Non Pagan husband vs Pagan friends

[MorningDove030202]

I'm struggling with my marriage right now. i know we need to see a councler but it's just not afordable.

1) Can anyone recomend any books, perhapse something like a workbook for married couples in trouble? Something to help us forgive eachother and to communicate without yelling? We yell entirely too much infront of our son.

2) We both agree that we arn't the best friends we used to be. My husband thinks it's because he's not Pagan. He sees me having strong relationships with my Pagan friends, and is jelous. He has not ben suportive of my spirituality, realy he's against any spirituality. He says all religion is "entertainment". He thinks I'm obsessed with Wicca. He is resistant to me atteding the local coven's open events, and has forbid me from joining, so instead I joined www.witchschool.com, but I still want to go to some open events because my best friend is in that group. How can my husband show more support of my spirituality without actualy joining/participating? Is this an issue with other's who's SO isn't Pagan? How does your non Pagan SO suport your spirituality?

Dove

[Temptation]

I'm struggling with my marriage right now. i know we need to see a councler but it's just not afordable.

1) Can anyone recomend any books, perhapse something like a workbook for married couples in trouble? Something to help us forgive eachother and to communicate without yelling? We yell entirely too much infront of our son.

2) We both agree that we arn't the best friends we used to be. My husband thinks it's because he's not Pagan. He sees me having strong relationships with my Pagan friends, and is jelous. He has not ben suportive of my spirituality, realy he's against any spirituality. He says all religion is "entertainment". He thinks I'm obsessed with Wicca. He is resistant to me atteding the local coven's open events, and has forbid me from joining, so instead I joined www.witchschool.com, but I still want to go to some open events because my best friend is in that group. How can my husband show more support of my spirituality without actualy joining/participating? Is this an issue with other's who's SO isn't Pagan? How does your non Pagan SO suport your spirituality?

Dove

I'm sorry about your troubles with your hubby.
I guess I'm lucky mine was raised by people whose beliefs are even more out there
than mine so, to him, I'm relatively normal and he doesn't have any problems with it.

What really struck me in your post is that he forbade you to join into the
local coven's open events. Sweetie, who is he to forbid you anything? You are
your own person, you have to make your own choices and, like it or not, he has
to respect them. That's what marriage is all about; respecting, being commited to
and supporting each other every day.

You need to sit down and talk about this situation calmly. Yelling at each other will
accomplish nothing. Explain to him that your path is important to you and that he
should respect that and not mock you or make you feel guilty for your beliefs.
You should also find ways of spending quality time together so that he doesn't feel
as jealous of your closeness with your pagan friends.
It seems to me that's where the problem is, he feels left out and jealous so he lashes
out any way he can. Maybe he's afraid of losing you to your religion because he
doesn't really understand it.
Communication is always the key. Talk it over with him. Tell him that your religion
is not a threat to your marriage unless he makes it one.

I hope I've helped a little. Good luck. I wish you and your hubby all the best.:)

[mol]

Well, then it sounds like he needs to compromise. If he cares enough about you then he will seek out understanding or, at least, toleration. *shrugs*

Sorry....I dont know what else to say to help.

[mucgwyrt]

I'm sorry about your troubles with your hubby.
I guess I'm lucky mine was raised by people whose beliefs are even more out there
than mine so, to him, I'm relatively normal and he doesn't have any problems with it.

What really struck me in your post is that he forbade you to join into the
local coven's open events. Sweetie, who is he to forbid you anything? You are
your own person, you have to make your own choices and, like it or not, he has
to respect them. That's what marriage is all about; respecting, being commited to
and supporting each other every day.

You need to sit down and talk about this situation calmly. Yelling at each other will
accomplish nothing. Explain to him that your path is important to you and that he
should respect that and not mock you or make you feel guilty for your beliefs.
You should also find ways of spending quality time together so that he doesn't feel
as jealous of your closeness with your pagan friends.
It seems to me that's where the problem is, he feels left out and jealous so he lashes
out any way he can. Maybe he's afraid of losing you to your religion because he
doesn't really understand it.
Communication is always the key. Talk it over with him. Tell him that your religion
is not a threat to your marriage unless he makes it one.

