Goddess was real, also. (Obviously, I learned that she is.) I didn’t have the animosity toward the religion that you have, so I tried to walk both paths for three years. Then I was told to choose. It was an amicable parting.

The most important thing is to find your truth. This is a life-long quest; we do the best we can as we toddle down our individual roads, changing our relationships and refining our beliefs until we’re done. So, I guess “finding your truth” means being true to yourself, your inner vision, more than anything else. And as your vision gets clearer, your thoughts about it will change.

Friendships come and go. Sometimes relationships have to end, but that doesn’t mean they have to end bitterly. And sometimes relationships that have ended are re-established; there’s always that possibility.

Someone else has pointed out that leaving Christianity and leaving Christ are two different things. I wouldn’t ignore that possibility.

If you do decide that your friendship with Jesus has to end, you will probably want to find another face for the divine. I knew the Goddess only as “Goddess” for two years before she manifested to me in a particular aspect. That didn’t stop that time from being wonderful. And you can always put out a general call, along the lines of: “Will the deity I need to be with please let me know?”

Pagans have been keeping their beliefs and practices secret from others in their families for a long time. It is hard to hide such an important part of oneself from those one loves; but what else can you do when they simply won’t understand? I kept my change of religion from my father until he died, because I knew that, with his limited frame of reference, he would conclude that his son had gone insane, and it would have broken his heart. Sometimes you have to let people believe what they want to believe.

Blessed be!

Thank you so much! This is very reassuring. I don't know where I am going today, but maybe I don't need to know right now! :thumbsup:

[LostSheep]

If you do decide that your friendship with Jesus has to end, you will probably want to find another face for the divine. I knew the Goddess only as “Goddess” for two years before she manifested to me in a particular aspect. That didn’t stop that time from being wonderful. And you can always put out a general call, along the lines of: “Will the deity I need to be with please let me know?”

Funnily enough, that's exactly the direction that I think I'm finding myself heading in as well. Wise words there. :uhhuhuh:

[Cloaked Raven]

Dearest MC... :hugz: You know that I will support you in any choice you make, no matter what path you choose to follow and no matter where your life takes you...You are a dear and trusted friend of mine. :hugz:

I have been in your shoes when it comes to being disgusted with Christianity... There was a time when I was really considering leaving Christianity altogether. I was sick of the hypocrisy of a lot of the local Christians and the way they treated people who didn't follow their own beliefs to the exact letter.

I spent an entire year trying to find the right path for me... I was betwixt and between whether or not to leave Christianity altogether or find something under that particular umbrella which was more for me. It was a long journey but when I found my path, it was more than worth it.

Be true to yourself... Never ever let anyone tell you your chosen path (now or in the future) is wrong... Follow your heart and find the path that is right for you, not what others think your path should be.

If you ever need to vent or just to talk, feel free to PM me. :hugz:

I wish you the absolute best, my friend.

:hugz:

[1111]

Before you do anything I would just sit back and wait. You change your mind a lot---so I would just do some research before you go changing anything.

Good luck.

[MoonBreath]

I'm sorry you've been going through such a difficult time mystic christian! :( :hugz: i can kind of relate, my beliefs have taken quite a different turn these past few months! I did some soul searching of my own, really stopped and examined what i was telling myself was true, and faced up to my changing view point. I've had my regressions here and there, but i currently see myself as an agnostic atheist. I feel more content now, more happy and at peace since being honest with myself. Like Vampiel said, i see the gods, god, as creations of the human minds, not as real literal beings or being (or at least the agnostic side really doubts a literal existance). That being said, they still hold some meaning to me as archetypes, symbols and such. Maybe you could do the same? Instead of subscribing to a particular flavor of Christianity and believing in the literal being of Jesus Christ, you could exclusively look at what he represents and how that relates to your life? just an idea! :) Regardless, i hope you'll be able to find peace and come to a decision that works best for you!:uhhuhuh:

[Tiberias]

I think one thing you have to think about very carefully and make clear to yourself is if you don't believe in the dogma of sin and salvation (which would, I would think, kinda negate the need for Christ to exist), or if you are just annoyed or disgusted or frustrated by it. The two are very different. Do you not believe in the need for a savior, or do you wish that there wasn't that need? I'd say most Christians at one time or another fall into the latter category, especially if they're heavily involved in their faith (reading through the writings of eminent saints and Doctors of the Church, it's a frequent lament). I don't think the notion of original sin, imperfect personal will and morality, and the need to rely on a bloody sacrifice to atone, is really supposed to be easy to accept.

So, again, do you not believe, or do you want not to believe? Once you have that answer, you can start to figure out if you need to reinvest in your Christian faith or look elsewhere. :)

[ninurta2008]

I am not sure. It would be very difficult to do this "officially" if you know what I mean. I don't think I will ever go atheist because I know that Christ exists... I just almost hate Christians right now. The religion is making me feel ill.
I see. If you're just upset with christians then maybe its not that you have to leave christianity, maybe you just need a break from your felllow christians? I know they can be tough sometimes to deal with, but give them some time and they who are your friends and familiy among them should come around.



Can someone tell me, in a nutshell I can understand, what is an agnostic? I have never understood what this means.
You don't know if god(ess)((e)s) exist or not.

[Anthony41671]

MC...I have no advice for you...your path is going to be what you want it to be...or none at all if you want...

My point in this post...good luck and I hope you find your center...whatever it might become!

[Cunae]

I think my way to go is some kind of agnosticism. I don't *want* to know if a god exists or not... a little twist on the definitions so far.

I am not so put off my fellow christians, though some I am, as I feel like I don't want to talk about this god anymore. Like I want to be left alone to think what I want to think... spiritual freedom from this bloody, guilt-filled, sin-obsessed religion.

You know, the christians I am around complain about catholics keeping christ on the cross (the crucifix) but they keep him nailed and dripping blood in their songs!

