Sun & Moon

[mucgwyrt]

I have long been tripping overmyself, sure that Ing was the god of the Sun and in Anglo-Saxon lore not just Sun-Shine as in Norse, but constantly being corrected by Mothwench as the Norse believed that the sun was feminine and the moon masculine.

However I've recently come across an anglo-saxon text which refers to the moon as "she", inferring then, that the anglo-saxons believed as we do, that the moon is feminine and the sun masculine.

Somewhere along the line there has been a change, and I do wonder how much the Celts and the Romano-Celts influenced this change and anglo-saxon culture in general? :confused:

Just wanted to share :cheers:

[mothwench]

i was thinking about this, recently...
so the norse sun and moon deities are called sunna and mani, or variations of such. however, as far as i can see, these figures do not represent the actual celestial bodies sun and moon, they are the driving force behind their motion.
sunna drives the sun chariot and mani sets the course of the moon (i haven't been able to find a reference as to how?)

which anglo-saxon text was that you came across?

[Mòrag Elasaid Ní Dhòmhnaill]

Just wanted to point out that while the various Celtic peoples honored a sun god (Bel, Belenos, Beli Mawr, etc.) the sun itself was considered to be feminine, at least amongst the Gaels (Scots, Irish, and Manx). The word for sun was Grián, which is a feminine noun. Additionally the year was divided into two, that of the 'big sun' and 'little sun,' summer and winter respectively. The time of the little sun was known as Grianan.

[mucgwyrt]

i was thinking about this, recently...
so the norse sun and moon deities are called sunna and mani, or variations of such. however, as far as i can see, these figures do not represent the actual celestial bodies sun and moon, they are the driving force behind their motion.
sunna drives the sun chariot and mani sets the course of the moon (i haven't been able to find a reference as to how?)

which anglo-saxon text was that you came across?

It was a pagan text on dream divination according to the days of the month on which you have said dream (e.g. third moon of the month...). I dont think it's online anywhere though... :huh: it was in "aspects of anglo-saxon magic" by Bill Griffiths, by Anglo-Saxon Books

[mucgwyrt]

Just wanted to point out that while the various Celtic peoples honored a sun god (Bel, Belenos, Beli Mawr, etc.) the sun itself was considered to be feminine, at least amongst the Gaels (Scots, Irish, and Manx). The word for sun was Grián, which is a feminine noun. Additionally the year was divided into two, that of the 'big sun' and 'little sun,' summer and winter respectively. The time of the little sun was known as Grianan.

Mmm, so it's not Celtic Influence then.
Roman perhaps? Although the roman's had officially left, there was a strong Roman influence (culturally I mean) in the country at the time of the anglo-saxon's arrival...

[mothwench]

i just read something really interesting. in the second merseburg charm, frigg is named with her three sisters: sunna (sun), volla (abundance), and sinthgunt (night wanderer, moon)
i'll try and find a link in english, the one i have is in german: http://ahnensitte.net/goetter.htm

edited to add: weird. according to my old high german dictionary, sind means travel, drive and gunt means pus, sore. :wtf: errrr....

[Kern]

i just read something really interesting. in the second merseburg charm, frigg is named with her three sisters: sunna (sun), volla (abundance), and sinthgunt (night wanderer, moon)
i'll try and find a link in english, the one i have is in german: http://ahnensitte.net/goetter.htm

edited to add: weird. according to my old high german dictionary, sind means travel, drive and gunt means pus, sore. :wtf: errrr....
Any luck finding that English Link??????? :thief:

[mothwench]

yup. sorry it's a bit late, i just got back from my holiday. here's a link that has the original text, then a translation into modern german, then on the bottom there's the english translation.
http://www.angelfire.com/on/Wodensharrow/merseburg.html

[Kern]

Thanks Mothwench! :bigblue:

[Wodening]

I think what folks are failing to see here is that in the Germanic pantheons, there can be a moon goddesses, but yet there is THE moon god. The same is true of Sunna. You have Sunna who is THE sun goddess, but Frey or Frea (pick your tongue) who is a sun god. Thus you have Mona or Mani who is male, yet you have Sinthgunt who is female. That is just one of the many interesting things about Heathenry, its dieties are multi-facted.

Welga!
Swain

[mothwench]

then there is nott. which is damn confusing, cause apparently, nott is the goddess of night, and rides the chariot pulled by hrimfaxi and one of her sons is "day". here's a snippet from an article about norse cosmology: http://www.northvegr.org/intro/cosmology.php

Bergelmir's children lived in the world named Jotunheimr, to the easternmost side of the worlds. He had a son named Narfi, and his daughter was named Nott, or night. She was married to a Jotun named Naglfari, and their son was Aud. She next took a husband named Annar, and their daughter was Jorth, who was endowed with the energy of growth and fertility, and became a joy to mankind. Nott's final husband was Delling, or Dawn. Their son was Dagr, or the energy of daylight. Othinn asked Nott and her son Dagr to ride two splendid chariots around with the course of Sol, in order to make the day and night for mankind. Nott's horse is named Hrimfaxi, or 'frosty mane', and Dagr's is named Skinfaxi, or 'shining mane'. Sol's horses are named Arvak, the 'always awake', and Alsviðr, the 'all swift'.
so... are sunna and mani out of a job, or wha...? :huh:

[Mjollnir]

then there is nott. which is damn confusing, cause apparently, nott is the goddess of night, and rides the chariot pulled by hrimfaxi and one of her sons is "day". here's a snippet from an article about norse cosmology: http://www.northvegr.org/intro/cosmology.php

so... are sunna and mani out of a job, or wha...? :huh:


Sol is the sun goddess whereas Dagur is the personification of the day, same goes with Mani and Nott, Mani being the personification of the moon and Nott the personification of night

[Kern]

hmmm