Week IV | Magick | Lesson Four

[mol]

Lets look at a topic really quickly here. I dont want to spend a lot of time on it, but i think we will all get something out of it.

What are some uses of Magick?

Lets hear it.

For the beginner...why do you want to learn? What do you want to do with it?

For the seasoned...what do you use Magick for?

And no one is going to ridicule you here. For the beginners...just blurt it out. Heh.

[Shatav]

Ack! Gee, Mol, don't start small or anything! Okay, some of the things I usually use magick for.

Well, nightly I do a ritual in order to ground and center myself, to open myself up to the teachings of the universe and deity and to generally just discover more about myself and the universe that we all live in.

Other things that I use magick for is really depending on situation...healing, reversal of negative trends in many areas of my or others lives, divination, balance in many imbalanced areas of my or others lives...sheesh, the list goes on and on, really, so I'll let others jump in. ;)

[Sleeping Ghost]

Why I want to learn-
I dunno how to explain it... partially because it will allow me to connect with being on a high plane of existence.

What do I want to do with it-
I want to be able to heal, protect, and bring prosperity to myself, and my friends and family. (partially)

[mol]

Originally posted by Sleeping Ghost
Why I want to learn-
I dunno how to explain it... partially because it will allow me to connect with being on a high plane of existence.

What do I want to do with it-
I want to be able to heal, protect, and bring prosperity to myself, and my friends and family. (partially)

Ok...great start...and thank you for jumping right in. Now, try to elaborate on the Higher plane...what do you hope to connect with?

[mol]

Originally posted by Shatav
Ack! Gee, Mol, don't start small or anything

Hmmmm...well...hehe...I havent been known for doing anything small in scale. All or nothing!

[Mariposa De La Luna]

Is the monthly moon/new moon ritual considered magic or only if you do certain things?

[Mairwen]

Well ... This is a tuffy. *guzzles coffee in hopes to redeem self asap* ... On a personal level, I don't do what most of you would consider "magical acts" that often at all; I have no use for them ~ as a Gwyddon, I have a very ... set way ... to do certain things. Now, we do "healings" on the Full Moon, but those are group-oriented; we can ask for personal-specific things, but we work on them as a Family. But, like I said, we don't "do spells" or "throw spells" or "do magic" ~ we're energy movers, which can be considered magic, but ... Well, it's hard to explain.

Mol, Mari is on the board without coffee, again. *sigh*

[Mairwen]

Originally posted by SAHM
Is the monthly moon/new moon ritual considered magic or only if you do certain things?

I think that depends on your Path/Tradition, SAHM-I-AM. :D

[mol]

Originally posted by SAHM
Is the monthly moon/new moon ritual considered magic or only if you do certain things?

As Mairwen (Get some coffee) said, this all depends on your tradition. If you dont have a tradition or you are just starting your Path, then dont concern yourself right now with the "is this Magick or is this..."

Now, from my view. Yes. The esbat ritual in itself, to me, is a very Magickal act. And the Full Moon is one of the most powerful Magickal nights for me. But, this is me. I have seen others who have more power on the New Moon.

[Shatav]

To me, "doing magick", "throwing spells", etc IS just moving energy, in my definition. I would even count in saying prayers as the same, as well as many other assorted acts that haven't been labeled as performing magick in the past. It's all in names, but I really think it's all the same durned thing.

[Mairwen]

Nope.

[Shatav]

Originally posted by Mairwen
Nope.

What's your distinction then? (Just curious). As I said, it's mostly semantics to me.

[Mairwen]

For us, and for myself in private, we don't go through the circle casting, the lighting of candles, or anything in particular in order to "do magic" like most Pagans seem to do. We drop into what could be called extremely deep meditative states (no, not Alpha) and move energy. We don't cast spells, or anything resembling anything of the sort; to us, all that is totally unnecessary.

If you like, we could take this into e-mail so as to not clog up Mol's lesson or boards? But there's really not much more to it than what I've already told you ~ cept for "subtleties" and "energies" that you'd have to be face-to-face with a Gwyddon to learn.

[mol]

Well, I dont consider it a "clogging" anything. What we are learning about here is not one particular style of Magick, but we are striving to learn about all the styles and concepts we can. WITHOUT EXCLUDING any.

This is an attempt to broaden everyone's views on Magick.

