mason and templar history.

[zemblin]

mol wanted a thread on the masons and templars,and so did I.We have a masonic temple in this townand i always wondered about the masons and their history.Mom always told me it was a place for old men to hang out.I heard about there being some sort of templar rituals and shrines in there.

[Mairwen]

Not all Masons are men. There are women Masons ~ they're called Co-Masons.

[Revelation]

I have never in all my life heard of this Mairwen. Would you care to expound on that idea for us?

[Yvonne Belisle]

I found this perhaps it will help also there is a link at the end with more information if you would like to look.

Masons (Freemasonry)*
Christian or Anti-Christian?
Freemasonry refers to the principles, institutions, and practices of the fraternal order of the Free and Accepted Masons. The largest worldwide society, Freemasonry is an organization of men based on the "fatherhood of God and the brotherhood of man," using builders' tools as symbols to teach basic moral truths generally accepted by persons of good will. Their motto is "morality in which all men agree, that is, to be good men and true." It is religious in that a belief in a Supreme Being and in the immortality of the soul are the two prime requirements for membership, but it is nonsectarian in that no religious test is used.1 The purpose of Freemasonry is to enable men to meet in harmony, to promote friendship, and to be charitable. Its basic ideals are that all persons are the children of one God, that all persons are related to each other, and that the best way to worship God is to be of service to people.

Masons have no national headquarters as such, but the largest regional is the Scottish Rite Southern Jurisdiction (35 Southern states), which is headquartered in Alexandria, Virginia. U.S. membership is claimed at about three million, with about five million worldwide. The basic unit of Freemasonry is the lodge, which exists under a charter issued by a grand lodge exercising administrative powers. The lodges are linked together informally by a system of mutual recognition between lodges that meet the Masonic requirements. The lodge confers three degrees: Entered Apprentice, Fellow Craft, and Master Mason. Additional degrees are conferred by two groups of advanced Freemasonry: the York Rite, which awards 12 degrees; and the Scottish Rite, which awards 30 higher degrees. In the United States and Canada, members have formed a large number of groups to enable them to expand their social and charitable activities. The best known of these groups is the Shriners ("The Order Of the Mystic Shriners"), who hold festive parades and support hospitals for crippled and burned children. (To be a Shriner, one must be a 32nd degree Scottish Rite Mason, or its equivalent in the York Rite [Knights Templar]).

Although only men (of at least 21 years of age) can be Masons, related organizations are available for their relatives -- there is the Order of the Eastern Star for Master Masons and their wives; the Order of De Molay for boys; and the Order of Job's Daughters and the Order of Rainbow for young girls. The Masonic Lodge has more than a hundred such fraternal organizations, including Daughters of the Nile, The Tall Cedars of Lebanon, The Mystic Order of Veiled Prophets Of The Enchanted Realm, The Knights Of The Red Cross Of Constantine, and The Blue Lodge.

Though some Masons trace their organization's origin back to the beginning of time (much of their teaching is tied to Solomon's temple, but they also claim that John the Baptist and the Apostle John were Masons), modern Masonry dates only to 1717. It was in that year that four lodges in Great Britain formed the first Grand Lodge of England, which became the Premier Grand Lodge of the world. Since that time, lodges have spread all over the world with local grand lodges formed whenever enough lodges exist in an area. Lodges first appeared in America in Philadelphia (1730) and Boston (1733).

The terminology and symbolism of Masonry seem to come mostly from the actual craft of stonemasonry during the Middle Ages. The "free" in Masonry probably came from the "freestones" (stones that could be cut without splitting) that Mason's worked with. Stonemasons had three classifications for workers practicing their craft: Apprentice, Fellow Craft, and Master Mason. As mentioned earlier, this is also the terminology used for the first three degrees in Masonry today.

Many allegories and symbols are used in Masonry. Masonic writers often refer to an ancient definition of their ancient craft: "Freemasonry is a system of morality, veiled in allegory, and illustrated by symbols." But Freemason's symbols can be made to mean almost anything a person chooses to make them. Master Masons take an oath, "Ever to conceal, never to reveal."2

Masonry was originally a means by which people in the occult could practice their "craft" and still remain respectable citizens. The official magazine of Masonry in the U.S. is titled New Age. Some church denominations are also led by avowed Masons (e.g., a 1991 survey by the Southern Baptist Convention Sunday School Board found that 14% of SBC pastors and 18% of SBC deacon board chairs were Masons. It is also estimated that SBC members comprise 37% of total U.S. lodge membership.)


found at http://www.rapidnet.com/~jbeard/bdm/Cults/masons.htm

[Greenthumb]

That was very interesting. I knew some of the general stuff, but had no idea that they had special things set up for the ladies & children.

greenthumb

[Mairwen]

Originally posted by Revelation
I have never in all my life heard of this Mairwen. Would you care to expound on that idea for us?

