So why are we the major ones being picked on?

[sincerebliss]

Well, Christians (as a whole) believe that if you don't worship their god then you are actually worshipping satan in disguise. Therefore, they think all other religions are practicing a form of satanism, right? If this is true then why does it seem like most Pagans are the only ones being accused of worshipping the devil? What about all the other religions? According to Christians, all the other religions are devil worshippers, too!!!!!!! Why not pick on them????? Grrrr...lol:fpraise: :imout:

Edited for the sake of: we ..lol

[Rudas Starblaze]

ok, im lost. which side is "we" or "us"?

[sincerebliss]

lol..."we" as in pagans (sorry)

[Rudas Starblaze]

oh, ok. well, i think its all cause the pagans pick on the christians too by cutting down their beliefs. so really its like being in grade school and saying "my daddy can beat up your daddy" kinda thing.

[Aidron]

Well, Christians (as a whole) believe that if you don't worship their god then you are actually worshipping satan in disguise. Therefore, they think all other religions are practicing a form of satanism, right? If this is true then why does it seem like most Pagans are the only ones being accused of worshipping the devil? What about all the other religions? According to Christians, all the other religions are devil worshippers, too!!!!!!! Why not pick on them????? Grrrr...lol:fpraise: :imout:

Edited for the sake of: we ..lol


Anyone who does not ascribe to Christian ideaology is Pagan. Paganism denotes many things, one of which is a person who does not practice or hold belief in the ideals, stories, and moral inclinations incooperated throughout every branch of Christianity. See where I am going with this? Satanism, Hinduism, Buddhism, Shintoism, Druidry, Wicca, Atheism... they are all Pagan in some form or another.

It is not uncommon for Christians to fight among themself, as with any religion or grouping of similar ideals, but it is less common, however.

[misschief]

Well, Christians (as a whole) believe that if you don't worship their god then you are actually worshipping satan in disguise. Therefore, they think all other religions are practicing a form of satanism, right? If this is true then why does it seem like most Pagans are the only ones being accused of worshipping the devil? What about all the other religions? According to Christians, all the other religions are devil worshippers, too!!!!!!! Why not pick on them????? Grrrr...lol:fpraise: :imout:

Edited for the sake of: we ..loldepends on what 'brand' of christians you come across, some of them do think every other religion is worshipping the devil. gotta say tho, those ones are few and far between. most christians don't think much of anything about paganism besides that it's not for them.

[Shanti]

Personally I am uptight...my local news is picking on people who drink coffee and smoke a cig at the same time!!
See you are suppose to drink coffee or smoke a cig..not do both at the same time!!! There are more health risk if you dont alter cigs and coffee. Coffee/smokers are costing health care cost to rise ya know!!!

Sorry but somebody has to do the picking and someone has to be the pickee!!!!
Fundie christians have difficulty excepting a lot of differant things that doesnt match them. Heck sex is a sin ya know!!
Thats just the way it is. It has improved over time, we may take a few steps backward for a while, but it will be even better in the future..someday.

How do you think gay and lesbians feel..some of them are christian too!!!!!!!!!!!! They are publicly and constantly bashed relentlessly, everyday!!! And not only by christians but by all differant people. They are the major target today, I think!!!

[Rudas Starblaze]

depends on what 'brand' of christians you come across, some of them do think every other religion is worshipping the devil. gotta say tho, those ones are few and far between. most christians don't think much of anything about paganism besides that it's not for them.


yeah, what you said! i guess i may be one of the few.

[Calen]

depends on what 'brand' of christians you come across, some of them do think every other religion is worshipping the devil. gotta say tho, those ones are few and far between. most christians don't think much of anything about paganism besides that it's not for them.