[pattyann]

Well, since I don't know anything as far as what can be done, I guess I will just say I would like to know how to control my physic abilities, protect me & mine against negative vibes. or I guess I should say energy?? maybe I am learning after all. LOL I would REALLY like to convert my other half from negative personality to a positive personality!! or at least neutral.
patty

[mol]

Originally posted by pattyann
Well, since I don't know anything as far as what can be done, I guess I will just say I would like to know how to control my physic abilities, protect me & mine against negative vibes. or I guess I should say energy?? maybe I am learning after all. LOL I would REALLY like to convert my other half from negative personality to a positive personality!! or at least neutral.
patty

Perfect...that is a great start...and that is a goal. You know what you want, now you just need to know how to get it.

Stay with it pattyann, you are doing fine...

[pattyann]

Originally posted by mol


Perfect...that is a great start...and that is a goal. You know what you want, now you just need to know how to get it.

Stay with it pattyann, you are doing fine...
Yes, now I need to know how to get there. It may not seem like I am active here or in tarot, but with the cramming 20 years in a house into a 33 ft rig, all the @!#%^*acompaning selling..ect. I am printing everything in magic, devination & tarot. Then when we are on the road (4 days supposed to be) I can study the info. Is it possible to change a person from negative to positive? Just wondering.
I REALLY appreciate ALL the help I have had here. Blessings to all..Oh BTY why the long haired guru on your name tag? Not like you at all.
patty

[mol]

Originally posted by pattyann


I REALLY appreciate ALL the help I have had here. Blessings to all..Oh BTY why the long haired guru on your name tag? Not like you at all.
patty

Actually closer than you might think. ;)

Changing negative to positive. I believe the best kind of Magick you can use there is the greatest of it all...

Love.

[eaglewolf]

Originally posted by pattyann
Is it possible to change a person from negative to positive?

I'm not the one to say whether this is possible or not, but I am one to ask...

Wouldn't it be better to help the positive shine through, rather than trying to change the necessary part in all of us?

~ew

[mol]

Originally posted by eaglewolf


I'm not the one to say whether this is possible or not, but I am one to ask...

Wouldn't it be better to help the positive shine through, rather than trying to change the necessary part in all of us?

~ew

Absolutely. And the best way to promote the positive in others is to let the positive in YOU shine through and through.

[Mairwen]

Well, I dont consider it a "clogging" anything. -----8<---- but we are striving to learn about all the styles and concepts we can. WITHOUT EXCLUDING any.

Well, that's good. :D

[Shatav]

Originally posted by Mairwen
We don't cast spells, or anything resembling anything of the sort; to us, all that is totally unnecessary.

Ah, you sound like my husband and I completely understand. Truthfully, to an extent, I agree, spells can be unnecessary...but only if that's what you're comfortable with. (And yes, durnit, I need my spells and rituals).

I guess for me, the spells and rituals are a way for me to focus and drop myself into the meditative state I need, as well as a way to physically see what I am doing on an energy level. Could I do it without all my pomp and circumstance? Yes, and I have before.

Do you think there's a difference in the energies that we manipulate, then? I just see it as different ways of manipulating the same energies, but it may very well not be, as I've never been a Gwyddon and don't have the experience to know what energies you're speaking of versus what I'm speaking of.

[Shatav]

Originally posted by eaglewolf


Wouldn't it be better to help the positive shine through, rather than trying to change the necessary part in all of us?



Beautiful and so true! Light cannot exist without dark, positive without negative. As long as we do not let the negative control our actions, then we are accomplishing making ourselves more positive.

[Mairwen]

Do you think there's a difference in the energies that we manipulate, then? I just see it as different ways of manipulating the same energies, but it may very well not be, as I've never been a Gwyddon and don't have the experience to know what energies you're speaking of versus what I'm speaking of.

There very possibly could be a difference in the types and amounts and ways of energy use; however, since I've never been anything but a Gwyddon, I have nothing to compare this to ~ I just know what I've been taught and what I use.

So, I guess this puts us back in the same barrell, which is probably where we belong, anyway. :D

[Shatav]

Originally posted by Mairwen

So, I guess this puts us back in the same barrell, which is probably where we belong, anyway. :D

*ROFL* Monkeys in a barrel! Eee! Eee! Eee!

:D

[mol]

I draw the line at monkeys!

Where's my agent?

:P

[Shatav]

Originally posted by mol
I draw the line at monkeys!

Where's my agent?



:uzi: :shot:

Hah hah! There's no escape now! Oo oo! Eee eee!

[Mairwen]

ROTFLMAO!

(oh my sides!)

