Shaman

[Nighthawk]

Native American teachings. If you have this leaning, I guess this might be a good start to getting together...

[WolfMoon]

Not much I know, but I'd love to learn more!

[Shanti]

What I learned when we lived on the res for my early childhood....
Follow the beat of your own drummer. Thats where you begin. :)

[Calyx]

I don't know much about shamanism right now, but have been feeling pulled that way, especially with totem magic. I am looking forward to lurking on the discussion here, and hopefully being brave enough to post sometime! :)

[WolfMoon]

I don't know much about shamanism right now, but have been feeling pulled that way, especially with totem magic. I am looking forward to lurking on the discussion here, and hopefully being brave enough to post sometime! :)

Me too! :)

[Nighthawk]

As far as I am concerned, I started the thread, please talk away... we will ALL learn.

[WolfMoon]

I'm kind of a weird mix...I've mostly been studying Nordic teachings, but the nature of shamanism really appeals to me a lot.

Sadly, I've been slacking off, so I'm pushing myself to get motivated again.

[Nighthawk]

There are different types of Shaman... yet, they feel similar to me, if only in their focus.

[WolfMoon]

They really do, and I think it's the general 'vibe' that I'm drawn to. (I'm still really new at this!)

It's not that it's simpler than any other path, but to me it feels more connected somehow. Closer to the heart than anything else I've found.

[Nighthawk]

Well, perhaps then it calls to you as much as you to it. I grew up not fitting in quite, yet did not know how or why. Going to church was nice and all, but why in a special building? Why not in the open with nature? I do understand.. good stuff....

[Calyx]

Well, like I said, totem magic is calling to me strongly right now, but I confess I don't know much about it. So I am hoping to learn a bit more here! :) As a green witch, it just seems like a logical expansion to me, although a bit unexpected. I just figured I would go with the flow.
I am delighted to see this thread, though.

[Shanti]

The best companion in times of quiet are the trees!!!
They have much to say.

[marigold]

My dad used to work with the Abenaki indians here in Vermont. He once brought me a beaded good luck charm that the Abenaki children made and I keep it in my pocket all the time... he's a social worker and he might know a little bit but I really don't know much about it, though its always been something I've been fascinated by. I don't have any native american blood or anything I just wish I could learn more.

[Nighthawk]

I think this is a good place to learn... today is the first day this thread has been alive

[WolfMoon]

Yeah, I can understand a special place, but being inside never quite struck me as inspiring as outdoors.

I grew up never fitting in either, and in some ways, I still don't.

[Moon Momma]

I have been drawn to Shamanism for a long time. When I was growing up, I used to bug my grandmother and my mom to tell me about my great-grandmother who was full blood Cherokee. In a way I feel attached to that part of my blood, but I also feel DEtached too, know what I mean? I really want to reconnect and I am so glad this thread is here so I can "meet" with more like-minded people.

On a side note, thats what I love about MW...there are sooooo many different people on different paths but yet somehow there is always so much connecting going, so much common ground! It's unity and diversity all rolled into one!!

[GryphonGirl]

I have been drawn to Native things alot of my life, without knowing why.....don't know when or how, but I will find my beginnings...... which I think are somewhere in the archaeology and/or census of early new England.

[Nighthawk]

I think the first thing to do is hug each other and thank each other for being here. We will help one another learn this.... The creator/god..Wakan Tanka watches over all.. and wants all to succeed.

[RubyRose]

While I'm interested in learning more about it, just for curiousity's sake, I find it very hard to locate any basic facts about this path.

So, maybe those who do practice could share some links?

[MoonLyte]

I seem to be being led this way recently.I know nothing about it to be honest,but so want to learn.

[Nighthawk]

THis is all good.. Ruby Rose, as soon as I find some links today, I will edit this post and include. Earthchild, welcome.. Wolf Moon, Moon Momma, GG, Marigold. Calyx, Shanti... Welcome.. I agree with WolfMoon about the "Being outside" part, as in the before times, there were no 'churches' to go into, rather it was everywhere you were. The true story is, the Native brothers were shocked when they saw white man's church and that they worshiped on Sunday.. they said "Why is it your god is in a building? And why only on one day?" "Our god is with us always, in everything we see and eat, everywhere we walk." Anyway, I do know that I wanted to share that with you. Peace

[Deranged Hermit]

I've been interested in Shamanism since I was a kid, but really don't know anything. It will be good to "lurk" and read what everyone has to offer.

[Nighthawk]

Ahhh welcome, my friend. So glad you came here. I am not the expert, but have a working knowledge, some of this is just known, and I feel it falls in step with the class I am doing, because the memory...of something you know nothing about, means something.. Thank you DH for coming.

[WolfMoon]

I'm wondering if anyone has read 'Shamanic Experience' by Kenneth Meadows? Seems a very good 'starter guide', especially when it comes to meditation. I haven't gotten all the way through it yet, but I like what I have read.

[Nighthawk]

*another book to buy* No, I have not... I shall look at it tomorrow... I am in Shaman, Healer, Sage right now by Villoldo and it is really good.

[WolfMoon]

That's one I need to get.

'Shamanic Experience' is very basic, but very good. And it's put out by Bear & Co, rather than Llewyllen.

[argento_occhi]

i'm rather intrested in african shamanism. i find it very fascinating, but i'm more interested to find out more about it rather than begin practicing. don't know much about native american shamanism either, nor shamanism in general. i just love the african shamans. very cool. love the drums.

[Nighthawk]

WolfMoon... I recommend it
Argento Occhi... you av is similar to mine, but prettier. I LOVE drums... I used to go to sleep to them at the Powwow/rodeo circuit... We lived in a van from spring to late Autumn.. and travelled around.... I still hear the tires on the road in my sleep. and the drums... By the way, nice to meet you

[WolfMoon]

I'll pose a few questions for everyone. Do you often feel like you hold others at arm's length, almost subconsciously? Do you often have trouble fitting in with the rest?

[Nighthawk]

Ha ha ha.... sorry to laugh... Oh yes... Every day. All the time. Me to a 't'.. yup..

[Nighthawk]

My question back to all, why do you think this is?

[WolfMoon]

Ha ha ha.... sorry to laugh... Oh yes... Every day. All the time. Me to a 't'.. yup..

Me too. There's very few people I'm extremely close to, the rest I feel like I always hold off on something...

It's been confusing me for years!

[RubyRose]

I'll pose a few questions for everyone. Do you often feel like you hold others at arm's length, almost subconsciously? Do you often have trouble fitting in with the rest?

Yes, to both questions.

[Nighthawk]

RubyRose, I said I would give links, well.. There are no good ones I can find for you. I have looked all over and very little..So, I will point you toward Jung for starters. and do more when I find them

[argento_occhi]

thanks nighthawk. it's actually an image of Sobek, who's very close to my heart. i've always loved percussion type instruments anyways. nice to meet you too.

[Nighthawk]

Wow.. Is he a jackal too?? You know already mine is Anubus...Edited... Oh, a crocodile... fertiity god..cool!!

[WolfMoon]

My question back to all, why do you think this is?

I can only relate what happened in my own experience on this one. I was just out of college and starting work. At college, I hadn't fit in at all. I just chalked it up to being an open-minded art major, where the majority of people there were criminal justice and communications majors.

No big deal, right?

At my first job, I wound up working in a field that had nothing to do with my major. Sadly, I had to take it, had bills to pay and I was getting married. I tried getting along with my co-workers, but nothing seemed to work. My friendliness was met with polite distance and things were kept at that. I tried going to the little company get-togethers and unit happenings, but nothing worked. Eventually, I just gave up and did my own thing.

A few years later, after I had transferred to a different department I found something out. Someone who I had worked with originally told me that the rest of the group had been intimidated by me and had felt uncomfortable around me.

Intimidating? Me? Huh?! I'm a major goof!

Now, I still have quite a few friends, but they all have the same bent that I do.

So apparently, there is something in my nature that makes people feel uncomfortable around me.

[Nighthawk]

I can understand... I too have the problem. I am told it is because I think too fast. I can multitask too well, and that the bosses fear I will either do A. Something to embarass them and get them fired, or B. Find something out and expose them and get them fired. So, now I just steal their mouse balls when they are not looking. I am friendly and helpful, but with a killer temper. So what? . I think I see some patterns here.... Anyone else???

[Shanti]

Two good books:

First is a true story of one womens expirence with shamanism in mexico:
Dance of Power A shamanic Journey by Dr. Susan Gregg.
Its a very good story.

For a little more advanced reading there is :
Shamans, Healers and Medicine Men by Holger Kalweit.
This book covers Ancient Shamanistic Practices from all over all over the world. It has information on various types and uses in Shamanistic practice.

As for having a distance from people, I dont have a distance from people because I outright choose to, I have a distance from people because I cant relate to the average way of thinking. I observe more than anything.

A good example of how I differ is, One summer day we went by my in-laws. It was peak grasshopper season and a beautiful day outside, warm not hot, a nice breeze. They were several people their that day. I and my So and our kids, spent all me time outside watching the grasshoppers, which I found to be fun, stimulating and pure enjoyment. Everyone else stayed in the air conditioned house talking about the usual nonesence. No one cared at all about the grasshoppers or the beauty of the day.

That how most visits are with people, I am always pre-ocupied by thoughts other than the mundane and so there is a big distance. No connection to most people.