Well, then you need to dig a little deeper, because there have been Co-Masons for centuries.

[Revelation]

Or, you could, as I requested, tell me what you know of the subject. Or do you not know, and are just passing on what you "heard" somewhere?

[Mairwen]

Not because of something I've "heard" ~ please do not put words into my mouth, okay? Thanks.

[MammaStar]

So, there not like the guys from the Simpsons then right? They don't sit around a long table singing. :p

[Lilu]

Well if you talk to my Uncle he'd say that they do sit around drinking ;) But that's not all there is to it. My Uncle has been in the Masonic Lodge for decades now, and a couple of years ago was the head of his lodge, it's rather interesting. Our debutante ball was hosted by the Masonic Lodge and the members all dressed in their masonic "uniform" and "presented" us to society. :D

My uncle says that there is a lot of stuff that goes on that is private, you aren't allowed to discuss outside of the lodge. The rituals etc. are not to be revealed to non-initiated. It used to drive my Aunt nuts!!!

But I've never heard of the co-masons Mairwen. Are they in Australia do you know? Perhaps it's only something in England, or America? I would be curious to hear anything you have to say about them.

Lilu

[Lilu]

Revelation, thought you might be interested in this link I found on Co-Masonry just now. Very interesting! Turns out there are branches in Australia, I'll have to tell my Aunt, she might find that very interesting!

http://www.luckymojo.com/comasonry.html

Lilu

[Revelation]

Not because of something I've "heard" ~ please do not put words into my mouth, okay? Thanks.

My apologies. Perhaps if you had put your own words there...

[Mairwen]

Originally posted by LdyStarlite
So, there not like the guys from the Simpsons then right? They don't sit around a long table singing. :p

Who keeps the metric system down?
We do! We do!

[Mairwen]

Originally posted by Revelation
My apologies. Perhaps if you had put your own words there...

My own words? I did use my own words. How can you say I didn't? :rolleyes:

[Revelation]

It was a joke, Mairwen. Ha ha. A sense of humor, woman, sheesh!

[Mairwen]

I do have a sense of humor. But not, however, when someone turns my own words against me and mangles my thoughts.

[cluny]

As a Mason's daughter, widow, mother and mother-in-law there is a lot of nonsense talked about masonary. The Order of the Eastern Star is the only womens "branch", in fact up until the last 10 years a women would not have been allowed inside the temple at any lodge. Personally I see nothing wrong with men doing their own "thing".I feel no urgent need to prove I am as good as a man I know I am and have always been treated as such by the men in my life. My husband ( who left this life 4 months ago much to my sorrow)was Master of his Lodge last year and I certainly shared that with him and all the enjoyment it brought him and no he was not an old man sitting around drinking, he was only 59 when he died. My son joined the Lodge when he was 18 as he is a Lewis ( a mason's son) so 18 is allowable. Masonary dates back to the Crusades and before so it is not something that has surfaced in the lsat few 100 years.
Cluny

[Mairwen]

According to my Craft's History, we had an Elder who was a Co-Mason in London, England, in 1792.

[Naillosotarrain]

I see that you are all headed back on topic. This is just a reminder.

There have been many wars fought throughout history however there will not be one here.

Thank you.

[Sunday's Child]

My father was a master mason in the Scottish Rite.Everything they did was very secretive so I don't know much..All his stuff is in the attic, maybe I should do some diggin.

[zemblin]

so are they kinda like christian or what?exactly what do they do and how do they relate to the templars?

[idusty88]

Originally posted by Mairwen

Who keeps the metric system down?
We do! We do!

For that you must be shackled to the 'Stone of Shame'!:D

[mol]

As far as women go...there is also the present day 'Eastern Star'.