[Shatav]

:crazy:

[mol]

Ok....Back to the topic at hand...all newcomers and everyone else...lets hear your thoughts on the subject at hand. ;)

[Semele]

I have to join Shatav's team on this topic!! The only "magikal" aspects of my life have to do with energy manipulation in some form or another, and for me this is not always practiced in a formal ritual. In fact some of most magikal moments are done in public or without any of the witnesses actually knowing it is going on right under their noses. My poor mother has been the recepient of my magik more times than I can count. I learned at a young age that I could feel and often times manipulate her energy to better suit my needs. It was a difficult lesson for me to learn the boundaries with her though.

Semele

[Witchbourne]

What i use Magick for?

Well nowerdays i only use it for the balance of everything on the inside and on the outside for me and my sourounding....

In the beginning when i just had understand it i used it wrong and i've payd for that..and it's now past...

And before i understod it i did thinks i never understod was my doing...and somethings that happend i will never forgive myself......

hope this answeard your question?

[Shatav]

Originally posted by Witchbourne

In the beginning when i just had understand it i used it wrong and i've payd for that..and it's now past...



Been down that road myself. Ah well, live and learn. I'm sure many have done the same and we're all in the same boat. But I feel stronger for what I've learned from the whole experience.

It's all about balance, baby.... :sunny:

[Witchbourne]

Been down that road myself. Ah well, live and learn. I'm sure many have done the same and we're all in the same boat. But I feel stronger for what I've learned from the whole experience.

It's all about balance, baby....
*********************************************
Yes..i learned from my mistakes too....

and yes i know that it's all about balance...thats why i feel so good in it now...

Blessed be*

[mol]

I think we probably all learn from mistakes made in the beginning times...much like a child tryign to learn to walk. Eventually they do learn to walk and so...

[Witchbourne]

I think we probably all learn from mistakes made in the beginning times...much like a child tryign to learn to walk. Eventually they do learn to walk and so...


__________________
In Darkness and in Light...

mol
Site God
*********************************************
Yes...but sometimes i wished i had found my balance faster...but i'll gues theres no quick way and it has to take the time it takes......

Blessed be*

[mol]

Ah! But sometimes when you learn faster you get cocky. In the example of walking...the cocky person might not watch where they are walking because they can 'walk so well' and walk right off of a cliff.

;)

[pagangoddesschild]

I know i'm a bit late here but not too late i hope! Joining in on the fourth lesson i mean.
Okay lets see, why do i want to learn magick?
Hmmm good question. Not sure i can put the answer into words. Basicly i guess i just want to. I've always loved and have been facinated by magick. I also think it's a part of me that I would really love to develope (make sense?). I would feel more attune with myself i think.
What do i want to do with it? Many things i suppose.. Become more self confident, would love to be a healer... I'm not really sure how to answer this question. I guess i'll know what to do with it when that time comes. I dont really have anything specific in mind.

[Witchbourne]

Ah! But sometimes when you learn faster you get cocky. In the example of walking...the cocky person might not watch where they are walking because they can 'walk so well' and walk right off of a cliff.




__________________
In Darkness and in Light...

mol
Site God
*********************************************
Yes i can see what you mean....but i only meant that if it had gone faster no one had to be hurt....but at the same time i can understand that i've learned by it all and now my balance are so much stronger then what it probebly would have been if i've gone to fast foward...

Blessed be* et merci*

[Jazzmine]

So far, I have done one healing spell on myself, and have done some work with putting positive energy into a talisman for a good luck charm for my husband. Other than that I have done Sabbat Rituals and Full and New Moon Esbats, but haven't done any spells in hardly any of them.

[mol]

Originally posted by Jazzmine
So far, I have done one healing spell on myself, and have done some work with putting positive energy into a talisman for a good luck charm for my husband. Other than that I have done Sabbat Rituals and Full and New Moon Esbats, but haven't done any spells in hardly any of them.

Well, spells (To me) are one thing and Magick is another. We use Magick everyday without ever paying much attention to it at all.

Stick around with us in this class. ;)

[mol]

Originally posted by Witchbourne

Yes i can see what you mean....but i only meant that if it had gone faster no one had to be hurt....but at the same time i can understand that i've learned by it all and now my balance are so much stronger then what it probebly would have been if i've gone to fast foward...

Blessed be* et merci*

I understand your point of view. Just remember, and i try to stress this to everyone...anything dealing with Magick should never be fast-forwarded. The slower the better. Leaving more time for things to sink in...so to speak. ;)

[Shatav]

Originally posted by mol


Just remember, and i try to stress this to everyone...anything dealing with Magick should never be fast-forwarded. The slower the better. Leaving more time for things to sink in...so to speak. ;)

Baby-steps! I'm all for that one. I try to tell people that all the time. You can't expect to become a marathon racer without having learned to walk first. ;) Not to mention, practice practice practice!

