ideas for an unmotivated step-brother?

[novena]

(I hope this is the right forum for this post...)

I'm looking for ideas on how to help my step-brother. He is 23 and graduated from a very good university last May. Since completing his studies, he has been living back at home. For months, he wouldn't even go on job interviews, but instead slept all day. He doesn't have friends in town now and so isn't socializing. He has always been kind of depressed and moody.

In the past month or two, he has started a temp job at night, but still isn't looking for a real job during the day. He seems to be completely uninterested in much of anything. His mother and step-father (my Dad) are at their wits' end, trying to get him motivated to start his own life. They now require him to pay rent, which he does grudgingly, but I think he's already several months behind on that. He has also borrowed money from his mother to pay bills he accrued in college, and I don't think he's made any effort to pay her back.

My sister and I both think that he could use some counseling -- and possibly a psychiatric evaluation to make sure he's not clinically depressed. It may require a real intervention to even get him to a therapy session. I'm also trying to come up with other ideas that might get him interested in life (and out of the house, living on his own) -- Outward Bound, the Peace Corps, etc. But I wanted to ask you folks if you have any additional ideas.

I suggested to my Dad that they pretend that the three of them -- my step-brother, step-mother, and father -- are all going to do an Outward Bound couse together. Once they arrive at the site, they could just leave him there and go back home -- it might be the only way to get him to go! I like the idea of Outward Bound due to their focus on learning one's individual strengths, overcoming personal obstacles, etc. I also think the Peace Corps could be *very* good for him, but I don't think he has any interest in doing *anything*. At the same time, he says that he doesn't like living at home, yet he makes no effort to change his situation.

His mother is very reluctant to practice "tough love" with him (like throwing him out of the house so he has no choice but to stand on his own two feet.... he'd probably just go flounder at his similarly unmotivated father's house), though she may soon have no other choice.

I'm really concerned about my step-brother. He is very bright and did well in school. Any ideas on programs for unmotivated adult children living at home, or ideas on how to get him to go to counseling would be much appreciated.

Thanks!

[novena]

* bump *

[MoonDragn]

He needs a girlfriend and to get laid. Thats it. Start setting him up for dates.

[novena]

Does anyone have any real advice?

:)

[WitchJezebel]

He needs a girlfriend and to get laid. Thats it. Start setting him up for dates.

Come on MoonD; that's not the answer to everything (altho I'll admit it helps :devil: )

Novena, it sounds like he is depressed. I don't know any other suggestions except for counseling, but if getting him to even go is a problem....

Maybe try getting him motivated about his degree from university? I assume he didn't just go to college to get out of the house, that he got a degree in something? He could be missing his college life and friends. The Outward Bound sounds like a good idea and/or maybe the tough love thing will do some good. Good luck, I wish I had better advice for you.

[MoonDragn]

I am being serious here. It sounds like he is depressed over a girl. He shows all the symptoms. Have you talked to him and asked him? Getting him involved with another girl will put his domestic instincts in gear. That means getting a job to support a future family.

[novena]

He has never shown any interest in girls -- or boys for that matter -- which makes me concerned about clinical depression. And given that he spends all his time in his room, he's not had any opportunity to meet anyone to get upset over.

I didn't mean to disrespect your suggestion. I feel he needs to stand up in his life for himself first. Otherwise, if any potential relationship goes south, he'd be back to where he started, or more likely much worse. We're looking for ideas on how to help him get engaged in and excited about his life.

[MoonDragn]

No offense but how do you know? Have you actually talked to him? Try to get him to explain whats wrong first. You can't really help him til you know the source of his depression.

There was this story about this kid who was in his room day and night and had no social life of any kind. His mother was worried but did not know what the problem was. Turned out he was addicted to everquest but more importantly, he had a relationship with a woman IN the game.

Your brother sounds like he has the same kind of addiction. Maybe he is playing an online game day and night and has no wish to live in the real world.

Btw, the kid ended up killing himself. He left a suicide note and thats when the truth came out.

[novena]

Believe me, we've asked, over and over again, and trying different tactics to get him to open up. He seems to be frustrated with himself and pretty much bottles up when anyone tries to connect with him.

He doesn't have a computer, so he's likely not gaming or socializing with anyone. There is a "family computer," but it's out in the open -- where it would be obvious if he were using it.

Again, I'm looking for ideas on how to get him engaged in helping himself. Sure, he might be addicted to something secretive or might be clinically depressed. There's no way to know when he is so shut down. What I'm asking is, how do we get him to even talk to someone (particularly a professional) in the first place, to find out what might be wrong? How do we get him to show up for such an appointment? It could be that my father and step-mother will simply have to drag him -- physically -- to see somebody.

