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BrightStar
August 15th, 2001, 02:15 AM
Hi all!
Here in the town of Moore,Oklahoma all the grocery stores have closed except one in my part of town.We used to have some really cool,comfortable grocery stores.They were owned by local folks and the people were nice and helpful.Then Wally World opened a Walmart Neighborhood Market.They all went under,places that had served the community for years.I mean,the town already has a Wally World superstore that sells groceries.It put all the downtown guys out of business.I feel like that movie with Sly Stallone and Sandra Bullock,Demolition Man,where every place was Taco Bell.The people in the stores don't know anything,are not very helpful,and the whole place makes me rather uncomfortable.I won't shop there,but most people just feel there's really no choice.
Then there's a suburb of Oklahoma City called The Village.Walmart came in,they got the city to give them tax breaks by making all sorts of promises.Well,they set up in the town and ran everybody else out of business until the whole tax base was dependent on Wally World.Then Wally World decided to build a new place just across the street from the city limits and closed the old one.The people of the Village feel they may have gotten rheemed on this deal.
So,I got to thinkin.Is Wally World evil?
just my opinion
Peace and Love
BrightStar

Danustouch
August 15th, 2001, 02:36 AM
I'm beginning to dislike Walmart for differen't reasons. Mainly..it's policy on Music. It won't carry anything with a parental advisory label. And they give artists an ultimatum about it. "Change your lyric, song title, album cover..or we won't carry your product". I dislike censorship.

reanna
August 15th, 2001, 02:54 AM
Big Conglomerate(sp?) corporate companies.
I have little respect for them. They come in and take over without thought at all to who they may be hurting.
Eventually, what goes around comes around though.:)

A few years back......Big Video Store chain opened up in our neighborhood. Actually bumped my local "family"owned vid store out of the location they had been in for over 30 years.

"family" video store moves just down the alley way.
Big vid store has tempting deals that originally steal some of the less faithful customers away.
However, said Big vid store did not last a year before they were out of buisness. They could not compete with the level of service that was provided by teeny family vid store, so their new customers did not stick around long. :D:D:D

I love the level of service and all round friendliness of family owned businesses. I don't have to tell them my card number, they know it automatically. I always receive a friendly greeting. If my movies are a tiny bit late, no big deal. It gives you the fuzzy feeling when you go into them and you can talk to each other on that personal level about what is going on in your life or theirs because you truly do care about each other.

As for Walmart.......

I almost boycotted them in the fall.
:mad: :mad:

But that is a whole other story in itself, so I'll be good and stay on topic.:)

reanna
August 15th, 2001, 02:55 AM
Originally posted by Danustouch
I'm beginning to dislike Walmart for differen't reasons. Mainly..it's policy on Music. It won't carry anything with a parental advisory label. And they give artists an ultimatum about it. "Change your lyric, song title, album cover..or we won't carry your product". I dislike censorship.

I do too!!!
Is that actually thier policy? No wonder I can never find what I might be looking for in there.

I only buy my cd's from HMV. Love,love, love their return policy. Can't beat it!

Danustouch
August 15th, 2001, 03:03 AM
It was on an investigative report on MTV. Yeppers..for instance...Nirvana's song "Rape Me" had to be changed to "waif me" to be put on their shelves. Alanis Morrissette had to slightly alter the lyrics to "you oughtta know". Some other artist..forgot who..some heavy metal band...had to change their album cover, which depicted tastefully posed naked women (their genitals were all covered by their hands, and strategic camera angles). They had to AIRBRUSH bikini's onto the women. Of course, most artists simply just come out with a "walmart" version for their material..and still keep the "Harder" stuff, for other stores. But...I realllllllly despise that about walmart. Who do they think they are?

Myst
August 15th, 2001, 03:18 AM
They think they are catering to people who feel children shouldn't be exposed to that.

If I can't find it there I just go elsewhere.

Not sure on this Walmart thing at all myself. I go there almost weekly. Then again I live in a city of 320,000, so there's no worry about Walmart closing "family" shops. In the village I'm from the population's too small for a Walmart and it's too bad because there's plenty of times when people could use one and have to drive into the city to get there. The family businesses there don't cover all the needs a Walmart would...

Tigerwallah
August 15th, 2001, 08:46 AM
I despise Walmart. I lived 32 years without a Walmart. I could live the rest of my life without it. I find their style and quality inferior and hokey. The hunting supply displays tasteless, and offensive. Overall, I think Walmart caters to people who say things like "Hey, watch this" before they die.

Walmart is currently being sued due to Sexual discrimination. Seems that although 75% of it's employees are women, less than 15% of it's management is made up of women. A little unbalanced, I'd say.

Illuminatus
August 15th, 2001, 10:41 AM
There's this dude who runs a site: Walmartcanadasucks.com: http://www.wallmartcanadasucks.com/

Anyway, Wal-Mart tried to sue him, to take the domain name away from him, because he was infringing on their name. They failed, because he didn't put a hyphen in the name, and used 2 L's instead of one, and he had registered the trademark "wallmartsucks".

That would have been that. But, it turns out, that Wal-Mart had registered some derivitives of HIS name: namely wallmartcanadasucks.org and wallmartcanadasucks.net. So HE turned around and sued THEM because they were infringing on his name! Haha!

Read the original story on Slashdot:

http://slashdot.org/yro/01/04/13/2331235.shtml

Also go check out walmartsucks.com for more antics and whimsey.