Agreed. I'd say a lot of Christians (particularly the ones who don't know any Pagans personally) might have a lot of interesting ideas about the stuff we do, but that's more misinformation than getting 'picked on'. For example, Wicca came up in a discussion during my church retreat last week. You could tell that none of the people involved other than me and my friend had really done any research on the subject, because they were making generalizations about animal sacrifices and such. They weren't being bigoted, just misinformed, and I corrected them. There was one girl who made a comment about doing spells 'for every little thing', but that was about it.

While I know that my beliefs aren't accepted by my church community, I've never felt particularly persecuted, mostly because the subject doesn't come up. But if it does, most people do their best to stay PC when they are saying that they don't agree with it. And if that's all they have to say, that's fine by me!

[silverstard]

I understand what sincerebliss is trying to say... I sympathize. I'm in the closet - more now because I'm afraid (before it was more because it's not anyone's business).

:: off topic ::
This post reads really funny using the MW@Work setting.

[Shanti]

I still think gays and lesbians are the major target right now!!!!!

[sincerebliss]

I understand what sincerebliss is trying to say... I sympathize. I'm in the closet - more now because I'm afraid (before it was more because it's not anyone's business).

:: off topic ::
This post reads really funny using the MW@Work setting.

( ((((Thanks for replying everyone! )))))
Yeah, I'm in the broom closet also. I've been asked a few or so times this week what my religion was and just what my beliefs in general were. Despite the fact that it's none of their business, I still don't feel like I can be open if I wanted to.. :imout:

[Rudas Starblaze]

[QUOTE=Shanti]Personally I am uptight...my local news is picking on people who drink coffee and smoke a cig at the same time!!
See you are suppose to drink coffee or smoke a cig..not do both at the same time!!! There are more health risk if you dont alter cigs and coffee. Coffee/smokers are costing health care cost to rise ya know!!!

Sorry but somebody has to do the picking and someone has to be the pickee!!!!
Fundie christians have difficulty excepting a lot of differant things that doesnt match them. Heck sex is a sin ya know!!
Thats just the way it is. It has improved over time, we may take a few steps backward for a while, but it will be even better in the future..someday.

How do you think gay and lesbians feel..some of them are christian too!!!!!!!!!!!! They are publicly and constantly bashed relentlessly, everyday!!! And not only by christians but by all differant people. They are the major target today, I think!!![/QUOTE

well, i am sure to be attacked for this one.

the reason why christians bash homosexuality is because of the bible verse "if a man should lay in bed with another man as he would a woman, kill them both."

in the true christian belief, to be forgiven for your sins, one must repent, ask for forgiveness, and try there best to never do that sin again.

[Aidron]

I have never before posted a karma comment in public, but I would like to address yours, sincerebliss.


Yeah, I understand what your saying. I may have phrased it wrong. I was going more into the fact that out of all the non-christian religions, we seem more picked on.

Granted, if you phrased this poorly, let me know, but what religion is it precisely that you referring to? Paganism is not a religion, but a grouping as I have pointed out of all religions that includes any faith that does not ascribe to Christian doctrine through their many sects.

If you're referring to Wicca, not every Pagan is Wicca, specifically me.

If you're referring to Witchcraft, Witchcraft is not even a religion-but a practice.

Could you clarify what it was you meant by 'we'?

[sincerebliss]

I have never before posted a karma comment in public, but I would like to address yours, sincerebliss.



Granted, if you phrased this poorly, let me know, but what religion is it precisely that you referring to? Paganism is not a religion, but a grouping as I have pointed out of all religions that includes any faith that does not ascribe to Christian doctrine through their many sects.

If you're referring to Wicca, not every Pagan is Wicca, specifically me.

If you're referring to Witchcraft, Witchcraft is not even a religion-but a practice.

Could you clarify what it was you meant by 'we'?