Here is a classic example: "I saw One hanging on a tree, In agony and blood, I saw my sins his blood has spilt, and helped to nail him there"

Agggh! I hate this crap!!

I do powerpoint for the church's songs and I couldn't help myself... I put a grimacing, bloody zombie in the background for this one. Let's see if they notice.

[Nicholas]

I'm going to suggest taking a step back from faith as a whole. You may not go back to it, or you may use the time to reset your priorities (maybe even find a better fit). What ever the case, it seems like if you're disgusted with what you have currently you need to separate from it for a time for your own well being.

As for your husband, that's a entirely different matter. I'm a being who advocates self preservation. If you internally cant stand his faith to a point where it becomes a problem I would would want to be fair for both parties and step away. If he and you can manage with different faiths or different ideas then you should be fine. Don't up and throw it all away though if you make a switch to something else, the idea may grown on him.

[1111]

May I asked what changed your mind all of a sudden? You have been God's poster child since joining---so I am just trying to wrap my head around your sudden 180.

And if it is too personal to share I get that.....just trying to understand.

[Cunae]

May I asked what changed your mind all of a sudden? You have been God's poster child since joining---so I am just trying to wrap my head around your sudden 180.

And if it is too personal to share I get that.....just trying to understand.

I never meant to be the poster child, I was always just giving my opinion... which happened to be christian.

What happened has been in the works for a while. I was gone for a while from here and then didn't write anything on the christian-focused threads. I know I often sound confused, but I have an open mind that doesn't always stick with one opinion if I hear one that is better.

That being said, I am not sure what happened. Just maturing spiritually, maybe... realizing what isn't true to my heart. If I mean what I say, and say what I mean, this will mean some serious changes in how I approach christianity and religion in general. I am going to take a step back and look at what I am feeling, but I think I know where I am coming from already. I'll see, though.

[Cunae]

I want to change my screen name... any ideas?

[1111]

I have a few.....

[RoseKitten]

What happened has been in the works for a while.

Not to be too terribly rude, but... http://mysticwicks.com/showpost.php?p=4147484&postcount=9

I guess I just get tired of seeing people bounce around all the time, especially ones who bounce from an extreme rather quickly. Makes me suspicious of what's really going on.

Good luck.

[1111]

Not to be too terribly rude, but... http://mysticwicks.com/showpost.php?p=4147484&postcount=9

I guess I just get tired of seeing people bounce around all the time, especially ones who bounce from an extreme rather quickly. Makes me suspicious of what's really going on.

Good luck.

In all fairness that was OVER two weeks ago. :giggle:

[RoseKitten]

In all fairness that was OVER two weeks ago. :giggle:

There were some more recent ones as well.

[1111]

Nooo.

I am shocked.

[Infinite Grey]

I think my way to go is some kind of agnosticism. I don't *want* to know if a god exists or not... a little twist on the definitions so far.

I am not so put off my fellow christians, though some I am, as I feel like I don't want to talk about this god anymore. Like I want to be left alone to think what I want to think... spiritual freedom from this bloody, guilt-filled, sin-obsessed religion.

You know, the christians I am around complain about catholics keeping christ on the cross (the crucifix) but they keep him nailed and dripping blood in their songs!

Here is a classic example: "I saw One hanging on a tree, In agony and blood, I saw my sins his blood has spilt, and helped to nail him there"

Agggh! I hate this crap!!

I do powerpoint for the church's songs and I couldn't help myself... I put a grimacing, bloody zombie in the background for this one. Let's see if they notice.

Wow, even my old Pentecostal Church didn't go that morbid! Oh and kudos on the zombie thing, very awesome!

Apatheism is probably the label you're after, also known as Apathetic agnosticism or Pragmatic agnosticism; which is the position of apathy, disregard, or lack of interest towards belief, or lack of belief in a deity.

[Cunae]

I used to post numerous times a day, including any time there was a christian related thread. I have been pulling away for a while.

I guess I don't care if you believe me or not. There's no game or alterior motive here. Take it or leave it. At least a few of you understand what's happening... even if I don't yet.

[1111]

Not to worry.

We can all learn together along the way. This will be fun.

[RoseKitten]

I used to post numerous times a day, including any time there was a christian related thread. I have been pulling away for a while.

I guess I don't care if you believe me or not. There's no game or alterior motive here. Take it or leave it. At least a few of you understand what's happening... even if I don't yet.

No need to get snippy. I'm simply pointing out that, as I've seen many times in the past, people who move from an extreme stand on a religion to another extreme rather quickly (sorry, a week is quick, especially when you *claim* that it's been a while coming), tend to be missing quite a few important spiritual points. It's almost like you're running away instead of truly looking at the problem(s) that you have. I find that when one runs, they tend to be neglecting themselves along the way because it's too much work/thought/effort.

[blithespirit]

My neighbors across the street have an 8 or 9 foot wooden cross covered in Christmas lights that they keep plugged in 24/7. So nice to see a glowing instrument of torture shining at me every night before bed. Morbid? Yes, please! You are feeling the same doubt I had right before I finally pulled away.

Welcome to the Dark Side! :p

[Cunae]

No need to get snippy. I'm simply pointing out that, as I've seen many times in the past, people who move from an extreme stand on a religion to another extreme rather quickly (sorry, a week is quick, especially when you *claim* that it's been a while coming), tend to be missing quite a few important spiritual points. It's almost like you're running away instead of truly looking at the problem(s) that you have. I find that when one runs, they tend to be neglecting themselves along the way because it's too much work/thought/effort.


Ok, sorry.

[1111]

no need to get snippy. I'm simply pointing out that, as i've seen many times in the past, people who move from an extreme stand on a religion to another extreme rather quickly (sorry, a week is quick, especially when you *claim* that it's been a while coming), tend to be missing quite a few important spiritual points. It's almost like you're running away instead of truly looking at the problem(s) that you have. I find that when one runs, they tend to be neglecting themselves along the way because it's too much work/thought/effort.

qft.