Semele
August 15th, 2001, 12:14 PM
Who does Wal-mart think they are....for censoring music??? Come on...they are a family store and it is their perogotive to choose not to sale explicit material or display it where children can easily view it. Just like it is my perogative as a parent to go elsewhere and buy my five year old son the "real" version of KidRock C.D's. Some may think that is totally wrong to let a child listen to it, but I don't. Either way I am the one making the decision. He can't get the real deal at Wal-Mart...I don't complain...I go somewhere else and buy it for less anyway. I see nothing wrong with this censorship, as long as it is the stores making decisions, not the labels saying it can't be done period.

As for them closing down smaller businesses...that is life. I just wish I would have opened the first Wal-Mart!!! If we don't appreciate them coming in and taking over...then we have the right to go to the smaller places and support them instead. However, Wal-Mart has just as much right to open shop there as the lil places do.

I know I sound like a big Wal-Mart fan, but I hate the place!!! Can't stand waiting in line for an hour and those greeters really get on my nerves!!!

Danustouch
August 15th, 2001, 12:20 PM
you are right, semele. It IS The parents choice whether or not to allow kids to buy these records. But the same applies in or outside of walmarts doors. In other words...I know that they are a family store, and that they are trying to protect their consumers. But does EVERYONE who shops at walmart have the same values? Does EVERYONE at walmart object to music which might have not so nice lyrics? Does EVERY family that shops there think that they shouldnt' carry these albums? The ones that are against this type of censorship..are families too. It just seems to me, that walmart seems to see itself as the guardians of family values. I don't like that..but that's just my opinion. Yes..I can go someplace else to buy an album. But...while i'm already there, in that store, doing my routine shopping..isn't their goal supposed to be easier shopping for me? It's supposed to be a "One stop place to shop"..so why should I have to go some place else to buy the album?

Semele
August 15th, 2001, 12:56 PM
I do see your point, however it is easier for those parents who are concerned about their children seing "offensive" material to shop without the fear. the parents who don't mind can always find what they want. I guess it is like the smoking and nonsmoking section at resauraunts, if you can see my analogy. We can choose to sit in either section and not have our children or us exposed to second hand smoke, or we can choose to sit in the smoking section. At a place like Wal-Mart, I think it is great that parents don't have to avoid certain sections of the store to avoid the kids seeing something they may not want them to see. They are just taking the higher ground in my opinion.

random
August 15th, 2001, 12:58 PM
"Is WalMart evil?"

Yes, of course, didin't you hear, they're selling Harry Potter books.

SnowStar
August 15th, 2001, 04:27 PM
On the issue of Wal-Mart putting mom and pop stores out of business:
Large congomerates tend to do that. It sucks. The only Wal-Marts around here are in the not-so-nice parts of town and they're kind of gross so we don't tend to shop there. Sometimes large chain stores just compliment the smaller stores, for example, the little town in SD where my grandparents live got a Super-Valu about 15 years ago I think and everyone was worried that it would put the Jack and Jill out of business because it was a smaller, family-owned grocery. Here we are 15 years later and both stores are doing just fine. So sometimes it isn't bad, but then other times it can be really bad.

On the issue of censorship:
The last CD I bought from Wal-Mart was "Wander this World" by Jonny Lang. Since I learned of their policy on censorship and also that albums sold in stores like Wal-Mart and K-Mart don't normally count toward Soundscan album sales (a whole different can of worms, has nothing to do with this really...so I won't get into it) I tend to buy my music at FYE/Camelot, Wherehouse, or Media Play.

I do sort of have issues with Wal-Mart overall...around here the employees tend to be really rude, the stores are badly kept, and just...bleh...I'll stick to K-Mart and Target, thank you...

EasternPriest
August 16th, 2001, 09:12 PM
Originally posted by Danustouch
you are right, semele. It IS The parents choice whether or not to allow kids to buy these records. But the same applies in or outside of walmarts doors. In other words...I know that they are a family store, and that they are trying to protect their consumers. But does EVERYONE who shops at walmart have the same values? Does EVERYONE at walmart object to music which might have not so nice lyrics? Does EVERY family that shops there think that they shouldnt' carry these albums? The ones that are against this type of censorship..are families too. It just seems to me, that walmart seems to see itself as the guardians of family values. I don't like that..but that's just my opinion. Yes..I can go someplace else to buy an album. But...while i'm already there, in that store, doing my routine shopping..isn't their goal supposed to be easier shopping for me? It's supposed to be a "One stop place to shop"..so why should I have to go some place else to buy the album?

If Wal-Mart chooses not to sell music the requires warning labels - that isn't censorship. Every business has the right to select and sell merchandise as they see fit. Having CD's custom made for them isn't censorship either, just a business choice. It's also a choice for the labels and artists involved to do or not do. Noone has the "right" to have their merchandise sold at any particular outlet.

As to what family values they use to make their decisions, probably the Walton Family...it is, after all, their business.
Do they make all the right choices? Probably not. It's also doubtful that they are evil either.....

Danustouch
August 17th, 2001, 12:05 AM
Originally posted by EasternPriest


the rIf Wal-Mart chooses not to sell music equires warning labels - that isn't censorship. Every business has the right to select and sell merchandise as they see fit. Having CD's custom made for them isn't censorship either, just a business choice. It's also a choice for the labels and artists involved to do or not do. Noone has the "right" to have their merchandise sold at any particular outlet.

As to what family values they use to make their decisions, probably the Walton Family...it is, after all, their business.
Do they make all the right choices? Probably not. It's also doubtful that they are evil either.....

