What do you call God and Goddess (Re-visited)

[mol]

Another new thread! For an old one that should keep going..

Here is the most recent post by Lynnaea:

It is A Witch's Bible by Janet and Stewart Farrar. It is full of info on various rites and rituals. Good Book!
Semele
__________________
I use the Farrar's material also, the Witch's Bible is good for understanding Gardnerian material if you can get past the silly naked pictures.

(I know Janet is Alexandrian but the book quotes Gardner throughout; and if you want to practice sky-clad that is fine, but I don't see why they needed to publish the pictures)

One thing that does puzzle me about Gardner is the selection of gods, he calls God Cernunnos which is Celtic, I thought, but calls the Goddess Aradia which I thought was Northern Italian. The trads I am acquainted with use the gods and goddesses from the same culture, not to say mixing and matching is wrong. Modern covens mix and match all the time, but Gardner was supposedly initiated into an old fam-trad. The Farrars do say, though, that Cernunnos is another form of the name Herne.

I found the last part of the book is very good for explaning astral travel, reincarnation, spells and much more.
__________________
Bright Blessings
Lynnaea
http://moonglade.hypermart.net


Any opinions on this?

[Mairwen]

It is A Witch's Bible by Janet and Stewart Farrar. It is full of info on various rites and rituals.

I keep hearing mixed opinions about it. I've never had a reason/desire to read it, myself, and have only had it in my hands once ~ and that was to peruse something someone was pointing out to me at a Community meeting once.


The Farrars do say, though, that Cernunnos is another form of the name Herne.


Nah. I don't think so. But the mixing of Aradia with Kernunnos is quite odd. I don't understand the mixing of pantheons at all. We teach that it's not a good idea ~ unless the gods are willing, and the personalities you're attempting to mix compliment one another.

[Shatav]

Well, I have two general definitions. I believe in the One. It is consisted of everything in the universe, astral and physical, etc, etc. Then there are divinities, those are what most people refer to as God/desses or deities. I believe that these things were once human/animal/whatever, but through a process of purification and perfection have risen their level to be a perfect reflection of the One, complete with all of the wisdom and power therein.

[Jazzmine]

I have heard of Christian Witches calling God the All, Mary the Goddess, and Jesus the God. Does that sound right? My husband, who is not pagan or witchy feels that that would make it more understandable for non-pagans. What do you think?

[Jazzmine]

Thank you Eaglewolf. That was informative. It's not quite what I believe, but an interesting view. That would be helpful to others who are searching.

[Nyxee]

I can see I'm gonna have to go searching through some of my Lore books... There was actually a bit of research done on the 'Goddess' known as Aradia, and these scholars came to the conclusion that she was an invention (created fro bits and pieces gathered from lots of sources) by one writer, and expanded upon by others like Leland. It was an interesting theory. Anyone here work with Aradia? In the current Stregheria tradition, I believe, she is seen to be the daughter of Diana and Dianus/Lucifer, and was placed on the earth to teach and lead the strega/stregone of the time. I could be wrong tho, as I am not a strega. Anyone available to check me? :)

Blessings

Mellee

[Lilu]

The only thing I've ever read about Aradia comes from the book "Paganism for Beginners" and is written by Teresa Moorey.

I don't know how accurate it is or anything, but thought I'd post it for everyone's reading anyway and to hear comments:

[begin quote]
DIANA AND ARADIA

Aradia is especially important to Wicacns, and C.G. Leland's 'Aradia, Gospel of the Witches' is one of the key sources of the current Wicca/Witchcraft revival. It tells us: "Diana was the first created before all creation; in her here all things; out of herself, the first darkness she divided herself; into darkness and light she was divided. Lucifer, her brother and son, herself and her other half, was the light."

The story continues with details of how Diana fell in love with Lucifer and seduced him, how she became mistress of all sorcery and how her union with her brother produced a daughter, Aradia. Aradia then became her emissary upon earth, bringing knowledge of witchcraft and hidden arts to the poor and deprived. Aradia says: "My mother will teach you all things and ye shall be freed from slavery."

Whether we are enslaved by materialism, dogma, inhibitions or prohibitions, this is an exciting message and Wiccans have preserved it in their ceremonies. Aradia, who is linked to the full moon, brings wisdom, the starlight vision, and freedom - she is a female Messiah. She also represents delight in the pleasures of the flesh and whispers of secret worship in grove and on moonlit hill. Young, beautiful and wise she is the counterpart of the horned god Cernunnos, a true Nature Goddess of the Witches.

