Question... Would This Be Stealing...?

[Morr]

I'm considering getting tattooed soon. And one of the tattoos im considering getting is part of the cover art of an album by a band I like (I wont be tattooing their name/band symbol - only the art).

Would that be considered violating any copy rights?

I know a lot of people do it. And its not like I'll walk down the street and all of a sudden one of the band members will be like - "Yo, you stole our copy rights!".

But I'm just wondering...

[alesay]

HAHA i have no idea... but yeah, i know a lot of people who do it... SO um, i have no idea but YAY! tattoo!

[Morr]

:lol:

thanks.
i really would like to know... maybe i should just email them?
i dont know...

[soilsigh aingeal]

You could try emailing them, or asking whomever does the tat. Good luck!

[mattolsen]

I'm not sure if its violation of copyright or not. But realistically I don't see anything morally wrong with it. The whole point of copyright law is so that you can not take away profits from the owner of the copyright. Realistically if anything walking around as a living billboard for the band could only do the exact opposite.

[Mithrea]

I don't really know but I *think* that you aren't violating the copyright, the artist would be because it's the artist that is reproducing the design for profit.

At least if someone stole my drawing and tattooed it on someone without asking me, that's who I would sue. ;)

I seriously doubt a band is going to come after you for that though. They'd probably love it.

And lastly, if this is the logo of that strange looking guy, as your friend, I would advise against it. :p

[Morr]

I don't really know but I *think* that you aren't violating the copyright, the artist would be because it's the artist that is reproducing the design for profit.

At least if someone stole my drawing and tattooed it on someone without asking me, that's who I would sue. ;)

I seriously doubt a band is going to come after you for that though. They'd probably love it.

And lastly, if this is the logo of that strange looking guy, as your friend, I would advise against it. :p

LMAO
i love Dani but im not tattooing him on myself... just like im not going to tattoo Madonna or Tori - despite my undying love for them both.

This is the picture I want to get - except smaller (obviously), without the title and the band name... on my left arm...

[Jenett]

Technically, yes - it has to do with the right to determine derivative works. Even though it's a very different form of art, it's still a derivative of the original image. The law gives the copyright holder the right to decide about derivative works.

I'd honestly suggest writing to either the band or the original artist, if you can track them down. It's quite likely you'd get a "Sure, go ahead." but you'd be giving them the choice.

One other thing: in five years, if you no longer care so much about this band, is the art still going to be meaningful to you? Maybe there's some variant you can do that includes similar symbols, but that would also have other meaning as well. That'd sidestep the copyright related issues, and also make for a longer-lasting symbol.

[Silver_FireStar]

yes. All art commissioned by the band for the albumn is under the federal copywright act. What you need to do, for it to be legal, is to email and ask for permission. But it is one of those things which rarely has consequences.

[Silver_FireStar]

I like that picture

[Morr]

One other thing: in five years, if you no longer care so much about this band, is the art still going to be meaningful to you? Maybe there's some variant you can do that includes similar symbols, but that would also have other meaning as well. That'd sidestep the copyright related issues, and also make for a longer-lasting symbol.


i just LOVE the picture and what it stands for (notice the obvious christian attributes - i love christian history and theology, as well as art). I also usually stick with the bands/music i like for years, but im not getting this art as a thing for the band itself or its music. I just REALLY love this picture, and after a few days of looking - I couldnt find anything that I liked better.

I also have 2 other tattoos, so I'm familiar with it all (got my first one 4 years ago and i still adore it).

But thanks :) :lol: you just reminded me of my mom.

[~BEBZ~]

I learned from my tattoo guy that it was. But only if you were to copy it onto you exactly. If you or your tat artist does a copy of it in their own hand then it isn't.

[Yasmine Galenorn]

I'm considering getting tattooed soon. And one of the tattoos im considering getting is part of the cover art of an album by a band I like (I wont be tattooing their name/band symbol - only the art).

Would that be considered violating any copy rights?

I know a lot of people do it. And its not like I'll walk down the street and all of a sudden one of the band members will be like - "Yo, you stole our copy rights!".

But I'm just wondering...

Technically yes, it is a violation of copyright.

Yasmine :colorful:

[charmedkisses1]

Technically, yes - it has to do with the right to determine derivative works. Even though it's a very different form of art, it's still a derivative of the original image. The law gives the copyright holder the right to decide about derivative works.

I'd honestly suggest writing to either the band or the original artist, if you can track them down. It's quite likely you'd get a "Sure, go ahead." but you'd be giving them the choice.

