Couple accused of caging 5-year-old sons

[VelvetBlade]

Couple accused of caging 5-year-old sons

Tuesday, August 26, 2003 Posted: 9:53 PM EDT (0153 GMT)
http://i.cnn.net/cnn/images/1.gifhttp://i.cnn.net/cnn/2003/US/Southwest/08/26/caged.brothers.ap/story.cages.ap.jpg Makeshift cages that allegedly were used to lock-up five-year-old twin boys are shown in these police handout photos.

PHOENIX, Arizona (AP) -- A couple were arrested on child abuse charges for allegedly keeping their 5-year-old twin sons locked in filthy makeshift cages for nearly 20 hours a day.
Police found the boys Saturday after an adult older brother told an off-duty officer at a grocery store about the squalid living conditions.
When police arrived at the home they found the children inside two cribs that had been wired together and sealed by plastic crates. Roaches filled the cages, which contained a blanket and small mattress stained with feces and urine.
Louis and Estelvina Rodriguez of Phoenix were arrested on suspicion of child abuse and kidnapping.






http://www.cnn.com/2003/US/Southwest/08/26/caged.brothers.ap/index.html

[MammaStar]

why...why...why...why..!!!

why can people like this have children and do these kind of things...when others who would make great parents can't!!! I don't understand people. I really truly don't....how can you hurt a child???

*wanders off completely disgusted*

[Old Witch]

I give......Some people should just die and be done with it......

[Fairywolf]

:bastard: I agree with you SugarMags. I don't understand it!!

*mumbles something under breath not suitable for others to hear*

[Nissala]

*totally bewildered by it all*

I will never understand................

[Flar's Freyja]

I give......Some people should just die and be done with it......

I proposed sterilization of the stupid but it didn't go over very well......

I'm glad that the kids were rescued. I've always wondered what the difference is between people that get upset with their kids and consider things like this but would never dream of actually doing it in reality and those who do - and it seems that it's a matter of intelligence level. The majority of mentally ill people that I've worked with are neglectful, and the majority of abusive ones are supposedly normal.

[Gareth]

Yes the kids were rescued, but they're not potty trained. They can't speak properly.
So many good people who can't concieve a child then you hear about this type of people who do nothing but abuse thier own!
If they didn't want them.......
I think you know the rest.

[LadyOak]

"She said they kept the kids in the cage for their own protection." ---How could those parents BELIEVE such a thing????

[Kaylara]

*Must... Resist... Urge... To... Kill...*

[Arylon]

I proposed sterilization of the stupid but it didn't go over very well......



Hey, I'm with you all the way on this one! I know it's not right, but it'd be nice if certain people weren't allowed to reproduce. :geez:

[Gareth]

*Must... Resist... Urge... To... Kill...*

I feel the same way. When I heard this on the news yesterday I had to get up and hug all my kids.


For thier own protection!!

Please, what the hell is wrong with these stupid people?!?

:fishsmack Stpid people :fishsmack

[Kaylara]

I hope that they fry those people... If there's one thing I can't handle, it's people abusing kids or animals... GGGGGGGGRRRRRRRRR!

[JeweledNight]

It's just amazing. You have to fill out an application to get a job cleaning toilets. You have to get a license to go fishing. You have to have a permit to do certain construction on your house.

Yet any man and woman that are physically capable can have children, and, in my opinion, being parents is something that requires more HUMANITY and maturity than any of the above.

[willamena]

one of the things that amaze me about our culture is our unwillingness to acknowledge the very baseness of humanity...no offense community, but how can we NOT believe these things are happening when the dominant paradigm is seeped in what's best for oneself--if it truly benefited the "community" there would be more accountabilty...i see this more on a grass-roots level, and that's where our commitments are crucial...the internal doesn't make any room for abuse; embracing our capacity for violence is a step in the right direction toward diminishing it's power...

[Brenners]

I agree that stupid parents like these need to be sterlized, there should be a national test on whether or not you're competent enough to have kids. Bastards.

:bastard:

[Psyche Ague]

This has been discussed in other threads, but I feel that people should go through training and be forced to get a license before they're able to reproduce.

It's crap like this that just reinforces my thoughts on the subject. How disgusting. And it will never stop until more people are educated and given more choices in reproduction and raising children.

[Sparrow]

That's so sad :( Those poor kids.


I I've always wondered what the difference is between people that get upset with their kids and consider things like this but would never dream of actually doing it in reality and those who do - and it seems that it's a matter of intelligence level.