[Caitlin.ann]

I don't see the purpose of picking apart Mystic Christian and I fail to see what ulterior motives she could have.

Most of us have all experienced a path change at least once in our lives. I'd prefer to encourage MC to explore her new feelings rather than beat her over the head with quote mining.

[Nicholas]

I don't see the purpose of picking apart Mystic Christian and I fail to see what ulterior motives she could have.

Most of us have all experienced a path change at least once in our lives. I'd prefer to encourage MC to explore her new feelings rather than beat her over the head with quote mining.

I agree, this is the first time she's even discussed such a thing. I personally believe she felt this place as a medium where she could speak freely without the criticism she's getting.

Seems many people forget where they come from.

[Twinkle]

I think if one is going to put it out there, they have to be prepared for a number of different opinions or responses....not all of them pleasant or what we'd like to hear.

I don't believe anyone is beating anyone over the head here - just giving honest responses to a post that was put out there for public consumption.

Being blunt and straightforward doesn't mean that someone is beating someone over the head.

I thought rosekitten gave some very good advice.

[Caitlin.ann]

I agree, this is the first time she's even discussed such a thing. I personally believe she felt this place as a medium where she could speak freely without the criticism she's getting.

Seems many people forget where they come from.

Yup. We give everyone else the benefit of the doubt without bashing them over the head, but we can't do that for Mystic Christian? Why because she's defended Christianity? She made a few enemies? We don't know whats been going on in her mind, she hasn't shared everything here, so how are we going to quote mine a few posts and assume we know she has ulterior motives or that we know exactly whats going on inside her head?

Actually disgusted at a few people right now.

[RoseKitten]

Yup. We give everyone else the benefit of the doubt without bashing them over the head, but we can't do that for Mystic Christian? Why because she's defended Christianity? She made a few enemies? We don't know whats been going on in her mind, she hasn't shared everything here, so how are we going to quote mine a few posts and assume we know she has ulterior motives or that we know exactly whats going on inside her head?



How dare I expect honesty. All I did was point out that this was, based on her posting, not something that's been "in the works for a while." So, based on what she shows here, this is a new development, likely provoked by something recent, and that she may want to actually think about her choice before running away from her path.



Actually disgusted at a few people right now.

Oh noes!

[Infinite Grey]

Enlightenment (yeah I went there) can be a delicate thing; how about people save their grilling for a later date?

[RoseKitten]

I think if one is going to put it out there, they have to be prepared for a number of different opinions or responses....not all of them pleasant or what we'd like to hear.

I don't believe anyone is beating anyone over the head here - just giving honest responses to a post that was put out there for public consumption.

Being blunt and straightforward doesn't mean that someone is beating someone over the head.

I thought rosekitten gave some very good advice.

I actually would have appreciated some bashing in my earlier days to spirituality, instead of everyone just patting me on the back and telling me good job. Sometimes blunt honesty, and asking/telling someone to actually think things through before jumping in is a good idea.

[Caitlin.ann]

How dare I expect honesty. All I did was point out that this was, based on her posting, not something that's been "in the works for a while." So, based on what she shows here, this is a new development, likely provoked by something recent, and that she may want to actually think about her choice before running away from her path.



Oh noes!

Isn't that what she's doing already? Thinking about it? Surely if she were acting as a mindless drone she never would have gotten irritated of whatever is going on in her life right now anyways. I think one obviously has to think about what they're feeling to even post a thread like this.

[Caitlin.ann]

I actually would have appreciated some bashing in my earlier days to spirituality, instead of everyone just patting me on the back and telling me good job. Sometimes blunt honesty, and asking/telling someone to actually think things through before jumping in is a good idea.

No one is saying that. I don't care what she practices as long as she's an agreeable person. What I am saying is that is pretty juvenile to dig up posts assuming one knows everything about whats going on with the poster.

ETA: I've said what I wanted to say and out of respect for the original poster, I would rather not derail this thread any further.

[rinabella]

Lol............. your expressions are hilarious. Why? because i sometimes think that way. I believe in a higher being but the Christianity approach can be ...


Got to tell you guys, I am burned out on my own faith. I am sick to death of the blood dripping from the cross and being washed in it (yuck!), so I can gain some mansion on the street of gold. What kind of perversion is that?? I am not sure I believe in any of that right now or if I want to ever again. I want peace of mind and this god's not doing it for me. I long for freedom from this Creator Being who demands attention and praise...who thrives on making humans suffer then beg for forgiveness. I don't even want to believe in him anymore.

This is not some period of withdrawal or disaffection, nor is it some crisis of faith... I wouldn't drag you into something like that. I guess I am kind of sharing why I have been so silent and seldom getting involved in discussions about Christianity anymore. Frankly, I don't care about Christianity! I wish I could escape it in my own life, but I am married to an effing pastor.

Well, that's my heart tonight. Sorry if it comes off as anything but sincere.

[David19]

We all go through this, and the marriage part I can't help you with. Thats a completely different beast and I have a lot of questions about the concept of marriage.

I will say this though, what has worked for me in concerns to peace of mind and everyone has their own view on it. Just be honest with yourself. If Christianity doesn't work for you their is nothing wrong with that just as it didn't for me but it does for some people. My personal view is that god is born from the human mind and its an answer that can be given to any questions we have. Dont know the answer? Well its god. Why did such and such happen, its in gods hands. God has a plan, its a comfort of the human mind and born from it. Thats how I see it and that viewpoint makes the most sense to me in the most honest and critical way. My mind is at peace from that conclusion just as many other people their mind is at peace from a completely different conclusion. Just be honest with yourself and what makes the most sense to you, that is YOUR own truth.