[Nighthawk]

Thank you, and I will have to put more books on hold. I understand. Really I do. After sitting in the corner reading at my Ex-in laws house while they all tore each other apart, I understand. One more point... Have you noticed in threads, and most in this one for me, that we are having deep, meaningful conversation and enjoying it? Well, I am. I have never met some of you until this thread. So, I wonder if is a THEM problem or an US problem? Hmmm.

[spirit wind]

I can understand... I too have the problem. I am told it is because I think too fast. I can multitask too well, and that the bosses fear I will either do A. Something to embarass them and get them fired, or B. Find something out and expose them and get them fired. So, now I just steal their mouse balls when they are not looking. I am friendly and helpful, but with a killer temper. So what? . I think I see some patterns here.... Anyone else???Hi, anyone mind if i join in? What i have read so far describes me exactly! and Nighthawk, you described it best in the above quote!!! I lose jobs like people lose socks. I either do something that i thought was 'right' at the time and they were embaressed my bosses or i point out to them somethng that i think is a mistake and they take it to heart and i find myself out of a job.
I have been interested in Native American teachings since i was in early teens. I have never really done much about this until about a month or two ago. I have a Native American store which i frequent often and feel so at home there. I spend hours just looking at everything and flicking through their books, listening to the music that is always playing. It calms me after a stressful week.
I also keep people at arms length. I have very few friends and many aquaintences.

Nice to see there are a few more people on the same wavelength :)

Spirit Wind

Also, my user name is Native American. Just noone has picked it ...

[WolfMoon]

It's a Them problem.

I've never gotten into mundane conversations. I often feel very detached from some things, but eh...I'm enjoying myself.

[Shanti]

Well, I think that in presant time, the problem is a lot of people have lost the connection to mother earth and I think it is few people that 'feel' their spirit. Many people believe they have a spirit but I think few feel it. And with today being a time when matieralism is a way of life, I think people lost sight.
There was a time in the human race when being 'in touch' was the most important quality for happiness and health. (looong time ago).

I look at the average summer day...few people are outside feeling natures beauty. Most are in their air conditioned homes and cars and offices. When we go to town on a nice summer day, there are few people just sitting outside. Thats were I think a connection with nature gets lost. Artificial climate control!! And, I think people over time forget.

My daughter in law stopped over the other night. It was cool but pleasant outside. The nearby pond was alive in a chorus of frogs. As we stood outside talking, I stopped her sentance, for the moment, and said..."listen". She replied with , "what I dont here anything". I said "shh". She listened and after a minute she said, "oh the frogs". She immediately went back to the mundane conversation and not another thought was of the chorus.

I spend a lot of time at night listening to the frogs. I never tire of it and each night it holds me in awh.

Few people.

[Nighthawk]

SHanti...Uh huh, I go to this small town nearly every wekend. I did since childhood, with a 15 year hiatus. In the mountains, by a river. I walk up to frog lake, and listen. It is a 3 mile hike, but worth it. I ran into a brown bear there one time. I smell the berries. I listen to the birds and frogs and the insects buzzing around me. I also can hear snakes going across grass. I can smell them too. I understand the tie with nature.
WolfMoon.. I understand, and that is the most important thing, to enjoy yourself, with or without their company.
SprirtWind, I know your name is... that is why one time I asked about your avatar. Yes, please do join in. I think I will learn from you. Is this store also online? I believe if we were to be together by a campfire, more would come through, but we just have to imagine it I guess.

[spirit wind]

I believe if we were to be together by a campfire, more would come through, but we just have to imagine it I guess. It's funny that you say that Nighthawk. I have been a lurker on this board since you first posted this thread, and that is how i see us. Sitting around the campfire, with an abundance of stars above and a beautiful moon slowly moving across the night sky, Sharing stories.

The store isn't online, well i don't think it is. I must ask them this weekend. Unless RubyRose knows? (the one at Malaga?)

And that Avatar is somewhere in my computer :) I have been looking for it and can't seem to find it as i would like to put it back up.


Spirit Wind

[Nighthawk]

This is some of what will happen in class. I will provide a setting, a backdrop and we will share. i promise. The avatar.. which one was that? I do not remember that detail yet. So, it is in Australia,???

[WolfMoon]

Oh, that sounds great! I love campfires...

Sadly, the only place where my husband and I can go hiking and get into nature is a good 45 minute drive. We planned on starting to hike this srping, but then I majorly sprained my ankle. Happened about a month ago and I'm still healing from it! Ow!

We do frequently go camping, but that's with our LARP. Not the same vibe as this discussion has taken, but still very cool.

[Nighthawk]

That is too bad... perhaps a nearby park with the right setting can help also. Have you ever seen those full wall murals? They look like a rainforest or the like... I wonder if those would be ..hey... I wonder how many people have a slide projector? Hmm, if we could pass around a picture, ooh.. even on the net on our screen, that could be a backdrop.. ok, so two computers.. does everyone have two? I have some really odd ideas here, that just might work... I am talking about themes here.. oh, how exciting... ok.. whatever I wrote....ok?

[WolfMoon]

Hrm...maybe find a great nature shot for desktops?

[Nighthawk]

Yes!!!!! See, it would work here, as well as the class. I have a bunch of computers, so I can still do a lesson while loking at a picture, some could print it, some could print the lesson and look at the pic.. Hmm, I see some cool things up ahead.

[WolfMoon]

What might be interesting would be to use shots of the different areas when discussing (national) shamanism. Like a great shot of the outback when talking about dreamtime, etc?

[Nighthawk]

Ooohhh, perfect!! See? I told y'all I would be learning.. so cool!!!!!!

[GryphonGirl]

Oh boy!! I have read so much cool stuff from all the folks who have posted in this thread...I am way psyched for the class, love the idea of sharing some sort of picture/back drop for the discussions and I sure do wish we could all meet in the Great Outdoors for real!

I feel connected to this path for many of the same reasons these other folks have stated....Shanti, I too can be at some family function but be off somewhere outside walking around outside listening to nature....the keeping people at arm's length, I am hard to get to know - have been told I am a stoic or uninterested or something....wondering forever what it is that makes me different....

[WolfMoon]

Oh boy!! I have read so much cool stuff from all the folks who have posted in this thread...I am way psyched for the class, love the idea of sharing some sort of picture/back drop for the discussions and I sure do wish we could all meet in the Great Outdoors for real!

I feel connected to this path for many of the same reasons these other folks have stated....Shanti, I too can be at some family function but be off somewhere outside walking around outside listening to nature....the keeping people at arm's length, I am hard to get to know - have been told I am a stoic or uninterested or something....wondering forever what it is that makes me different....

nah, you're not uninteresting...just like the rest of us aren't.

[Shanti]

Oh boy!! I have read so much cool stuff from all the folks who have posted in this thread...I am way psyched for the class, love the idea of sharing some sort of picture/back drop for the discussions and I sure do wish we could all meet in the Great Outdoors for real!

I feel connected to this path for many of the same reasons these other folks have stated....Shanti, I too can be at some family function but be off somewhere outside walking around outside listening to nature....the keeping people at arm's length, I am hard to get to know - have been told I am a stoic or uninterested or something....wondering forever what it is that makes me different....
I honestly dont see any of us as differant. Dont ask your self that.

Instead try this on....say...
I am unique!!

[GryphonGirl]

Yup, you are right.....must re-program that thinking....!

[GryphonGirl]

nah, you're not uninteresting...just like the rest of us aren't.

Thank you and Shanti both!

[gyroWang]

nothing to add, just announcing my presence :)

[WolfMoon]

Besides all the reading we've been doing...what other things are people exploring in relation to shamanism?

I've been getting heavier into animal totems and the ideas of shape-shifting and therianism. It feels so very sequential to me, like -this- leads to -that- and that means -something else-.

[Nighthawk]

I think that is the collective/ tribal memory kicking in. I have sacred path cards and stuff. Shapeshifting is also a druid thing. it is neat how many things tie together. I have been sing it to be more aware. My empathic abilities are heightened when I do so, and I can do other things not usually possible for me, by the 'shifting' of my mind..

[WolfMoon]

I think that is the collective/ tribal memory kicking in. I have sacred path cards and stuff. Shapeshifting is also a druid thing. it is neat how many things tie together. I have been sing it to be more aware. My empathic abilities are heightened when I do so, and I can do other things not usually possible for me, by the 'shifting' of my mind..

So is it possible then that my pattern of learning may be being 'taught' to me via tribal memory?

[Nighthawk]

I believe in this course ALL of us are going ot learn something along this line... Oh yes.. there is a reason we feel close to someone... we do not know.. aathere was a thread about Native Americans here, and I watched it for days. nearly EVERYONE who posted in it, I had reached out to, and did not know why. There is a common thread, might be DNA, might be something else, but I KNOW something out there, affects us and in a big way... more in the class

[WolfMoon]

This going to be one of the teaching circle classes?

[Nighthawk]

Yes, well, collective memory/ Tribal memory.... I wonder if a Shaman class would be good too?

[MoonLyte]

I've always felt detatched from people,but always put that down to my depression,maybe i was wrong.I'm not alone after all.Have felt that way as far back as i can remember,felt different from all my family,deep thinker.

[WolfMoon]

Yes, well, collective memory/ Tribal memory.... I wonder if a Shaman class would be good too?

Already signed up for the collective/tribal memory!

I'd take a Shaman class.

[Nighthawk]

So would I.. not sure if I could TEACH a Shaman class.... Hmm
AND earthchild.... duh... I KNEW you were a deep thinker.... see??

[MoonLyte]

I don't know that i have enough brain to contribute much,but i will learn much from reading.I can take it in and learn..but it does make me feel alive reading this thread.I can associate with the feelings and thoughts discussed.