Sorry..I must disagree on the opinion you've expressed. I do find it to be cencorship. Just as public libraries deciding not to carry "Certain" books, because they find the material objectionable. The store might be privately owned..but it is there to serve the general public consumers. Well..I happen to be public too. And I don't want redubbed versions of my favorite music. That is simply my opinion. I wont shop there, because I feel it is censorship.

MammaStar
August 17th, 2001, 12:22 AM
Well, I don't really think they are evil. I must not cause I just dropped $208 on back to school clothes for my son there last weekend.

I don't really care what they sell and not sell. I go there to get clothes at decent prices and some other items. I don't really agree with their gun policies, but I just steer clear of that section.

They moved in where our county used to have a Caldor's and before they took over that space, there was only Target, another store I frequent. and there wasn't a place in the county where one could buy decent clothes for yourself and your kids for reasonable prices.

Yeah, there policies for books and musics kinda sucks, but it's there store they can do what they want. I have my own stores for books & music. Two of which are "mom & pop" type stores and have NOT been run out because of the big guys. I live in the Metro NY area and competition is fierce for consumers. If you have good prices & service, you're gonna last, if not. See ya!

EasternPriest
August 17th, 2001, 01:32 AM
Originally posted by Danustouch


Sorry..I must disagree on the opinion you've expressed. I do find it to be cencorship. Just as public libraries deciding not to carry "Certain" books, because they find the material objectionable. The store might be privately owned..but it is there to serve the general public consumers. Well..I happen to be public too. And I don't want redubbed versions of my favorite music. That is simply my opinion. I wont shop there, because I feel it is censorship.

You have every right not to shop there - but it isn't censorship, by any definition of the word. And no store is in business to sell anyone anything that they want.... That is like me claiming the local Ford dealer is guilty of censorship for not selling Chevy's.

bluecat
August 17th, 2001, 02:54 AM
They often don't play fair with the small businessperson, but they are a lot less evil than many corp stores ...

We have a super wally-world here and it has not hurt that many stores ... this town still trades with mom & pop ... the only real closure we have had is Furr's ... they are also a corp that had really poor internal management ...

Blue

Tigerwallah
August 17th, 2001, 08:28 AM
Walmart is a publicly owned company. In fact, it's one of the few stocks that have done well in this rough period.

If Walmart was the only store on Earth, which I'm sure they'd like to be, than not carrying certain music titles would be more insidious. You can buy your music elsewhere, which is better for the smaller establishments that have to compete with WalMart.

SpikesPet5150
August 17th, 2001, 10:46 PM
I don't care about the music stuff, I can buy my CD's at a much better price elsewhere... but I do care about the rude people that work in the store in my town. Right now (well, for the past year) they've been turning it into a Super Wal-Mart (which sucks, because I live a privacy fence away from their brand new parking lot).. anyways, back to the point... I went there with my sister to pick up some makeup and clothes... we stood in line for 45 minutes because there was only 4 lanes open (on a Saterday, midafternoon) and then when we got to the cashier, she said nothing to us. No Hello, no nothing. She just threw the items in a bag, didn't fold up the clothes (or take them off the little plastic hangers for that matter). She didn't even tell us the price, she just looked over at the cash register screen and back to us, raising her perfectly sculpted eyebrow as if to say, "Hello? Anytime now!" It was ridiculous. After my sister paid for her items, I said, "Hey, it's nice to know that Wal-Mart hires such courteous, helpful employees!" right to the lady, she just glared at me and began ringing up the next person in line. I've worked in retail ALOT, and the one thing I've learned is a simple hello, how are you? and a nice smile can be the difference between a one-time customer and a repeat customer. They should really train their employees in Customer Service.. it would help them out ALOT.
~Bree
:elf:

MammaStar
August 17th, 2001, 11:05 PM
So, then your problem really isn't with Wal-Mart the store, just a few dopey employees they've managed to hire in your neighborhood. I totally understand that. The Wal-mart that I frequent, (45 min. from my house), is VERY friendly, even their greeters don't get on my nerves and when I was there last week, the sales people were very helpful. I've encountered that in MOST of the Wal-Marts I've visited. But I can see how rude, obnoxious (sp???) people can grate on one's nerves and not make you want to go back, add that all the little stores are gone and you have no choice, makes it seem worse. There are people like that here in our local grocery store, most of them being young people (this is NOT A SLAM ON THE YOUNGER GENERATION). The kids who work at the local market all chat with each other while working and are more worried about what they are gonna wear on their date later than keeping an eye on what they are doing. But the one who gets on my nerves the MOST is this older woman who works in the early AM, all she does is complain, complain, COMPLAIN!!!!!!!! ahhhh, she drives me crazy, and most times she's the only one on duty that early. grrr. i'd go to another market, but this one is right up the street from my house, plus out of the 3 we have, this one has the best prices.

So you see, it's like that everywhere. i'm sure there are perfectly nice people at the A&P in another town, just not mine. makes ya crazy and it's rough when they got you pinned against the wall, just gotta make do. Maybe smile a bit when you're on line the next time. Say how are ya or something like that. I used to work as a cashier too, so I know how tiring that can be. Sometimes just a smile and thanks from the customer used to make my day.

'k speach over. :D :sunny: :heartthro

Tarot Collector
August 18th, 2001, 08:31 AM
I don't think Wal-mart is any more evil than any other corporation with the goal of making the most money it can for its shareholders, owners, etc.

What we are really talking about here is capitalism.

Is capitalism evil?

bloodstone20
August 18th, 2001, 12:54 PM
i've never been to walmart, and i think i am glad about that.