I hope you can find peace within yourself, and just know that this is something that most of us go through. You are not alone.


you can quietly find your own path without causing a stir, surely you can find a path that respects your husband's calling without being untrue to yourself.
I used to be with a very fervent Catholic, he was so sincere and thoughtful about his faith and I respected that.. but that doesn't mean it is going to work for you.

As far as forgiveness stuff.. how can a god who made us have made us so wrong that we need to be totally appologizing for ourselves? I think its not Christianity's basic tenents that are broken so much as that the focus has gotten a little messed up... have you explored the Unitarians?

They are a lot less'washed in the blood" and while not particularly Christian, they are b respectful and respectable....

I agree with both Vampiel and Tanya, as well as Twinkle and Jon, if Christianity doesn't seem to work for you, then, there's no shame in it, perhaps, it's time you travelled a new path, perhaps Christianity has got you this far, and you're meant to walk a new one now. Like Twinkle said, know what you are rejecting, what don't you like about Christianity, like jon said, explore other avenues within Christianity, if you don't like the organized Christianity bit, then, go for something unorganized, there's many different flavours within the religion, some that might be deemed "heretical" (like the Gnostics, among others), there's even Atheist Christianity (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_atheism). If you can't connect with anything within the religion, then, maybe, another religion is for you, maybe another Philosophy might be for you, or Atheism (which is, technically, a Philosophy), etc.

Just find your own path and live it, or, as Joseph Campbell said, Follow Your Bliss, or, as a great Witch once said, "to your own self, be true".

Edit: Just wanted to add, I can't advise you on your husband, I don't think anyone here can, that's between you and him, but, if you respect him, and his Faith, and he respects you (assuming he knows you post on a Pagan forum, he probably does), I don't think there should be many problems.

[David19]

Mystic Christian, perhaps you should look in to Gnosticism? I think it's the most helpful path for a Christian tired of Christianity to take. There are many different sects with different belief systems, all having a pretty similar view on the creator...But Christian Gnostics still believed in Jesus, just not the Jesus that most believe in. Hehe. Look in to it! You might find something you like. :)

Besides, I believe that knowledge either strengthens faith or it destroys it, thus showing you what is real and what isn't. Good luck! It takes courage to walk a path that is not written down in a book for you to follow.

Very true, and, many Gnostics hold a vareity of different opinions, some hold Jesus to be a Saviour figure, just in a different way to how Orthodox Christianity defines it, others see him as a symbol of the Christ, or Divine force, within us, some aren't even Christian, etc.


I am not sure. It would be very difficult to do this "officially" if you know what I mean. I don't think I will ever go atheist because I know that Christ exists... I just almost hate Christians right now. The religion is making me feel ill.

It sounds like you might want to consider Gnosticism, or, at least, just a Christian without any of the labels (i.e. Catholic, Evangelical, Fundamentalist, whatever, etc).

If you do want to pursue Gnosticism further, you may want to check out these 2 sites:

http://gnosis.org/welcome.html
http://www.gnosis.org/eghome.htm

I can link to others, if you wish.


Can someone tell me, in a nutshell I can understand, what is an agnostic? I have never understood what this means.

Agnostic means "don't know", it's probably the best option to hold about most things in life. They neither take a "yes, there's definitely a God", or "no, there is not a God at all, and you're dumb for believing in one".

[Agaliha]

How dare I expect honesty. All I did was point out that this was, based on her posting, not something that's been "in the works for a while." So, based on what she shows here, this is a new development, likely provoked by something recent, and that she may want to actually think about her choice before running away from her path.


Just because she said otherwise doesn't mean it wasn't occurring. There are many people when asked how their marriage/relationship or some other aspect of their life is going, may say everything is great when really it's not. People that are depressed may say they feel happy and things couldn't be better, when deep down they're suffering and in pain. They may say these things to convince themselves, others or because they aren't ready to realize and face the reality that things aren't what they once were-- their marriage is in shambles, their faith is gone/changed, etc.

I won't get into details, but I know this first hand. I did it myself with Islam. Even while things were going in another direction, I continued to post with a positive attitude. Why? Not to lie, deceive or anything like that, but because I wanted it to be that way, I wanted to believe things were how I described-- positive, perfect and with no problems (I suppose it a way, I was trying to convince myself). Perhaps MC wanted something similar, I don't know. It's really not for anyone on here to nitpick or decide, though. Spirituality is very much a personal thing and even though many of us post a lot about ours on MW, we don't know the whole situation... And just because she wrote she was happy with her faith (or whatever it was), doesn't mean there wasn't more to it. All we're reading is text, we don't know her thoughts, feelings and day to day struggles. We're missing all the context behind it. Because of that, I think we should give her the benefit of the doubt.

Though I go agree that sometimes, some people do need hard questions. I'm not saying people shouldn't ask questions, either. My point was specifically about your comment about how this couldn't have been occurring for awhile because of her past/recent posts.

[Æon Flux]

My only advice for situations like this is to sit down in front of a window with a nice view, have a cup of tea and just breathe.
Don't stress out and don't let things overwhelm you regarding changes in spiritual and religious believes and how you view them, just allow yourself to exist for a while. Be in this very moment and try not to judge your views or the way others interpret them.

Just spend some time with yourself. Answers will come eventually, in the meantime just sip tea and don't worry.

[Tobias]

Try to bare in mind too people, that at the very heart of Christianity is the requirement for a proclamation of Faith. "I believe in Jesus, that He is the Son of God, and that He died on the cross to save me from my sins."

A Christian wavering in the faith may be very quick to stand up and proclaim what must be said on the good days, and on the days when doubts cloud our minds we say nothing at all. There is nothing odd about things appearing to be fine on the surface, then all of a sudden you find out what's been going on inside for some time. It is then another giant step, one much further down the road, to proclaim the opposite, that "I no longer believe in Jesus..."