[Shanti]

I believe in this course ALL of us are going ot learn something along this line... Oh yes.. there is a reason we feel close to someone... we do not know.. aathere was a thread about Native Americans here, and I watched it for days. nearly EVERYONE who posted in it, I had reached out to, and did not know why. There is a common thread, might be DNA, might be something else, but I KNOW something out there, affects us and in a big way... more in the class
I dont think DNA has anything to do with it what-so-ever and this is why:

My step mom is a full blood (done ask what tribe I cant remember and it is a complex name) and my step dad was a full Oneida.

Needless to say, through the years I have been to many powwows and gatherings. I have met people who had not one bit of Native American blood in them and yet they had such a mindset to the ways of thought as the Natives do. On the other hand, I have met many Native Ameriacans, that were totally not in touch even a tiny bit with the Native though process.

I think thats holds true for everything so DNA I must rule out of the equation.

I look at it more as the "we are all connected" in some way thought. Be it spiritual, destiny from what we will do or be and so on.

[Nighthawk]

Interesting thought. Can DNA skip???? There has to be a connection. I too have seen what you are talking about. Again, I am learning too... Hmm, I wonder what the tie is then?

[Shanti]

Interesting thought. Can DNA skip???? There has to be a connection. I too have seen what you are talking about. Again, I am learning too... Hmm, I wonder what the tie is then?
This is what I think so far......
Its spirit. Whether it be from past lives or future lives yet to be expirenced.
Our spirit knows what we need and where to find it. I believe our spirit is taking itself through a learning process by becoming mortal..(how else would it 'know' what a rose smells like to a human or an animal?) And we are all connected on the spiritual plane. We are all at differant points but its like throwing a stone in water...the ripples are ignored by the frog but noticed by the bird witch looks around. We are the bird and are looking around!!!!

My thought!!! :)

[Shanti]

And to add to the thought..the frog will notice a differant ripple when its created for him and then the bird will not notice. A time for everything!

[Calyx]

I'll pose a few questions for everyone. Do you often feel like you hold others at arm's length, almost subconsciously? Do you often have trouble fitting in with the rest?

yes to both questions.....

The whys are not completely understood yet, but I'll take a shot.......
I am adopted and don't know my history. I know bits and pieces, but not the whole deal! I have Estonian, Welsh, Scotch and Irish blood in me. I am an extraordinarily fast reader, and like others here, can multitask exceptionally well. I have a near photographic memory.
I don't play mind games and usually call things like I see them (with some tact, of course! :lol: ) I am very intuitive and sometimes it creeps people out when I know what they are feeling or thinking when they haven't even said anything.

I MUST have alone time to be a rational and functional person. Most of my alone time is reading or being outside. I have always been one to be an outdoors person, and have a very green thumb. I am fascinated by water and feel like I am dying inside if I am not around it somewhere, of some type.

These things I feel make me unique and special, and therefore set me apart from others.

[spirit wind]

I understand what you say Shanti, i like to sit outside and listen to nature. I block out all the cars and trucks and buses (i live on a main road in an industrial area!) and just listen and feel. As much as i can, i go to where nature is abundant. Out in the bush i truly feel alive. The city seems to deaden my senses after a while. I also see myself as unique, i am very different from my other members of my family and from my friends too. They don't see the little things were as i do. They are too busy, passing life by were as i am happy and watch life as it passes by. Did that make sense?

And HI! gyroWang :) Jump in anytime ok.

As you can all see, i found my avatar!!!!! and i added something in Cherokee. Know what it says?

I love the idea about the pics. I have two computers but the other one is in another room. I have some lovely desktop shots of the snow in the mountains somewhere in America (i think) as we don't get snow where i live. It is so serene.

Just a quick question? I feel energy coming from posts and threads, depending on who has posted and i was wondering if anyone else felt this. That is what drew me to this thread in the first place. Sometimes i feel good energy, negative energy, sad energy etc.

Spirit Wind

[savannahrose44]

Well, perhaps then it calls to you as much as you to it. I grew up not fitting in quite, yet did not know how or why. Going to church was nice and all, but why in a special building? Why not in the open with nature? I do understand.. good stuff....

I know the feeling. I could never understand the concept of god in a church. It just didn't seem to work. One would think people would look to nature to seek their creator. Shamanism has always had a very strong pull with me. I'm trying to learn all I can. Hope you don't mind if I butt in every now and then. :colorful:

[Calyx]

After reading through this thread, I had a thought I would like to voice....

It seems most of us here are drawn to nature or the outdoors and feel on some level that that's where we need to be to feel either: completely free, happy, thoughtful, energized, etc.

Is this part of what makes up shamanism? I apologize for my ignorance. :)

[Shanti]

After reading through this thread, I had a thought I would like to voice....

It seems most of us here are drawn to nature or the outdoors and feel on some level that that's where we need to be to feel either: completely free, happy, thoughtful, energized, etc.

Is this part of what makes up shamanism? I apologize for my ignorance. :)
This sums it up pretty much for me..on the level of practising shamanism:From some notes I have taken through time of a lot of reading....

People who are shamanic practitioners believe that the world of spirit interpenetrates our third dimensional reality, effecting all aspects of physical reality. By mediating between the realm of spirit, and the realm of form, profound changes can be made that can effect not only our consciousness, but the quality of our lives within the context of physical reality.

Nature is a very good way to be in touch with the spirit in ones self. Natures' spirit energies stimulate oneself, and thus the draw to nature.

I cant think of a simple way to explain shamanism. Its complex in itself.

[RubyRose]

It's funny that you say that Nighthawk. I have been a lurker on this board since you first posted this thread, and that is how i see us. Sitting around the campfire, with an abundance of stars above and a beautiful moon slowly moving across the night sky, Sharing stories.

The store isn't online, well i don't think it is. I must ask them this weekend. Unless RubyRose knows? (the one at Malaga?)

And that Avatar is somewhere in my computer :) I have been looking for it and can't seem to find it as i would like to put it back up.


Spirit Wind

Okay, I haven't caught up on this thread yet, so bare with me. No I don't think that store at Malaga is online ... I'm not even sure of the name of it right now ... :lol:

[RubyRose]

My question back to all, why do you think this is?
Um, I think its because I've always felt isolated and I feel better being of by myself than I do in crowds.

RubyRose, I said I would give links, well.. There are no good ones I can find for you. I have looked all over and very little..So, I will point you toward Jung for starters. and do more when I find them
Ah that's okay, I have managed to find a few things myself, but it still doesn't really explain what I'm looking for. When I get home (I'm at tafe at the moment) I'll hunt the links up and share em.

[spirit wind]

Ok people, i found a heap of websites on Shamans, mostly Native American Shamanic ways and was wondering what you thought about this website?

http://deoxy.org/shaover.htm

I found it gave me a general overview, but you have to remember that i am only starting out here and i have no idea if what i am looking at is a load of cods wallop or the good stuff :)
What are your thoughts?

Spirit Wind

[RubyRose]

Ok people, i found a heap of websites on Shamans, mostly Native American Shamanic ways and was wondering what you thought about this website?

http://deoxy.org/shaover.htm

I found it gave me a general overview, but you have to remember that i am only starting out here and i have no idea if what i am looking at is a load of cods wallop or the good stuff :)
What are your thoughts?

Spirit Wind

:hugz: Thanks girl. Now, why does that website seem familiar ... :lol:

Edited: Oh that's because I have it in my favourites file at home.

[spirit wind]

That's good to know, if it is in your fave file then i am sure i am on the right track :)

I was just in looking at a site about working with animal spirits and it was amazing! The amount of animals they listed. Everything from a flea right up to the well known ones like wolf (mine :) ) and Puma etc. They even had stuff on Dragons and such. I always thought that there was only the usual animals (wolf, eagle, tiger, bear etc ) that people worked with. It certainly opened my eyes that's for sure.
Nighthawk, i was looking at the wisdom your animal embodies (if that is the right word?) and it is you to a T. Then again, before today i didn't even know there was such an animal as a Nighthawk. May i ask, do you work with a nighthawk? and is that why you have chosen that name? Sorry if that is too personal and you don't have to answer if you feel you don't want to.

Do many people here work with animal spirits?

Spirit Wind

[RubyRose]

Animal Spirits? I have what I refer to as a Totem Animal, which for me is the Pegusas ... hence I got a tattoo of exactly that.

[li'l_red_one]

has anyone been to shamanscave.com it has heaps of info. i have just sarted studying samanism myself and the site has really helped.and i hope it will help you.

[RubyRose]

Thanks I'll check it out

[spirit wind]

has anyone been to shamanscave.com it has heaps of info. i have just sarted studying samanism myself and the site has really helped.and i hope it will help you. Hi welcome to MW!
And you wouldn't beleive it, but i am actually in that site right now :)

[RubyRose]

:lol: Not a bad site actually

[MoonLyte]

I haven't got an animal spirit guide,don't really feel connected to one animal so have yet to meet him.Sure i will when the time is right though.

[spirit wind]

I haven't got an animal spirit guide,don't really feel connected to one animal so have yet to meet him.Sure i will when the time is right though.You will, earthchild, they have perfect timing and will show themselves to you when you are ready.
My wolf did! Many years ago and i thank him for it almost everday :)

[MoonLyte]

I agree with Nighthawk about worshipping nature outside.
I was a christian,and could never get my head around having to worship God in a church.Before becoming pagan,i had no interest in nature,but now it overwhelms me,there are even a set of trees near me which i speak to everyday as i pass them,i love sitting in the woods and meditating,last time i was honoured by the presence of a deer.
Other than saying that,from everything i've read,i really don't feel intelligent enough to contribute,so i'll just observe.