Thanks for your help.

[sarabethv]

Seriously, this sounds a bit more than for you to handle. The reason I put it that way was not a case of bad grammer.

First, the people who have the responsibility to intercede do not seem to be doing so. (That would be Mom and Dad). While you don't say so in your post, I am assuming that this is your older brother, so you also have no authority to make him get counseling etc. If he is a younger brother, then you can approach this from the standpoint of having been where he is now.

Now, for what you may not want to hear.

I could not help but notice that in your post, you seemed a little more angry than worried. You are upset that he isn't doing something and that he is living there and possibly not paying rent. Whether or not he is late on his rent is Mom and Dad's problem - not yours.

So, my advice is for you to look at your motives here. Are you angry and want him to go away or are you really concerned for a family member and want to help him. If it is anger and you are maybe jealous that he is getting all this attention because he seems to be unmotivated (is the family spending a lot of time and mental effort on his problem?) then calm down and talk to your Dad about maybe spending some quality time and getting some attention for yourself. Remember wanting a parent's attention is valid so don't beat yourself up if you are angry. This is true whether you are a big kid or not. My son will still call me fairly regularly and ask for some quality time. When other people ask him what that's about he says; "Sometimes a guy just needs his mommy."

If you are worried and concerned for your brother (note I don't use the distancing term step) then do talk to him and try to get him to open up. Even if you are younger he may really need someone to talk to about his worries and fears. Getting a degree and suddenly being faced with "the rest of your life" is scary. Now, its time for him to grow up and get out on his own which is terrifying.

So, ask him to go out with you for a cup of coffee (or soda) and in that neutral environment, tell him you are concerned and want to help him but that you can't if you don't know what is wrong. And then listen. If he doesn't talk right away you will need to build trust by talking to him, spend time with him on a regular basis, share with him. Open up those lines of communication.

[novena]

Novena, it sounds like he is depressed. I don't know any other suggestions except for counseling, but if getting him to even go is a problem....

Yes, it's very frustrating for my father and step-mother. My step-brother's father has a similar outlook on life (he's an architect yet is living in a house that is deteriorating around him), so I'm wondering if it might be an inherited chemical imbalance, or something similar.

They have tried instituting "consequences" for his behavior -- i.e., if you don't pay the rent, you get kicked out -- but he doesn't appear to be responsive. Admittedly, another part of the problem is that his mother is hestitant to really kick him to get him off of his duff -- so there's kind of a "good cop, bad cop" thing going on in the house with my father and step-mother, which no doubt sends convenient mixed signals to my step-brother. ("Convenient," because he's not shown any motivation on his own.)

We have bent over backwards to try to help this kid. In these past months, when he has shown an interest in anything, we've rallied around him to support him in that direction -- e.g., setting up informational interviews with people we know in fields he says he's interested in -- and then he just fails to show up.

Sorry, I don't mean to make this a rant. We're all just very concerned. I think that my father and step-mother need to make a firm decision about what to do, and do it -- and then let my step-brother deal with the consequences. I've suggested that they get him checked out by a psychologist (even if they have to drag him in, kicking and screaming.... though he is big and strong), send him on something like Outward Bound (if they can afford it), and then use the time that he is away to pack up his stuff up, so that he has to figure out his own plan when he gets back and cannot just go hide in his old room. Even if he does just go flounder at his Dad's place, that's falling apart.... *sigh*

Sure makes me glad he's not my son. ;)

[Lunamoth]

There isn't anything inherantly wrong with having a night time temp job; a temp job is a great way to gain real working experience. It's a hard job market right now and more companies are using agencies than direct hire these days. Trust me. As for his hours, perhaps he just likes having an reversed circadian rhthym. Many people do. People on a normal cycle don't really get it, I know, but there's logic in it. See, the night time holds less environmental stress in that there's not so much stimulous. Fewer people around, fewer cars on the road. Everything's a little quieter, there's less electricity and radio waves winging through the air (you think I'm being esoteric, but it's true).

Now the reason I say all this is, it sounds like your step-brother is suffering clinical depression (though it could simply be circumstantial, not clinical), and often those suffering that have a hard time with too much stimulous. Stress can lead to further depression symptoms, such as sleeping a lot, or insomnia, or shutting out others or not eating right, etc etc... There's often more going on in the brain than just having the blues, you know?

If it's truly clinical depression, a person can't just snap out of it and start being happy. It doesn't work that way. BUT, that said, getting more involved with him is a good step. I don't think that making him go to some function that wasn't his idea is necessarily the answer though. When I have a down cycle, the last thing I want to do is be dragged somewhere I don't want to go. I just get resentful and dig my heels in then. Perhaps, instead, as sarabethv suggested, just ask him out to coffee or some other neutral thing where he won't feel spotlighted or anything.