[Revelation]

Bah somebody already mentioned that Mol, pay attention :p

[mol]

Originally posted by Revelation
Bah somebody already mentioned that Mol, pay attention :p

:p

I have to stop it with those mind-expanding drugs. :rolleyes:

:D

Sorry....carry on...

[mol]

So...what of the history of the Templars and DeMolay ? Anyone know the story?

[Sunday's Child]

I'm not sure what you want to know
I do know that in 1118, nine Christian Knights formed a fighting unit to patrol the Palestine roads and escort pilgrims on their journey. Leader was Hugh de Payens a Burgundian Knight
Jaques Demolay was a Grand Master who was burned at the stake on an island in the Seine River along with Guy de Charney
Seems the King of France,Philip IV was envious of the Templars wealth and treasures. France excuted all Templars who would not recant. Many escaped.. What else?
...

[cluny]

How about the theory that the Templars whilst on the Isle of Sicily were originally responsable for helping to form the Mafia ! Lots of evidence to back that one up. I do not think that anyone will ever sift the fact from the fiction as with a lot of early faiths, societies etc all were forced underground by the Inquisition so many records were lost and also at the time of the burning. There is however , no doubt, that the masons have ehld a huge influence over time and do to this day.
Curious to understand the post about back on track and war??????? mmmmmmmm
Julienne

[mol]

Originally posted by Sunday's Child
I'm not sure what you want to know
I do know that in 1118, nine Christian Knights formed a fighting unit to patrol the Palestine roads and escort pilgrims on their journey. Leader was Hugh de Payens a Burgundian Knight
Jaques Demolay was a Grand Master who was burned at the stake on an island in the Seine River along with Guy de Charney
Seems the King of France,Philip IV was envious of the Templars wealth and treasures. France excuted all Templars who would not recant. Many escaped.. What else?
...

I heard that DeMolay was actually killed because he would not give up the names of the other Templars....but was that the only reason he was killed?

[Sunday's Child]

For seven years DeMolay and the other knights suffered torture and inhuman conditions in the dungeons. Loyal to his friends and fellow knights, he refused to disclose of the funds of the Order and refused to betray his comrades. He was tried and his confession was forged. DeMolay disavowed his forged confession. Under the laws of the time dissavowment of a confession was punishable by death.. He was burned at the stake March 18, 1314.

[mol]

Originally posted by Sunday's Child
For seven years DeMolay and the other knights suffered torture and inhuman conditions in the dungeons. Loyal to his friends and fellow knights, he refused to disclose of the funds of the Order and refused to betray his comrades. He was tried and his confession was forged. DeMolay disavowed his forged confession. Under the laws of the time dissavowment of a confession was punishable by death.. He was burned at the stake March 18, 1314.

Thanks for the info. Any good reference on the net? Or books perhaps?

[Sunday's Child]

Sorry, I don't have any refrences, you might try Freemasons.com... sorry I don't know how to add a link in here.. I'm compute illit...

[Mythrel]

I realize this is a hard group to get info on, but does anyone have any idea about the Masons "secret" rituals?

[mol]

Well...if anyone wants a good reference on the Templars...I found a pretty good one.

http://www.tylwythteg.com/templar.html

[Sunday's Child]

Thank you, Mol.

[Mairwen]

FWIW, I take stuff posted on the YTT website with a grain of salt. After all, they DO proclaim that THEY are the ONLY TRUE Gwyddons. And they call themselves Witches to boot. Give me a break. Never met a Gwyddon anywhere what called himself a Witch. :bad: :bad:

[Sunday's Child]

But, you do perform magick, spells and rituals, right?

[Mairwen]

No.

[mol]

Originally posted by Mairwen
FWIW, I take stuff posted on the YTT website with a grain of salt. After all, they DO proclaim that THEY are the ONLY TRUE Gwyddons. And they call themselves Witches to boot. Give me a break. Never met a Gwyddon anywhere what called himself a Witch. :bad: :bad:

LOL. Sure you have, they are on the YTT website...

:p

[Sunday's Child]

Has anyone ever heard of the Druses? Lawrie in his History of Freemasonry, claims that the Templars inherited their knowledge from the Druses of Mount Lebanon.

[Mairwen]

Originally posted by mol
LOL. Sure you have, they are on the YTT website...
:p

They're liars and fakes. And I say that with kindness. :D

[cluny]

What information on rituals for freemasons do you want Mythral. Would be happy to help.