[RubyRose]

I agree with Nighthawk about worshipping nature outside.
I was a christian,and could never get my head around having to worship God in a church.Before becoming pagan,i had no interest in nature,but now it overwhelms me,there are even a set of trees near me which i speak to everyday as i pass them,i love sitting in the woods and meditating,last time i was honoured by the presence of a deer.
Other than saying that,from everything i've read,i really don't feel intelligent enough to contribute,so i'll just observe.

Yeah I feel the same. I find myself when I get angry now, talking a walk down to a little area of natural bush by where I live, and it really helps to calm me down.

[WolfMoon]

I've worked with animal spirits in the past, Wolf and Raven. I've gotten a lot out of those experiences and really enjoyed them, which is why I'm trying to work more with them.

[spirit wind]

WolfMoon.... Do you know if there is a difference between a Raven & a Crow? Here in Australia they are both called a crow and yet for some reason i call them Ravens. I find them intriguing birds as they seem to stare right into me. When i was in hospital the other week, there was one that would sit and listen to me for hours on end. It was a beautiful experience :)

[Wascally Wabbit]

I wish I could sleep in the middle of a friendly wolf pack, in the forest in the snow, cuddled down in their fur. That would be heaven to me.

[WolfMoon]

WolfMoon.... Do you know if there is a difference between a Raven & a Crow? Here in Australia they are both called a crow and yet for some reason i call them Ravens. I find them intriguing birds as they seem to stare right into me. When i was in hospital the other week, there was one that would sit and listen to me for hours on end. It was a beautiful experience :)

From what I've been able to find, Crow is more about changing the future by studying your past and finding your balance. By finding out what caused past suffering, you can shed them. Raven is the messenger of that which is to come and to embrace it without any negative baggage.

Kind of interesting there, that both represent aspects of change, just different ways of handling it.

Granted, their meanings are going to be as varied as the books you find them in! I find it best to meditate and ask what lesson I'm learning....but since both are a bit of a trickster, you may not get the answer the way you're looking for it! :lol:

[WolfMoon]

I wish I could sleep in the middle of a friendly wolf pack, in the forest in the snow, cuddled down in their fur. That would be heaven to me.

That would be such a beautiful experience!

Within a 2 hr drive of me, there is a wolf conservation park. They allow visitors at certain times of the day, usually noon and five. The wolf pack knows when the tour bus is coming and not only greets it, but I've heard they send up a howl when it arrives (very friendly like!)

At the end of the presentation, guests are invited to howl with the wolves. In fact, they host a monthly Howl Night, when the presentation happens at night.

I so have to go to that! :floating:

[Wascally Wabbit]

I'll pose a few questions for everyone. Do you often feel like you hold others at arm's length, almost subconsciously? Do you often have trouble fitting in with the rest?

Yes, I feel like that.

[Deranged Hermit]

Yes, I definitely have trouble fitting in. Aside from my husband and kids, I don't have any other human friends, and have very little contact with people. As far as being outside, I feel much calmer and more serene when I spend a good amount of time outdoors.
My spirit/totem animal is a Raven.

[Nighthawk]

Well hello, DH... and I am not surprised at the events that led you to this thread. I was somehow drawn to you from your post. It is fitting together now. Welcome. You might wish to sign up for the class too....only if you want, though

[Nighthawk]

That's good to know, if it is in your fave file then i am sure i am on the right track :)

I was just in looking at a site about working with animal spirits and it was amazing! The amount of animals they listed. Everything from a flea right up to the well known ones like wolf (mine :) ) and Puma etc. They even had stuff on Dragons and such. I always thought that there was only the usual animals (wolf, eagle, tiger, bear etc ) that people worked with. It certainly opened my eyes that's for sure.
Nighthawk, i was looking at the wisdom your animal embodies (if that is the right word?) and it is you to a T. Then again, before today i didn't even know there was such an animal as a Nighthawk. May i ask, do you work with a nighthawk? and is that why you have chosen that name? Sorry if that is too personal and you don't have to answer if you feel you don't want to.

Do many people here work with animal spirits?

Spirit Wind
My friend... I was told at 13 that the name for my band would be Nighthawk.. it was in a dream. I was on a buffalo skin in a teepee. Yes, it is true. There were drums in the background from stick game. I have never looked at the powers, and did not even think about it as a Spirit Animal, until you mentioned it. He he..I said I would be learning, now I must go see what I am to learn. Thank you.

[Nighthawk]

I see....Hmmm
Nighthawk's Wisdom Includes:
Patience
Use of body movement
Camouflage
Ability to rest when others cannot
Nocturnal vision

Is this correct? I men, iis there different info somewhere else? Or is this what you saw?

[spirit wind]

If that was from the web address i sent you, then yes it is what isaw. :) I should have put in the above post that it is how i perceive you. I am most likely wrong. But that is what comes through on your posts, not just in this thread but all over MW. And not all of those traits i see in you, as i don't know you personally. Did you see my post earlier (i think it is on page two) about feeling energy from the posts here at MW? That is how it has come through to me. Did that make any sense? :) I think i am too tired. I will be back in the morning with a fresh brain cell to get me through the day.

Spirit Wind

[Nighthawk]

Ahh, I did not see that, but I will look. I oddly enough went to the same site for the info, THEN received your link... Hmm, well. The only thing that bothers me, is I am the one most impatient person in the world. However, as I have said, I will be learning too.. I wonder if I shall learn patience?

[Nighthawk]

nothing to add, just announcing my presence :)

Hope you return

[argento_occhi]

actually, Sobek isn't a fertility god. he is more seen as the strength behind the pharaoh, his protector, and also as a healer, which i find very interesting. crocodiles are also linked with set/sutekh, but Sobek is more commonly associated with Ra as Sobek-Ra, taking on some of his solar aspects. the crocodile is also representative of the primeval land mass first arising from the primordial waters of nun.

*looks around* yes i realise this has nothing to do with shamans.

bright blessings,
argent

[Nighthawk]

Oh.. thanks for the clear up.. I looked at this site and it said that. Hmm, they are wrong. It is fine, you were addressing something of concern. Well, thank you.

[li'l_red_one]

*spiritwind*

so what do you think of the site? i hope that you found it helpful,i would like to know what you think.

with love and blesssing li'l_red_one

[Nighthawk]

*spiritwind*

so what do you think of the site? i hope that you found it helpful,i would like to know what you think.

with love and blesssing li'l_red_one
her time zone.. she is sleeping now. Might have to check back later.
Welcome!!!!!!

[spirit wind]

*spiritwind*

so what do you think of the site? i hope that you found it helpful,i would like to know what you think.

with love and blesssing li'l_red_one Morning everyone!
li'l red one, i found the site to be quite interesting. I loved the clacking exercise :) and the sock one was too funny :lol: But overall, i liked it. I have bookmarked it for future reference. The forums there look good to but are a bit too new for me.

Hope you are enjoying MW
Spirit Wind

[li'l_red_one]

*spiritwind*

the clacking exercise is really good so i thought. but actually i found the sock exercise hard to do because i could not concentrate you has to be all by yourself. i first tryed it when my other half was home and it was impossable because i had him in fits of laughter.so if you do try the sock exercise make sure nobody else is in the area, unless they can restrain themself and understand what your trying to do. but i do recomend you the clacking exercise when you are ready it is a good experince.

with love and blessings li'l_red_one

[Nighthawk]

Side note...Some say Shaman cannot be empath.... I disagree... you must shield, but can be done....What do y'all think???

[Shanti]

Side note...Some say Shaman cannot be empath.... I disagree... you must shield, but can be done....What do y'all think???
I agree. Theres differant levels and types of empaths but a Shaman to not be almost seems conradictory. Some Shaman that I have known about have been highly Empathic. Some less but still theres some empathic abilities.
Thats just my conclusions from the circles I've expirenced.

[Nighthawk]

That is what I came up with...In order to be in 'touch' one would wish to be empathic... I think these guys are off...but, oh well... I respect your words, so it means alot that you posted here...Thank you....

[Shanti]

That is what I came up with...In order to be in 'touch' one would wish to be empathic... I think these guys are off...but, oh well... I respect your words, so it means alot that you posted here...Thank you....
I was thinking on using the words in touch but it seemed to not be deep enough. You know what I mean?

[WolfMoon]

Side note...Some say Shaman cannot be empath.... I disagree... you must shield, but can be done....What do y'all think???

I agree with you, Nighthawk! It doesn't make sense to be a 'blank' and be a Shaman. It would seem to me that you couldn't connect.

[spirit wind]

*spiritwind*

the clacking exercise is really good so i thought. but actually i found the sock exercise hard to do because i could not concentrate you has to be all by yourself. i first tryed it when my other half was home and it was impossable because i had him in fits of laughter.so if you do try the sock exercise make sure nobody else is in the area, unless they can restrain themself and understand what your trying to do. but i do recomend you the clacking exercise when you are ready it is a good experince.

with love and blessings li'l_red_one :lol: No, i don't think i would try it with others around. I do 99% of my meditations and exercises once the children are in bed and i know that noone will disturb me. The worse thing that will happen is that my son would wake up as he usually does when i am meditating, so i lay him in my lap and he will happily lay there and watch me. He seems to enjoy it and he is so quiet while i'm in the meditation i am doing. :)
Side note...Some say Shaman cannot be empath.... I disagree... you must shield, but can be done....What do y'all think??? My thoughts... I would think that being empath would only help and not hinder. I am not sure about sheilding as i am only new at it and am still trying to figure out how to 'drive' so to speak.