It sucks, yeah. And we can complain all day long about how things shouldn't be this way. But the fact is, this is what people go through when they move away from Christianity. Some of us are deeper invested in that religion, having more friends and family that would be offended, and deeper spiritual foundations completely ingrained in Christian doctrine.

Just be patient. And please try to keep the "I told you so's" to a minimum. :)

[LacyRoze]

MC, take time for you. Right now you need to just "be" and explore what you're feeling and why. Let your heart tell you what is true for you and what isn't. Maybe your journey on this path has come to an end and you know what? That's ok. Maybe it's time to spread your wings and grow spiritually.

Whatever you decide is right for you, I'm here if you need me...

[Cunae]

I wish I could explain this transition better for those who question it. I don't know the exact words. I have been thinking about it for a while now and waited to say anything here until now. I appreciate all of the lovingly meant advice and hope to be more concise in the future.

[Tobias]

Even if all our advice is useless, at least know that a lot of people care about you. Down at the bottom of the page I saw this:



"Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 17 "



:thumbsup:

[Bettie]

Mystic Christian, for someone who, here at MW at least, has been so 'outspokenly Christian', I imagine it took a lot of courage to post here about possibly having doubts about Christianity. I don't have any answers, but I wish you all the best in your continued journey of faith.

[Twinkle]

I wish I could explain this transition better for those who question it. I don't know the exact words. I have been thinking about it for a while now and waited to say anything here until now. I appreciate all of the lovingly meant advice and hope to be more concise in the future.

I remember the transition for me very well. It was tough. I was torn, confused, questioning myself and everything else.

It was a very confusing time that I couldn't put into words, either.

If you're going through something similar, I do feel for you.

I really think that you need to just be. I know acceptance and kindness from Pagans helped me with the transition into finding who I was and what I truly believed.

The hard questions need to be asked and answered - because without that - you may find yourself in a sort of void where you are just *lost*....and I wouldn't want you to go through that if you don't absolutely have to.

[TuathaSidhe]

Just because she said otherwise doesn't mean it wasn't occurring. There are many people when asked how their marriage/relationship or some other aspect of their life is going, may say everything is great when really it's not. People that are depressed may say they feel happy and things couldn't be better, when deep down they're suffering and in pain. They may say these things to convince themselves, others or because they aren't ready to realize and face the reality that things aren't what they once were-- their marriage is in shambles, their faith is gone/changed, etc.

I won't get into details, but I know this first hand. I did it myself with Islam. Even while things were going in another direction, I continued to post with a positive attitude. Why? Not to lie, deceive or anything like that, but because I wanted it to be that way, I wanted to believe things were how I described-- positive, perfect and with no problems (I suppose it a way, I was trying to convince myself). Perhaps MC wanted something similar, I don't know. It's really not for anyone on here to nitpick or decide, though. Spirituality is very much a personal thing and even though many of us post a lot about ours on MW, we don't know the whole situation... And just because she wrote she was happy with her faith (or whatever it was), doesn't mean there wasn't more to it. All we're reading is text, we don't know her thoughts, feelings and day to day struggles. We're missing all the context behind it. Because of that, I think we should give her the benefit of the doubt.

Though I go agree that sometimes, some people do need hard questions. I'm not saying people shouldn't ask questions, either. My point was specifically about your comment about how this couldn't have been occurring for awhile because of her past/recent posts.

Very well said, especially the very last part. Unless you really know a person, you cant put together a few posts or threads and really know whats going on. To think you can is...laughable IMO.

I agree that maybe for now you should just take a step back, breath, think about things and give it some time. :hugz: good luck

ETA: I was raised as a christian. I NEVER felt comfortable with it, I never "felt" it like I was "suppose" to. However...I was active, and outspoken about it. I was taught that if I tried hard enough it would come, that it was a test of my faith, yadda yadda yadda. So for the few who knew I actually left it, it was a shock to them and very much out of the blue. So I know how you feel in some ways.

[Meadhbh]

I agree theres nothing rushing you to make a choice about anything. Every one at some point questions their faith. Some people go back to it, other people find new ones. I can't say to much about christianty from first hand experience but if your not comfortable in that faith, if I were you I'd stop and try to figure out what was bothering me first and go from there.

[Cunae]

Name change to Cunae, which is Latin for bird's nest... I am an avid bird watcher so it seem appropriate!

[Cunae]

I love that avatar!

[~*Trinity Aura*~]

Leave it! I had a similar feeling years ago and came to the conclusion that "God" didn't want me screwing up his plans and people so I would just leave the terrible prick well enough alone.

Find YOUR truth and revel in it.

Agreed! Plus life is too short to worry about if you're going to Hell or not. Do your own thing and see how it works out:thumbsup:

[Phoenix Blue]

How dare I expect honesty.
"Expecting honesty" is fine. However, you're in the Paths forums, and you WILL show respect toward others. I have zero tolerance for personal attacks in this forum -- that's MY expectation.

[daphnerose]

Cunae-love the new name btw.:)
My only advice would be, just spend time getting to know more of yourself. Like another poster said..de stress, sit in front of a window..watch the birds.:) Relax! Sometimes the more we question things the harder it gets. You will find your answers!
hugs and blessings
daphne

[Caitlin.ann]

Cunae-love the new name btw.:)
My only advice would be, just spend time getting to know more of yourself. Like another poster said..de stress, sit in front of a window..watch the birds.:) Relax! Sometimes the more we question things the harder it gets. You will find your answers!
hugs and blessings
daphne

The bolded portion I find to be very important. For years I thought way too much about what I believed, and what I thought I was supposed to believe and it only made my spirituality feel forced and strained.

[Twinkle]

I'm a big believer in asking the hard questions - but I do believe that overthinking is never good. IMO I think it's important to ask the hard questions, but not be in any huge rush to get *the answers*. The journey is part of the process. Sounds trite, but it's true.