[chaos]

Originally posted by mol


Well, spells (To me) are one thing and Magick is another. We use Magick everyday without ever paying much attention to it at all.

Stick around with us in this class. ;)

i couldnt agree more. spells to me are little chants and works that can be done driving in my car. magick is something i must prepare for thoroughly.

[Jazzmine]

So what you are saying is that the Sabbats and the Esbats are magickal in themselves. Sorry, I was confused with the question I guess. I thought that you meant spells when you were talking about magickal acts. You have to understand, there is some, not much, but some blonde in my red hair. And it acts up sometimes. But I will be remaining in the class. It's nice to have people to discuss things with.

[Mairwen]

Jazzmine, to some people/groups/traditions, spellwork is considered magic. To others, like myself and some others here, it isn't.

[Witchbourne]

Originally posted by mol


I understand your point of view. Just remember, and i try to stress this to everyone...anything dealing with Magick should never be fast-forwarded. The slower the better. Leaving more time for things to sink in...so to speak. ;)

well my steps in to it have been taking me a long time and i can understand that slow are so much better then fast....hmmm....how do the old words go...the short way leds only to the unknown nothingness and the long way takes you furter than everything.....merci*....

Blessed be*

[BrightStar]

Hi all!
Interesting thread,as usual.Thanks!
What do I use magick for?Just a few things,I guess.I use it to open up,to the psychic and spiritual parts of my being,the intuition and emotion I sometimes suppress.I do magick for money,when I need it.These I try to add a line like,if more than enough to fill my needs results,send the left over energy to someone who needs it.I do magick for protection of my home,when I feel the need.I think a strong need is mandatory before I try magick.I also try all the normal,mundane methods to do things first,but magick is a great kicker.I've done magick for self love.I've done it to help me focus when I'm having trouble and a big test is coming.
Peace and Love
Rain Brightstar

[mol]

Originally posted by Mairwen
Jazzmine, to some people/groups/traditions, spellwork is considered magic. To others, like myself and some others here, it isn't.

Correct! ;)

We all are of different Paths. Remember this...this is not a normal class where we are teaching you a set way of doing things. This is a class on Magick, the whole spectrum. You choose what way best suits you...

[Sephiroth]

i wont to learn so im not an outcast in every place i go. i only fit in with some gothic ppl and some of my g/f's fellow witchs although their not all fond of me being an outsider and all but if i learn i will follow the 3 major rules think befor casting, asking before casting a spell on someone and the most and highly valued rule for me HARM NONE.

[Sephiroth]

Originally posted by Sephiroth
i wont to learn so im not an outcast in every place i go. i only fit in with some gothic ppl and some of my g/f's fellow witchs although their not all fond of me being an outsider and all but if i learn i will follow the 3 major rules think befor casting, asking before casting a spell on someone and the most and highly valued rule for me HARM NONE. FOR EVERY DEATH THERE IS A REBIRTH.

[mol]

Originally posted by Sephiroth
FOR EVERY DEATH THERE IS A REBIRTH.

Out of curiosity, why did you put that comment in?

[Illyandra]

To me just looking out the window and appreciating the view has a magick all of its own, so I guess there is a lot that I do that I consider "magickal".

As for uses, I use magick just about everyday. In prayer and meditation, I use creative visualization, especially when I light a candle for someone and 'see' them feeling better or getting over an illness or their situation improving. Its just an example, but that is one of the ways I make use of magick. Not necessarily spellwork, or during ritual, but I use it more than I realized!

[Arioska]

Joining a bit late, I am afraid.
Very interesting question indeed. Magick is what I always lacked in the past. As many did probably, I was born Christian and as soon as I could study it in depth, I became a non believer. But there was always this empty space.
Becoming a Wiccan was like coming home. I am not a feminist but always found that most religions (not all of them) lacked feminity and the image of the Mother.
I started with all the decorum of the circle, the candles etc... and it helped me but now, magick is more like a way of life, the possibility to live a spiritual life I lacked for so many years. And frankly, don't you think sometimes it is just great to wake up in the morning and think " I am a Goddess.." when you have spent most of your life underestimating yourself ?
To me, paganism is a "religion" where everyone respects you and do not try to convince you. No proselytism, no leader, just believers and the most important of all, you learn to respect others beliefs and personality( not exactly what you're being taught in "real"life).......

[ruthie]

What drew me to the path? That's a big question. (and once more I am late, but I'm catching up now!).

To be at one with myself, others, and the enormity of it all.

To balance the good with the bad, and accept it all as it exists.