One other thing: in five years, if you no longer care so much about this band, is the art still going to be meaningful to you? Maybe there's some variant you can do that includes similar symbols, but that would also have other meaning as well. That'd sidestep the copyright related issues, and also make for a longer-lasting symbol.


Exactly. Are you going through a phase where you looove this band/person? And maybe in ten years you'll think "why the hell did i do that?" not to mention tats look worse as you mature.. just something to think about.

[Morr]

Exactly. Are you going through a phase where you looove this band/person? And maybe in ten years you'll think "why the hell did i do that?" not to mention tats look worse as you mature.. just something to think about.


charmie i already answered her question.
this is not my first tattoo, and im not doing it for the band itself or its music. i just really adore the art, and what it represents - speaks to me on so many levels and has always spoken to me.

[flar7]

yes, its a violation. but even so, I wouldnt worry too much about it, the tattoo artist would be in more trouble than you, even though you requested it.

A derivative form of the original has to be a percentage base different to be considered free of the copyright. I cant recall the percentage, but its just a legal mumbo jumbo way of breaking the law.

Look into international copyright laws if you are really worried, or write/email the band for permission to get the tat.

and yes, Tattoos age horribly. I would consider that, above all else.

[TornadoAli]

I thought you werent violating copyrights if you take whatever it is for personal use. Like downloading a pic of the net for your wallpaper or something..? I can't imagine anything more personal than your body...

I figure just email the band and ask. They will probably be flattered you want to use their art on your body.

[Yasmine Galenorn]

I thought you werent violating copyrights if you take whatever it is for personal use. Like downloading a pic of the net for your wallpaper or something..? I can't imagine anything more personal than your body...

I figure just email the band and ask. They will probably be flattered you want to use their art on your body.

That's a totally mistaken assumption...the only time that's correct is when there is explicit permission given on the site/etc. for you to do so. Most books, art, music have copyright restrictions printed in them or on them. And even if they don't, the material is STILL copyrighted to the original producer unless it's explicitly listed as being public domain.

Yasmine

[Yasmine Galenorn]

Exactly. Are you going through a phase where you looove this band/person? And maybe in ten years you'll think "why the hell did i do that?" not to mention tats look worse as you mature.. just something to think about.

Actually, the inks used nowadays wear really well. Most people can't believe my tattoos are already six years old--and if you keep your skin up, they don't age that bad. But I agree: you need to really think whether you want to wear something forever. I've never regretted my tattoos, and thought about them for a long time (years) before getting them.

Yasmine

[flar7]

when I mean age, I mean the difference between a tattoo that you got at 16, and how that boob tattoo looks at 55. your skin ages and begins to loosen, wrinkling may occur as well as skin pigmentation changes like brown spots.

[Rudas Starblaze]

a voilation of copywrite laws would be as if you are planning on making money of whatever it is you are reproducing. since its a tat, no, im pretty sure you wont get into trouble.

[flar7]

sorry Rudas, but if its a reproduction, regardless of profit, its a violation of copyright. Marvel comics is currently pressing such a case.

[Yasmine Galenorn]

a voilation of copywrite laws would be as if you are planning on making money of whatever it is you are reproducing. since its a tat, no, im pretty sure you wont get into trouble.

Nope. I've had sites shut down that copied my work from my books onto their pages--it's a violation of my copyright and is considered intellectual theft, whether or not you make money off of it. I know what I'm talking about, I'm an author who deals with this stuff on a daily basis. Fair use rules are generally considered for reviews or papers, and usually a 200-250 word excerpt from a book length work may be used on a site or in a paper with proper credits, but no more. Song lyrics are far more restrictive--and usually are considered off limits for copyright purposes. Art--well, I'm not quite as versed in copyright procedures about pictures and artwork, but I know that it falls under similar categories.

Yasmine

[Cornflake_Girl8]

I'm considering getting tattooed soon. And one of the tattoos im considering getting is part of the cover art of an album by a band I like (I wont be tattooing their name/band symbol - only the art).

Would that be considered violating any copy rights?

I know a lot of people do it. And its not like I'll walk down the street and all of a sudden one of the band members will be like - "Yo, you stole our copy rights!".

But I'm just wondering...

If the band says that, then they obviously are too greedy to take advantage of you being a walking billboard for them.

I know plenty of people who have Godsmack's sun tattooed on them and have never heard of Godsmack complaining about the borrowed artwork.

Besides, if they sue and win, what will you do? Carve your skin off?