I hope I've helped a little. Good luck. I wish you and your hubby all the best.:)
I agree 100%. I think it's sad that he 'forbids' you to do things out of his own insecurity - I think he needs a big fat :hugz: and some reassurance from you. Maybe you could join a class together, or find a hobby you both enjoy doing. Sharing a different interest will probably make the world of difference :smile:

[Lunamoth]

What Temptation says is about what I'd say. My husband and I ran into problems a few years ago when he started doing much of the same thing yours is. Mocking me, forbidding me to "hang out" in pagan crowds, etc. It finally took for me to sit him down, as was said, and tell him how this made me feel. How it made me feel like he didn't respect me or that he thought I wasn't capable of making smart decisions. And of course, he didn't want me to feel that way, he just didn't know he was doing it. Yes, he was jealous of me doing things that didn't include him and he feared he would "lose" me to a life he wanted nothing to do with.

Has your spiritual practice been increasingly more prevailant over time? Perhaps if you show him that while there are changes going on, it's good to grow and learn and it doesn't automatically mean that you're a different person, just better than you'd been before.

[MorningDove030202]

I agree 100%. I think it's sad that he 'forbids' you to do things out of his own insecurity - I think he needs a big fat :hugz: and some reassurance from you. Maybe you could join a class together, or find a hobby you both enjoy doing. Sharing a different interest will probably make the world of difference :smile:


You are absolutly right. We don't share any hobbies, except for our son. It seams like we have little in common. It's like the things we used to do we can't because we are parents. We used to play EQ together, and Camalot, and we used to do D&D....but we gave that all up because we didn't want to be distracted from our responsibility of caring for our son.

Does anyone have any hobbie suggestions?

Dove

[mol]

You are absolutly right. We don't share any hobbies, except for our son. It seams like we have little in common. It's like the things we used to do we can't because we are parents. We used to play EQ together, and Camalot, and we used to do D&D....but we gave that all up because we didn't want to be distracted from our responsibility of caring for our son.

Does anyone have any hobbie suggestions?

Dove
How about playing with your son....together?

[Rockprincess]

Can't you do many of those things without neglecting your son? Play after he's in bed at night, or have a family member care for him occasionally?

[equinox2]

Ouch!

It sounds like both you and your husband have some work to do to bring your marriage back to the fun, enriching thing it should be. Hang in there, you can do it. Invest in some counseling if you have to, it's worth it.

Most of it is communication and respect, so I apologize for not being able to focus on those. Instead, I'll focus only on the spirituality problem, since that is something I might be able to help with. I hear of many Pagan women married to atheist men, and my experience of being an atheist who turned to Paganism can be useful.

Your description of your SO reminded me of what I was like 5 years ago. I was pretty sure of my worldview (and still am), but was lacking something in my spiritual life. I came across someone else like that a little while ago, and the letter I sent them is below. If you like, your SO may find it interesting. "Pagan Humanism" and "Naturalistic Paganism" are two names for the same spiritual approach. I'd use "Pagan Humanism" in your case because you SO is coming from the Humanist side. Also, maybe you could get him more used to spirituality through the UU church? There are many hard-core atheists in the UU church, so he'll fit right in. Oh, and here is an essay on the Humanist-Pagan conflict that you may find useful:
http://www.firstunitariantoronto.org/Sermons/Humanism_and_Paganism.htm

lastly, this approach might be good for him too: www.pantheism.net

You can do it! You can have a common family spirituality, like my wife, 2 sons and I do. You too can celebrate the 8 holidays as family events, focusing on the family aspects (carving pumpkins, having a solstice tree with gifts, egg hunts & Ostara baskets, Summer Solstice bonfires.....).