In the serene moonlight
Spirit Wind

[WolfMoon]

Yanno, it looks like we're a ting group...but we're connecting so well! This is great to see, this thread has such a good feel to it! :floating:

[Nighthawk]

So do I.... I love this little group...and it ties in so well with the class that I feel I should have done Shaman.... Oh well.. we shall all learn and become friends and have a really good time here....THEN we can do Shaman

[Nighthawk]

I was thinking on using the words in touch but it seemed to not be deep enough. You know what I mean?We shall learn, I guess.... I could not find better words either...

[spirit wind]

Yanno, it looks like we're a ting group...but we're connecting so well! This is great to see, this thread has such a good feel to it! :floating:I really agree with you there Wolfmoon :) I have met some new people here which i most likely would never have talked to otherwise. And this thread does have an awesome feel to it. Must be why i keep coming back...


Spirit Wind

[PeleRising]

Hello

I'll pose a few questions for everyone. Do you often feel like you hold others at arm's length, almost subconsciously? Do you often have trouble fitting in with the rest?

Yes and yes... I often feel alone in the midst of a great crowd :)

My question back to all, why do you think this is?

I am different errr unique ... I dont feel as if I fit in... Its always been that way... me on the outside looking in. The quiet one... the shy one~ also for me sometimes I can pick up how others are feeling, not their exact feelings and causes.. but overwhelming emotions... anger sadness etc... especially in large crowds... That causes me to feel hemmed in and trapped. Is this what you are asking for? I feel a bit like I should bring a couch lol

I MUST have alone time to be a rational and functional person. Most of my alone time is reading or being outside. I have always been one to be an outdoors person, and have a very green thumb. I am fascinated by water and feel like I am dying inside if I am not around it somewhere, of some type.


Oh this is me to a tee... If I dont have alone time i get overly stressed... I need to be by myself to regroup. But rather then water... I am drawn to the wind and the earth :)

[Nighthawk]

my dear.... bring a couch if you wish. No area can be explored without opening doors to another. Is it counseling? Yes. Is it discovery? Yes. Will you like it? Not always. Will it change you forever? I hope so.





Hello



Yes and yes... I often feel alone in the midst of a great crowd :)



I am different errr unique ... I dont feel as if I fit in... Its always been that way... me on the outside looking in. The quiet one... the shy one~ also for me sometimes I can pick up how others are feeling, not their exact feelings and causes.. but overwhelming emotions... anger sadness etc... especially in large crowds... That causes me to feel hemmed in and trapped. Is this what you are asking for? I feel a bit like I should bring a couch lol



Oh this is me to a tee... If I dont have alone time i get overly stressed... I need to be by myself to regroup. But rather then water... I am drawn to the wind and the earth :)

[MoonLyte]

[QUOTE=PeleRising]

I am different errr unique ... I dont feel as if I fit in... Its always been that way... me on the outside looking in. The quiet one... the shy one~ also for me sometimes I can pick up how others are feeling, not their exact feelings and causes.. but overwhelming emotions... anger sadness etc... especially in large crowds... That causes me to feel hemmed in and trapped.
/[QUOTE]

Oh my goodness,that is me you're describing!!!
Always,always felt as if i was just observing life rather than participating.So nice to know it's not just me!!!

[RubyRose]

Wow, this thread is certainly progressing.

[WolfMoon]

Oh this is me to a tee... If I dont have alone time i get overly stressed... I need to be by myself to regroup. But rather then water... I am drawn to the wind and the earth :)

It's wind for me also! Wind and woods, those are my two. Maybe not surprisingly, but water scares horribly scares me...love looking at it, love being near it, not too fond of being in it. (Also claustrophobic...for me, watching Titanic was like watching a horror movie...eeep!)

[MoonLyte]

Being a water sign,i find mine is water in many ways,just love walking in the rain,and letting it wash over me,and washing away all my woes.
Also earth though,i'm happiest when sitting in the woods.nature is very important to me.

[Nighthawk]

Oh my, I love to see the communication here.... I did not like 'Titanic' at all either... and I see Earthchild has a beautiful new avatar.... Osho zen deck art, huh?

[MoonLyte]

It's beautiful isn't it.Couldn't stand looking at myself any longer. :lol:
Aside from that,i can't believe how much people feel as i do.Always thought i was odd,weird etc,but now i see i'm not.Maybe i'm just destined for other things,i dunno.Not saying i'm special or anything,just it's almost as if i was adopted into my family cos i'm so not like any of them.I look so much deeper into things than they do,i know they think i'm a bit odd.But now i see i'm not.
Here,i feel i belong at last.

[Nighthawk]

Yes, it is beautiful..but i never minded looking at your pic either.... You are beyond them... Worry not. You will soon find your destiny...

[MoonLyte]

I am hoping so..searching for so long,in so many places,but i was drawn here for a reason i know.i know i need to be patient.

[spirit wind]

Today i had the most interesting... Day dream? not sure. I have these quite often but have not understood them and usually never take much notice of them. I was sitting on the couch and just staring into space (i was tired and trying not to fall asleep) when all of a sudden i was jolted out of my 'little world' by the baby crying. But, this time i actually remembered what what was happening. I was in a small town, talking to some people (not sure what about exactly) and we were all at a truckstop (i think) but not a big truckstop and there were cars and (what we call) utes pulling out of this place to go somwhere. On the back of this one ute was words in large letters saying something like.... " You will know" or maybe " You know what to do" It's a bit hazy right now.
Does anyone know what this might have been? I am not sure of it myself and have been thinking about it all afternoon. When this happens to me, i know i have lost time. Sometimes it could be 5 minutes and others it could be up to half an hour. Would anyone be able to point me in the right direction so i can delve deeper into this?

Thanks

In the cold of night
Spirit Wind

[Shanti]

I call that 'walking in 2 realms at once'. I consider it just that. Being in this reality and in another at the same time. You may discover a way to do this at will. What that other reality is, only you know. It may be past life of yours, or someone elses. May be a future or parellel time line. It may not even be a timeline. It may messages for you to figure out, you may be being guided. As for being told you know and etc....you will know as you learn and explore this area of consciousness. You will know how to do whatever it is.
We all hold the key to knowing purpose of things. We only need to explore, ask questions while in that realm and let your intution and heart guide you.

Your intution is your biggest teacher.

This is the best opinion I have on the matter.

[Michie]

Hi, I'm new, and I have just caught up on all 14 pages. :)

I've often been drawn to Native American things...but confess I don't know a lot about them.

I have social anxiety...a fear of social situations, and basically people...and have always been very shy. I have been called unique, and have been told that I think very differently.

I have always had an odd sense of feeling about what I guess you would call my spirit. Sometimes I feel like what makes me me, my essence...is floating around in this body, but that they aren't necessarily connected. I relate it to the idea of the "ghost in the machine" does that make any sense?

I am also very, very, very drawn to water. I always have a sense of "coming home" when I am at the ocean. It is a place that calms me, and speaks to me. Oddly enough, even though I love water and love swimming, I am terrified of drowning. I can only imagine that I have a healthy respect for the element.

Every year my husband and I go to a renne faire that is held in the woods...this is another place where I usually feel very at peace.

Anyway, just wanted to pop in and say hello.

[Deranged Hermit]

Hi Michie. I don't post here often, I mostly observe, but I just wanted to welcome you, incase everyone else is offline. I have social anxiety too, so bad it crosses over even to here, so if my posts sound funny or distant, don't be scared off. :hugz:

[Nighthawk]

Hey, you guys... thank you.... SW...wonderful day dream... good stuff, and Shanti.... good, good reply... thanks..
Welcome Michie, nice to meet ya
DH...Judy.. I think you are great... I do not see a problem...

[spirit wind]

I call that 'walking in 2 realms at once'. I consider it just that. Being in this reality and in another at the same time. You may discover a way to do this at will. What that other reality is, only you know. It may be past life of yours, or someone elses. May be a future or parellel time line. It may not even be a timeline. It may messages for you to figure out, you may be being guided. As for being told you know and etc....you will know as you learn and explore this area of consciousness. You will know how to do whatever it is.
We all hold the key to knowing purpose of things. We only need to explore, ask questions while in that realm and let your intution and heart guide you.

Your intution is your biggest teacher.

This is the best opinion I have on the matter.Thank you Shanti :) It has made a little more sense of what is happening. I think maybe i am becoming more aware of what is going on around me these days. I can't exactly do it 'at will' but if i sit down and make it a point of going through the process of getting to this state, then most of the time i can do it. If i try to hard then it just doesn't happen. I plan on exploring this and seeing if i can go further with it. Not sure what 'further' means right now. But i am willing to see what happens. Thank you

Hi Michie :) Nice to see you here. I am also very, very, very drawn to water. I always have a sense of "coming home" when I am at the ocean. It is a place that calms me, and speaks to me. Oddly enough, even though I love water and love swimming, I am terrified of drowning. I can only imagine that I have a healthy respect for the element.
I also have a debilitating fear of drowning. I can sit by the ocean or a lake, pond, river or such. But i can't bring myself to go in it. Sometimes, i can wade in up to my knees but after about 10 minutes, i have to get out. I am more drawn to Earth and wind as i can sit in the bush and just listen to the wind for hours. To me it is music. I even have cd's that have just that on it (no actual man made music) so when i can't get out i can be still inside.