Thanks for pointing that out first of all. When thinking about Paganism..I usually assume witchcraft follows under its subtitle. A few of the people I have conversed with online consider witchcraft a religion, though, it is "technically" not. I, myself, consider it a religion because it is a way of life but that's just me. I shouldn't have used "we" really because it is such a broad term and can be applied to many, many people. I don't know what word would be more suitable in my question. I probably shouldn't of used "we". Perhaps I should of said Wiccans...Druids..ect. and named all the religions I was referring to. I assumed most would know that I meant. My karma comment basically rephrased my question. Maybe then you'll have a better undertstanding of what I was asking. Thanks for your comment..I need to be going now. _happydanc lol

[-Sky-]

Well, Christians (as a whole) believe that if you don't worship their god then you are actually worshipping satan in disguise. Therefore, they think all other religions are practicing a form of satanism, right? If this is true then why does it seem like most Pagans are the only ones being accused of worshipping the devil? What about all the other religions? According to Christians, all the other religions are devil worshippers, too!!!!!!! Why not pick on them????? Grrrr...lol:fpraise: :imout:

Edited for the sake of: we ..lol

I don't believe Christians think that ALL the other religion followers worship Satan.Actually,Christians have this false idea only for Pagans(as in wiccan,druids) and witches in general.But for other religions they believe that Buddism's followers worship Buddha,Islam's followers worship Allah etc
Greece is one of the countries with the most Christians and I've been present in many conversations in my school and outside it that's why I am forming the above opinion.

[Aidron]

Thanks for pointing that out first of all. When thinking about Paganism..I usually assume witchcraft follows under its subtitle. A few of the people I have conversed with online consider witchcraft a religion, though, it is "technically" not. I, myself, consider it a religion because it is a way of life but that's just me. I shouldn't have used "we" really because it is such a broad term and can be applied to many, many people. I don't know what word would be more suitable in my question. I probably shouldn't of used "we". Perhaps I should of said Wiccans...Druids..ect. and named all the religions I was referring to. I assumed most would know that I meant. My karma comment basically rephrased my question. Maybe then you'll have a better undertstanding of what I was asking. Thanks for your comment..I need to be going now. _happydanc lol


Ah, okay. Many people are guilty of subtitles in assuming what Pagan people are, so I thought that might be it-and often it's nothing more than a simply slip. I just wasn't entirely sure.

[Secrets Flame]

Well, Christians (as a whole) believe that if you don't worship their god then you are actually worshipping satan in disguise. Therefore, they think all other religions are practicing a form of satanism, right?

Not neccessarily always worshipping satan himself, but certainally being decieved by the devil. Doing his bidding wether on purpose or through ignorance.


If this is true then why does it seem like most Pagans are the only ones being accused of worshipping the devil? What about all the other religions? According to Christians, all the other religions are devil worshippers, too!!!!!!! Why not pick on them????? Grrrr...lol:fpraise: :imout:

You think they don't? Christians as a whole are MORE anti-atheistic humanism then they are neo-paganism. And they are certainally not too happy with the growing spread of Islam around the world.

As far as Christians "persecuting" paganism goes, most Christians don't give paganism a single thought (except at hallowe'en and that truly is a lack of history because hallowe'en is a christian festival)

[Aidron]

As far as Christians "persecuting" paganism goes, most Christians don't give paganism a single thought (except at hallowe'en and that truly is a lack of history because hallowe'en is a christian festival)


Depending on the locale, this is true or untrue, but that is to be expected. Location has a vital impact on the mindset of those who live there.

And the misinformation regarding the origins of Halloween are quite true, with it once having been All Hallows Eve, later mutilated into what we know it as today: Halloween. Regardless of that, many Christians are informed enough to know that Halloween originated from the fact that Samhain (among others) could not be wiped out, so they took to assimilating it and putting a Christian spin on it. Many do not approve of even this-as did some when it originated-and now return to a mindset of simply attempting to wipe it out.

[ap Dafydd]

Accepting all the provisos that others have said, I still think there's a questiont to be answered.