-Equinox

(Here’s the letter: )

Like you, I don’t believe in anything without good evidence for it first. Similarly, I don’t think magick is any more real than prayers, saintly intervention, or the appearance of Jesus on a tortilla. The real world is amazing enough - no make-believe is needed!

These are, of course, my best guesses about the world. I’m humble enough to see that all my “beliefs” are actually just “best guesses” and as such could be just plain wrong. I do think that magick is good as a way to focus one’s motivation, to renew one’s commitment to something, etc. I think that it should be practiced – while being understood that it changes you, not the outside world.

In the same way, the goddesses and gods are wonderful archetypes to think about, though I don’t think they are literally real. My personal favorite is Prometheus, who gave humans the knowledge of fire - at great risk to himself.

I’ve labeled my path “Pagan Humanism”. I think that plain Humanism is just that – plain. It needs the color, majesty and fun of Paganism to truly reflect the experience of those of us who are in love with life – this life here on earth. After all, if this life is really all we have, then I don’t want to waste a second of it by being stodgy or afraid to have fun! I needed to loosen up and have fun, so now my my spirituality focuses on THIS life, THIS world, and on THIS experience, not on some hypothetical afterlife or on a stuffy disdain for all religion. I feel that much of paganism complements and enriches my life. I see the wheel of the year a beautiful way to honor each stage of our lives and to be with family – not to mention being able to celebrate another year of our lives together.

I also recognize that many other Pagans see things differently than I do, and I respect them. Because Pagans generally do not condemn my lack of belief, they deserve the same good religious tolerance they show me.

For an overview of my journey out of Catholicism, through Humanism and finally to Pagan Humanism, start here: http://www-personal.engin.umich.edu/~leta/TREATISE/tjchap1.htm

(however, you might want to just cut to the chase and read chapter 8 http://www-personal.engin.umich.edu/~leta/TREATISE/tjchap8.htm

You also might also want to see how the 4 elements and the wheel of the year are important as metaphors in my spirituality, if so, just click here:

http://www-personal.engin.umich.edu/~leta/TREATISE/TJPSUM/woverv/wovervhome.htm, or go to www.naturalpagan.org

If any of this is interesting, cool! If not, I’m sorry for wasting some of your time. May the stars light your path-

[Seren_]

My hubby isn't pagan, but he knew I was from the start. He pokes fun at me occasionally about my "witchy ways", but with no disrespect. He is completely non-religious (as much as a Catholic can be, anyway :D ). My commitment to the coven I was with when we first started going out caused some problems occasionally, because he felt I was being demanded of too much. Which was very true. I think the idea of a coven was a bit bemusing for him as well. After leaving that coven, it wasn't an issue, because I'm now solitary, and happy that way at the moment. But he's happy to leave me space to get on with whatever I want to when I feel the need.

It sounds like your hubby's feeling a little left out and frightened or worried that your interest in Wicca is going to change your relationship with him...that it's going to leave him behind. Probably especially so if you've started studying recently, or since starting your relationship with him.

It sounds like a good idea to get some more mutual interests going again. Even if it's a romantic meal every now and then...inviting friends over for D&D or whatever. Are there any outdoor weekend D&D events that you could go to? They're usually kid friendly, and also usually attract a lot of pagans. So it's the best of both worlds...

[MorningDove030202]

Can't you do many of those things without neglecting your son? Play after he's in bed at night, or have a family member care for him occasionally?

We don't have family down here, but we do have one friend who might be able to baby sit, but they tend to be very busy too.

If we had EQ it would be too much of a distraction, the house wouldn't get cleaned...... It's a bad idea! I was thinking of maybe a D&D bord game that wouldn't take forever to set up or something like that.....

Dove

[mucgwyrt]

We don't have family down here, but we do have one friend who might be able to baby sit, but they tend to be very busy too.

If we had EQ it would be too much of a distraction, the house wouldn't get cleaned...... It's a bad idea! I was thinking of maybe a D&D bord game that wouldn't take forever to set up or something like that.....