[Jenett]

Just to add to what Yasmine said:

Art also comes under stricter requirements (as do poetry, lyrics, and music) because one of the things they look at if a case comes to court is how much of the heart of the work has been reproduced.

If you reproduce a substantial part of an image, you're much more likely to get at that than a couple of hundred words from a book-length work.

Let me just repeat: it's not ok to use stuff just because you're not making money off it. That's *one* factor if something comes to court (and can affect additional damages) but it's not the only factor the courts look at. Spreading that bit of misinformation around can get people in trouble. Please don't.

(It also makes it much harder for authors and artists who have to deal with people using their stuff. That particular myth is really popular. A lot of people don't mean to cause trouble. But if your favorite author or artist has to spend time dealing with copyright violations, that's time they're not writing/creating art.)

If you want to use something someone else has created, whether that's text, art, music, whatever, either get permission or do your best to be absolutely certain it's likely to be considered fair use (which is usually limited to academic uses, analysis, reviews, news, etc. Using it because you like it is almost never fair use.)

There are lots of good books out there. (I like the Nolo Press one, personally.) http://www.templetons.com/brad/copymyths.html also covers a bunch of the major myths about copyright fairly clearly.

Even without the legal side: ethically, isn't it nicer to ask? Someone put a lotof time and effort into that. If you're going to stick it on your body, wouldn't you rather know they thought that was cool? Personally, I'd feel creepy about using art without permission. (And yes, I am contemplating a tattoo myself.)

[BlessedByTheGoddess]

My sister has the Dave Matthews Band thing on her ankel.

[donatello51]

Technically a tattoo would be a copyright infringment issue. But I doubt anyone would go after you in a law suit over it. One off is not big deal. you become part of a group of several thousand folks wearing it to a concert or appearing enmass on tv and then they might contact you about it. My own personal concern about getting any tattoo is "do I want to wear this forever?" Don't bring up the absurdity of having it lasered off later if you change your mind. Think long and hard first before thinking about getting one in the first place. And then IF really sure you HAVE to have one decide on a design you can live with forever. Regardless of FLAK or odd looks from family and friends and bosses at jobs you might have later in life. What your boyfriends orgirlfriends or husbands and wives and children will think about it. Getting a tattoo is not a thing to be decided lightly upon. Just like sex or pregnancy. Be sure you really really want it. And can deal with the consequences of your actions. Been there... done that. The tattoo not the husband or children.

[morrigan]

i dont think your problem will be violating copyrights with that pic... the problem may actually be whether or not the tat artist can make a stencil of the picture.. and whether they will be able to do a good enough job of it.. they may be able to make up something based on that design.. your best bet would be to ask the tattooist if they can do it and how much it will cost you for the stencil to be made up... most tattooists i have known charge by the hour and that includes time they spend on making the stencil for the tat..
it may be different in different countries but i know here in aus thats how they usually do it if you want a custom design done..
Blessed Be ~Morrigan~

[Morr]

Thanks for all of your responces!

I have emailed my tattoo place to ask if they agree to do a reproduction of art that is copyrighted. And I'll probably email the band (or what is closest to them - the official site) and ask.

and just a note -

i already have 2 tattoos, I am familiar with the emotional/thought process of getting a tattoo and i know i have to live with them for the rest of my life. So please - I dont need lectures. I know this is coming from a good place, but I really know what I want and I know I'll have to live with it forever. This picture is NOT *for* the band itself. If you know me well enough, and you recognize the type of art and the symbolism in it - you know its ME.

Morrigan -
As for the tat artist reproducing it, I'm pretty sure they can do it. Again, im not using the name of the band and the title of it.. so it will be different and smaller, obviously. They have done many *amazing* portraits of actors, artists & musicians. I got my 2 previous tattoos done there, even though they are smaller and less complicated. They are great. I'm pretty sure this will cost me around $200-$250.

[Cornflake_Girl8]

and just a note -

i already have 2 tattoos, I am familiar with the emotional/thought process of getting a tattoo and i know i have to live with them for the rest of my life. So please - I dont need lectures. I know this is coming from a good place, but I really know what I want and I know I'll have to live with it forever. This picture is NOT *for* the band itself. If you know me well enough, and you recognize the type of art and the symbolism in it - you know its ME.


It's sad that you even have to write to something like this. :geez:

[Ron]

I _highly_ doubt that it would be a copyright infrigment, because the tatoo artist would be doing an impression of it. Even if they did trace it, etc. :) Still argueable an impression, not a copy.

:)

[Morr]

It's sad that you even have to write to something like this. :geez:


what do you mean..?