Perhaps that answer is: because Pagans are the Original Enemy of Christianity. Once upon a time they were a small sect derived from Judaism in the huge diversity of religions that were around in the Roman Empire. But by seeing themselves as the One True Religion meant that they had to define all the rest of us as the opposition. As they grew in strength and influence, they were able to impose themselves, define everyone else as pagan, and demonise all religions but their own. Don't believe any of the cuddly myths, there were bitter conflicts as this happened. And the pagans lost.

Now we're back. Uncomfortable for them. Some of us are explicit reconstructionists. Others just acknowledge our roots in the ancient religions. But all of us are a painful reminder of ancient battles which they may have to re-fight.

But there's more. We have challenging and uncomfortable attitudes to the Earth and to each other. "An it harm none..." may sound trite these days in Pagan circles, but it's a direct challenge to those religions that are based on "thou shalt not..." We don't require austerity but instead welcome pleasure in our lives. We can be Dionysian in our practices. Many of us have nailed our colours to the need to defend the Earth against the environmental threats that it faces.

I can well understand why a fundy would consider us to be the spawn of Satan, even before we trot out Old Hornie!

gwyn eich byd

Ffred

[flar7]

the number one target for most christian propaganda is the faith of islam. Christians find this faith more disturbing and tolerate it less than any other I can think of..... Maybe even Satanism itself. Pagans vs Christians may be an old battle that continues, but right now, I would rather be pagan in the U.S. than muslim.

[zakzekezedd]

Intolerance has a long tradition in Christianity. A lot of it goes back to that period in time when Christianity wasn't a major religious or political force to be reckoned with......"someone" got the idea that the only way Christianity was safe was if everyone was Christian! No differences could be tolerated or allowed. Anyone who didn't conform would be "eliminated"....The Jews and Moors didn't fare all that well during the Inquisition either.
The whole business of intolerance of anyone different isn't just a "human" thing...put a black chicken in a pen with white chickens and guess who gets attacked? It's just that humans being somewhat more advanced socially than the average chicken make the whole us vs them distinction on slightly more subtle things than what color your feathers happen to be. That leaves room for a whole variety of religious, social, sexual, and economic reasons for intolerance.

[Phoenix Blue]

If this is true then why does it seem like most Pagans are the only ones being accused of worshipping the devil?
Because we talk about magic and call ourselves witches, maybe? *Shrugs and smiles* Just a hunch.

[Pure Ahimsa]

Well, Christians (as a whole) believe that if you don't worship their god then you are actually worshipping satan in disguise. Therefore, they think all other religions are practicing a form of satanism, right? If this is true then why does it seem like most Pagans are the only ones being accused of worshipping the devil? What about all the other religions? According to Christians, all the other religions are devil worshippers, too!!!!!!! Why not pick on them????? Grrrr...lol:fpraise: :imout:

Edited for the sake of: we ..lol

Pagans are actually not the most picked on by the Christians, I know that Christians did a lot to Pagans but their are some worse things.
Also, whenever I go to churches for a friends' conformation/communion, they speak really badly of Judaism, Buddhism, Hinduism and Voodoo. But when a friend of mine told his priest/pastor (w.e lol) that I was a Witch, the priest hissed at me and gave me such a look, but said nothing. It's confusing, but Pagans are not the most picked on.

[Shana-chan]

Anyone who does not ascribe to Christian ideaology is Pagan. Paganism denotes many things, one of which is a person who does not practice or hold belief in the ideals, stories, and moral inclinations incooperated throughout every branch of Christianity. See where I am going with this? Satanism, Hinduism, Buddhism, Shintoism, Druidry, Wicca, Atheism... they are all Pagan in some form or another.

It is not uncommon for Christians to fight among themself, as with any religion or grouping of similar ideals, but it is less common, however.

Actually, the definition of Pagan is 'Any religion that is not Christian, Judaism, or Muslim.' ^_^ And, right now, Christians are hating every religion. (P.S. - sorry if I'm repeating anything anyone else said).

[flar7]

um, isnt the definition of pagan, : country dweller?

cool, they have changed the online definition to include religous aspects. Books still stick mostly to the country dweller version.