Dove
Yeah, especially if you were able to put it on a wooden board or something so you could lift the whole thing up and stick it ontop of a cupboard or something through the day, without having to pack it all away!

[MorningDove030202]

The UU isn't realy this thing either..... He doesn't like any organized religion. He also think's ritual is silly, even if it's litteraly believing in gods, or metaphoricaly believing in gods.....

Dove

[MorningDove030202]

How about playing with your son....together?

I'm a stay at home mom 95% of the time and he's 2 1/2. The lack of mental stimulation is driving me crazy......

NO I don't want to play with my son more than I already do!!!!!!!!


AAAAAAAhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!!!!!!

Dove

[equinox2]

MorningDove030202 wrote:
He also think's ritual is silly, even if it's litteraly believing in gods, or metaphoricaly believing in gods.....


Darn. I'm sorry I couldn't help more. Maybe he will at least admit that we scientists don't know what human consciousness really is or why we are conscious. That was my first step away from a dogmatic, elitist, atheistic Naturalism........

I wish you both the best.....

[Keroberos]

Yeah, were you involved with the religion before you guys were together? I think that's an important thing, I understand that you are home a lot with your son so you want to go out and be with like minded people. That's reasonable, it's also reasonable for your husband to want to spend time with you. Hang on, if you can afford it I would totally recommend getting a console game system. Even though it's not PC it's still a game. Game Cube has some really cool multi-player games, you guys could game together still without all the commitment that EQ requires. I play games with my SO all the time.

Another thing is altough you can't expect him to be spiritual all of a sudden, he can't expect you to be secular all the time, this religion is a part of us, it's not a passive religion like some others. We actively worship and learn as much as we have time to. Also just because he doesn't get what you feel and believe, maybe he feels left out, it wouldn't hurt to have intellectual conversations about spirituality in general (though I know athiest are impossible to talk to sometimes). Knowing that you are trying to include him may make him feel better about you going out. When going out to events, reassure him that you aren't just going out to have crazy sexy nekkid dancing in the woods, and tell him what time you'll be home. I don't think it's right for him to put a leash on you, especially since you're confined to the house as it is, perhaps explaining to him in a rational manner that you do need time to yourself a couple times a week, and he needs to be responsible for your son a few times a week isn't too much to ask for. He may respond better knowing that you're not going out to get away from him but to have much needed you time.

I hope I helped even a little bit, I've seen couples treat each other badly and it makes me sad, so I hope everything works out.

[Jenett]

One book you might want to look at - people I know have found it useful for relationship stuff is "Getting the Love You Want" by Harville Hendrix. It's got exercises and such.

As far as Pagan vs. non-Pagan. My husband isn't Pagan either. (for that matter, neither is my other significant other: we're polyamorous.)

What made it easier for him was seeing me come home from ritual and coven work in a *better* mood (and more able to take on more at home, help him out, etc.) than if I didn't go.

He doesn't necessarily like everyone in the group himself (he likes some people a lot, and a couple make him slightly uncomfortable) but he agrees it's good for me.

What springs to mind are the following questions:

1) Is it you doing stuff without him, or you doing *Pagan* stuff without him that is making him uncomfortable? They're two different issues in many ways.

2) If it's stuff in general, that can get unhealthy fast. Figuring out some way to deal with the issues involved is definitely a good idea.

3) If it's Pagan stuff in specific, can he pin down what makes him uncomfortable? Does he have specific fears or worries? What can you do to address them?

(i.e. if he's worried about time apart, then negotiate times that are reasonable. Looking at what he'd consider reasonable for another religious practice, or a hobby is probably a good place to start. If he's worried about you drawing apart, that's a different discussion, but there are places to start)

5) Does he have accurate information both about Wicca, and specifically about what *you* want to do on your path? Sometimes people get weird assumptions, or don't know that what they're thinking isn't actually what you want. Talking frankly helps a lot.