[flar7]

Morr, the actual artwork was turned in (probably a submission or contract job) by the artist without the logos and lettering, so its still the protected piece.

So, the answer to the blunt question is, yes, its breaking the law. The reality is, its not something that the United States Secret Copyright Enforcement Agency will come to Israel to arrest you for. :nyah: So get the tat.

[Morr]

Morr, the actual artwork was turned in (probably a submission or contract job) by the artist without the logos and lettering, so its still the protected piece.

So, the answer to the blunt question is, yes, its breaking the law. The reality is, its not something that the United States Secret Copyright Enforcement Agency will come to Israel to arrest you for. :nyah: So get the tat.


:lol:
yeah i figured that.. i know theres a lot of people out there who have tats that are art that was featured through bands, etc... but i emailed the official site of the band anyways... i guess ill have to wait and see what they say... ill probably get it anyways.. but we'll see..

thanks!

[flar7]

ok, but keep us informed, and definitely let us know if the USSCEA comes to your door! That dang Bush. :veryweird

[Morr]

ok, but keep us informed, and definitely let us know if the USSCEA comes to your door! That dang Bush. :veryweird

:lol:
Bush loves Israel, he wont come after me!

[Cornflake_Girl8]

what do you mean..?

I mean that it's pathetic that this person writes a question about copyright infringement for a TATTOO and people feel that the person is stupid enough to NOT realize a tattoo is permanent and laser removal is expensive.

It's sad that the person who started the thread had to make a point of REMINDING people that they know that tattooes are pretty permanent.

[StormVixen]

i have a heartagram tattoo... hmmm i never thought of it being a copyrite thing!

[memnoch]

If you like the art do it. The chances of them coming after you are null, so who cares if its copyrighted. I have a copyrighted tat of Marilyn Mansons baphemet titled god of f**k on my arm

[flar7]

I mean that it's pathetic that this person writes a question about copyright infringement for a TATTOO and people feel that the person is stupid enough to NOT realize a tattoo is permanent and laser removal is expensive.

It's sad that the person who started the thread had to make a point of REMINDING people that they know that tattooes are pretty permanent.
why is it pathetic to show concern, interest, and to inform someone? Many may not have even heard of Morr until this post, may not know anything about her other than her sig, avatar, and that she has a tat and wants another. I would find such posts as well meant, even if it turns out they were extraneous and not truly needed. No need to get upset about how others post, there was no malice or ill intent in them, just good intentions from all I could see.

[Cornflake_Girl8]

why is it pathetic to show concern, interest, and to inform someone? Many may not have even heard of Morr until this post, may not know anything about her other than her sig, avatar, and that she has a tat and wants another. I would find such posts as well meant, even if it turns out they were extraneous and not truly needed. No need to get upset about how others post, there was no malice or ill intent in them, just good intentions from all I could see.

It's pathetic because the initial question was asking about copyright infringement, NOT "are tattooes permanent?" C'mon here. THINK.

[KaimelarFeylove]

why is it pathetic to show concern, interest, and to inform someone? Many may not have even heard of Morr until this post, may not know anything about her other than her sig, avatar, and that she has a tat and wants another. I would find such posts as well meant, even if it turns out they were extraneous and not truly needed. No need to get upset about how others post, there was no malice or ill intent in them, just good intentions from all I could see.


I think its more pathic that people didnt read to see that she said twice before that "just a note" that yes she had other tattoos.. anyone who mentioned the thing before that was just being nice, but people tend not to read though the thread to see whats been said.. after she had originly said"i have two alreadly and i know what i'm doing", there were still people warning her becasue all they did was read the first post and comment...

or maybe thats just a personal pet peeve of mine.. :whatmewor

[flar7]

It's pathetic because the initial question was asking about copyright infringement, NOT "are tattooes permanent?" C'mon here. THINK.

think you can be a little bit more CONDESCENDING?

no one said she was stupid, nor did I get that indication from the posts. Many people miss things when people post them. Morr didnt mention she had other tattooes until the 2nd page, and so, its easily missed. Those who know Morr, knew she had them and those that dont, didnt.

Lighten up. Sheesh.

[Yasmine Galenorn]

...there were still people warning her becasue all they did was read the first post and comment...
or maybe thats just a personal pet peeve of mine.. :whatmewor

Not everyone has time to read every single post in every thread they answer.

Yasmine

[KaimelarFeylove]

Not everyone has time to read every single post in every thread they answer.

