Green Witchcraft?

[abbyseyes]

Hi everyone. This is my first post here - this is a really great site.

I read in another post that someone had chosen to follow a path of Green Witchcraft because less "ritual" suited them better.
What is the difference between Wicca and Green Witchcraft?

[MistOfTheSea86]

it is just a different form of magick, which is a part of wicca.

[Myst]

Actually it's not Wicca at all :)

A person who practices Green Witchcraft usually is interested in herbs, recipes and kitchen magick, faeries, divination, and simple kitchen spells. They normally understand and appreciate the necessity of "dark" energy. It's not a ceremonial path and celebrating a Sabbat can be as simple as picking herbs at Midsummer. A spell can be as simple as turning a broom upside down or stirring some herbs into the stew pot, or even just planing an herb on a special night. :)

[MistOfTheSea86]

It could be a byproduct hence the name Witchcraft. ANd we all know that that Wicca=Witchcraft, so it being just another form of wicca is not completely not understandable. And wiccans also know the necessity of the Dark. That is one of the goals of a Wiccan. To understand the mysterious, to balance themelves between light and dark.

It could also be called a hedge-witch. Or this person that she speaks of could be more interested in traditional Witchcraft and not Wicca.:)

[loopy]

Actually, Mist, I'm fairly certain there are many views on the Wicca=witchcraft thing, and that a lot of people believe them to be separate. Correct me, anyone, if I'm wrong. :)

Willow Raven-- would you be able to direct me to a particularly good website about Green Witchcraft? It sounds like what I might be looking for. :)

[MistOfTheSea86]

From what I have read and seen Wicca=Witchcraft, but I could be wrong. Like I said the person could probably be interested more in traditional Witchcraft then Wicca. Of course I can be wrong.

[loopy]

Hmm, I searched MW, and I found two topics relevant,
http://www.mysticwicks.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=4000&highlight=wicca+witchcraft

and

http://www.mysticwicks.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=1722&highlight=wicca+witchcraft

I'm not saying you're wrong at all, I just think it's one of those topics where there are no CLEAR, be-all-and-end-all answers. :D But we are getting off topic, so... :D:D

Green Witchcraft, yay! Tell me more, tell me more, (Didja get very far?) Excuse the Grease reference please. :D:D

[Faery-Wings]

Argh! I just had this whole thing typed up and I lost it! :mad:
Oh well. Lucky you, this will be shorter than the last post I just lost LOL.

Here goes again:
When I first stared out , I was studying Wicca. The more I read and learned, the more uneasy I felt about it being the right way for me. I had read a little about Kitchen Witches and Green or hedge witches and that seemd to click within me. I talked a bit to Wildchild and Spirahl (thanks again ladies!!! You both helped sooo much:D) and they helped me confirm my feelings towards this. My Goddesses are Hestia and Demeter who chose me several months ago (and I *still* cannot believe that :eek: :) ) and they obviously fit in perfectly to my path. I am a very simple, down to earth, get to the basics kind of person. I believe that the Divine is everywhere and accessible at any time. I didn't feel like a circle was necessary and I feel closest to my Goddesses either outside in my garden or at the lake or in my kitchen. Weird how that works out!

Some books I have read are Green Witchcraft, by Ann Moira (sp) She also has a Volume 2 and 3 in that series and I can't wait to get the $$ to buy them, Magical Household by Cunningham, A Kitchen Witches Cookbook and A Victorian Grimoire, by Patricia Telesco, in addition to all of my Wicca 101's. Oh and I am taking an online course in herbal medicines, and have several herbals too. Whew!
I have found a few websites, take them for what they are worth, some are better than others:

Kitchen Witch:

http://hometown.aol.com/mia726/myhomepage/cooking.html
http://www.celestialtides.com/Coven/bos/kitchen.html
http://www.geocities.com/hearthwytche/index.html
http://members.tripod.com/hearthwitch/
http://catdeville.home.mindspring.com/kitchenwitch.htm
http://gypsygrl65.tripod.com/thecottagemaymidsummer2001issue/
http://members.tripod.com/~WitchesSanctuary/kitchen.htm

Hedgewitch:

http://www.angelfire.com/folk/greenwitch/index.html

http://community-2.webtv.net/page001/TheHedge/

http://www.cros.net/soraya/path.htm

If anyone has found any others, please send 'em along!

If anyone wants to talkmore about Green witchcraft to another newbie, feel free to pm me.

Wow, this one got long too. Whoops!
BB!
Chris

[Faery-Wings]

Oh and I forgot to say welcome!!!!!!!