[Caitlin.ann]

I'm a big believer in asking the hard questions - but I do believe that overthinking is never good. IMO I think it's important to ask the hard questions, but not be in any huge rush to get *the answers*. The journey is part of the process. Sounds trite, but it's true.

Yeah..thats one of my issues. I want everything NOW NOW NOW!!!!

[Cloaked Raven]

I'm a big believer in asking the hard questions - but I do believe that overthinking is never good. IMO I think it's important to ask the hard questions, but not be in any huge rush to get *the answers*. The journey is part of the process. Sounds trite, but it's true.
:thumbsup: Very wise words, Twinkle. :)

[Twinkle]

I can honestly say it took me 18 years to truly figure out my spirituality and religious ideation.

I wouldn't trade one moment of my time as a Satanist, Wiccan, Christian Wiccan, back to Christianity and finally Hellenismos.

I firmly believed that I needed that whole process in order to figure out what I believed and why I believed it.


I remember finally leaving Christianity. I said it on a Pagan Board, where I had been hanging out for a good year.

It felt good to finally figure it out.

I really hope that MC gets that same sort of support, regardless of what her religious ideation ends up being.

It's a long and hard process for some of us.

[Cunae]

Great posts, everyone! I love you guys for supporting me right now. As for what's happening: change is sometimes necessary, but seldom painless. I do feel relieved to be a lot more of myself now.

[1111]

"Expecting honesty" is fine. However, you're in the Paths forums, and you WILL show respect toward others. I have zero tolerance for personal attacks in this forum -- that's MY expectation.

Really? How come only this forum?



Seriously, you are going to give me three infractions for speaking the truth to a troll who can’t make up her mind if she is real or not. If she is a drunk or not, if she has horses or not, if she is rich or not, if she believes in god or not---when all she truly is—is a troll. And you are going to call me out for not respecting some twit who spits on this board daily? And why because this thread she happens to be hiding behind is a protected path forum? Really? And you don’t think that shit was by design?

Oh but that is right you are going to allow the ****tards like IG, MC and SS who just run around posting snarky bullshit and you are going to call that respectful and real? When is the last time any one of them posted something meaningful or helpful that was not just full of ego bullshit—patting them selves on the back? But I call bullshit when I see it and you call me disrespectful? Well judging by my karma, new friends’ requests, PM’s and emails that was not the popular opinion.

Why don’t you take a look around this place that use to be called home and wonder WTF happened? When is the last time GEBS even posted at her own site? Gee, wonder why? If she can’t stand to be here, what the hell do you think the rest of us feel?

And you are going to let people who actually teach and wanted to help people waltz right out the door? Like Rick and Rudy who took the time with their knowledge and expertise to actually share it with members and allow them to learn. And you are going to let healers like Taliesyn and Sleepycat just fade away because in the process of helping others and being of service they might have called bullshit as well? Or DW or any of the others who would at least speak up with things were getting out of control.

So really you would rather have assholes free to post bullshit then actually have some kind of meaningful forum where likeminded people can come to learn from one another and have fun. Ok, I don’t get it. That is ****ed up. And PB you can sit there and go around banning people and sending out infractions to those who don’t deserve it because you feel it gives you some kind of wicked power—yet it only confirms what the entire net is saying about this place—it is not the same as it once was. And until someone steps up and makes some major changes it won’t be again.

In the last year this place has lost some awesome members, very wise members who were here for the good of the community, the good of MW and shared with others what was necessary. So you take a look at the last year and what you handed out bans for and infractions and I am sure you will find the same common denominator is all of it. Your trolls who have not taught anyone a single thing expect what assholes they are. Ooooo great, I am more balanced and fulfilled today know that. Rolls eyes.

I left here last year because MC and her lies and I did not come back till GEBS took a stand and called her out in public and SWORE this place was going back to the way it was. Really and when will that be? Because it is only worse now and not fun. And not home. And you can sit there and think I am the only one that feels this way, but trust me there is a busload behind me that feel the same way and can’t say anything for fear PB is going to ban them. So I not only speak for me, I speak for a slew of others who called this place home and who held guide positions, teacher positions, admin positions and who helped this place be home. And that is not welcomed or wanted. So, you would like us to bend over backwards and get ****ed in the ass by those posting to see their words in print that does nothing to benefit the next member to feel good about themselves. Alrighty then.

So yeah, go ahead ban me, I was leaving anyway. This place is not home and if GEBS and Mol ever decide it will be again—well then I did not wait long enough did I?

And for you losers I called out don’t bother hitting the report button, I did it myself. Why don’t you run along and post your bullshit that means nothing in the long run and wonder when you look in the mirror why you feel empty.

[Darth Brooks]

I couldn't care less whether you stay Christian, or leave it and come back to it later, or become something else entirely. As long as you stay you, Cunae, that's all I care about. :hugz:

[Nicholas]

Really? How come only this forum?



Seriously, you are going to give me three infractions for speaking the truth to a troll who can’t make up her mind if she is real or not. If she is a drunk or not, if she has horses or not, if she is rich or not, if she believes in god or not---when all she truly is—is a troll. And you are going to call me out for not respecting some twit who spits on this board daily? And why because this thread she happens to be hiding behind is a protected path forum? Really? And you don’t think that shit was by design?

Oh but that is right you are going to allow the hugtards like IG, MC and SS who just run around posting snarky bullshit and you are going to call that respectful and real? When is the last time any one of them posted something meaningful or helpful that was not just full of ego bullshit—patting them selves on the back? But I call bullshit when I see it and you call me disrespectful? Well judging by my karma, new friends’ requests, PM’s and emails that was not the popular opinion.

Why don’t you take a look around this place that use to be called home and wonder WTF happened? When is the last time GEBS even posted at her own site? Gee, wonder why? If she can’t stand to be here, what the hell do you think the rest of us feel?