Kaylara
August 18th, 2001, 02:23 PM
Originally posted by Tarot Collector
I don't think Wal-mart is any more evil than any other corporation with the goal of making the most money it can for its shareholders, owners, etc.

What we are really talking about here is capitalism.

Is capitalism evil?

When you take it to the extreme yes. When all you care about is money, it's a problem...

Kaylara

quixote
August 18th, 2001, 05:44 PM
Originally posted by Kaylara


When you take it to the extreme yes. When all you care about is money, it's a problem...

Kaylara
don't get me going on capitalism...
Q

quixote
August 18th, 2001, 05:48 PM
...and despite the commercials, Tweed does NOT have a wal-mart.
Q

bloodstone20
August 18th, 2001, 05:54 PM
that must be fair annoying.

Earth Walker
August 18th, 2001, 05:58 PM
Originally posted by bloodstone20
i've never been to walmart, and i think i am glad about that.

I used to shop at Monkey Ward's. :D


Only my Cat understands me.
************************
There are only two times I feel stress.
Day :D and Night :D

Earth Walker
August 18th, 2001, 06:01 PM
Originally posted by Tarot Collector
I don't think Wal-mart is any more evil than any other corporation with the goal of making the most money it can for its shareholders, owners, etc.

What we are really talking about here is capitalism.

Is capitalism evil?

YES! And it sucks too! :G


Only my Cat understands me.
************************
There are only two times I feel stress.
Day :D and Night :D

bloodstone20
August 18th, 2001, 07:18 PM
Why does it suck?

Sequoia
August 19th, 2001, 08:20 AM
Well, I don't think Wal-Mart is nessicarily EVIL. . .

evil's a pretty strong word. . .big bad scary thing. . . Wal-Mart is just kinda more annoying than anything else. . .

they don't seem to replenish their stock often enough, at least not in clothing. . . And the darn places always smell like pancake syrup! I swear, they must wash the floors with it!!

The peoples here are ok, but it's always so muggy and poorly ventilated in there, it's easy to get lost, the toy section is like a kid's jungle-gym/daycare. . . and don't get me started on the Mc. Donalds in every story. . . *SHUDDERS* heck, that's prolly why they always smell like pancake syrup!

But those stores always drain me, I dislike them. I'd rather go to a couple smaller stores.

And yes, I think that music stuffs is censorship, in a way. . . but what kind of ARTIST would censor their own stuff just to sell it in a certain store? that kinda sickens me. . .

bloodstone20
August 19th, 2001, 08:34 AM
Originally posted by Puma Hime

And yes, I think that music stuffs is censorship, in a way. . . but what kind of ARTIST would censor their own stuff just to sell it in a certain store? that kinda sickens me. . .
They make a Walmart album. Some people don't have a choice but to shop there, and its fair that they should be able to get the CD to.
I can't buy CDs that have the parental label on them. So, yesterday, i couldn't get j lo, eve, or limp bizcut like i wanted. So tomarrow I am off to K-mart to get them.
From what I here, I wouldn't like Wal-mart. So, I simply won't shop there.

Myst
August 19th, 2001, 01:54 PM
I think the answer is that if you don't like it there are hundreds of other stores to shop at. Walmart isn't the only store who is selective about what music they carry; but being the big guy they're the most obvious.

I compare saying Walmart is evil to saying Microsoft is evil. Whatever jokes can be made, those of us in the IT industry who know what we're doing don't really believe that.

Tigerwallah
August 19th, 2001, 07:56 PM
I think the big plastic deer target, guns and ugly camoflage hunting clothes that they sell makes them evil - not to mention the big, ugly, cartoon character, bed pillows, way too ruffly window treatments, and ugly Kathy Ireland clothes. Just say no to Wal-Mart. There are stores out there with much better quality for the same price, ie: T.J. Maxx and Marshall's. If you must shop a superstore, Target is a great one. Even the knock down furniture has a little style, and you can never be accused of bad taste if you shop Martha Stewart ( who is definately evil) at KMart.

enwyn
August 19th, 2001, 08:29 PM
Yeah Wally World is a pretty big crock! Just another "plastic" conglomerate with plastic beliefs, and plastic claims. With plastic smiles and plastic promises. Oh yeah, and I hate plastic too! :D
Anyway, I think they're bad for all the same reasons as everyone else: the not caring if they hurt others and stuff like that. But my pet peeve with them although mundane in the grander scheme of things, is how they mistreat the plants they sell. Whenever I can I rescue a plant from their evil clutches. They don't water their plants, over half of them are badly bruised or broken or even half dead from shipping! It hurts me to my very core! So that has become one of my projects: rescuing plants from them and nursing them back to health. Okay, I think I'm done my rant now!

" I don't suffer from insanity,
I enjoy every minute of it!"
________________________
enwyn

Xois
August 19th, 2001, 10:20 PM
in a word, YES

EasternPriest
August 20th, 2001, 01:29 AM
Noone is forcing anyone to shop there......

EasternPriest
August 20th, 2001, 01:32 AM
I think its interesting that so many people are ready to declare Wal-Mart evil......I thought pagans didn't believe in the concept of evil?

Tigerwallah
August 20th, 2001, 08:03 AM
Pagans, generally, believe that evil exists as the opposite side of the coin to good. I believe that one can not exist without the other, and that all things are both good and evil. We accept our evil nature, but embrace our good and hope to always have the wisdom to choose good. Even the most evil person or thing imaginable has done some good, and even the most benevolent has done some evil.

Where we stray from Christians is that we do not believe that there is an entity that creates the evil in the world. We recognize that we are responsible for the bad that we do. We also do not believe that there is a hell.