Help yourself to the lemonade and goodies on the Porch!

Chris;)

[loopy]

Thanks chryssi! I'm gonna check those out as soon as I'm awake enough to understand them, lol. :D:D

[Spirahl]

WillowRaven and Chrissi1 have said most for me. I would just like to reitterate that GreenWitchcraft is not the same as Wicca. The ritual and higher magic that Gardner incorporated into Wicca is just not me somehow. As I once explained to Chrissi, I like to do things in the way that a pagan peasant woman, long before Wicca was developed, would have likely done. I will never know exactly what those peasant women did, but my interpretation does not resemble Wicca. My focus is on herbs, charms, divination, offerings, and prayers. My focus is not on ritual or spells. Wicca does include these things, but there is much of Wicca that I exclude. Does that make sense?

[Draedon]

The word Wicca was coined by Gerald Gardner from the Old English word for Witch, which derives from the same etymological source as Gnostic, so both Witchcraft an Wicca, etymologically speaking, are the same, meaning 'One who knows' or 'One who concerns himself or herself with the hidden wisdom'.

[loopy]

Hmm.. I didn't have much luck with the websites. Maybe I'm not awake enough, lol.

If I asked some questions here, could you generous, loverly, amazing Green Witches give some spectacularly brilliant insight? :D (And naw, that was not desperate sucking up) :D:D:D

Q1: What is the difference between a hedgewitch and a kitchen witch? Or are they the same? Do they both make up green witchcraft, or can/should you follow them separately?

Q2: Does aromatherapy go hand-in-hand with the herbery (is that a word?) :D

Thanks in advance. :D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D

[Emerald Sky]

Thanks to all of you for the info and wisdom. Chris - thanks!!! for the sites. I'm off to check them out now. :) [skips away whistling...]

[Spirahl]

Dradeon, I understand what you mean, however Gardner used the word Wicca to mean more than witch. He used it to name his religion. I am a witch, but I do not have the same beliefs as one who follows Wiccan dogma and religious structure. I don't subscribe to any religion at all. There are many traditions of witchcraft that predate Wicca: Stregheria, Voudon, are examples. Often there are similarities, often there are differences.

Loopy, I would see aromatherapy as part of herbcraft. As for your other question, I've never looked into it, but I use the terms interchangably. I also use Cottage Witch.

[MistOfTheSea86]

Like I said a million times, you probably follow Traditional Witchcraft, and Wicca. Cause as we all know, those are two seperate things. Hope that makes sense8O

[Faery-Wings]

Originally posted by loopy
Hmm.. I didn't have much luck with the websites. Maybe I'm not awake enough, lol.

If I asked some questions here, could you generous, loverly, amazing Green Witches give some spectacularly brilliant insight? :D (And naw, that was not desperate sucking up) :D:D:D

Q1: What is the difference between a hedgewitch and a kitchen witch? Or are they the same? Do they both make up green witchcraft, or can/should you follow them separately?

Q2: Does aromatherapy go hand-in-hand with the herbery (is that a word?) :D

Thanks in advance. :D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D

Hmm, you weren't able to see the websites? The links didn't work? Odd, they worked for me, did they work for you, Emerald?

To your first question, and this is entirely the way *I* see it... I see the Green/hedge witch part more for outside. The gardening, the faeries, the close contact with nature in all its forms. It is also the use of herbs for medicines and magick. The kitchen part is more inside- the way I cook and keep house. I feel that both parts work togther perfectly. To me, they both make up Green Witchcraft. But I am sure there are some Green witches that hate to cook! :) As with any path, I think how you see to make it work for you is your right way.

Second question: I see aromatherapy as completely part of herb uses. I am a certified aromatherapist from the Pacific Institute of AT. I took a correspondance course of their's a few years ago (man, it was tough!) . Now I am starting to combine my knowlege of herbs and oils together. And I am sure I will be using both of them in my formulas and magick as well.

Can I tell you how happy I am that all of my interests and beliefs are finally fitting all in together? :) I hope that you find all of yours doing the same too.

BB

Chris

[Myst]

Loopy, you could consider kitchen witch + hedge witch = green witch. Some also consider a hedge witch as "someone who walks the hedge between the worlds". I read that somewhere and I'm afraid I can't remember what it meant, but I think it has something to do with a hedge witch spending more time on various planes then on the physical one (ie. meditating a lot and spending a lot of time between the worlds, etc.), and thus being closer to a Shaman. Like I said tho, I don't really remember.