And you are going to let people who actually teach and wanted to help people waltz right out the door? Like Rick and Rudy who took the time with their knowledge and expertise to actually share it with members and allow them to learn. And you are going to let healers like Taliesyn and Sleepycat just fade away because in the process of helping others and being of service they might have called bullshit as well? Or DW or any of the others who would at least speak up with things were getting out of control.

So really you would rather have assholes free to post bullshit then actually have some kind of meaningful forum where likeminded people can come to learn from one another and have fun. Ok, I don’t get it. That is huged up. And PB you can sit there and go around banning people and sending out infractions to those who don’t deserve it because you feel it gives you some kind of wicked power—yet it only confirms what the entire net is saying about this place—it is not the same as it once was. And until someone steps up and makes some major changes it won’t be again.

In the last year this place has lost some awesome members, very wise members who were here for the good of the community, the good of MW and shared with others what was necessary. So you take a look at the last year and what you handed out bans for and infractions and I am sure you will find the same common denominator is all of it. Your trolls who have not taught anyone a single thing expect what assholes they are. Ooooo great, I am more balanced and fulfilled today know that. Rolls eyes.

I left here last year because MC and her lies and I did not come back till GEBS took a stand and called her out in public and SWORE this place was going back to the way it was. Really and when will that be? Because it is only worse now and not fun. And not home. And you can sit there and think I am the only one that feels this way, but trust me there is a busload behind me that feel the same way and can’t say anything for fear PB is going to ban them. So I not only speak for me, I speak for a slew of others who called this place home and who held guide positions, teacher positions, admin positions and who helped this place be home. And that is not welcomed or wanted. So, you would like us to bend over backwards and get huged in the ass by those posting to see their words in print that does nothing to benefit the next member to feel good about themselves. Alrighty then.

So yeah, go ahead ban me, I was leaving anyway. This place is not home and if GEBS and Mol ever decide it will be again—well then I did not wait long enough did I?

And for you losers I called out don’t bother hitting the report button, I did it myself. Why don’t you run along and post your bullshit that means nothing in the long run and wonder when you look in the mirror why you feel empty.

Don't let the door hit your ass on the way out.

[Caitlin.ann]

Don't let the door hit your ass on the way out.

I find it amusing because the last time I recall writing anything remotely "snarky" was last night. Rofl.

[Sequoia]

Cunae,

Sometimes it helps to just breathe, just "accept" what is happening inside you, and to put that weight on the cause of it - call it "God" or "Goddess", call it "The Universe", call it whatever you like... for me, personally, I have found that by simplifying my faith, it has become stronger. Shift the weight on your heart to your "God", tell them what is torturing you so, let THEM guide you... and treat the assholes like a particularly distasteful dinner: take what you can stomach, what might nourish you, and leave the rest.

Some people might be inclined to turn your thread into their own personal joke; others may be inclined to make a stand about topics unrelated to you. Take what you will, leave the rest.

Just breathe.

[Hope]

Really? How come only this forum?



Seriously, you are going to give me three infractions for speaking the truth to a troll who can’t make up her mind if she is real or not. If she is a drunk or not, if she has horses or not, if she is rich or not, if she believes in god or not---when all she truly is—is a troll. And you are going to call me out for not respecting some twit who spits on this board daily? And why because this thread she happens to be hiding behind is a protected path forum? Really? And you don’t think that shit was by design?

Oh but that is right you are going to allow the hugtards like IG, MC and SS who just run around posting snarky bullshit and you are going to call that respectful and real? When is the last time any one of them posted something meaningful or helpful that was not just full of ego bullshit—patting them selves on the back? But I call bullshit when I see it and you call me disrespectful? Well judging by my karma, new friends’ requests, PM’s and emails that was not the popular opinion.

Why don’t you take a look around this place that use to be called home and wonder WTF happened? When is the last time GEBS even posted at her own site? Gee, wonder why? If she can’t stand to be here, what the hell do you think the rest of us feel?

And you are going to let people who actually teach and wanted to help people waltz right out the door? Like Rick and Rudy who took the time with their knowledge and expertise to actually share it with members and allow them to learn. And you are going to let healers like Taliesyn and Sleepycat just fade away because in the process of helping others and being of service they might have called bullshit as well? Or DW or any of the others who would at least speak up with things were getting out of control.

So really you would rather have assholes free to post bullshit then actually have some kind of meaningful forum where likeminded people can come to learn from one another and have fun. Ok, I don’t get it. That is huged up. And PB you can sit there and go around banning people and sending out infractions to those who don’t deserve it because you feel it gives you some kind of wicked power—yet it only confirms what the entire net is saying about this place—it is not the same as it once was. And until someone steps up and makes some major changes it won’t be again.

In the last year this place has lost some awesome members, very wise members who were here for the good of the community, the good of MW and shared with others what was necessary. So you take a look at the last year and what you handed out bans for and infractions and I am sure you will find the same common denominator is all of it. Your trolls who have not taught anyone a single thing expect what assholes they are. Ooooo great, I am more balanced and fulfilled today know that. Rolls eyes.

I left here last year because MC and her lies and I did not come back till GEBS took a stand and called her out in public and SWORE this place was going back to the way it was. Really and when will that be? Because it is only worse now and not fun. And not home. And you can sit there and think I am the only one that feels this way, but trust me there is a busload behind me that feel the same way and can’t say anything for fear PB is going to ban them. So I not only speak for me, I speak for a slew of others who called this place home and who held guide positions, teacher positions, admin positions and who helped this place be home. And that is not welcomed or wanted. So, you would like us to bend over backwards and get huged in the ass by those posting to see their words in print that does nothing to benefit the next member to feel good about themselves. Alrighty then.

So yeah, go ahead ban me, I was leaving anyway. This place is not home and if GEBS and Mol ever decide it will be again—well then I did not wait long enough did I?