DH! Your posts could never sound "funny or distant". And i am sure we all understand. Make your presence know when you feel you are able to :)

In the cool of the morning
Spirit Wind

[Shanti]

Thank You NH.
Your Welcome SW.
:) :)

[Deranged Hermit]

I also have a debilitating fear of drowning. I can sit by the ocean or a lake, pond, river or such. But i can't bring myself to go in it. Sometimes, i can wade in up to my knees but after about 10 minutes, i have to get out. I am more drawn to Earth and wind as i can sit in the bush and just listen to the wind for hours. To me it is music. I even have cd's that have just that on it (no actual man made music) so when i can't get out i can be still inside.

DH! Your posts could never sound "funny or distant". And i am sure we all understand. Make your presence know when you feel you are able to :)

In the cool of the morning
Spirit Wind

That's exactly how I feel about the water, I just didn't know how to put it into words. I also feel the same about earth and wind.

And thanks for understanding.
:)

[Michie]

Hi Michie. I don't post here often, I mostly observe, but I just wanted to welcome you, incase everyone else is offline. I have social anxiety too, so bad it crosses over even to here, so if my posts sound funny or distant, don't be scared off. :hugz:

Thanks for the welcome, and it is nice to know someone else who can understand the social anxiety. :hugz:

It is funny...I am terrified of drowning, but I love being in the water. I will be in or around the water as often as possible. I have been compared to a dolphin or a fish for how much I enjoy the water...yet at the same time one of my biggest fears is drowning, probably because of not being able to breathe. I also have sleep apnea, which means I stop breathing sometimes at night, so maybe it stems from that too. Anything that could cut off my breathing really scares me.

[Nighthawk]

You people are communicating so well... and I am honored by it. I can feel the love between you all.... There is a long road ahead..but we will learn many, many things...If you are afraid of water, you might have drowned..and that is the collective. I have lost my legs at some point. We will work through this..if I am allowed in the class..since most of you are in the class anyway.... and Judy, you are doing just fine... THIS is one of the thinngs you are to learn.. You will come out of your shell...I can almost promise this to you...

[spirit wind]

I'm not in the class, but i am watching and sort of going along with you guys. The brain is slowly awakening and it is an awesome feeling. I will be signing up for the next one though.

[Nighthawk]

It is fine...but you could still sign up... it will not be hard... The biggest thing you need to learn is to listen to your heart. this is all I really ask... You can choose either... no problem either way, my friend.

[PeleRising]

It's wind for me also! Wind and woods, those are my two. Maybe not surprisingly, but water scares horribly scares me...love looking at it, love being near it, not too fond of being in it.


I am also very, very, very drawn to water. I always have a sense of "coming home" when I am at the ocean. It is a place that calms me, and speaks to me. Oddly enough, even though I love water and love swimming, I am terrified of drowning. I can only imagine that I have a healthy respect for the element.


I also have a debilitating fear of drowning. I can sit by the ocean or a lake, pond, river or such. But i can't bring myself to go in it. Sometimes, i can wade in up to my knees but after about 10 minutes, i have to get out. I am more drawn to Earth and wind as i can sit in the bush and just listen to the wind for hours.

That's exactly how I feel about the water, I just didn't know how to put it into words. I also feel the same about earth and wind.

Does anyone else find this very interesting... I too love being near the ocean/water... the wind hitting my face.. the sound of the surf... the sound of the gull...it calms and restores me but I feel positively ill getting in it. I can wade a bit... but not for long before i have this very strong compulsion to get out immediately... I too fear drowning... although its no where near as bad at the lake...

[Shanti]

Ok I would like to go on a road that may or may not be a thought others will agree with but here it goes.

Fear of drowning. Actually it is very logical. You can die. This we know, period. Fear isnt always what we preseave. Fear is a part of survival instinct. Some animals will fear water because its survival instinct tells it that it is not an animal designed to deal with water and it can die. Its survival instinct/fear will stop it from crossing water.

Fear of hights is the same thing. Some people do not have the same fears as others..makes us unique, but also some people are capable of passing their instincts and solely go on their own desire and will.

Anyhow, these are called rational fears. There is a reason for the fear that is logical. They are also the most common fear. To find a couple here who share the fear of water/drowning, I dont find unusal because it is a common fear.

This is my perspective. :)

[Nighthawk]

Hmmm, taking all this in.... keep going, please.

[Shanti]

Ok.

I stated my views on rational fears. I would like to state questions to irrational fears, also known as phobias !!!!!!!!!!!!

Phobias can not be explained with logic.
You are afraid of lets say the dark. You turn on the light and you are fine. Turn off the light and fear. You know there is nothing to be afraid of but you feel fear.

Fog. No reason to feel fear but when you see it you are afraid and you dont know why.

A snake. Its on the t.v. and yet you scream and are scared big time!!!!

Why?

Are these fears from past lives? Are they from the collective consciousness? Are they from a differant realm, time, demension?

Are they manifestations of something in this timeline and life? Physical? mental? spiritual?

Are they manifistations of something from another realm, time, place?

The possibilities are endless!!

[Nighthawk]

I said I would learn.....

[MoonLyte]

Oh wow,i missed so much while i was sleeping!!!
welcome Michie,yea i also suffer social anxiety so you're among friends here. :)

[argento_occhi]

i just freak out when any sort of invertebrate gets near me, spiders especially. not fond of jellyfish, poisonous snakes and other sea creatures that aren't fish or cartilaginous fish. if it's got a backbone, i'm usually ok. but if i even think for a moment that there's a spider somewhere in my room, i won't be able to sleep. that's about the only fear i can put down. i was afraid of the dark, but i taught myself out of that one.

[Shanti]

but i taught myself out of that one. I love it. That line says so much for the human condition. We can teach ourselves out of all sorts of stuff. Awsome way to word it. Good one agento_occhi!!! :)

[argento_occhi]

yep, the one time a blackout actually did some good! within a week, i was sleeping in the dark, no nightlight or anything.

[spirit wind]

I have heard, maybe read somewhere, that an irrational fear may be from a past life. Like a fear of heights could mean that in a past life you died from falling from high. I also have this fear of great heights.... Ok, well not great heights, but if i get any higher than a few centimeters of the ground i feel ill and my body shakes and i start crying. Yet i am ok on an airplane, i just don't look out the window :) LOL
With water, i 'feel' something in my bones. It tells me to get out!!!! I am a great swimmer, swam all through childhood. Once i hit adulthood, that was it. No more. I get in sometimes, but only if i can see the bottom and the water is placid.

NH, i went to that store i was talking about at the markets near me. It is called Wolf Spirit and it isn't online. And i was so happy :) They have all new stock in and i was so happy just looking through everything. But i didn't stay long though as the guy that was there today had some real bad energy around him and everytime he spoke or i looked at him, i got angry and felt agitated. So i high tailed it out of there. Not before buying something though :lol:

It's so cold...
Spirit Wind

[DragonflySpirit]

O'siyo, (Greetings Brothers and Sisters)

I have been watching from behind the fire for a while, learning your ways. As way of introduction - I am an eclectic old soul, more Crone than Mother - though the years don't show it, very much the Willow of my birth and even more the Hare. Gentle and bending, nurturing and compassionate but with a soul as proud and true as any Oak or Eldar. But let this not be taken as a prideful spirit - simply one of honor for those who brought me to where I am today. Centuries removed from my McBride and Cherokee family, I am still a child of the open moonlit night and rolling hills of green. My magick has no color - no lines of cage to bind it - but I am most closely connected with the ancient Pictish Arts and the Red Road of Shamanism - both solitary paths of the Earth and Her elements. I have been walking this Path for over 14 years and every day learn more.

I have seen much here that intrigues me and look forward to the conversations!

Namaste (I honor the place in you in which the entire universe dwells.)

~*~ DragonflySpirit ~*~
I am a Child of the Universe;
No less than the trees and stars;
I have a right to be here....
"Desiderata"

[PeleRising]

:wave: Hi DragonflySpirit. Welcome :)


My fear of the Ocean I believe has to do with two things... 1) its power... that same power that makes me feel safe on land at its shores... and yet frightens me when i am in its pulling embrace. You step into that cold realm... and it touches you.. and the sand, the earth beneath your feet pulls away. Its almost like being told ... choose... one or the other. 2) I know I drowned in the ocean in a past life. I remember the feeling of being trapped :(

I just find it interesting that there are a few of us who are drawn to the earth and wind... also like to be near the water... but frightened to be in it. Wouldnt it stand to reason that if you are afraid of something you wouldnt enjoy being near it?

I just find it very odd in my life that being close to the ocean brings such peace... but if i get in that same water it scares me. I never knew others felt the same way... :) That was what I found so very interesting

[argento_occhi]

i won't swim in the ocean. i'll happily swim in pools, indoor or out, but i won't swim in the ocea. i used to as a id, but i think i got sick of swallowing sea water, and now i avoid it. it doesn't scare me, as such. i just don't like it.

[Deranged Hermit]

I just find it interesting that there are a few of us who are drawn to the earth and wind... also like to be near the water... but frightened to be in it. Wouldnt it stand to reason that if you are afraid of something you wouldnt enjoy being near it?

I just find it very odd in my life that being close to the ocean brings such peace... but if i get in that same water it scares me. I never knew others felt the same way... :) That was what I found so very interesting

Yeah I agree with you here. I know lots of people who are afraid of the water, but they just don't go anywhere near it. They have no desire to be near a lake or an ocean. Unlike us. :)

[argento_occhi]

i don't mind being near a lake or the ocean or whatever. i just completely object to going in the ocean.