Aromatherapy would definitely be part of working with herbs, I think! Another good word for "herb magick" (ie. other then "herbery") is wortcunning, which comes from the wort which means herb and cunning for well... cunning... as in cleverness. :)

As far as Wicca vs Witch .. well read Spirahl's post -Spirahl's got it nailed.

Chryssi, I totally agree with you, and Ann Moura's series, Green Witchcraft, is my FAVOURITE! I have all three books and I'm always referring to and rereading them. I've also seen the victorian grimoire and hey maybe I'll pick that up too!

Mist, yup you could also call this "traditional" Witchcraft, because it's what probably was practiced in the cottages of our ancestors; in their own homes and kitchens centuries ago... :)

[Myst]

Oh btw I found some of those websites very useful and also very beautiful. Thanks Chryssi! They worked fine here (so far)!

I'm working on a website myself for Green Witchcraft - ie. correspondences, wortcunning, faerie magick, divination, animal magick, dragon magick, nature stuff, personal articles, and so on. It's currently very under development but can be found at www.willowraven.com . I hope no one thinks I was trying to spam, I was just thinking someone might find the site interesting or have some input about it... :elf:

[Lavender]

Considering all the interest in Greenwitchery, I think we could learn a lot from each other. I wouldn't mind seeing the questions & answers here.

[Spirahl]

I agree. GreenWitchcraft could be seen as a form of traditional craft, rather than of Wicca.

[Myst]

Ok.. I bit the bullet... Finally I couldn't stand having a copy of Green Witchcraft - Folk Magic, Fairy Lore, & Herb Craft (the first in her Green Witchcraft series) by Ann Moura in my library. I lent it to a friend weeks ago and she hasn't returned it yet - she says she's too busy to read it yet she's reading the Harry Potter series, agh!

Anyways I went out and bought myself a new copy. I justify it by saying my first copy was a little beat up anyway, hehe :) I also picked up A Victorian Grimoire by Patricia Telesco... lots of reading to do (I'm still not halfway through the Witchcraft book by Ly de Angeles) ! :) Good thing I love reading...

[loopy]

Thanks for all the information, guys. :D chryssi-- my browser was a bit funky before. I'll try the sites again.

My cat is playing with my computer mouse. Hee.

Some more questions: Would you say Green Witchcraft is pretty open to variations, like say if you wanted to perform a ritual or spellwork for a month or so, would that be "acceptable"? Or would you say spellwork is not part of Green Witchcraft at all?

Chryssi-- you took a correspondance course in aromatherapy? Cool! I was just looking into that a few weeks ago. How long does it take to complete?

[Lavender]

Originally posted by loopy
Would you say Green Witchcraft is pretty open to variations, like say if you wanted to perform a ritual or spellwork for a month or so, would that be "acceptable"? Or would you say spellwork is not part of Green Witchcraft at all?

Yes, there are so many variations. It depends a lot on you. Even the names used varies as well...kitchen witch, hedge witch, green witch, wisewoman, cottage witch, etc. In the end, they're just names. You use what you're comfortable with. For me, it's herbal craft. But doesn't mean that I don't use candle magics or other types of magic. They're all intertwined together. Each aspect compliments each other to achieve your goals.

[Kiya]

...is that there are no set rules or dogma here. I wouldn't really know WHAT to class myself as, but I'm certainly leaning towards Green Witchcraft. I'm at my happiest in a kitchen or garden, and I've used herbs in my cooking for years.

When I started looking at the correspondences for herbs and oils, a lot of these made sense, because I already 'knew' some of them just by cooking with them.

I don't tend to be interested in formal ritual, it's just not me, but I am interested in spellcraft - I'm just quite practical, and I won't cast a spell unless I can't find another solution!

I like the idea of a hedgewitch walking the 'hedge between the worlds' - I'm meditating daily and I'm finding that with (a lot of!) practice I am starting to be able to move to different levels of conciousness much easier, so maybe I'm leaning that way as well!

I'd be interested in talking about growing herbs too - I haven't had much practice (only just got back into a house with a garden!) so perhaps I should start a new thread?

I'm babbling here!

Another link for you: www.open-sesame.com which is Eileen Holland's site - lots of herb correspondances, and it's all listed alphabetically.

[Dria El]

Originally posted by abbyseyes
Hi everyone. This is my first post here - this is a really great site.

I read in another post that someone had chosen to follow a path of Green Witchcraft because less "ritual" suited them better.
What is the difference between Wicca and Green Witchcraft?

Welcome to Mystic Wicks abbyseyes!!! Glad to have you with us!