To quote:

"The reality is that occultism causes our problems to intensify, making us come to grips with the world at large so that we really begin to learn to handle the universal forces both within and without" – WMT website

I think that about covers it.

[vocis noctis]

I am a newbie so what I want to do with magick, is just casting protection spells on me and my friends, and a major love spell cuz I'm lonely. But I want to learn first, before I actually do magick.

[Sephiroth]

the best love spell is not a spell. its the way u control ur heart to let ppl know ur fellings good or bad.

[cydira]

I've been one to view magic as a form of science. I use it all the time. Spellwork is a specific form of magic and has different rules and uses, but still is governed by several fundamental laws. Such as the ones of pysics stating what goes up must come down and all of that. :D

I use spellwork and ritual for several reasons. I use ritual as a religious practice to strengthen my relationship with the Lady and Lord, also to provide a sense of stablity to my highly unstable life. :) I also use ritual to provide addtional focus to my energy for my spells. Spellwork is something that's a bit more flexible, but not by much. I will usually cast a small circle around me when I am using a spell with all of the necessary precautions to keep myself safe. I use spellwork to help myself in areas where I have exhaused all "mudane" methods. Or to help myself in areas where the "mundane" methods are not necessarily enough.

<shrugs> Usually, I'm kinda like alot of kitchen witches. I just don't have a kitchen right now because I live in a dorm. Ahh, the joys of being a college student. <lol>

[Sephiroth]

to me magick is everything i can see and do. magick is everywhere u look. but spells are nothing more that prayers with attitude. its not magick that make them work but the oposite u make them work..

lets take a money spell for an example.. after u do the spell u dont know it but u look for cash (money) more( u'll knowties it more.. example ur walking down the street and theres a 50.00 dollar bill on the ground and u dont knowtis it. but then later u cast the spell and u walk down that same street and u see it after u casted the spell.

but thats my theiry

[Sephiroth]

DAMN IT!!!!!!!!!!
it wen two magick lession 5 insed of 4

[sherry]

Originally posted by mol


Correct! ;)

We all are of different Paths. Remember this...this is not a normal class where we are teaching you a set way of doing things. This is a class on Magick, the whole spectrum. You choose what way best suits you...

OK I guess this is where my mind gets stuck in the mud "the choose what way best suits you thingy" I know I am pagan, I cast my circle but then when i try to go on my own I still have the fear of getting in over my head or doing something wrong, and with my history I need nothing else bad to happen. Baby steps are all I know!!
It takes me for ever to deside what is best for me, because I know what I want but I guess I still fear the thought of being wrong once again.
I find most of what I want does not mean much to others, just me. I am slow to try magick because of this other than candle magick because each is for a specific reason and has a specific color that is designated for it

It has taken me 17 years of reading everything I can get my hands on and hiding most of what I dream of to finally make these choices. So I guess I am just not the brightest crayon in the box when it comes to big steps and right decisions, so leaving all of those wrong ones in the past is difficult for me to do. I am trying to find my path and this road has been a long one but not an easy one because when you get used to people telling you what to do, to be told the choice is yours, leaves you standing in wonder of "now what do I do!"

[Jesse]

Magick to me is using everything around me, to protect myself and my family which I have had to do recently and succeeded without harming others. I dont think that when you are doing a ritual that you can really screw up and do something wrong, sometimes you have to laugh at yourself, pick yourself up and start again. :D It isnt necessary to do long drawn out rituals if that isnt something that you are comfortable with, there are easy ways of casting a circle, easy quarter calls or none at all. The more you add to this the more difficult it gets, there are those that like that and thats wonderful for them others dont. For myself I help others when I am asked, and am doing what I can to learn more about myself and my own beliefs. I read everything I can get my hands on and learn something new everyday. I dont necessarily agree with everyones version but I try to incorporate it in some way to make it right for me.

[MagicAngel]

i wanna learn and do magick to help me, i am not a beginner i just am still starting out even though i have been following my path for four years now. i just feel that magick will be better to help my own prosperity and protection, like against negativity, i think it will help more than just chants and prayers because i have been doing that and i will continue i just thought magick would help a little bit more.
~Blessed Be~
~~Chasity~~

[random]

For the beginner...why do you want to learn? What do you want to do with it?

Why I want to learn:

I always wnat to learn, no matter what it is about. And this is in my intrest at the moment.

What I would do whith it:

I will probably use it as a last resort. I usually try everything I can.


For the seasoned...what do you use Magick for?

Well, I have used magick in helping one of my friends through a really rough time... I couldn't help her otherwise.