[MoonLyte]

I love sitting near water,closing my eyes and being swept away.think the only reason i don't like going in is because i'm not a strong swimmer.i have a stronger fear of fire,for some reason i'm terrified i'm gonna be trapped,even though i've never actually been in one.

[Crystal_Raye]

Sadly, I've been slacking off, so I'm pushing myself to get motivated again.

Here, let my do it for you *lightly boots you in the behind*.

[SylverStar]

*wanders in*

Hmmm, I've never really looked into Native American Religions. As far as leaning towards the shaman way of things I guess I wouldn't know really. Never really studied any of it. But Nature is the predominant part of my religion. The elements, and animism, and panthesism. Meditation and scrying, and personal rites of passage. I also have a brown bear as a spirit guide right now. When I was younger I had The white Tiger as a animal gaurdian. I don't know maybe the bear is my totem, never asked him the difference. ^_^

[Rowan MoonDragon]

K. I just finished reading this entire thread and I have to say I found home! Reading all of the posts...most of them are me. I always felt, and still do, out of place. I feel like I dont belong anywhere. I'm drawn to Shamanisn ALOT. At first I thought it was becasue its my heritage. My great grandmother was a full blooded Cherokee. but I could be wrong. I dont know. This is going to sound really really silly, but sometimes I'm outside and I just want to cry becasue its so beautiful. My hubby and I have 44 acres and although the area is becoming populated (we're not in the middle of nowhere-so to speak), its just awesome. I cant explain it. I sometimess feel really stupid for crying at the beauty but I cant help it. I"m just in awe of it all. And its funny about the why you have to have a building for god thing because I've felt like this all of my life. I think that's one of the reasons why I steered myself away from Christianity as a kid. It just didn't feel right to me. Its really nice to know I'm not alone. Thanks guys. (ok-on the verge of tears right now-=OP )

[Shanti]

Oh that wonderful bond with nature. It actually feels as if you are living from its energy. The feelings of oneness, awh, and passion. They do run deep. I get frustated because it seems so few people feel it. You know ..a tree is just a tree...not to me.
It is a life force all it own. It feels, it breaths and I can feel it. Beautiful. I am lucky.
We all are.

[GryphonGirl]

Well here I am, I don't get alot of time to hang out here...but I signed up for the Tribal/Collective Memory class, and I am soooo drawn to Shamanism, I can only guess why. I think I have some native heritage in this life, and some collective memory from before.......I feel so at home with the people who have into this thread, and with the folks who have come to "make a home" here at MW......

[Shanti]

Here is a simple deffinition of shamanism. I have a feeling that some people have read this thread and did not know the deffinition and would of liked to know.

Roger N. Walsh, M.D., PhD. defines Shamanism as follows: "Shamanism can be defined as a family of traditions whose Practitioners focus on voluntarily entering altered states of consciousness in which they experience themselves or their spirit[s], traveling to other realms at will, and interacting with other entities.

I stopped there because the deffenition goes on from ancient ways to modern practise and I feel some have come to this thread just to ask what is a shaman or shamanism and looked for the answer but didnt find it. A simple answer to sum it up.

I hoped I help the people I feel, came and asked.

Your welcome.

[Michie]

The interesting thing to me is that not only do I love the ocean, but I love to be in it too. I love pretty much anything relating to the water or water sports. I also love pools, lakes, waterfalls...I even climbed a waterfall in Jamaica on my honeymoon. Yet as much as I love it, I am afraid very much of drowning. Perhaps it is just a rational fear of something that could happen. I have just lately decided that it is a way of remembering respect for the element, and to be responsible while you are enjoying it.

Lately I have also felt like I would like to have wings...this is a new thing for me to be drawn to lately. And yet I realized recently that I have a picture in the living room of dolphins hovering over the ocean, so that they look almost like clouds...and it is entitled, "dolphin dreams." Since I LOVE dolphins, I found it interesting that I am suddenly drawn to both the ocean and to the idea of flying...

And now I'm rambling... :)

[DragonflySpirit]

I too share a slight trepidation about the open ocean - beautiful to behold but I give it a healthy respect - before travelling on water - I always ask that the Guardians of the Sea grant me safe passage and leave them an offering before and on my return. As for swimming in it - not really but it is more my affinity for attracting jellyfish and being stung more than anything else - and although I feel safe in the "not drowning" aspect - I am by fore more attracted to the glens and glades of the forest than the Sea. That said I do still do alot of work with both fresh and salt water - especially in cleansing rites.

[spirit wind]

Welcome Dragonflyspirit. :)

1) its power... that same power that makes me feel safe on land at its shores... and yet frightens me when i am in its pulling embrace. You step into that cold realm... and it touches you.. and the sand, the earth beneath your feet pulls away. Its almost like being told ... choose... one or the other. That was said so well PeleRising! I so agree with that.
I just finished reading this entire thread and I have to say I found home! Welcome home Gaia. Come sit by the fire with us and share your story too. And nothing here sounds 'silly' we are all learning from each other. I also understand how you feel about nature and crying because she is so beautiful. I cry now because the home i live in is surrounded by concrete and bricks. I think it would be awesome to be able to go out your back door and see the beautiful trees and just sit with them to listen to their story.

Even though i have the fear of staying in the water, my best meditations are done while sitting on a quiet stretch of beach. The water's song lulls me better than anything else. And not only the water, but i can meditate really well in the bush too. The sound of the wind through the trees and the animals noises and those bush smells!!! there is nothing comparable to it. :)

[Nighthawk]

Keep it up...you guys are sharing, and that is reallly good...!!!!!!

[SylverStar]

Ok I just jumped in in the middle of the thread and didn't read anything before. I have a really bad habit of doing that. So were we suppose to be saying something specific?

On the def. that Shanti said. I would think that there would be more to go along with that. Something along the lines of nature being included. Hmm. As for altered states of mind, well I believe that's where alot of learning can take place.

[Shanti]

Ok I just jumped in in the middle of the thread and didn't read anything before. I have a really bad habit of doing that. So were we suppose to be saying something specific?

On the def. that Shanti said. I would think that there would be more to go along with that. Something along the lines of nature being included. Hmm. As for altered states of mind, well I believe that's where alot of learning can take place.
Oh theres is so much more than that...volumes more, yes. I put this short quick version in because I felt there were some people that were looking for just that. People who never really heard the word or if they did, asked themselves, whats that?, and then moved on. People that dont want to post, just want to know...whats that?

[SylverStar]

Ah ok. ^_^

[Nighthawk]

Wow!!! Keep it up, guys.... come on....

[Gala]

Well I just found this thread.
I didn't read the entire thing. My eyes are falling shut and though the semester is almost over I still have to get up early.
So... I am not (or seem so to myself) a stand offish person. Maybe at first. But I want to take everyone in and hold them and make them better--well--happy.
People tend to shy away from me. I don't know why. Most people who don't know me, I think they think I'm stuck up or something. But I am far from it.
But I am an enigma. I don't fit most sterotypes except for pisces.

I think very fast too. But it does bother me when someone does it to me. I work with a woman for three years and she has yet to let me finish a sentence.
So I can understand if it bothers other people.


this is going back to some of the beginning posts,so forgive please.

I never thought about my taking part in Shamanism, until ( and don't laugh) I took a survey in a book called "How Psychic are You" or something like that. And the results were that I would be suited to Shamanism.
So That sparked an interest.
Ok.. I have to go. Falling asleep here. not making sense.

[Nighthawk]

My kind of person...... well... read and enjoy the thread... It kind of goes with the class, but it does not have to...

[fireswimmer]

I started reading this thread yesterday morning and have finished it now. I wanted to read the entire thing before posting. I am often willing to jump in th emiddle, but not this time... I am nto sure why.

I am interested in Shamanism but not becoming a Shaman. I have a friend who follows a shamanistic path and he did a soul retrieval for me. That was absolutely wonderful and terrifying all at the same time. I have learned so much from him and I appreciate him, but it is not my path. When we had a Shaman come in and speak during my Alternative Therapies class (College credit not community) I did nto like her. She had taken classes and studied but I did nto like her. I actually thought that she was just a little on the dangerous side. She talked about journeying and was very adament about the fact that what she met was friendly. She journeyed without someone drumming to help bring her back.

My friend taught me that you tend to attract what you are in the spirit realm as opposed to your opposite in this realm. That saddened me a bit because it made me realize that I have a lot of darkness in me. It was also one of the first major steps in bringing myself together and not being embarrassed by that darker side. I think that when you choose to do things like journey that you have to be aware of who you are.

One man that I met In Mexico left an impression on me that I will never forget. I was on a college trip to see some of the Mayan ruins in the Yucatan peninsula. The woman who wrote the text book we were using happened to he there with a student of hers. The book followed six families, I am sorry in that I can neither find it nor remember the title, and she set up arrangements for us to meet with the elders in small groups. Each group got to meet with one elder. He was an elder, he was not called a shaman, and I know that in the Mayan culture being a shaman is a very specific thing. He just had that feel to me.

I love being around people like that. I have a draw to nature. I love being by the water and by the fire. Those are my two major elements. I read a lot but not alot about spirituality. I do not seem able to learn from books. I prefer to learn by talking to the spirits and feeling what is out there. I make mistakes but in general I have learned how to follow my instincts. I do nto seem able to follow other people's writings. I feel like I live in a world full of spirits and it is awesome to experience them.