:)

[Faery-Wings]

WillowRaven, congrats on the "new" book and the Grimoire. You can't keep me out of a bookstore either :) What is the book by Ly de Angeles about? Now, don't answer me "witchcraft" ~ I got that much from the title! :D:D:D:D:D

Loopy, the course I took was from PIA *running off to get info*

*back and out of breath :)*

It is 6 lessons:
1. Essential oils
2. Structure and Energy
3. Treatment of disease
4. Cosmetology
5. Psycology of fragrance
6. Toxicology

It was very in depth on the chemistry of the oils- what compounds are found in each oil and who they react with each other and physiologically.

I took this in 95 and it was $320 and $45 for the test. You go through the lessons on your own, request a test when you are ready and then you have 14 days to complete the test.
PIA's contact info
PO Box 6723
San Rafael CA 94903
Phone: 415 479 9121
Fax: 415 479 0119

This info is from a few years back but I am still getting newsletters form them so i know they are still around. If you have any other questions or want to know more, just ask away! Or we could start another thred in the Green Room if that is better.

BB

Chris

[loopy]

Wow, thanks chryssi! :D I don't think I can take the course for a while (I need money, and to catch up on schoolwork), but thank you very very much! ::runs to scribble down address, realizes she's sitting in front of a keyboard, and opens a new Notepad::

[Myst]

Witchcraft Theory & Practice by Ly de Angeles... has basic intro witchcraft info and stuff about meditation techniques, familiars, glamouries, fith-fathing, fetches, shape shifting, sigils, warding and banishing, Qabballah, tarot, dream walking, astral projection, etc....

I think one of the biggest parts of Green Witchcraft is that it is so flexible. It's like celebrating the sabbats - some of us still have a huge party and some of us just sit and watch the sun rise for Lughnassah.

Hey this topic is fascinating :)

[Lavender]

Chris, that would be good to get a discussion on aromatherapy in the Green Room.

Kiya, there's lots of info on starting your garden & what everyone's fav herbs are in the Green Room as well.

(gentle nudge for the Green Room here! :D )

[loopy]

What's a glamoury?

I'm cleaning out the refrigerator later to get my mom to pay for Ann Moura's first book for me. See what you people have done? :p

[Scorpio]

Originally posted by chryssi1


I am a certified aromatherapist from the Pacific Institute of AT. I took a correspondance course of their's a few years ago (man, it was tough!)
BB

Chris



Is a correspondance course a course from home? I live in R.I and we have nothing like that around here. I would love to be certified in these kinds of studies. I would love to be a lisenced refloxologist, but the closest school I found to me was in Colorado! Any info would be great. Im going to post a thread about this as well.

[Myst]

I wouldn't say glamouries are OT, they can be considered part of green witchcraft. You can think it in a way as enchantment or bewitchment - wherein you work to change your appearance in some way. While it can be misused and thus a harmful thing (ie. someone making themselves look more beautiful and rich to fool people through magick) it can be positive - you can use it for protection, for example, by glamouring yourself a spikey armour suit or making yourself look tougher. Its an interesting type of magick.

I presume that this is where the belief that you can change your eye or hair colour comes from in movies. While technically some "real" practitioners of Witchcraft claim they can do that, I have to wonder. I have a feeling that kind of stage magick wouldn't work too well just because I can't see a valid use for it beyond showing off... :)

[loopy]

So it's really changing the image you project to people, not your physical one, then? Nifty. And yay me, I didn't go off topic. :D

Scorpio-- correspondance courses are from home. :)

[Spirahl]

There's been times that I've forgotten to buckle my seatbelt and didn't realize until I've seen a police officer. Then I project the image that I am wearing it. Aren't I evil?:bad: :D
I project the image of being someone very strong and confident on occasions when my shyness is causing a problem. This is a visualization technique really.

[Myst]

loopy : yup that's about it

Spirahl : yup, definitely a visualization technique. very useful in certain situations like those you've mentioned, and also can be quite simple and easy to use.

[abbyseyes]

Wow! Thanks to everyone! There is so much information available - it's overwhelming sometimes. And so many books, it's hard to know which books are "real" and which were only written to make a dollar. I'm definately hitting eBay and half.com today to find the ones everyone suggested. For now, I think "green" probably suits me a little better. I spent a very long 8 years in Catholic School (b/c quality of education was excellent) but I'm not & never was Catholic. - anyway, 8 yrs of it being shoved down my throat on a daily basis is, well let's just say I still balk at any time of repetitive "ritual" anything. Don't get me wrong- I respect Catholicism & any other faith, it's just not for me.