6) At the same time, if he's not terribly interested in it himself, maybe don't push it. My husband and I negotiated a 10 minute rule: I get to babble about Wiccan stuff for 10 minutes (after coming home from ritual, class, etc.) After that, he's perfectly within his rights to say something like "I'm glad you had a good time, but can we talk about something else now?".

If I want to talk about it more, there are lots of other people I can talk to, but sharing *some* of what I'm doing and what's meaningful to me was also important. (In practice, we're rarely that explicit about it anymore: sometimes we change the subject, sometimes we go on a related tangent.)

7) I'm firmly convinced that adults need time too. My parents trained me (my father was a university professor, and did a lot of work at home, as well as a side lecture/performance business that my parents needed to cooperate on).

I was expected to be in my room from 1 to 3 pm and quiet (barring emergencies) in the afternoon when I was little, ditto a firm bedtime of around 8 (except for special occaisions). That gave my parents time with each other as adults, and time to get necessary business stuff done. It also taught me to amuse myself, which is a good habit to have.

They didn't care if I read or listened to music or played, or napped, as long as I was quiet about it. That was also important. (They were certainly doing this by the time I was 2.5, though they did check on me regularly, and were right down the hall. Most of that time at that age, I was napping though.)

Working out the housekeeping and maybe getting a mother's helper in for a few hours sometimes (so you could focus on talking to each other, and someone could get you if there was an emergency: mother's helpers are generally younger/cheaper than babysitters. But it'd give you a break.)

I know a lot of people who've found that simplifying/streamlinging their household duties (both cleaning and cooking) find it very worthwhile. You get more time to focus on the stuff you enjoy, you don't need to worry about household chores when your husband's home, so you could do fun stuff more.

Some people I know swear by FlyLady (which I'm working on adapting myself). It's not terribly Pagan friendly on first glance (there's some fairly Christian attitudes in some parts) but the basic ideas work really well for a lot of people. (http://flylady.com - I got a lot more out of getting the book out of the library and working on the bits that made sense to me, where I work and there's no kids.)

[MorningDove030202]

We had a long talk yesterday and we decided on a few things....

1) I can go to at least 4 open events a year at the local coven, and more if there is time/money.

2) We are going to read a book together about marriage/relationships and have our own private book club.

3) We are going to have a game night once a week, we just need to find some cooler games. (could be video games, we have an X-box, any game suggestions?)

4) We looked into taking some cooking classes together. They look afordablle. We found one on making sushi, MMMMM!

Some perceptions of his about my practice of Wicca:

1)He feels that for me to be clergy and realy do the job of clergy I'd have to either abandon my family or waite until I'm retired. I don't think it has to be that way at all. Yes, somethings will have to waite until I'm retired, but not everything.

Dove

[mucgwyrt]

We had a long talk yesterday and we decided on a few things....

1) I can go to at least 4 open events a year at the local coven, and more if there is time/money.

2) We are going to read a book together about marriage/relationships and have our own private book club.

3) We are going to have a game night once a week, we just need to find some cooler games. (could be video games, we have an X-box, any game suggestions?)

4) We looked into taking some cooking classes together. They look afordablle. We found one on making sushi, MMMMM!

Some perceptions of his about my practice of Wicca:

1)He feels that for me to be clergy and realy do the job of clergy I'd have to either abandon my family or waite until I'm retired. I don't think it has to be that way at all. Yes, somethings will have to waite until I'm retired, but not everything.

Dove
Yay! Sounds good! :smile:

[mattolsen]

My own personal expereience as a child is that it is very difficult to deal with parents who yell at each other all the time. I'm sure that this is something that neither you or your husband want to do. I would suggest talking to him and comming to an aggreement to make an extra effort not to yell in front of the children. This doesn't always work and what my family has done with a fair amount of success is this:

Talk to your children and see how they feel... make sure they know that because you guys fight it doesn't mean you don't love them.

Give them a secret word they can use when they hear you fight... usually hearing your son/daughter saying that word is enough to bring you down.