\Pa"gan\ (p[=a]"gan), n. [L. paganus a countryman, peasant, villager, a pagan, fr. paganus of or pertaining to the country, rustic, also, pagan, fr. pagus a district, canton, the country, perh. orig., a district with fixed boundaries: cf. pangere to fasten. Cf. Painim, Peasant, and Pact, also Heathen.] One who worships false gods; an idolater; a heathen; one who is neither a Christian, a Mohammedan, nor a Jew.
.

[dr_zeus440]

ive got no figures, but im gunna instinctively say that jews and muslims get it a lot harder than pagans. theres a whoooooole lotta people out there who have no idea what the hell paganism is. but you can walk up to any man, woman or child who's watched the news and almost be certain that they'll know islam and israel.

[IvyWitch]

Even if you define Pagan as a member of the Neo-OPagan religion, it's still not the group that holds the highest concern among Christians. It just seems that way because you're Pagan, and Christians may target you or others you know. To be honest, the "minority" that Christians are picking on most these days are Muslims and Homosexuals. *shrug*

[Shana-chan]

um, isnt the definition of pagan, : country dweller?

cool, they have changed the online definition to include religous aspects. Books still stick mostly to the country dweller version.

\Pa"gan\ (p[=a]"gan), n. [L. paganus a countryman, peasant, villager, a pagan, fr. paganus of or pertaining to the country, rustic, also, pagan, fr. pagus a district, canton, the country, perh. orig., a district with fixed boundaries: cf. pangere to fasten. Cf. Painim, Peasant, and Pact, also Heathen.] One who worships false gods; an idolater; a heathen; one who is neither a Christian, a Mohammedan, nor a Jew.
.

Nope! That's the definition of the latin term that they took the word from. The actual definition of the english word is after the brackets. Here's a link from dicitonary.com, which shows the definitions for just about every dictionary out there. http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=pagan

[Shana-chan]

Even if you define Pagan as a member of the Neo-OPagan religion, it's still not the group that holds the highest concern among Christians. It just seems that way because you're Pagan, and Christians may target you or others you know. To be honest, the "minority" that Christians are picking on most these days are Muslims and Homosexuals. *shrug*
Well, for some reason, when you tell anyone you're pagan, the first thing they will say is, 'You worship the devil?!' In fact, my step-father was a person of this persuasion, and I honestly think that the Christians think the same way about us as my step-father did. He was actually screaming at me, saying that I didn't know the meaning of the word 'pagan', and wouldn't stop until I showed him 'pagan' in my dictionary. <.< -.-;
But, yes. The homosexuals are being picked on far more than us, and everyone in Iraq who isn't a Christian are being stereotyped by the US government. It's awful. :(

[Romani Vixen]

I'm not going to do the whole "I'm more picked on than you" thing... not necessary... but..... a story!

About 5 years ago I was attending Job Corps. It's a government run trade school... with a few decent kids and a lot of .... *PC SPEAK* undereducated youths with a lack of exposure to cultures other than their own. One of the 'decent kids' was a young woman who had recently converted from Catholic to Seventh Day Adventist... the religion that I was raised.

She did the "well, if you don't worship god, you're just doing satan's bidding'. Oh, goody!!!!! I know her religion better than she does, and I *know* that I can take this on! :D Keep in mind, we're in front of the recreation center having this discussion... a crowd is gradually growing.

I pointed out that deeds speak louder than words, and what of my deeds is anything but loving kindness. Nothing... I'm a healer. I don't speak ill of Christ or the Christian God. What exactly is showing that I work for Satan, either directly or indirectly? I of course pointed out early on that I didn't believe in any entity of pure good or pure evil.

It was sooo good. Of course this is a few years ago... so I'm starting to forget the juicy bits.

I'm happy to say that she couldn't call me evil... or a worshiper, or minion of satan... nothing of the like. And about 30 innercity youths were watching.... and *listening* the whole time. :) I love mass education.