Freemasonary is surrounded by a lot of myth and huge amount of untruth

[Mythrel]

Cluny I was just curious to know what they do. Every time anything is brought up about the Masons the air of mystery is present and everything is kept in a secrective manner. What do I have to do to find out, join one of these temples to see what they do? I am just curious to find out why everything is kept in secret if they aren't doing anything wrong, why all the secrets and mysteries.
Mythrel

[mol]

Originally posted by Mairwen


They're liars and fakes. And I say that with kindness. :D

LOL. Well, they say the same about you and everyone else I guess...

[Mairwen]

Actually, they do say that about us. They say they're the ONLY TRUE Gwyddons ~ and they're not even Gwyddons! LMAO!
8O 8O 8O

[AnnaHawk]

jumping to Mairwen's defense is not what I usually have to do, but, YES, she is right here. :p :)
The oldest known Gwyddon name we have in our tradition's lineage was a PRIESTESS known as MEM (meant to be capitalized). She was a Free Mason as well (Not and Eastern Star, they didn't exist back then), and her moniker MEM was there to give us a clue as to which organization it was. The time period was the late 1700's. Can anyone find out which one it is ?:elf:

Don't feel too bad it you can't, I've even lost the referance in my volumious notes scattered everywhere. But the fact is that there are and were women as Masons. Rare, yes, but they do exist. Rare because of our patriarchial anti-woman society, and the Masons were a very powerful organization. Also, keep in mind that Masonic rules vary all over the world. The rules quoted earlier may have applied in one locality and Masonic branch but not in others.

AnnaHawk

[Mairwen]

Thanks! :D

[mol]

Originally posted by AnnaHawk
jumping to Mairwen's defense is not what I usually have to do, but, YES, she is right here. :p :)
The oldest known Gwyddon name we have in our tradition's lineage was a PRIESTESS known as MEM (meant to be capitalized). She was a Free Mason as well (Not and Eastern Star, they didn't exist back then), and her moniker MEM was there to give us a clue as to which organization it was. The time period was the late 1700's. Can anyone find out which one it is ?:elf:

Don't feel too bad it you can't, I've even lost the referance in my volumious notes scattered everywhere. But the fact is that there are and were women as Masons. Rare, yes, but they do exist. Rare because of our patriarchial anti-woman society, and the Masons were a very powerful organization. Also, keep in mind that Masonic rules vary all over the world. The rules quoted earlier may have applied in one locality and Masonic branch but not in others.

AnnaHawk

Thanks for the info Anna...

[Illuminatus]

My fraternity traces its ancestory back to masonic roots, taking a lot of our rituals from the ethics of the knights templar. We had to study their history, as well as a lot of british history and law as pledges.

I can tell you that some of our rituals reflect these themes heavily, while a great many do not. I wish I had been more sober the night of my initiation to remember it, since 70% of my fraternity's rituals involve mischeif and/or drinking.

Finally, as an Illuminatus Primi, I know the TRUE purpose of the masons, but I cannot divulge this to you, lest the eschaton be accidently immanetized before schedule. :) hail eris and all that jazz.

[story]

"Finally, as an Illuminatus Primi"
tell me where you're hiding jimi hendrix damn you !!!!!:crazy::uzi:

[mol]

Originally posted by Illuminatus
My fraternity traces its ancestory back to masonic roots, taking a lot of our rituals from the ethics of the knights templar. We had to study their history, as well as a lot of british history and law as pledges.


SO, how about a history lesson on the Templars, eh?

[Illuminatus]

Originally posted by mol


SO, how about a history lesson on the Templars, eh?

Hah, that was a long time ago, and I was very, very drunk! I'm lucky I remember the secret rituals, handshakes, keywords and passwords. Most of the templar stuff was just your basic textbook history, and high-handed ideals we had to memorize and recite.

Besides, all the really GOOD stuff I am sworn to secrecy about. Secret societies are like that...

[Krom]

Originally posted by Mythrel
Cluny I was just curious to know what they do. Every time anything is brought up about the Masons the air of mystery is present and everything is kept in a secrective manner. What do I have to do to find out, join one of these temples to see what they do? I am just curious to find out why everything is kept in secret if they aren't doing anything wrong, why all the secrets and mysteries.
Mythrel

There is no way that you will ever know what they/we do without going through the degrees. I am a 3*Master Mason in a Blue Lodge in California. I am also a Shiner. One no longer needs to be a member of the Scottish or York Rite in order to join the Shine. As a youth; I was a member of the Order of DeMolay and served as the leader of my Chapter.