You are right to be concerned, based on what you've said here. But dealing with depression, just to reiterate, is more than just making that person cheer up and start getting motivated. There's lots going on in the brain. Perhaps a slight case of depression, paired with fear of moving forward, fear of failure, fear of "the great unknown" that is the real world is just paralyzing your step-brother. It's important for all involved to be sensitive to that. Good luck.

[Windsmith]

Hi, novena. I commend you for realizing you needed some outside perspective on your stepbrother's situation - that can be a hard decision to make.

Please do everything you can to convince your dad & stepmom to abandon their idea of leaving him at the Outward Bound course. If he's depressed, the last thing he needs is for his own family to betray him that way. My suggestion is this: why "pretend" they're all going to do the course? It would be a great idea for them to go through it together. It might offer your dad & stepmom a great opportunity to interact with him outside of the negative environment home seems to have become for him, which may help them get a better idea of why he's acting the way he is & what he needs from them.

[novena]

Please do everything you can to convince your dad & stepmom to abandon their idea of leaving him at the Outward Bound course. If he's depressed, the last thing he needs is for his own family to betray him that way. My suggestion is this: why "pretend" they're all going to do the course? It would be a great idea for them to go through it together. It might offer your dad & stepmom a great opportunity to interact with him outside of the negative environment home seems to have become for him, which may help them get a better idea of why he's acting the way he is & what he needs from them.

The "pretend to go and leave him there" idea was more of a joke, or a measure of last resort if nothing else worked. Even if they did something like that -- which I doubt would happen -- in this case, it would be more of an intervention measure (a la family members collecting an addict and delivering him/her to treatment) than a betrayal.

I doubt that the three of them could attend together, due to financial constraints. Plus, I think he would really need to do something like that on his own, to get to know himself away from family and friends.

I appreciate your offering your wisdom on this. My father recognizes that it's "codependency all around"; it's just a matter of coming up with the right plan of attack, or at least a collection of good ideas to try. :)

[novena]

Thanks for your input, Lunamoth. I'm not looking for a quick cure to get him to "cheer up." He's been like this pretty much all his life; however, now it has gotten worse in that he seems to be hiding from the need to be responsible for himself. My father mentioned one recent weekend during which my step-brother spent two full days in his room, doing nothing, only coming out occasionally for food. He doesn't have a television or computer in his room, so he was likely just sleeping -- sleeping is what he has done for years when he wants to avoid doing chores, etc. As he is physically healthy, the family recognizes this as avoidant, escapist behavior.

I'm hoping that he can be convinced to seek professional help, and even treatment if it is warranted. At 23, he is a legal adult and so cannot be forced into anything.

Unfortunately, I'm on the other side of the country and so cannot engage him myself.

The temp job is a big improvement, though it took six months of prodding to even get him to contact the temp agency. That was six months of him doing nothing at all, just sitting around. He hasn't been looking for anything else, so we cannot really give him the benefit of the doubt about the economy being poor. He cannot succeed if he doesn't even try.

Thanks, everyone, for your ideas. :)

[MerrisHawk]

From what you've described it seems that your step-brother is dangerously depressed. He needs to talk to a professional.
One of the things you mentioned was a big red flag - he is acting like his father. It reads as though he is associating himself with his natural father. Children are usually hit the hardest in a divorce and tend to take the blame even though it's not their fault. I'm wondering how much strain was put on his affection for his father and if he ever talks about him in front of his mother or step father?
Get him an appointment, the more he withdraws from everday life the more trouble he's in.

[novena]

From what you've described it seems that your step-brother is dangerously depressed. He needs to talk to a professional.
One of the things you mentioned was a big red flag - he is acting like his father. It reads as though he is associating himself with his natural father. Children are usually hit the hardest in a divorce and tend to take the blame even though it's not their fault. I'm wondering how much strain was put on his affection for his father and if he ever talks about him in front of his mother or step father?
Get him an appointment, the more he withdraws from everday life the more trouble he's in.

Actually, there is a very close relationship between his father and the rest of the family. His father lives nearby and is present -- at my father and step-mother's house -- for all major holidays and various casual dinners and gatherings during the year.

I'll keep pushing for my father and step-mother to find him help. After that, it will be up to my step-brother to show up for the appointment.

[lednevir]

there are alot of minerals and brain chemicals that the lack of causes depression.
Everything you eat is either yin or yang,yin tearing down like raw fruits and vegetables and yang building up. Lack of energy can be caused by being to much either way.