Tigerwallah
August 20th, 2001, 08:04 AM
Just needed to answer that.

bluecat
August 20th, 2001, 11:51 AM
Good point Tigerwallah; Pagans do have a concept of good and evil.

Incidentally, I don't think Wal-Mart is evil. I don't agree with some stuff they do, but I don't think they are evil.

Blue

Sequoia
August 20th, 2001, 04:58 PM
EasternPriest- I'm not saying "evil" like "ooh woogy woogy bad juju demons and stuff" evil. . . I'm using it in a sarcastic way, I think everyone else is too. . . :rolleyes:

It's kinda how people will stub their toe on a chair and go "OH STUPID CHAIR!". . . the chair is neither intellegent or stupid (unless it has a spirit. . .but that's a WHOLE other thread), so we're just saying it in reaction. Same thing. . . like the word hate. It is truely a strong word but LOTS of people use it as just an everyday word "oh I HATE it when this happens", rather than "aw this sucks" or "I don't like this." . . .it's just words.

Danustouch
August 20th, 2001, 06:58 PM
yeah...EP...like...DUH...ya know??????? just kidding. Puma is right. Saying something is Evil, was just a way of saying..."Does walmart stink?". Something to that effect.

hands EP a "not so serious" pill.

Myst
August 20th, 2001, 07:01 PM
I think he has a point.

If you mean "does it stink" maybe you should say "does it stink" ? :)

sylphanie
August 21st, 2001, 12:11 AM
On the music issue, the only thing I really can complain about is the pull that Walmart has on the market. Many bands release edited versions of their CDs so that they can get them sold in Walmart, and Walmart doesn't post signs in their stores that say that their music isn't necessarily the original version. But, let's face it, all stores 'censor' in that way, in that they decide what items they will put in their store. Choosing what to stock and what not to stock isn't 'censorship,' to a large extent it's customer relations and profit margins.

Putting family stores out of business is a fact of life. It's kind of icky, but the family stores DO go out for a reason...usually because they can't get the same large varieties of items, or get them for cheap enough prices to compete. Stores like Walmart give more variety than local clothing stores, and people can go there without having to spend ridiculous amounts of money on clothing. I'm not defending the practice, but so it is.

Walmart is a corporation that started off in rural communities. Think of the market to which it traditionally caters. Yep, it's gonna have guns. I actually like that Walmart carries them, because they're relatively easy to buy from, and their prices are reasonable. I don't have to travel to a specialty store if I want to get a better sighting for my rifle.

The real issue that I have with Walmart is the fact that they say they're a 'conservative company' and the crap they do to their employees because of that. For instance, drug testing and making the female employees wear 'conservative' clothing. Even if working in the hot-as-hell stockroom in the summer, a female employee cannot wear a sleeveless shirt in many Walmarts. Male employees can, but females cannot. They can't wear skirts above a certain length, or shorts that reveal 'too much leg.' They can't wear clothing that the store has no problems selling. How's that for sex descrimination, promotion practices aside?

Just MHO

Sylph

Tigerwallah
August 21st, 2001, 12:20 AM
The dress code is a part of almost all retail environments (unless you work in Greenwich Village). Disney is way worse. Up until a few years ago, female employees weren't even allowed to wear pants, skirts or shorts, that's it. I was a manager for Lord & Taylor, and employees had a very strict dress code - no casual clothes at all, and a woman could not wear pants unless it was part of a three piece suit with a jacket, vest or sweater set.

Believe me, these rules are for the best. I saw some pretty scary things. I had one employee who came in in a skirt that was slit up both sides to the waste. Needless to say, I had every security guard and maintenance guy in the store in my department, and no one did any work.

Myst
August 21st, 2001, 12:41 AM
That's a good point, Tiger, and the dress code is important for many businesses. Remember, when you work there you represent the entire company, so the company will obviously want you to follow some standards and look polished. I think it should be also noted that no one is forced to follow these standards - when you sign up you're made aware of them and you sign up knowing you have to follow them, and if you don't like them why sign up at all? If they get changed and you can't deal with it, quit. I think the stores have every right to protect their image in this way.

sylphanie
August 21st, 2001, 04:01 PM
Originally posted by Tigerwallah
The dress code is a part of almost all retail environments (unless you work in Greenwich Village). Disney is way worse. Up until a few years ago, female employees weren't even allowed to wear pants, skirts or shorts, that's it.[/b/



Originally posted by Willow Raven
[B] Remember, when you work there you represent the entire company, so the company will obviously want you to follow some standards and look polished.

I'm not arguing that companies shouldn't have dress codes. There's 'proper' clothing for every part of life. But that doesn't explain why the corporation would have different dress codes for women and men. There is no reason whatsoever why women can't wear the same types of clothes in a work environment as men, other than because the corporation has sexist policies. There have even been a number of lawsuits in which men wanted to wear skirts or dresses in an office environment because of the heat. If a dress code descriminates on sex in any way, I feel that dress code should be taken to the courts. No one should be forced into anything based on their sex, especially not by a company that says it's an 'equal opportunity employer.' Window dressing. Humph.

Sylph

slvr_phoenix
August 21st, 2001, 04:37 PM
**shrug**

Wal-Mart is no more evil than any other business in it for making money. (Which is a good 99.999999999% of all businesses. Hardly anyone does it for 'fun' or to better mankind. Those are usually not-for-profit organizations, not businesses.)