But not always. My father was sadistically abusive and was a genius. You can't pinpoint for sure who will be a good parent and who won't. You can specualte, but you don't know for sure.

Forced sterilization just creates the stepping stones for another form of ethnic cleansing and weeding out "undesirables". Sure, you'll start with just people guilty of horrible abuse but soon it would be "Well, we don't want all those colored people breeding, let's think up a good reason. We don't want those Jews breeding either." Etc etc etc. Shit like that always starts out small and acceptable. But once it starts you can't control it.

There was actually a really good quote that makes me think of that. Paraphrasing, it's along the lines "first they came for the blacks, but I didn't speak up because I was white. Then they came for the muslims but I didn't speak up because I was a jew. etc etc etc... when they finally came for me, there was no one speak up for me."

[cydira]

This kind of stuff makes me livid. As one who has experiened abuse in a relationship, I tend to have a strong stance against it. I've also seen the effects that abuse of children has on the child and the family around the child. Specifically, the abuse of my neice by her mother and the abuse of my cousins by their mother. In both situations, the fathers were fighting for custody, but for some unfathomable reason, the court felt that the children should be with the mothers.

Quitefrankly, I feel that abusers are the worst blight upon the earth that one can think of. Unfortunately it's only with great difficulty that you can possibly identify one before they actually start their crap.

The forced sterlizaion is a nice wishful thought, it's benice to make that monster go away, but I'd have to agree that it is a perilously small step from sanctioned geniside.

The only real option that we have, my friends, is to vigilantly and agressively be aware of what is going on and strive to break the silence and secrecy that surrounds the abused relationship and household. We need to provide support for those who are being abused, make it clear to them that they're not making it up and that it really did happen. Make it clear that we believe them. And most importantly, show them that there is hope and a way out. In the case of children, that way out is by action on our parts. But even after they are out of the abusive environment, we ned to remain supportive and to help them draw on teh same strength that allowed them to survive the experience so that they may heal and move forward with their lives.

It's a stance we must take as a society. But I fear that too few people are interested in doing so.

[Siarlas]

It's just amazing. You have to fill out an application to get a job cleaning toilets. You have to get a license to go fishing. You have to have a permit to do certain construction on your house.

Yet any man and woman that are physically capable can have children, and, in my opinion, being parents is something that requires more HUMANITY and maturity than any of the above.

Pretty much what I'm going to say;

You need a licence to drive. You even need a licence to marry. But a licence is not needed for the most important job in the world.

[Flaire-FireStar]

This has been discussed in other threads, but I feel that people should go through training and be forced to get a license before they're able to reproduce.

It's crap like this that just reinforces my thoughts on the subject. How disgusting. And it will never stop until more people are educated and given more choices in reproduction and raising children.


I wish there were a thing like that..

(WORD!) :geez: For their own protection??

[Flutterby_whispers]

Oh my heart is so sad :( I have twin boys, they will be 3 on 9/22 ~ I just couldn't imagine .. I also have a 4.5 year old boy, the thought of keeping him caged all day made me cry for those two boys who were. They must've been so sad & scared being locked in there ~ I thank the gods they had each other at least ... They know better at that age which makes this even more upsetting to me.

:sadeyes:

[lovemy1dane]

How terribly sad! Those parents should be locked up like that and be treated the same way. I cannot imagine how you could treat your own child that way ( or any one else's for that matter.) And to think my kids scream abuse when they can't watch tv for 8 hours straight.

[VelvetBlade]

And to think my kids scream abuse when they can't watch tv for 8 hours straight.

Isn't that the truth! I told my son the other day that since he refused to clean his room, I refuse to allow him to use his computer, or his playstation or his tv or vcr. You would have thought I took away food and water...

~AW

[Kaylara]

Pretty much what I'm going to say;

You need a licence to drive. You even need a licence to marry. But a licence is not needed for the most important job in the world.
Well, I think at least part of the problem is that a lot people apparently don't want to be actual parents anymore... I heard the most disturbing thing on the radio yesterday... They were taking a poll on how excited parents were that they're kids were going back to school... One lady wrote in and said that it's too expensive to have them home in the summer, and they're annoying, and that she was very very excited to send them to someone else to take care of for 8 hours a day. She also said that their brains had turned to mush over the summer and the teachers were going to have a fun time fixing that... I mean wtf? Am I the only one who thinks this is a sick mentality? I mean... We shouldn't be expecting the Schools or the TV to teach our kids... We shouldn't be so wrapped up in our own lives that our children aren't part of them... HELLO? Am I nuts?