And for you losers I called out don’t bother hitting the report button, I did it myself. Why don’t you run along and post your bullshit that means nothing in the long run and wonder when you look in the mirror why you feel empty.

ROFL!!!

Well gee didn't you cover a LOT in one post today!

The bigger issues are the "taking a stand" and then being around to hold it are two very different things.

And yes MANY of us -- are gone, or just nicely helping some newer person here and there (often only popping in to look at something that someone asks us to see).. cause we have no interest in
Christianity, trolls, 20 somethings that claim long life experience etc.

You are in good company and made at least one person laugh today!

Then again I am a firm believer in actual standards and not double standards -- shrugs

♥

[LisaT4P]

And yes MANY of us -- are gone, or just nicely helping some newer person here and there (often only popping in to look at something that someone asks us to see).. cause we have no interest in
Christianity, trolls, 20 somethings that claim long life experience etc. qft :smileroll

[Chaos Hawk]

Really? How come only this forum?



Seriously, you are going to give me three infractions for speaking the truth to a troll who can’t make up her mind if she is real or not. If she is a drunk or not, if she has horses or not, if she is rich or not, if she believes in god or not---when all she truly is—is a troll. And you are going to call me out for not respecting some twit who spits on this board daily? And why because this thread she happens to be hiding behind is a protected path forum? Really? And you don’t think that shit was by design?

Oh but that is right you are going to allow the hugtards like IG, MC and SS who just run around posting snarky bullshit and you are going to call that respectful and real? When is the last time any one of them posted something meaningful or helpful that was not just full of ego bullshit—patting them selves on the back? But I call bullshit when I see it and you call me disrespectful? Well judging by my karma, new friends’ requests, PM’s and emails that was not the popular opinion.

Why don’t you take a look around this place that use to be called home and wonder WTF happened? When is the last time GEBS even posted at her own site? Gee, wonder why? If she can’t stand to be here, what the hell do you think the rest of us feel?

And you are going to let people who actually teach and wanted to help people waltz right out the door? Like Rick and Rudy who took the time with their knowledge and expertise to actually share it with members and allow them to learn. And you are going to let healers like Taliesyn and Sleepycat just fade away because in the process of helping others and being of service they might have called bullshit as well? Or DW or any of the others who would at least speak up with things were getting out of control.

So really you would rather have assholes free to post bullshit then actually have some kind of meaningful forum where likeminded people can come to learn from one another and have fun. Ok, I don’t get it. That is huged up. And PB you can sit there and go around banning people and sending out infractions to those who don’t deserve it because you feel it gives you some kind of wicked power—yet it only confirms what the entire net is saying about this place—it is not the same as it once was. And until someone steps up and makes some major changes it won’t be again.

In the last year this place has lost some awesome members, very wise members who were here for the good of the community, the good of MW and shared with others what was necessary. So you take a look at the last year and what you handed out bans for and infractions and I am sure you will find the same common denominator is all of it. Your trolls who have not taught anyone a single thing expect what assholes they are. Ooooo great, I am more balanced and fulfilled today know that. Rolls eyes.

I left here last year because MC and her lies and I did not come back till GEBS took a stand and called her out in public and SWORE this place was going back to the way it was. Really and when will that be? Because it is only worse now and not fun. And not home. And you can sit there and think I am the only one that feels this way, but trust me there is a busload behind me that feel the same way and can’t say anything for fear PB is going to ban them. So I not only speak for me, I speak for a slew of others who called this place home and who held guide positions, teacher positions, admin positions and who helped this place be home. And that is not welcomed or wanted. So, you would like us to bend over backwards and get huged in the ass by those posting to see their words in print that does nothing to benefit the next member to feel good about themselves. Alrighty then.

So yeah, go ahead ban me, I was leaving anyway. This place is not home and if GEBS and Mol ever decide it will be again—well then I did not wait long enough did I?

And for you losers I called out don’t bother hitting the report button, I did it myself. Why don’t you run along and post your bullshit that means nothing in the long run and wonder when you look in the mirror why you feel empty.


ROFL!!!

Well gee didn't you cover a LOT in one post today!

The bigger issues are the "taking a stand" and then being around to hold it are two very different things.

And yes MANY of us -- are gone, or just nicely helping some newer person here and there (often only popping in to look at something that someone asks us to see).. cause we have no interest in
Christianity, trolls, 20 somethings that claim long life experience etc.

You are in good company and made at least one person laugh today!

Then again I am a firm believer in actual standards and not double standards -- shrugs

♥

agreed

[Phoenix Blue]

Seriously, you are going to give me three infractions for speaking the truth to a troll who can’t make up her mind if she is real or not.
Yes, I am, because you did so in a disrespectful fashion. If you can't abide by the Respect Rule, you'll be gone.

And as to "Why this forum," you need only go to the top of the page:

This forum is absolutely not for heated debate or jokes. If that is your intention go to the Theology forum or Just Silly. The Respect rule is heavily applied in this forum and subforums contained within. This is non-negotiable. This is the "safe place" to talk about your beliefs.

If you choose to deny someone else access to a "safe place" to talk about their beliefs, expect to be called on the carpet about it.


And yes MANY of us -- are gone, or just nicely helping some newer person here and there (often only popping in to look at something that someone asks us to see).. cause we have no interest in Christianity, trolls, 20 somethings that claim long life experience etc.
If you don't have any interest in Christianity, etc., then stay out of those threads. No one's forcing you to read them. However, no amount of what you perceive as "trolling" justifies disrespectful behavior on your part.


One final note: everyone who responded to 1111's temper tantrum has received a warning for public discussion of admin modes. EVERYONE ... because responding to crap like that only adds to the problem.

THIS THREAD IS NOW CLOSED. If anyone thinks they may have a problem with the "safe harbor" provision in the paths forums, let me know and I'll mask your access flags so you never have to see the paths forums again.