Is that evil? Heck, I don't even believe that morality exists, so why would I concern myself with a notion like good or evil? :)

Saying that Wal-Mart is evil for being guilty of censorship though makes about as much sense as saying that I'm evil for being guilty of censorship for not allowing people to smoke in my house. It's mine and when other people are there, they follow my rules or they leave. It's just that simple. Wal-Mart is on Wal-Mart owned property and they make up the rules on what they sell and don't sell. So long as no laws are broken, it's entirely their right to. Is a video rental store 'evil' and guilty of 'censorship' if they don't have adult videos? Is a metaphysical show guilty of 'censorship' if they don't carry a pack of gum? Of course not. It's their shop and it's their right to carry the materials that they want to sell.

And saying that they're evil for putting small businesses out of business is kind of silly if you ask me. If the small business offered good prices, quality products, a reasonable selection, and excellent service, then they wouldn't be losing cusomers, would they? Small businesses only lose out to things like Wal-Mart because they lack in some way. If they can't survive a little competition, then they must be doing something wrong.

Wal-Mart is a company. They're out to make money. They do it by pleasing the majority. That's not 'evil', that's Business Survival 101.

As for the Capitalism is evil debate, I'll leave that alone because it's 1) off-topic and 2) taking things to extremes when they're not extremes.

BrightStar
August 22nd, 2001, 02:09 AM
Hi all!
The thread got kind of interesting,I'm only online about 3 daze a week,so I've been away.
I meant "evil" as a rather tongue in cheek term.My friends who have lost work because of Walmart jokingly refer to the whole place as the anti-christ,so I was coming from that point of view.
As far as "if you don't like it,go somewhere else".Well that's just the problem.I don't drive,I travel by bicycle.I used to have 3 grocery stores within a mile from my home until this summer.Wally world moved in with a neighborhood grocery market and all the other groceries closed.So if I can get a ride I can go 9 or 10 miles for groceries,or if I can't I'm stuck with the wally market.So,my choice is kinda limited.With the Wally superstore we lost all the little record stores,toy stores,all that stuff locally.So now I take my money and spend it in another town,or shop on the net.
It's a changin' world I reckon.:) Not all of them are good ones.I guess the people here made their shopping choice,so I'll live in a Wally World.
The town just South of here,Norman Oklahoma just had a big fight with them.Walmart is opening a superstore on each side of that town.
It seems they like to open just on the outskirts of a city,being sure to draw business away from the old downtown areas.It's kind of a bummer watching all these places being boarded up after Wally moves in.But,if it's what people want.
I read where they've been sued.It seems their managers come into the local places before a grand opening.They make sure all their prices are lower than anyone in that area.Then,when the other places close,they raise their prices.It seems like a type of monopoly,and uses unfair business practices.I'm not saying they're the only ones like this,I'm sure other national chains use similar methods.Wally is just the one that seems to be messing with me,lol.
Personally,I don't shop at the regular Wally superstore..I find the place rather terrifying,kinda scares me!!But sometimes I have to shop at the Wally Grocery if I want to eat that day,as much as I despise going there.
So,every place is Wally World!!
Peace and Love
BrightStar

Sequoia
August 22nd, 2001, 02:16 AM
hold on just a darn minute!

Wal-Mart has GROCERY STORES?!!?!?

:eek: dear GODS! *runs in fear*

Semele
August 22nd, 2001, 10:14 AM
Originally posted by Puma Hime
. . . but what kind of ARTIST would censor their own stuff just to sell it in a certain store? that kinda sickens me. . .

Kid Rock, Godsmack, Eminem, Metallica, Madonna....
you know, just the ones who want to make money. I have yet to hear an actual artist complain about having to "censor" or offer edited versions. It is just more coins in their pockets, which is, after all why they make the albums in the first place.

Semele
August 22nd, 2001, 10:20 AM
Originally posted by sylphanie
They can't wear clothing that the store has no problems selling. How's that for sex descrimination, promotion practices aside?


Sylph

Oh come on now!!! They sale guns too, but you can't go shooting up the place either. To the employees, I say the same thing I say to all who don't like them...go somewhere else.

Myst
August 22nd, 2001, 01:39 PM
Originally posted by sylphanie

I'm not arguing that companies shouldn't have dress codes. There's 'proper' clothing for every part of life. But that doesn't explain why the corporation would have different dress codes for women and men.

Businesses don't enforce these rules for the fun of it, or because of their feelings. These rules are based on society at large. Certainly there are men who wear skirts (in fact, I can think of 4 guy friends of mine who were wearing sarongs as skirts this weekend), but as a whole society doesn't accept this. Many people who would walk into a store would be shocked to find their male teller wearing a skirt. Is this fair? No, but it is so, and the store will want to protect their image according to that majority. Why, for example, didn't the men ask to wear shorts then, which are just as cool as skirts?

BrightStar
August 23rd, 2001, 01:22 AM
Hi all!
Yes,grocery stores!That's where I'm coming from.I could deal with the regular Wally,then the Superstore that also sold groceries.I just went elsewhere.But this is a Walmart Neighborhood Market and it is a grocery only!I just feel it's going to far.I hate feeling forced to go to shop at a Wally's.But it ran all the other groceries off.
Peace and Love
BrightStar