As for the secrets; they are not secret because of wrong doing... they are just not for the non-initiated. That is kind of like saying that those of us in Traditional Wicca must be doing something wrong because we have secrets or oathbound material.

I am curious about the idea of the Priestess MEM.
I have never heard that there was a Free Mason that was a female. I think that it is kind of cool if it is true. The Co-Masons are not considered Free Masons and by some Masons they are not consider Masons at all (with me though its all good).:) I would be interested in finding out more info on that individual.

MP B*B
Krom

[mol]

Originally posted by Krom


There is no way that you will ever know what they/we do without going through the degrees. I am a 3*Master Mason in a Blue Lodge in California. I am also a Shiner. One no longer needs to be a member of the Scottish or York Rite in order to join the Shine. As a youth; I was a member of the Order of DeMolay and served as the leader of my Chapter.

As for the secrets; they are not secret because of wrong doing... they are just not for the non-initiated. That is kind of like saying that those of us in Traditional Wicca must be doing something wrong because we have secrets or oathbound material.

I am curious about the idea of the Priestess MEM.
I have never heard that there was a Free Mason that was a female. I think that it is kind of cool if it is true. The Co-Masons are not considered Free Masons and by some Masons they are not consider Masons at all (with me though its all good).:) I would be interested in finding out more info on that individual.

MP B*B
Krom

*nods*

That nod is from an old initiated DeMolay member. :) And I say lets revive this discussion.

[story]

well, i'm not sure i have too much to contribute, but I did just speak with a neighbor whose husband was a 32* mason. He was also a member of the shriners as well as, and this kind of surprised me, the eastern star.
She also mentioned that she was invited to join the masons, but declined because she didn't have the time.
Krom had mentioned that he had never heard of a woman mason before. Personally, neither have I, or a man who was a memebr of the eastern star. So I guess I have a couple questions:
1. is it that he held a high degree and was required to participate in the eastern star? She mentioned that there was a massive amount of responsibility that went along with his status.
2. Are the regulations pertaining to member ship somewhat up for modification by the local groups, or is it very centralized?
3. is it possiblke that they have recently opened the doors to women(like, in the last ten years or so?)
thanks

[Mairwen]

Originally posted by Krom
I am curious about the idea of the Priestess MEM. I have never heard that there was a Free Mason that was a female. I think that it is kind of cool if it is true. The Co-Masons are not considered Free Masons and by some Masons they are not consider Masons at all (with me though its all good).:) I would be interested in finding out more info on that individual.

So would we ...

But as has been stated, laws, rules and regulations seem to vary from location to location ~ as far as I've been able to find out. And this Lady was located in late 1700's England.

[mol]

Originally posted by story
well, i'm not sure i have too much to contribute, but I did just speak with a neighbor whose husband was a 32* mason. He was also a member of the shriners as well as, and this kind of surprised me, the eastern star.
She also mentioned that she was invited to join the masons, but declined because she didn't have the time.
Krom had mentioned that he had never heard of a woman mason before. Personally, neither have I, or a man who was a memebr of the eastern star. So I guess I have a couple questions:
1. is it that he held a high degree and was required to participate in the eastern star? She mentioned that there was a massive amount of responsibility that went along with his status.
2. Are the regulations pertaining to member ship somewhat up for modification by the local groups, or is it very centralized?
3. is it possiblke that they have recently opened the doors to women(like, in the last ten years or so?)
thanks

My uncle is a member of the Eastern Star. In fact, nowadays, he does more with them than the Masons.

[seawitch]

i am eastern star my father being mason and shriner and scottish rite to be eastern star you have to be a close female relitive of a mason it is seperate from masonery but all the male members are mason i was worthy matron in1993 of aroura chapter #3 in ketchikan we did mostly charity work look in on the sick and aged sisters did some fund raising there is a lot of memorizing while going through all the chairs it is a bit like wicca with the opening and closing of the chapter&,the iniation. some of it seceret like the handshake and words but all the ladies that i ever met were christian there was even a baptist minister and his wife in our chapter i was the only witch that i know of and only 3 of us ladies were under 60 i have not attended since moving up here 5 years ago from ketchikan
my dad said he'd tell me some of the seceret stuff but they would bury him at low tide and cut his throat from ear to ear and a bunch of other stuff
i've never heard of a female mason but i am sure it could be have to do some reading
blessings

[mol]

Ack!