The story of Diana as primal Mother Goddess, giving birth to her son/consort is only one of many from different mythologies and cultures. It is symbolic and certainly does not imply any belief in or respect for incest.

Lucifer (meaning light) is well known as the archangel who succumbed to pride and was thrown out of heaven to become the Devil. However, the Lucifer in this story is a different matter entirely and no one should infer from it that Wiccans worship the Devil, for they certainly do not; in fact they do not believe in him.
[end quote]

It goes on to talk about Cernunnos, where he is in fact compared (if not indicated that they are one and the same) with Herne.

I'm not sure about the generalised comments of Aradia being important to all Wiccans, and C.G. Leland's book having been a key source in the revival of Wicca, but the information is interesting. I am finding the story of Aradia to be rather intriguing and wouldn't mind getting my hands on some more info on her.

BB
Lilu

[Pendragon]

In one of Raven Silvermoon's books, she admits that her selections for the names of the God and Goddess come from two different cultures. I do the same thing: mine are Cernunnos (Celtic) and Arianrhod (Welsh).

[Mairwen]

Well, in the Gwyddoniad, which is Welsh, we see Kernunnos as the All Father. However, he was an add-on ~ you're right ~ from when the Celts arrived. :D

[MoonWolf]

since someone brought this up *grins*.. I am not going to be much help since I am rather new little stregha, a student working up to initiation one of these days when it is deemed that i am ready.
But Aradia is not viewed as a goddess in the tradition I am studying.. but rather a holy woman/teacher.. the Great Stregha. for good information on the views of Aradia in the Aridian tradition of Stregheria read "Italian Witchcraft".
And unlike Leland's book (which many people practicing stregheria seem to find faulty information in from what i gather) it is Diana and Dianus, rather than Diana and Lucifer. Aradia had christian parents and a aunt who was a witch. She found some sort of enlightenment at Nemi and never returned home. she became known as the beautiful pilgrim who taught witchcraft to others.

I have never personally even heard of the witches bible until now, much less picked it up. though I do find the pairing of Aradia with Cernunous (please forgive the spelling) to be rather odd..( of course placing Aradia as a goddess seems rather odd to me but that is my personal views :)) particularly if it was quoting of someone who is from a long line of traditional practicing.

One point of notation is that stregheria is not wicca, while there is the threefold rule of return, return of what you do on mind body and spirit.. there is no wiccan rede. It is specifically a different form of witchcraft then wicca with obvious similarties. Just thought to add that tidbit of information :)

Sorry for getting too offtopic here, just replying to some stuff.

MoonWolf

[Adrenaline Junkie]

I don't know how old this thread is, but I'm replying anyways.

I see Aradia as a Goddess. Sort of like Christ. She was born as a Goddess in the heavens, and then was sent by her mother Diana to teach the poor and oppressed. When her job was done, she attained her goddess hood back.

But then again it depends on what your beliefs are.

I personally have a relationship with the Goddess Aradia and find her to be a beautiful deity that is always teaching and loving me. :)

[Shadowulfe]

On the topic of the Goddess Aradia: I never read anything about her
On the topic of The Witches Bible: Angelwulfe & I have it...seems like its got some very good info, but Ive only read very little of it(couple chapters)

[Silver Venus]

Originally posted by Jazzmine
I have heard of Christian Witches calling God the All, Mary the Goddess, and Jesus the God. Does that sound right? My husband, who is not pagan or witchy feels that that would make it more understandable for non-pagans. What do you think?


Sorry to par of subject a little but I just had to say that Jazzmine ~ Your words on Mary as the goddess did ring true to me!
My guardian goddess is called Mary! :) ~ She gave me this name when I first asked her years ago, but I have never been christian in choice just through school and parents... maybe it rubbed of, maybe it didnt :rolleyes: but I truly believe she is a true nature mother, pagan goddess just like Aradia.

[Myst]

Originally posted by MoonWolf
Sorry for getting too offtopic here, just replying to some stuff.


I found your post very very informative and helpful, since I've been doing a bit of studying into Stregheria myself. Thanks, I hope to learn more from you :)

[lucidfire]

hey jazzmine, I like the way you put that.