Karma Chameleon
September 11th, 2005, 05:04 PM
Hi all!
Here in the town of Moore,Oklahoma all the grocery stores have closed except one in my part of town.We used to have some really cool,comfortable grocery stores.They were owned by local folks and the people were nice and helpful.Then Wally World opened a Walmart Neighborhood Market.They all went under,places that had served the community for years.I mean,the town already has a Wally World superstore that sells groceries.It put all the downtown guys out of business.I feel like that movie with Sly Stallone and Sandra Bullock,Demolition Man,where every place was Taco Bell.The people in the stores don't know anything,are not very helpful,and the whole place makes me rather uncomfortable.I won't shop there,but most people just feel there's really no choice.
Then there's a suburb of Oklahoma City called The Village.Walmart came in,they got the city to give them tax breaks by making all sorts of promises.Well,they set up in the town and ran everybody else out of business until the whole tax base was dependent on Wally World.Then Wally World decided to build a new place just across the street from the city limits and closed the old one.The people of the Village feel they may have gotten rheemed on this deal.
So,I got to thinkin.Is Wally World evil?
just my opinion
Peace and Love
BrightStar


Yeah, I do believe that big box stores like Walmart are very destructive, you could call that evil. I also believe that everything about suburbia is destructive, Wal-mart is just one of many things that are a result. The food that Walmart sells in their stores is the bottom of the barrel.

StellaLuna
September 11th, 2005, 05:41 PM
Ok, let me preface this by saying that I have spent many years and precious energies preaching against Wal*Mart, it's censorship, discrimination and monopolistic practices.
The other day I heard this story on NPR about a community ( LA, MS or AL? I can't recall) which witnessed Wal*Mart as the first responders, with truck loads of water, food, blankets, etc. to help these people in desperate need. Mind you, this was WAY before National Guard, Red Cross and other emergency workers arrived on the scene.
When interviewed, one of the WM execs said they anticipate hurricane season and stock distribution centers in vulnerable areas with the appropriate supplies for sale or donation. When WM heard of Katrina, they sent tractor trailors immediately.
Why is it that America's # 1 retailer made it to help victims before our own government?
I don't have an answer.
I'm still anti Wal*Mart, but this act of forethought and kindness, has me thinking, maybe I'm too black and white on issues. Maybe WM isn't the evil empire I once thought, but like everything else in this world, a composition of good and bad.

http://www.walmartfacts.com/community/article.aspx?id=1331 (http://www.walmartfacts.com/community/article.aspx?id=1331)


Just some food for thought.

Kari

Baba Yaga
September 11th, 2005, 06:29 PM
That's a good point, Tiger, and the dress code is important for many businesses. Remember, when you work there you represent the entire company, so the company will obviously want you to follow some standards and look polished. I think it should be also noted that no one is forced to follow these standards - when you sign up you're made aware of them and you sign up knowing you have to follow them, and if you don't like them why sign up at all? If they get changed and you can't deal with it, quit. I think the stores have every right to protect their image in this way.

What makes anybody think that working retail is a career choice? I have to make ends meet somehow and retail is all I can get at the moment. So I have to against my natural inclinations and force myself into a conservative mold. And I can't just quit because i don't like it. I have bills to pay, dogs to take care of. I find your comment to be insensitive and rude. My job was not a "choice". It was an act of desperation. So I am supposed to just lay down and accept that I should not have the right to express myself because the company I work for may not like it? I accpet the realitied of my life, but that doesn't mean that I like it or that I won't try to change it.

Anyway, back to topic.
All super-chains suck.

Elaethril
September 11th, 2005, 07:55 PM
Ok, let me preface this by saying that I have spent many years and precious energies preaching against Wal*Mart, it's censorship, discrimination and monopolistic practices.
The other day I heard this story on NPR about a community ( LA, MS or AL? I can't recall) which witnessed Wal*Mart as the first responders, with truck loads of water, food, blankets, etc. to help these people in desperate need. Mind you, this was WAY before National Guard, Red Cross and other emergency workers arrived on the scene.
When interviewed, one of the WM execs said they anticipate hurricane season and stock distribution centers in vulnerable areas with the appropriate supplies for sale or donation. When WM heard of Katrina, they sent tractor trailors immediately.
Why is it that America's # 1 retailer made it to help victims before our own government?
I don't have an answer.
I'm still anti Wal*Mart, but this act of forethought and kindness, has me thinking, maybe I'm too black and white on issues. Maybe WM isn't the evil empire I once thought, but like everything else in this world, a composition of good and bad.

http://www.walmartfacts.com/community/article.aspx?id=1331 (http://www.walmartfacts.com/community/article.aspx?id=1331)


Just some food for thought.

Kari

That sums it up perfectly. Liking of disliking WalMart because of its business practices is entirely each person's right. But to say that it's 'evil' because of them is a bit of an overreaction. Yes, there are problems at some WalMart stores. Some employees are rude, some stores are not good places to shop. But that's true of *any* store - I encounter rude employees at other grocery stores, and am greeted cheerfully by the greeter at WalMart.

I realize that the thinking now is that other posters don't mean evil in the true sense of the word, but if that's the case, then you should make that plain with your post. The question posed was "Is WalMart evil?" I would say no. Hitler was evil. Pol Pot is evil. The jury is still out on Bill Gates. But WalMart? No. They're a corporation. That's a whole 'nother ball game. :tongueout

Isil Darkmoon
September 12th, 2005, 12:28 AM
Ok, let me preface this by saying that I have spent many years and precious energies preaching against Wal*Mart, it's censorship, discrimination and monopolistic practices.
The other day I heard this story on NPR about a community ( LA, MS or AL? I can't recall) which witnessed Wal*Mart as the first responders, with truck loads of water, food, blankets, etc. to help these people in desperate need. Mind you, this was WAY before National Guard, Red Cross and other emergency workers arrived on the scene.
When interviewed, one of the WM execs said they anticipate hurricane season and stock distribution centers in vulnerable areas with the appropriate supplies for sale or donation. When WM heard of Katrina, they sent tractor trailors immediately.
Why is it that America's # 1 retailer made it to help victims before our own government?
I don't have an answer.
I'm still anti Wal*Mart, but this act of forethought and kindness, has me thinking, maybe I'm too black and white on issues. Maybe WM isn't the evil empire I once thought, but like everything else in this world, a composition of good and bad.

http://www.walmartfacts.com/community/article.aspx?id=1331 (http://www.walmartfacts.com/community/article.aspx?id=1331)


Just some food for thought.