Where is the punctuation?

Thanks for the post. I think that my uncle was Worthy Patron and my aunt was Worthy Matron in their ES chapter.

[seawitch]

or spell very well sorry

[Xander67]

I am A FreeMason of Pennsylvainia,
according to Masonic Law, No Mason is to take part or allow the raiseing of a woman to be a Mason...

alot of people view this as sexist or discriminatory...
I myself have mixed views, however
Women play a very important part in Masonic History and Masonry today...
and there are Masonic organisations for women,
rainbow girls and Job's daughters are youth organizations for women and De Molay for boys...

Eastern star is an order for men and women...

there are alot of good women in history behind masons of note,
Madame Lefay(think that is spelled right) made George Washington's Masonic Apron, which is on display at the masonic temple in Pennsylvainia

women are very active in masonry, in some areas
there are certain organisations for women which men arent admitted but we are involved and support with our finances and hearts....

I feel it is healthy for men to gather together and fellowship and I feel it is healthy for women to gather together and fellowship...

it helps us respect each other....
and a Mason will glady give if it is within his power , to help the widow, and the fatherless

I am somewhat new to Masonry, but that is how I see it

[Xander67]

there are alot of false rumors about masonry
there are a few excellent online videos
at

http://www.pagrandlodge.org/programs/masedu/tool.html

titled tools of the craft

this is an excellent treatise on what masonry is all about
and a piece on "secrecy" they tell it like it is

also there are a few other good videos about masonry and the youth orgs at
http://www.pagrandlodge.com/videos/index.html

and I will reafirm here that no-one knows better about masons than masons, and they will answer any of your questions

if anyone tells you something about masonry that is not a mason,
you have to consider the source....

would you go to a baker when you need a buthcher??

GO TO THE SOURCE! and find out for yourself!
dont let the lies of people who have never even seen the inside of a masonic temple affect your opinion of one of the most wondeful organizations on earth! after all, thnk about it? the declaration of independance was drafted in a masonic lodge ..

[witchywench]

The templars or is it masons(?) believe that the 'Holy Grail' (the vessel that held Christ's blood) was a pregnant woman not a chalice or whatever, this woman was Mary Magdalain (sp) who came to Europe with Joseph of Arramathea (sp) and there leader is (they believe) decended from her. The father of the child was suppose to be Jesus!

The first leaders skull is honoured and secretly kept!

Sorry about spellings I'm sleepy.

Can't remember more, long time since did my B.A. in History!

Will try to find more info!

But then Xander's right go to the source, probably all myth!

[charmedkisses1]

Is there a 33rd degree? What;s the highest you can get?

[charmedkisses1]

The templars or is it masons(?) believe that the 'Holy Grail' (the vessel that held Christ's blood) was a pregnant woman not a chalice or whatever, this woman was Mary Magdalain (sp) who came to Europe with Joseph of Arramathea (sp) and there leader is (they believe) decended from her. The father of the child was suppose to be Jesus!

But then Xander's right go to the source, probably all myth!
thanks
If that's true, how did the disciples drink it. Ick.

[charmedkisses1]

I am A FreeMason of Pennsylvainia,
according to Masonic Law, No Mason is to take part or allow the raiseing of a woman to be a Mason...

alot of people view this as sexist or discriminatory...
I myself have mixed views, however
Women play a very important part in Masonic History and Masonry today...
and there are Masonic organisations for women,
rainbow girls and Job's daughters are youth organizations for women and De Molay for boys...

Eastern star is an order for men and women...

women are very active in masonry, in some areas
there are certain organisations for women which men arent admitted but we are involved and support with our finances and hearts....

it helps us respect each other....
and a Mason will glady give if it is within his power , to help the widow, and the fatherless

I am somewhat new to Masonry, but that is how I see it
That's almost like the Christian church. People think the Christian church is sexist too, but they don't know how much more the women do than meets the eye.