I can't help myself -LOL I have a couple more questions... Is animal magick a seperate magick than green? or does it sort of fall under green? Can someone give me an overview of it?

Thanks again for all the great suggestions and answers. I can't wait to get those books, and check out the websites!

[abbyseyes]

Oh, and where do y'all (yes, I'm a Texan-lol) get those beautiful little pics under your usernames?

[MistOfTheSea86]

YOu will love it here! IT is a great place, so grab a comphy chair couch thingie and discuss everything and don't be afraid to ask anything!

Those little pics are called avatars and all you need to do to get one is go to your profile page on the top of the screen, then click on edit options. Then scroll down the page, and click on the thing called change Avatar. If you want to see a list of all the wonderful avatars in store here then click on more info under the word avatar. You can also choose your own, scroll down the screen and click on browse then find a picture that is small enough to fit, then you have your own avatar. hope this helps. I don't know what the size can be but to see it's limits look aty Tanna's picture it is pretty big, and for more info. On avatars contact Mol.:D Hope you don't mind me suggestin ya mol.

[Dria El]

Or you can go to a thread in the 'Just Talk' forum called 'Avatar Store' and check out some of those. I'm overdue for a new addition so if you don't see anything you like you can wait for the next addition or pm me and let me know what you'd like and I'll see if I have it or can make it.

[Myst]

Animal magick could probably be considered part of green witchcraft just because green witchcraft is so based on nature. Then again, it's not a real structured religion anyway, so if you want to include animal magick go ahead..

[Lavender]

Ann Moura's Green Witchcraft series are very informative but I found them very ritualistic. Great source of info, though. As the author had suggested, these are just guidelines...you need to develope your own style. Green Magic by Leslie Gordon, A Druid's Herbal by Ellen Evert Hopman, Medicine Grove: A Shamanic Herbal by Loren Curden, and (if you can find it) Earth Magic by Claire Nahmad. Just to list a few good sources.

[loopy]

At bn.com, Earth Magic ships within 24 hours. :)

[Spirahl]

Wildchild, you have a point about the ritual in Ann Moira's "Green Witchcraft". It is more ritualized that what I personally practice. What I loved about the book, is the mood, the attitude, I don't know if I can find the correct word...but it was the first thing that I read that came close to the feelings that I had about having a green focus. Would you ladies think that Trish Telesco has a more casual approach? I only have one of her books, do enjoy it, was wondering about acquiring more.
Abbeyseyes, it's nice to meet you!:)

[Myst]

I just got her "A Victorian Grimoire". So far it has been all symbolism and history which I'm not into, but I'm sure once I get further I will find some interesting info.

And I agree with you on the "feeling" you get in the Green Witchcraft series. They do carry that earthy green ambience. As far as the rituals; they seem to be a little more structured then I'd like, but I do like performing rituals when I can..

[Lavender]

You are right. Ann Moira's books do give off that kind of feeling. It was a very comfortable feeling...like coming home. :)

Patricia Telesco's books are good too...I forgot to mention her earlier. She has a older one called "Herbal Arts". Great if you're interested in folklore & historical uses of herbs. Although, be careful of some of her recipes in the beginning of the book. I think the recipes are given from an historical standpoint. I'm fortunate enough to find most of her books in our local library.

[Myst]

When I have friends look over my library they are always drawn to this series. Without fail one pulls out a book from the series and flips through it. Recently, as I've mentioned, I leant the first book out to someone. Since then I had been dying to read it again. Just seeing a book from the series seems to remind me of my faith and the principles behind it. I finally had to go out and by another copy which I'm reading (again) as we speak :)

I wrote a review of the first book for the MW newsletter and if it gets accepted I hope you will find it interesting in the next issue! :)

[Spirahl]

That's great about the book review. It's so great to know that others have the same feelings and experiences. Although I knew I was on the right path, it still makes me more confident in that somehow.
I have Trish Telesco's "Dancing With Devas- Connecting with the Spirits and Elements of Nature". It is mostly practical info, just one or two rituals. And i love the titles of the other books, "Kitchen Witch's Cookbook", "Goddess in my Pocket", "The Urban Pagan"...they sound so blissfully casual.

[Myst]

Reminds me of one I have called The Goddess in the Office by Z Budapest. Basically just ideas, meditations, and rituals for each day that help you tap into your inner wild woman and connect her to each day at work. Kinda neat.

I'm thinking of picking up Kitchen Witch's Cookbook or another Pagan cookbook when I next visit the bookstore so I can get some ideas for some new dishes to try. Right now for us it's chicken nuggets one night, hotdogs the next, and sometimes even chicken breast or pork chop but that's about it... we're in a cooking rut :) And hey what's wrong with trying something different and working a bit of magick at the same time.