There have been discussions on feeling like you are on the outside looking in. I used to feel that way. I felt that way for years and years, but in the past 8 years I have worked on allowing myself to be me. Now people will tease me abotu being odd, but it is friendly. My friends pick on me and I pick back. We laugh about so many things. I laugh at the things that are so different in me, or at least discuss them with a smile. People started asking questions and I started opening up. I have a small group of very close friends but I have learned that I can be happy in larger groups of people as well. I never expected to be a person that people gravitate torwards, but I am noticing that happening.

Well, I did not realize that I was goign to type for so long. I am slighly embarrassed for running at the mouth so to speak. Thank you you for providing such an interesting thread. I look forward to it continuing.

Fireswimmer

[Gala]

just one thing Fireswimmer, I skimmed your letter b/c I ahve to run off to work, but
the dark side.
We all have it.
It is part of us.
Nighthawk. don't we need to accept it?--embrace it.
Don't Campbell and Jung talk about that?

[Nighthawk]

just one thing Fireswimmer, I skimmed your letter b/c I ahve to run off to work, but
the dark side.
We all have it.
It is part of us.
Nighthawk. don't we need to accept it?--embrace it.
Don't Campbell and Jung talk about that?

Do we need to accept it and embrace it? .. Hmmm, accept but work on... embrace, well... I guess a bit, for it shows that we are multi faceted. Or, were you asking me something else?

[Shanti]

If I may, I'd like to contribute my thoughts on the aspect of our darkside.

We all have good and bad as we humans perceive it.
I dont think it is so much as embracing it as it is learning to walk in balance.
When we walk in balance we are the best of our over-all persona.
To me, if we lean to much to the good side, we can leave ourselves volunerable.
To much on the dark and we may hurt ourselves or someone else.
But when balanced we can equally give and receive without harshness or volunerabilitiy.
And we need both sides to have balance.

[Nighthawk]

If I may, I'd like to contribute my thoughts on the aspect of our darkside.

We all have good and bad as we humans perceive it.
I dont think it is so much as embracing it as it is learning to walk in balance.
When we walk in balance we are the best of our over-all persona.
To me, if we lean to much to the good side, we can leave ourselves volunerable.
To much on the dark and we may hurt ourselves or someone else.
But when balanced we can equally give and receive without harshness or volunerabilitiy.
And we need both sides to have balance.
What she said....

[JWill0ws]

It is so hard to read such a long thread, so forgive me if I repeat...

I have been attracted to this path for 15 years. I met a Shaman when I was 14/15. One of my mentors when I was 18/19 was a shaman also. My house is decorated with Native american art and I have always felt drawn to the practices and theologies of the shaman. I feel honored to have met these people in my life and to know that there are such here on MW - warms my heart. :)

I went on several spirit journeys and have a great relationship with my totem - spirit animal guides. I have always felt shamanism focused on nature and the respect of every living thing having a purpose, a soul, a meaning. You belong to this earth as much as the cockroach (sp). I always felt that the purpose of journeying and learning in the shaman way - was to find the inner peace in your part in this world we all live in - no matter how small it may be - it is meaningful and necessary. Therefore, you should respect yourself as well as respect all creatures big and small.

This is what I have learned so far. It seems small and brief - but it feels to me to be huge and intimate.

Thanks for starting this thread :)

[Nighthawk]

It is so hard to read such a long thread, so forgive me if I repeat...

I have been attracted to this path for 15 years. I met a Shaman when I was 14/15. One of my mentors when I was 18/19 was a shaman also. My house is decorated with Native american art and I have always felt drawn to the practices and theologies of the shaman. I feel honored to have met these people in my life and to know that there are such here on MW - warms my heart. :)

I went on several spirit journeys and have a great relationship with my totem - spirit animal guides. I have always felt shamanism focused on nature and the respect of every living thing having a purpose, a soul, a meaning. You belong to this earth as much as the cockroach (sp). I always felt that the purpose of journeying and learning in the shaman way - was to find the inner peace in your part in this world we all live in - no matter how small it may be - it is meaningful and necessary. Therefore, you should respect yourself as well as respect all creatures big and small.

This is what I have learned so far. It seems small and brief - but it feels to me to be huge and intimate.

Thanks for starting this thread :)
Also. I think it is part of the way of the path... to see nature. To love nature and all it beholds. It is good to connect with our Earth mother.

[JWill0ws]

and also to understand - as with the dark side discussion here - that all has it's purpose. As with nature - what is good can only be understood with what is bad. It is a delicate, necessary balance that should be respected and reverred (sp). The best way, I think is to explain it the way the shaman explained it to me:

"If a Martian was to come down to earth and have dinner with you, and the Martian asks why you don't like cabbage - how do you clearly explain to the Martian why? The easiest - closest way to helping the Martian to clearly understand - is to explain what it isn't. This is why there are good and bad things in nature - understanding, balance, and clarity."

I truly didn't understand that until recently.

[Nighthawk]

Hmmm, true.. it is all about balance.. when you strip away the foo fra, the buildings, the books.. on and on, it is about balance and how to walk in it. yes.

[JWill0ws]

:D

I am so glad I was able to pass what he told me along. He was such a wise man -each year - I realise that more and more.

[Nighthawk]

I would have to agree... those elders.. they know their stuff.

[JWill0ws]

Boy, do they!! And you can never learn too much when you are blessed with knowing one.

[Nighthawk]

I sat at the feet of some, and marvelled

[Gala]

If I may, I'd like to contribute my thoughts on the aspect of our darkside.

We all have good and bad as we humans perceive it.
I dont think it is so much as embracing it as it is learning to walk in balance.
When we walk in balance we are the best of our over-all persona.
To me, if we lean to much to the good side, we can leave ourselves volunerable.
To much on the dark and we may hurt ourselves or someone else.
But when balanced we can equally give and receive without harshness or volunerabilitiy.
And we need both sides to have balance.


yep that's what I meant....

[SylverStar]

On the whole balance thing also. What is bad has a good side and what is good has a bad side. I don't think any one thing is truely evil or truely good.

When Mt. St. Helens Blew it was a disaster, but it turned out to produce art, humanity, and it also help the crops more than it hurt.

[Nighthawk]

I agree...but the paint on my car did not like it.. ha ha

[fireswimmer]

I so appreciate the elders that I have met. Without their guidance I would probably not be here today. I have a few questions to put out there. I have read the definition that was given of Shamanism. I would like to say that Shanti posted it but I am not entirely positive. The culture that I am attracted to the most is the Maya. My spiritual path became so clear when I sat by the sacred well. That may have been the first tiem that I felt completely connected with the universe. The first time when I realized that I was nto alone and I was not a freak. There were others who shared my beliefs. It was okay that I could nto put a name to the beliefs that I held, others had held them for centuries, and still did.

Is Shamanism a general belief or is it specific? To clarify that let me explain that for the Maya the Shaman is at the top of the heirarchy. There are a lot of people beneath them in the heirarchy that share the same belief system but the Shaman is the one with the knowledge and power to work with things that those beneath them have failed at.

I feel like I share many of the beliefs that I see discussed here but I do not think that I am anywhere near qualified enough to say that I am on a Shamanistic path. I am on a path that blends healing and fighting. I am on a path that includes seeking balance both within the microcosm of myself and the macrocosm of the universe. I want to be balanced within and without.

I talk to the spirits and I feel the spirits. I love living in a world that is inhabited by so many spirits. I belief that everything has a spirit wether it is animate or inanimate. I do nto truly believe in gods or goddesses. I've been asked how I could feel so strongly about the Maya and not believe in their gods but I noticed when I listened to the Maya that the spirits ruled the daily life much more than the gods. I have further researched that and it seems to be that the spirits are more for the masses and the gods are more for the Shamans.

Perhaps that is one reason why I say that Shamanism is not my path. Perhaps I also have some wounds from my view of an omnipotent God with a plan that I found so horrid as a child.

Thank you for the comments on the darker side. I am comfortable with most of mine. It took me years to be able to integrate it as part of me rather than fighting with it. There are just a few things left that I fight with.

Thank you for such a wonderful thread
Fireswimmer

[WHITE EAGLE +++]

Did you see my post earlier (i think it is on page two) about feeling energy from the posts here at MW? That is how it has come through to me. Did that make any sense? :)

Spirit Wind


Hail to all! It is a pleasure to meet those of like mind. I havn't read through all teh posts for this thead but I must say that this thread was the very first thing I have responded to and it grabbed me instantly, so yes I agree with Spirit Winds observation about "feeling energy from posts". (FYI the only stuff I usually post or check are the tarot readings I do here at MW under Oracle of Faries team, in which i tune into the person asking the question by keeping thier member page open coincidently)


I also wanted to tell WolfMoon that I am also drawn very heavily and more recently to Nordic mythology, Asatru and including the power of the Runes and was wondering if any one knew of a logical connection. Perhaps it is the Shamanic relation that is exsistant cross culturally?
_____________________________________________________________
"I'm kind of a weird mix...I've mostly been studying Nordic teachings, but the nature of shamanism really appeals to me a lot.

Sadly, I've been slacking off, so I'm pushing myself to get motivated again."
Originally posted by WolfMoon _____________________________________________________________

Regardless Im here and anxious to discover what forces have called us to meet like this in the MW forum.


Blessings,

White Eagle's Little Cub +++

[Nighthawk]

Very nice to see you post, White Eagle... I believe this thread is very alive. I feel each person seems like a finger on a hand.... and together, they comple