Yasmine


i know that.. and i'm not trying to offend anyone.. i just try and at least skim posts to notice things so i dont repeat things that dont bear repeating... but like i said maybe its just me..

[Jenett]

I asked (sorry for delay, I've been out of town) because just because someone's got other tattoos doesn't always mean they've thought through the issues with using someone else's art (or something related to a very specific interest, such as a specific band).

I also mentioned it because, *specific to the question*, using something with similar symbols, but which wasn't the band's actual art would also avoid the copyright issue. Going to something a little broader might have been a way to solve the whole issue, so it seemed worth at least mentioning.

[SSanf]

I really know what I want and I know I'll have to live with it forever......

If you know me well enough, and you recognize the type of art and the symbolism in it - you know its ME.

Sorry, but I really want to butt in here and add some insight that you can either accept or reject. I feel you will reject it but I want to say it anyway in case it does reach someone else.

Dear, you are 23. You know nothing of yourself except the last 23 years. You do not even begin to know and cannot know the person you will become over the next 50 years.

That person, you and at the same time not you, is real. And, that person is deserving of courtesy. Every time you do something to yourself that is irrevocable, you are slamming a door in the face of the person you will some day become.

The person you are now may have very little in common with you as you will some day be. Yet, for some reason, you feel at liberty to make irrevocable decisions for that person, impose your current will on them with no regard for how they may feel about it. That is a mistake and it can be cruel as well. You may change your politics, your religion, your educational level, your occupation, your associations and so many things that all add up to who a person is and how they perceive themselves.

Try to leave doors open rather than closing them. It is only courteous to the, now unknown, person who is your future self.

How do I know this? Well, I am 60. And I want you to know that I have very, very little in common with the person I was when I was 23 and thought I knew myself so well. Do you think I would, today, want that person making my decisions? Thankfully, 23 year old me did not slam too many doors in my 60 year old face. For that, I will always be grateful to her. She left me both freedom and choice.

[flar7]

I disagree. My decisions made me who I am. I am not young any longer, but I wouldnt change them, even the heartbreaking choices. Thats not slamming a door, that life. Living and learning, growing from the good as well as the bad. Be it a horrendous tattoo, or a masterpiece of body art.

[SSanf]

I disagree. My decisions made me who I am. I am not young any longer, but I wouldnt change them, even the heartbreaking choices. Thats not slamming a door, that life. Living and learning, growing from the good as well as the bad. Be it a horrendous tattoo, or a masterpiece of body art.
If you are, in fact,103 years old as stated in your profile, I defer to your greater wisdom.

[Gwenhwyfar]

I love my tattoos, even the one I got when I was 15, (its pretty bad, lol) they remind me of my past, like a photo album kind of...they bring back memories I like to think of every now and then, Im pretty confident thats how Ill feel untill Im dead.

[flar7]

hehe, no, Not that old. Older than 30 younger than 50. If you fail to do anything for fear of closing the door on your future self (which is still you btw) then you wont arrive at destinations such as Gwenhwyfar just mentioned. Memories need to be both good and bad, we may have regrets, but we realize that those same bad things led us to some pretty good ones.

[SSanf]

Yes, it is not good to be so fearful that you do nothing. Indeed that would be counter productive and lead to a very boring and useful to no one life. But, while you are doing something it is always good to try to leave yourself many, many options to be exercised at some future date.

The biggest worry with youth is that they will not do something to screw up so badly when they are young that there is no hope of recovery at a later time.

Thank the Goddess that by the time we are 30 almost everyone has turned into a pretty good adult.

[Yasmine Galenorn]

I love my tattoos, even the one I got when I was 15, (its pretty bad, lol) they remind me of my past, like a photo album kind of...they bring back memories I like to think of every now and then, Im pretty confident thats how Ill feel untill Im dead.

I'm covered with tattoos....I've never regretted them. Sometimes I wonder what drives me on with them, but each one respresents an important part of my evolution and at 43, almost 44, I finally decided that the process of life is the lesson. :)

Yasmine :colorful:

[WynnJera]

when I mean age, I mean the difference between a tattoo that you got at 16, and how that boob tattoo looks at 55. your skin ages and begins to loosen, wrinkling may occur as well as skin pigmentation changes like brown spots.



:hairraise Flar stop looking at my ( . )( . ) Tat that I got when I was 16 ... You Told me you would never tell :lol:

[flar7]

:hairraise Flar stop looking at my ( . )( . ) Tat that I got when I was 16 ... You Told me you would never tell :lol:
um.......I didnt. :cutesanta