[Lunacie]

Hmmm **thoughtful frown**, did the parents admit to keeping the children in the cages for such long periods of time? It seems the neighbors knew about this and yet there was only one call to social services? And when the case worker visited the children were playing outside ~ does that mean the social worker didn't go inside the house and look around? Either this has been exaggerated by the media, or the parents aren't the only ones who failed these children. Poor little mites.

[Ravens_Tears]

The article says an adult older brother told an off-duty police officer about it and that's why they checked...:sadeyes:

[Sparrow]

Pretty much what I'm going to say;

You need a licence to drive. You even need a licence to marry. But a licence is not needed for the most important job in the world.

I dunno, there's still a lot of horrible drivers out there...and I don't think you should need a license to marry...

I guess I'm always curious as to exactly what would be on this test? Do mean a mental evalutaion? Quiz on the basics of childcare? I think taking prenatal classes that encompass caring for an infant are good, and there are a lot of social programs that help parents, maybe we should encourage more people to take advantage of those?

Like I said, no matter what you do, there's really no way to tell if someone's going to be a good parent or not. I've been shocked on both ends on that. I thought my cousin would be a good mother but she's horrible, to the point were I think she's abusive(of her 1 year old). Then again I went to school with a 16 year old who was very immature and pregnant(and being 16 doesn't necassarily make you immature any more than being 40 makes you mature, it depends more on what your life experience is). I thought she'd be a horrible mother. But then her son was born with a cleft lip and palette and hypodasia, and she snapped out of it and she's an amazing mother. She's changed drastically, and for the better.

I agree with the sentiment, but I think creating more/better social programs and having a good support system in place would work a lot better than just taking away a person's ability to have children.

[Marchosias]

The forced sterlizaion is a nice wishful thought, it's benice to make that monster go away, but I'd have to agree that it is a perilously small step from sanctioned geniside.


Actually, abortion is already legal.

But, ah, thats another subject.

[IvyCeltress]

Well I think one of the problem is that people have kids because they feel they are supposed to, rather than making a decison whether or not they'd be a good parent. IMO, when you have a kid, you make a promise to whatever god you worship and to the kids to raise them the best way possible, even if it means some sacrifice on your part.

I've pretty much decided not to have kids, because frankly, children do get on my nerves. I'm pretty sensitive to high pitched noises. However, me not liking kids doesn't mean I that I don't think that children are a gift and should be treasured.

[Gareth]

I've probably said this before. When my children were born, I realized something. I have to be a better person for them!
My children inspired me to be better.
I am by no means perfect. But I'm learning as they learn, growing as they do etc,etc.
But I made this choice, they were my wife I's choice. Not an inconvience. They will never be an inconvience.

[FeatherGoblinglimmer]

I was disgusted when i heard this story on the news.. How could anybody do that?? I too hugged my little girl when i heard this.

As too tests to see whether you'd make a fit parent, I think that this type of thing is totally wrong.Having children is a right to every human being surely. I am not saying that there aren't some right b*****ds out there, but we can't take away the right to parenthood without tests....How would you decide what would even be viable questions to ask on this type of test???

I have a little girl, as i have already mentioned. I am was a single mum.I now have a loving b/f. Me and the father split up b4 she was born. I didn't know I was pregnant till I went into labour. I told the father and his family about a month after the birth and they have hounded me from then on. They have called me a bad mum on occasions because I wasn't managing to keep my house tidy and it was a bit messy. Nothing that would harm anyone mind, Just surfaces a bit cluttered, or washing up that needed doing in the sink...Stuff like that.Surely a lot of being considered is merely opinion. The real bad stuff is obvious, but what about the stuff that is smaller, like what happened to me?? How would that be judged. I didn't think I was doing anything particularly wrong, my daughter was in no danger of being harmed in any way and i still got called a bad mum by these people who saw me briefly once a week when they come to pick my daughter up for there weekly day with her(they have her overnight).

[Proserpina]

ohhh that is so sad.:sadman:AND CRUEL!!!!:meanhead:

[Magick]

How HORRIBLE..My love goes out to those children and all children that are abused,treated like animals,and lead to believe they are worthless...

[SilentStarWolf]

This is absolutely digusting. :(

[Xentor]

Ouch indeed.

[Autumn]

That is sad that people do stuff like that...

how about we teach more develpemental psych with a big focus on child developement and how to teach a child to participate in society. We know so much, why not introduce this to teens? especially those not intending to go to college, it's certainly more useful to them then calculus, chemistry or physics.

[Ceallach]

I am sickened. Sending energy to children, with hopes that the scars both mental and physical are softened by love over time.