Kari

I've always been kind of irritatedly indifferent to Walmart--I always feel kind of drained when I shop there, because it's just too big a teaming mass of people (like all the mega-stores are), and I know there are thigns that they could do better, but I don't care enough to put my money where my mouth is--I still shop there because it's somewhere I can afford.

However, I agree here--I've been head over heels impressed with their hurricane response.

They've:

Donated $20 MILLION (and counting)
sent over 1,500 18-wheelers full of supplies into the disaster area (in fact had 45 packed and ready at a Walmart a couple hours inland before Katrina even hit)
in addition to the above, sent 100,000 meals worth of food
promised all their displaced employees a guaranteed job at another Walmart store wherever they happen to settle
completely stopped gun sales at 40 stores in the hit region and put a lot of restrictions on some a little further out.


That gained them a LOT of respect in my eyes.

Exloration_La
February 26th, 2006, 02:16 PM
ok guys wal-mart is MUCH more a serious issue then just music CD's. Wal-Mart supports sweat shops, and cheapen and degrade everything. and pretty soon if something doesn’t' change where not going to have much left of ANYTHNG including all your favorite artists. Wal-mart drains your tax dollars while entrepreneurs are taxed every penny. Wal-Mart wants to take over banking so that eventually without Wal-Mart you won't be able to bank without them, and who know how much further that will go because they are also pushing micro chipping of products that invade your privacy, and to get you comfortable with latter pushing human microchip implanting. Wal-Mart is spreading to Japan and china, and basically if they keep growing at the rate they are they will take over the world and we will all be owned by Wal-Mart, and by the time people get fed up they will have to many worker drones to be stopped. Wal-Mart is a VERY serious situation, and it's about time people suck it up and boycott them while they have a chance. This is not a conspiracy theory wake up and even check the NEWS! and look at the links below. Do your part and stop shopping there and STRONGLY encourage those around you to shop there as well.


Does Wal-Mart Really Need Our Tax Dollars?
www.ilsr.org/columns/2003/120103.html

Keep Local Tax Dollars for Local Needs, Not Wal-Mart
www.ourfuture.org/fixwalmart/local_letters.cfm

http://www.newswithviews.com/Mary/starrett14.htm
Wal-Mart's putting the pressure on its top 100 suppliers to make sure their inventory is all chipped by the end of next year.
Will you make it a point to email, call or fax your representative today, before our Big Brother gets any bigger? Do it NOW before the lobbyists and big money special interests get to them and convince Congress these RFID chips are consumer-friendly!

Wal-Mart to expand China operations
http://www.busrep.co.za/index.php?fSectionId=&fArticleId=2285224

Wal-Mart ready to go big in Japan
www.busrep.co.za/index.php?fSectionId=&fArticleId=2194304

National Bank of Wal-Mart?
moneycentral.msn.com/content/Banking/Betterbanking/P109171.asp

Wal-Mart: Your New Banker?
www.businessweek.com/magazine/content/05_06/b3919046_mz011.htm

Banks wary of Wal-Mart
www.gazette.net/stories/021006/businew181945_31911.shtml

Little Billy
February 26th, 2006, 02:20 PM
ok guys wal-mart is MUCH more a serious issue then just music CD's. Wal-Mart supports sweat shops, and cheapen and degrade everything.

Yep. I can't support any company that utterly hates and loathes the American worker, the way WalMart does.

brymble
February 26th, 2006, 02:45 PM
i've already exhausted all my righteous anger in the abortion thread, at least for the time being.

just wanted to add, for those who think they "can't afford" to not shop at wal-mart and similar stores such as target, that i'm on food stamps, and have not even been near a wal-mart in about 3 years.

anyway it's not my intent to come across as high-and-mighty, condescending or superior. i just wanted to let people who oppose their policies yet feel they "have no choice" to shop there know that it can be done. as consumers, we can take back our power.

edited to add: start here http://www.coopamerica.org/programs/sweatshops/

i heard recently that wal-mart has tried petioning the WTO to try and stop small towns who don't want a wal-mart from keeping them out. has anyone else heard this story? *rushes off to google some more*

Akhkharu Asgard
February 26th, 2006, 03:05 PM
I don't really shop there because most of their merchandise is such crap quality. I just do my shopping elsewhere. But the numbers seem to show that everyone loves that store.

pawnman
March 1st, 2006, 10:41 AM
No they are not evil.

AutumnWitchie
March 1st, 2006, 03:19 PM
Maybe not evil but the folks in charge are idiots. If you're going to have cake decorators at least make sure thay are trained! Oh yeah, Wal Mart doesn't want to pay for experienced cake decorators. I'm still irratated at Wal Mart for screwing up a pretty easy cake order for my son's birthday and then not having the time to fix the problem to the customer's satisfaction. Before I quit working as a cake decorator to have my son, if we messed up a cake order then we damn well better fix it. Amatuars!

Winter_wolf
March 1st, 2006, 03:25 PM
Of course it's evil... don't you guys watch South Park... the only way to destroy it is to break that mirror in electronics!!!! :p