As far as your husband not accepting wicca as your religion, well I guess I would need to understand why he doesn't accept it. This is something you should probably talk to him about. Is he afraid of losing you to it? Does he have a general mistrust of religion? If so, why? Does he misunderstand or not understand at all wicca? I'm sure there are other resons that I can't even think of. The fact is he may not even realize why it bothers him until you talk about it.

Once you know why figuring out how to fix the problem is much easier. BTW my wife is agnostic but very supportive (so I'm pretty lucky) but to some degree I know where you are comming from.

blessed be

[DraconisArcanus]

3) We are going to have a game night once a week, we just need to find some cooler games. (could be video games, we have an X-box, any game suggestions?)

Dove
If you both enjoyed EQ, X-box has Champions of Norath and the two of you can play together without the leveling issues and constant rigors of the online game.

Hope it helps and I'll keep you family in my prayers.

Peace (from a fellow witchschool.com brother)

[MorningDove030202]

My own personal expereience as a child is that it is very difficult to deal with parents who yell at each other all the time. I'm sure that this is something that neither you or your husband want to do. I would suggest talking to him and comming to an aggreement to make an extra effort not to yell in front of the children. This doesn't always work and what my family has done with a fair amount of success is this:

Talk to your children and see how they feel... make sure they know that because you guys fight it doesn't mean you don't love them.

Give them a secret word they can use when they hear you fight... usually hearing your son/daughter saying that word is enough to bring you down.

As far as your husband not accepting wicca as your religion, well I guess I would need to understand why he doesn't accept it. This is something you should probably talk to him about. Is he afraid of losing you to it? Does he have a general mistrust of religion? If so, why? Does he misunderstand or not understand at all wicca? I'm sure there are other resons that I can't even think of. The fact is he may not even realize why it bothers him until you talk about it.

Once you know why figuring out how to fix the problem is much easier. BTW my wife is agnostic but very supportive (so I'm pretty lucky) but to some degree I know where you are comming from.

blessed be


Having a secret word is a great idea.... sometimes he tells us to stop and he puts his hands over our mouth...... I know the fighting is hurting everyone. I don't want to raise him in a verbaly abusive environment.

Dove

[Gracecat]

I'm a stay at home mom 95% of the time and he's 2 1/2. The lack of mental stimulation is driving me crazy......

NO I don't want to play with my son more than I already do!!!!!!!!


AAAAAAAhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!!!!!!

Dove

Personally I feel it is very very sad that you are reluctant to give your son an extremely valuable gift. He's being denied the attention of both of his parents simultanously. I truly understand the countdown to 5pm and it's time for Daddy to come home so you can have a break but there are still weekends.

The most precious memory I have of my two year old is how her favorite place was sitting between me and her daddy watching tv, eating supper and whatnot. It's what makes family, "family".

[MorningDove030202]

Personally I feel it is very very sad that you are reluctant to give your son an extremely valuable gift. He's being denied the attention of both of his parents simultanously. I truly understand the countdown to 5pm and it's time for Daddy to come home so you can have a break but there are still weekends.

The most precious memory I have of my two year old is how her favorite place was sitting between me and her daddy watching tv, eating supper and whatnot. It's what makes family, "family".

What? did you even read what I wrote? Is being a stay at home mom not valueable enough? Don't I have needs? When I'm not burnt out I'm a better mom!

Dove

[Jackiedanielz]

What? did you even read what I wrote? Is being a stay at home mom not valueable enough? Don't I have needs? When I'm not burnt out I'm a better mom!

Dove

I don't think that's what she meant Dove. Children need time with both parents simultaneously. Spending the day with you and then the nights with dad, they may be missing out on feeling like a family. The "togetherness". I can only imagine what its like to be a stay at home mom & needing to escape once your husbands home but your child needs the benefit of activities with both of you so he/she doesn't feel like their being pawned off to the other parent. Which may not be the case, but that could be what the child is feeling. Try setting up a family night where you all play a board game or watch a movie together.