[Spirahl]

Did you ever see the movie "Like Water For Chocolate"? The reactions everyone had to the chicken with rose sauce? Now she was a KitchenWitch Extraordinaire!;)

[loopy]

Is there anything you guys feel would NOT be connected to Green magic in any way, shape, or form?

[BrigitCayenne]

i guess u coould say that green withcraft is a little less complicated

[Spirahl]

Another link, the site is under construction, but promising.
http://www.io.com/%7Emirya/index.htm
Loopy, I don't know about others, but I do make a distinction between between "lower" and "higher" magic(k). Personally, I dislike these terms as they make one sound more powerful, more valid, but this is what they are known as. I tend to stay away from the "higher" magic, it doesn't work *for me* as well. Gardner incorporated elements of higher magic into Wicca, this being why Wicca does not suit me. I like to dig and get my hands dirty!:D

[Myst]

Things I would not consider to be part of green witchcraft include ceremonial magick or the qaballah. I can't imagine this kind of craft being practiced in a strict coven setting either (although green witches might occasionally join circles or groves to participate). Then again its pretty personal so who knows.

I think that a green witch concentrates on wortcunning, kitchen witchery, possibly hedge witchery (astral travel, dream walking, and the like), divination (crystal balls, tarot cards, and the like), faerie magick, healing magick, glamouring, meditation (even if she meditates by harvesting herbs from her garden), and often works with a familiar, probably celebrates the Sabbats quietly most often (even if only by harvesting herbs or fruits or preparing Sabbat-related foods). He or she would not feel the need to perform complicated rituals with complicated tools to reach his or her deities by performing "high" magick. Oh I also think he or she would understand the belief that "a witch that can't hex, can't heal" and have no problem protecting him or herself.


All IMHO :)

[loopy]

Thank you for your answers. :) Can I say that I'm loving this topic. :D

What's a hex? M-W.com says "to practice witchcraft" or something to do with evil, etc, but I'm guessing you mean something else.

Just to warn you all, I'm strictly adhering to the "the only stupid questions are ones that aren't asked" policy here. If only to make myself feel better. :D:D 8O

[Myst]

I totally agree with that thinking loopy - ask anything, we're all friends here right! I hope I can feel just the same when I have strange questions :)

A hex can be likened to a curse or some other magick to "harm" someone. Now the jury is out on how "right" this is for a witch to do. Some (staunch followers of the Rede) say harming anyone for any reason is bad! Others say you can harm others only to protect yourself. Which is where I think a Green Witch stands. A Witch has to protect themself, in my opinion! Now if they decide to just use deflection or reflection magick, or a binding, or even an actual hex, then its up to them to take care of the karmic responsibility etc.! Obviously it's not to be taken lightly but most green witches think it isn't inherently wrong.

[loopy]

That makes sense. Like self-defense. Witches shouldn't have to be passive.

Thanks for the definition, btw. :)

:)

[loopy]

Oh, I forgot. Has anyone read "Earth Power" by Scott Cunningham? I just started it, but it seems to have the same principles you've all mentioned to me-- folk magic, where simplicity is favored, earth is worked with, divination... I was just wondering if anyone had read it/what are your thoughts on how it relates with Green Witchcraft?

[Myst]

Sorry I've never read it :)

However, I'm just letting you all know that upon thinking of what Green Witchcraft is I decided to write an essay for the Witches' Voice. They have a Pagan Trads section wherein they invite people to submit an essay on their trad, so I wrote one up about Green Witchcraft and sent it in. If it gets accepted I'll be sure to let you know. If you would like to have a look anyway it can be found at http://willowraven.com/essays/GreenWitchcraft.doc
I'll probably post a message about this in our literature section too but I thought you might find it pertinent.

[MammaStar]

I just wanted to add my thanks for this thread! I too, read the first book in the Green series. I did feel more "at home" as I read on. I want to get the next two books also. I'm still trying to figure out which path I want to follow. Right now, it seems, at least to me, a mix of Celtic & Green.

I checked out some of those links posted and bookmarked a few too. I'm grateful to everyone who posted. Thanks so much for the info.