[Flutterby_whispers]

I admittedly don't know a lot about Masonry however whenever it's being spoken about I'm always interested in reading and or listening to what others have to say. My grandfather and as far back as my father can remeber were all Masons and very heavily invovled. As were all the women including his wife, my grandmother, they were apart of the Eastern Star. Most of my aunts are still alive and active, however both my grandparents have passed on, long before I was even born, which is such a pitty I really would of enjoyed getting to know them.

My father was never interested in it and around the age of 16 became LDS, he's since reined a terror on our family for nearly 30yrs due to abuse and has just recently been ex-communicated from the Church, so I am curious where he goes with this. When I've asked him about his father and what he knew of his activity w/in Masonry he said he didn't know much as he stayed away from it, but he did say that there was a lot of memorization, he said that he'd lock himself in his room for hours, days, memorizing things but shared none of it. And that he was a of an unusually high degree due to his dedication and involvement, which I don't understand, but I assume it was a good thing that he was so dedicated. He, my father, also mentioned that he was invited to become a Mason but both him and his brother declined and became LDS, however the 3rd brother I'm not sure if he ever became invovled. My dad did say that if he were to of joined all of his schooling would of been paid for and that he would of been taken care of.

Anyhow, I've not looked into it much. I have had invitations from my aunts to go visit them in Chicago and learn of it but I've yet to make it down there and now being a mom not sure if I ever will. I do think that it's possible to learn the basics of this society, but to truly understand and know it I imagine you would have to be apart of it in order to accomplish that.

[RogueEcho]

The templars or is it masons(?) believe that the 'Holy Grail' (the vessel that held Christ's blood) was a pregnant woman not a chalice or whatever, this woman was Mary Magdalain (sp) who came to Europe with Joseph of Arramathea (sp) and there leader is (they believe) decended from her. The father of the child was suppose to be Jesus!


Some people believe (like me) that the san'greal was, in fact, the children borne by Mary Magdalen to Jesus of Nazereth. It is merely theoretical that the Templars or others believed this as well -- although popular novels such as The DaVinci Code and others would have you believe it to be truth. In actuality, we still don't know.

[misschief]

not saying it's wrong... but i've never heard of co-masons either... the eastern star is the only thing i've ever known to include women... and as far as i understand they have to be related to a mason to be a member *shrug*

the whole thing is very interesting tho.. i just got done with a book about the eastern star and its links to other groups... they really have deep roots in society.

[misschief]

Is there a 33rd degree? What;s the highest you can get?

i know that there is a 33rd degree level.. but i dont know if there are any higher... probably tho.

[misschief]

ok.. i did some checking into it. apparently the 33rd degree is the highest and it is for only a select few. i'm not a mason... but the info i found stated that.

[Ben Trismegistus]

ok.. i did some checking into it. apparently the 33rd degree is the highest and it is for only a select few. i'm not a mason... but the info i found stated that.
The 33rd degree is an honorary degree, conferred to a member of Scottish Rite Masonry for exceptional service. 32nd is the highest degree you can earn simply by progressing through the degrees.

In Blue Lodge Masonry (the most common form of Freemasonry, and the kind upon which both Scottish and York Rite Masonry is based) only has 3 degrees: Entered Apprentice, Fellowcraft, and Master Mason. All Scottish Rite and York Rite Masons must first receive the three degrees of Blue Lodge Masonry before getting any Scottish or York Rite degrees.

And FYI, the link between the templars and the Freemasons, much like the link between Wicca and ancient hereditary pagan practices, is made up primarily of a lot of attractive mythology and the borrowing of a lot of symbols and practices.

[misschief]

yes... since the first post i have read some books and things.. although i'm sure they dont give too much accurate info., i have learned alot more about it than i knew in the first place. :)

[Shatril]

If you want a first hand account of what goes on in the Free Mason's Temples read
The Hiram Key (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/1931412758/qid=1087665953/sr=ka-1/ref=pd_ka_1/102-4424549-8146514) They explain lots of stuff and describe the rituals and the words used. The only thing that was not discussed were the secret hand shakes and words of greeting. This book began as a look at the history of Free Masonry, but actually folds over into ancient Egypt and the Templars. It give a detailed account of Jacques de Molay's arrest and gruesome details of it. It is quite interesting. I have to say that some of this is somewhat speculative, but you will know when they move into the speculation. I enjoyed finding all the connections between Free Masonry and Paganism, ritual, Christianity and the connections between all of them.