I can relate on the part of the burnout though, I have been watching my SO's children on the weekends while he's been at work. So when he has a day off I want to be left alone & I expect him to spend time with those kids alone. But we try to also do an activity together so we all feel included.

[Gracecat]

It's truly valuable Dove. I think you're doing an already wonderful thing. And you deserve kudos for it. But please trust me that you honestly need to set aside one evening a week to do something that includes all three of you, putting your son in the center of both of your attentions. It's a gift to him, it's a gift to you and your husband. Your son can be the one hobby that you both can actively share.

When my husband and I argu, taking time out and turning our attention towards parental things gave us a time out to cool off and by the time the discussion picked back up, it turned into such a petty and small thing, it ceased to matter. You can bond over your son, kids can be a wonderful marital aid if you're both open to reconciliation over the issues at hand :).

:hugz: I hope it settles down. I know how exhausted you are at the end of the day. Some days with a toddler can be hell on wheels and the last thing you want to do is load up and go eat at McDonalds, or such.

[MorningDove030202]

I don't think that's what she meant Dove. Children need time with both parents simultaneously. Spending the day with you and then the nights with dad, they may be missing out on feeling like a family. The "togetherness". I can only imagine what its like to be a stay at home mom & needing to escape once your husbands home but your child needs the benefit of activities with both of you so he/she doesn't feel like their being pawned off to the other parent. Which may not be the case, but that could be what the child is feeling. Try setting up a family night where you all play a board game or watch a movie together.

I can relate on the part of the burnout though, I have been watching my SO's children on the weekends while he's been at work. So when he has a day off I want to be left alone & I expect him to spend time with those kids alone. But we try to also do an activity together so we all feel included.


Where did the idea that our son doesn't spend time together with both of us come from? I think someone made an incorrect assumption!

Dove

[MorningDove030202]

It's truly valuable Dove. I think you're doing an already wonderful thing. And you deserve kudos for it. But please trust me that you honestly need to set aside one evening a week to do something that includes all three of you, putting your son in the center of both of your attentions. It's a gift to him, it's a gift to you and your husband. Your son can be the one hobby that you both can actively share.

When my husband and I argu, taking time out and turning our attention towards parental things gave us a time out to cool off and by the time the discussion picked back up, it turned into such a petty and small thing, it ceased to matter. You can bond over your son, kids can be a wonderful marital aid if you're both open to reconciliation over the issues at hand :).

:hugz: I hope it settles down. I know how exhausted you are at the end of the day. Some days with a toddler can be hell on wheels and the last thing you want to do is load up and go eat at McDonalds, or such.

Eat at McDonalds? Where did that idea come from? I cook dinner, we sit down and eat dinner together every day! We do lots of things with our son with the both of us! Where did you get the idea that we didn't?

Dove

[Rockprincess]

We had a long talk yesterday and we decided on a few things....

1) I can go to at least 4 open events a year at the local coven, and more if there is time/money.

2) We are going to read a book together about marriage/relationships and have our own private book club.

3) We are going to have a game night once a week, we just need to find some cooler games. (could be video games, we have an X-box, any game suggestions?)

4) We looked into taking some cooking classes together. They look afordablle. We found one on making sushi, MMMMM!

Some perceptions of his about my practice of Wicca:

1)He feels that for me to be clergy and realy do the job of clergy I'd have to either abandon my family or waite until I'm retired. I don't think it has to be that way at all. Yes, somethings will have to waite until I'm retired, but not everything.

Dove
It sounds to me like those are very positive steps. I'm sure you can work through this period! Especially since it sounds like you both really want to. :hugz:

[Jackiedanielz]

Where did the idea that our son doesn't spend time together with both of us come from? I think someone made an incorrect assumption!

Dove

Your right I did. I went back & saw the part about finding activities to do together without neglecting your son. But then you threw in the comment of watching him all day & not wanting to play with him anymore. I misinterpreted it. We all need time spent with adults so we don't talk baby talk permanetly!