Gee, I love this place! :D :heartthro :sunny:

[Dria El]

Originally posted by WillowRaven
I totally agree with that thinking loopy - ask anything, we're all friends here right! I hope I can feel just the same when I have strange questions :)

A hex can be likened to a curse or some other magick to "harm" someone. Now the jury is out on how "right" this is for a witch to do. Some (staunch followers of the Rede) say harming anyone for any reason is bad! Others say you can harm others only to protect yourself. Which is where I think a Green Witch stands. A Witch has to protect themself, in my opinion! Now if they decide to just use deflection or reflection magick, or a binding, or even an actual hex, then its up to them to take care of the karmic responsibility etc.! Obviously it's not to be taken lightly but most green witches think it isn't inherently wrong.

Wouldn't allowing yourself to be harmed, harming someone? I'm a follower of the Rede and it's not quite that simple. The group of words may be small, but the implications are huge.

[Lavender]

Originally posted by Spirahl
Loopy, I don't know about others, but I do make a distinction between between "lower" and "higher" magic(k). Personally, I dislike these terms as they make one sound more powerful, more valid, but this is what they are known as. I tend to stay away from the "higher" magic, it doesn't work *for me* as well. Gardner incorporated elements of higher magic into Wicca, this being why Wicca does not suit me. I like to dig and get my hands dirty!:D

I can't say if it's true for all but this does seems to be the general feelings of other "greenwitches" I know.

[loopy]

WillowRaven-- I very much liked your essay. :) It summed up pretty much everything I wanted to know. :D

I know I was going to say something else. I just can't remember what. :(

[Spirahl]

Loopy- There are two copies of "Earth Magic" by Scott Cunningham in this house. Both hubby and I had separate copies before we met.
The purpose of the book is to show magic as something that is "practical", and I think successfully so. It reminds us that there is magic around us, everyday, in everything we do, in nature. It is not something separate. It does not *have to* take place in a circle, with special implements, by special people. Life *is* magic.

[Spirahl]

I just read your essay WillowRaven. I applaude you and your initiative. It is a path that many in the pagan community have heard of, though they have misconceptions or simply don't know where to turn for information. All are grateful to those who seek to educate!

[Myst]

Thanks go to those who appreciate my essay - I'm glad that it effectively covered the topic then!

[Lavender]

Hi WillowRaven,

Your essay is quite good & sums up Green Witchcraft quite accurately. The one point I would question is the use of the threefold rule. I believe that for every action, there is a reaction...sort of a karmic payback but to say "three times", I don't think is correct. Just my opinion... :)

[Lavender]

The name "Green Witch" is a pretty close fit for me. I find myself using it more & more. Yet I am still a bit uncomfortable with this label. I'm not sure how I feel about this yet. I can't help but wonder if the popularity in the use of the term "Green Witch" has anything to do with Ann Moura's books. I know "Green Witch" has been around a long time...before her books. Still, I wonder if Ann Moura will be to Green Witchery what Gardner was to Wicca? I would like to hear what you guys think of this rambling of mine...

[loopy]

Oh, I thought of a question. :)

Do Green Witches have a specific pantheon?

[Spirahl]

My Law of Return follows ideas of Kharma too. No Times Three, boomeranging type of effect. I do believe that we build up or erase a kharmic debt in our lifetimes, but these aren't necessarily set up as punishment/reward, but rather lessons and what we need to learn/what we can teach. I think a GreenWitch can view it either way, or any other, as long as there is an ethical base. Those without an ethical base would not be under *my* definition of Greenwitch. They would be something...else.
Certainly within our times spent on Earth in individual lifetimes, some things are examples of "what's sent, comes back". Take a friend for granted...lose friend. Oftentimes what is sent back for misdeeds is guilt.

[Spirahl]

Pantheon? I don't think so, since I have a mix myself. I think many cultures just have different names for Dieties that preform similar roles/functions. Some I'm drawn to, some I'm not, it's really more about cultural flavour maybe. Perhaps sometimes, you draw them?

[Myst]

I would think, in general, that the Green Witch largely stays away from ritualistic or ceremonial deity work.. then again I suppose it's up to the individual.. I've worked with Greek myth, Stregherian myth, and Arthurian/Avalonian...

[loopy]

WillowRaven-- Avalonian? Like from Mists of Avalon?

[Myst]

Myth of and involved with Avalon - the priestesses and druids that dwelt there, the Gods they worked with, etc. :)

[loopy]

Neat! :)

[Myst]

I found your question interesting. You seem to have a good point. The Green Witches of old probably didn't call themselves Green Witches; then again there are those who think they wouldn't have even called themselves Witches at all. From what I understand Ann Moura has coined the term herself, whether it existed before her books for sure or not. She uses it to describe the Craft she has learned from her Mother and Grandmother with some of her own historical and magickal beliefs thrown it. Although she doesn't claim she was initiated into it by some ancient practitioners or anything, or that it's the NEW Witchcraft - just that it's a way of practicing.

Would it be a bad thing to think of her that way?

[loopy]

Spirahl-- thanks for your thoughts on "Earth Magic." :)

Wildchild-- IMO, if you don't want to label yourself a Green Witch, for whatever reason, don't. Do labels really matter as long as it feels right?

Whether or not the term is older than the New Age, if it embodies what you feel you are, don't hesitate. :D:D

I think it's a neat name, myself. Very down-to-earth. :D

[Lavender]

Originally posted by WillowRaven
Would it be a bad thing to think of her that way?

Heheh! No, not at all. I thought I had heard the use of Green Witch before. It might have been in one of the Leslie Gordon's books? Don't know & can't find those books right now. It was just a rambling I had...too many hours here reading everything. :)

Thanks for your input, though. It's always good to hear what others think about stuff.

Willow, I really hope you do your book.

[loopy]

Originally posted by Wildchild
Willow, I really hope you do your book.

You're writing a book? :)

[Myst]

Hm was thinking about it.

Not too sure though - there are already tons of good books out there you know! What could be said in this Green Witchcraft book that hasn't been in another?

(actually, that was a serious question. What do you think COULD be said?)

I was also going to start a zine but decided I didn't have time to keep one up all by myself so submitted stuff to the Witches' Voice and the MW newsletter instead :)

[loopy]

Well, I have yet to actually read a Green Witchcraft book (saving up, saving up) so I'm not sure what are in them currently.

Every author has their own tone, anecdotes, memories, etc., so I think every book differs from another in that respect.

Sure, there are lots of good books out there, but if it feels right, I say Go for it! :D I'll buy it! :D:D

[loopy]

Hey, guys, I just wanted to thank you all for answering the questions so patiently. :) I never really felt comfortable with elaborate ceremonies, and I think I might be Green at heart. Kermit says it's not easy, but I think it'll be great! :D:D So just... thanks for helping me find a Path that suits me better. :D

[Myst]

ooh Yay loopy got her Green Witchcraft book!!! :)

[loopy]

Hee! I was just thinking that. :D And a darn fine book it was. :D

[Rain Gnosis]

It's funny to read this thread through, from 2 years ago. My beliefs have changed so much. So much has changed :)

[Lavender]

Heh! I'd forgotten you were WillowRaven before Myst. I still think of you as Myst.

[Arienadean]

Actually, Mist, I'm fairly certain there are many views on the Wicca=witchcraft thing, and that a lot of people believe them to be separate. Correct me, anyone, if I'm wrong. :)

Willow Raven-- would you be able to direct me to a particularly good website about Green Witchcraft? It sounds like what I might be looking for. :)

Ok check the definitions at thease sites:

http://www.paganism.com/ag/articles/wvsw.html

the above link is to someone I hung around with years ago on the net. She is both an ordained gospel minister and a traditional witch.(it was passed on in her family for many generations) Her site btw is one about religious tolerance and such.

http://www.shadowdrake.com/HSDwitchFAQ.html

http://www.branwenscauldron.com/witch_wicca.html

(I'm a bit sleepy so didn't fully read that last link fyi the one before it I believe I've read before.)

[Rain Gnosis]

There are many threads on that Arienadean that you might want to read. I think there's even one stuck to the top of New Pagans. It's an ongoing discussion.

[Williwaw]

Thanks so much for this thread! I had been meaning to read through it and I finally made this time this a.m.

This is something that I am leaning towards as well. I've been interested in the use of herbs for years and it just seems to be more along the lines of my own beliefs. I am happiest when I am out gardening or poking through the woods.

I'm off to the bookstore yet again! I think I saw a GreenWitch book there yesterday, but I didn't even pick it up because I didn't really know what it meant.

I love being able to learn new things about our beliefs each day. :)

Gina

[Pan]

I just re-read this thread and I still like it.

Many of my beliefs have fallen in with what Green Witchcraft stands for as said in this thread.

Only thing is ... Loki doesn't seem to fit in with the idea of an earth-based magickal system.

Any thoughts on that?

[IvyCeltress]

I just re-read this thread and I still like it.

Many of my beliefs have fallen in with what Green Witchcraft stands for as said in this thread.

Only thing is ... Loki doesn't seem to fit in with the idea of an earth-based magickal system.

Any thoughts on that?

Well to me, a Trickster's role is to be contrary to any system, so Loki or Coyote will able to stir things up no matter what camp he is in, to mix my theological metaphors.