[MorningDove030202]

Your right I did. I went back & saw the part about finding activities to do together without neglecting your son. But then you threw in the comment of watching him all day & not wanting to play with him anymore. I misinterpreted it. We all need time spent with adults so we don't talk baby talk permanetly!

Thanks, that's more like what I was getting at.

Dove

[Jackiedanielz]

Thanks, that's more like what I was getting at.

Dove

This is funny & related to my comment before about baby talk.

At my SO's nephew's birthday party there was a woman there. I think she has like 6 kids, ranging from 16 down to 4. She comes in & starts talking to everyone. In baby talk. Seriously. I'm just staring at her, waiting for the adult to come out of her, NOPE. Baby talk voice ALL DAY. I guess with 6 kids she doesn't get much adult time, dunno. Thought I'd share. That it was kinda funny.

[Gracecat]

Ah, ok.. I'm with Jackie, I misunderstood. Sorry...

[AuntBooPeaceFrog]

We had a long talk yesterday and we decided on a few things....

1) I can go to at least 4 open events a year at the local coven, and more if there is time/money.

2) We are going to read a book together about marriage/relationships and have our own private book club.

3) We are going to have a game night once a week, we just need to find some cooler games. (could be video games, we have an X-box, any game suggestions?)

4) We looked into taking some cooking classes together. They look afordablle. We found one on making sushi, MMMMM!

Some perceptions of his about my practice of Wicca:

1)He feels that for me to be clergy and realy do the job of clergy I'd have to either abandon my family or waite until I'm retired. I don't think it has to be that way at all. Yes, somethings will have to waite until I'm retired, but not everything.

Dove
I think the family game night sounds great! My kids' school has one night a year when all the kids and parents are invited to school and they have all these board games for everyone to play, and it re-sparks our interest if we've fallen off track. Also, I am a mostly stay at home mom too, except now that the kids are getting a little bigger and there are extracurricular activities, there doesn't seem to be as much "stay" in the "home". My hat is off to anyone who is able to work full time outside the home and still take care of a family. I guess I could if I had to (and I'd probably have to if we weren't fortunate enough to scrape by with extra money from the band gigs) but I doubt that I would be successful at either work or parenting, I'd probably just do a halfway job on both...I'm horrible when I have no "me" time at all. I don't have much time for anything outside of daily chores/activities; that's why the online community is great: I can log on and off or stop right in the middle of my conversation when the baby wakes up, and return to it later. My 9 year old is going to try the MW Kids tonight, so that will be something else we have to share.
BTW, I was going to return the karma poke and label it Ex-Lax for the BM, but it won't let me poke now...it says I've touched too much karma in the last 24 hours...but I'll be sure to get you later :T

[Keroberos]

Oh good, you guys have a few activities to do together. I wish you luck with that. I'm afraid I can't suggest any X-Box games, I'm more familiar with the Cube. I'm not sure how many games are all age appropriate that you guys could play in front of/ with you son.

[MorningDove030202]

Oh good, you guys have a few activities to do together. I wish you luck with that. I'm afraid I can't suggest any X-Box games, I'm more familiar with the Cube. I'm not sure how many games are all age appropriate that you guys could play in front of/ with you son.

Ya, that is an issue... we have PS2 as well.

Thanks everyone for all the support and ideas!

Dove

[MorningDove030202]

I also wanted to explaine this about the job I'm starting. It's my dream job! I've always wanted to be a Vet Assistant, and I took some classes this year, and I've been looking for full time employment. I wouldn't stop being a SAHM for just any job, but this is something I realy want to do with my life. I think that makes a difference when the job your are puting your kid into daycare for is something that is realy interesting and satisfying. (Plus we need to buy a new car, so I kinda need to have a job! :)
I hope that makes sence!

Dove

[mattolsen]

Please do not feel guilty about getting a job, this unfortunetly is a fact of life. Besides who says it has to be a stay at home mom, it could just as easily be a stay at home dad. In an ideal situation I agree it would be better if you could stay home with your children... however that just isn't always realistic.

Blessed Be.