Medicine Bags

[GoddessofWisdom]

Personal medicine bags are powerful, sacred objects that have long been part of American Indians' private accoutements. A person can wear one openly around his neck or his waist. Some people conceal them.
An individual can make her own medicine bag, or relatives or friends may make them for her. Many American Indians create a medicine bag to help them accomplish a formidable task, or something they feel is a long shot; others keep special medicine bags in their house, car or truck.
Medicine bags are important throughout life, but especially during illness or other major changes. Because these are times of accentuated self-awareness, sensitivity, and sometimes quandary, making someone a medicine bag is a way to honor his identitiy and provide reassurance.
People may create entirely new medicine bags or add to existing ones. These cherished possessions are created from sort tanned animal skins or from red cloth, calico, or muslin. some are plain, but they may also be ornately beaded, quilled, or painted with clan or dream symbolism, medicine plants, or totems. While he cuts and stitches it together, the bag's maker prays for the health and happiness of the recipient. He carefully chooses the items that will go into it and directs a particular prayer or good thought into each one.
Some medicine bags are blessed and begun with a pinch of tabacco or pollen, sweet grass, sage, or red cedar. Less is better: It is not the amount but the energy that counts. You might choose to add special seeds, a small stone or crystal specific to a sacred place, or a pinch of earth from your home, wrapped or tied in a tiny peice of red flannel.
Medicine bags are works in progress. You can add to or subtract from the unique personal items they contain throughout your life, depending upon events. Invested with prayer and healing energies, they orten retain their power for a lifetime or beyond.

[Lavender]

One of my favourite forms of magic! Each one is so unique because it's made for a special person or specific purpose. The contents can change as your needs change. You can stitch magic into the bags as well, using runes. I keep a supply of little fetishes to use for these bags.

[Mairwen]

Okay, am I the only person here who has a problem with this??

I don't understand just going in and using something because it's cool and useful. If it's sacred to a particular tribe, leave it alone.

People say the ancients did it ~ so that's supposed to make all this borrowing and such "okay". No. They did so after they were adopted into each other's tribes ~ or took over tribes. If then.

[Maggie]

Originally posted by Mairwen
Okay, am I the only person here who has a problem with this??

I don't understand just going in and using something because it's cool and useful. If it's sacred to a particular tribe, leave it alone.

People say the ancients did it ~ so that's supposed to make all this borrowing and such "okay". No. They did so after they were adopted into each other's tribes ~ or took over tribes. If then.


Medicine bags are good talismans--but the imagery, meaning, and usage is particular to a culture. I have been on some NA message boards, and--a word to the wise. It is exactly this type of thing that makes some NA's very angry, they call it 'cultural theft'. The *idea* however, is not unique to NA cultures, and it would be even better for its intended purpose to construct one using items meaningful to the person and from within the culture of one's own pantheon......

Regards,


Maggie

[MystyPines]

Hello Everyone!

How are medicine bags different from Charm Bags, Mojo Bags or Gris Gris Bags?

:nonono: :nonono:

[Maggie]

Originally posted by MystyPines
Hello Everyone!

How are medicine bags different from Charm Bags, Mojo Bags or Gris Gris Bags?

:nonono: :nonono:

I don't think they are, particularly. That's why I suggested leaving the 'medicine' bags along, and looking for something similar among one's own culture. Lifting the idea and practice wholesale from the NA culture is what gets people angry--using something for the same purpose from one's own culture would probably work better anyway.........

Regards,

Maggie

[MystyPines]

I didn't realize that the Native American's would get angry if non-NA people were to use Medicine Bags. Although I follow the Celtic pantheon and my heritage is from Ireland and also have an Italian friend who also follows the Celtic Pantheon. And, I am sure there are people that follow Greek pantheons, etc. I never thought following another culture's traditions as offensive. :D :D

[Lavender]

Ok, I guess I should have been more clearer and say that I don't call my bags "Medicine Bags". To me, the purpose of these bags are similar. Whether you call them medicine bags, mojo bags, gris gris, crane bags, relic bags, whatever. I knit mine out of fine silk, lined with silk or cotton, each one made by hand, individually for the person it is intended for. I don't do it because it's cool or neat or the latest trend.

I apologize, I didn't realize that this was a disscussion on the NA Medicine bags. When I replied to this thread, I took it as Medicine Bag = herb bag, magic bag, etc...
:wah:

[MystyPines]

Hey WildChild!

Crane bags and Relic bags, they sure go by many names! By whatever name, it is stuff that goes in a bag, he he he! [grin] :p

[Maggie]

Originally posted by MystyPines
I didn't realize that the Native American's would get angry if non-NA people were to use Medicine Bags. Although I follow the Celtic pantheon and my heritage is from Ireland and also have an Italian friend who also follows the Celtic Pantheon. And, I am sure there are people that follow Greek pantheons, etc. I never thought following another culture's traditions as offensive. :D :D

The problem here is both terminology and cultural differences.:)

I don't know if *all* NA's would be angry, it's just that this type of borrowing has caused trouble--things like this are what prompted the Lakota Declaration of War, for instance. From the NA side, quite a few are angry at how non-NA's have appropriated things like sweats, medicine bags, medicine wheels, etc. They see it as whites stealing yet something else that doesn't belong to them, and using it in ignorance of the tribe and culture they belong to. On the non-NA side, an awful lot of Americans are of mixed ethnic heritage, to put it mildly. We ARE used to the mixing and matching here in American. In addition, most religions here are not fixed by ethnic identity--even if they were originally, it doesn't always survive the generations. For instance--my son's surname is Kennedy, courtesy of my ex, but my son is Lutheran since I raised him and that was my childhood religion. The Irish might raise both eyebrows, but here that would only rate mild surprise that he wasn't Catholic. Protestants in particular are rather prone to 'modifications' in doctrine, I don't think that a definitive list could ever even be drawn up of all the Protestant churches here!
BUT--the NA spiritual beliefs are an integral part of the whole culture as opposed to 'on the side' that is common for so many non-NA's. The NA's insist that one can't just take a piece, while the non-NA's don't understand why not, since we do that all time without thinking about it. They say no one can follow NA spiritual beliefs without being part of the culture, while most Americans think nothing of celebrating St. Patrick's Day, eating Italian food while listening to reggae, wearing a dashaiki while watching a French movie in the original, having a Italian-American bridegroom wear a kilt at the wedding because the bride has some Scots....etc. Perhaps thinking of it as a religious-integrated culture as opposed to the secular/public religious/private culture of America would make it clearer.


The other cultural landmine could be a western cliche that is in direct opposition to the NA viewpoint. We often say "Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery", but I can assure you that NA's who have spoken up DON'T see it that way. They see the imitation as mockery, not honoring or flattery.


Regards,

Maggie

[Lavender]

Yup! As you said, it depends on what you put in them & what they're for. Heh! Most of my friends just call them "Bags". :p

There are differences in all these types of bags in that the magic is different. To me, these are slight and you have to study each culture and their magic to discern the difference.

I would be really interested to hear if anyone here uses the traditional NA medicine bags. :cool:

[MystyPines]

I would be interested also. Oh, and about the Gris Gris bags and Mojo bags, are they a part of Voo Doo?

[Lavender]

That is so true, Maggie. I'm guilty of that. I've learned from herbal healers from many different cultures. I guess I've taken what I've learned from each & mishmash them together to whatever it is I'm doing now.

[Maggie]

Originally posted by Wildchild
That is so true, Maggie. I'm guilty of that. I've learned from herbal healers from many different cultures. I guess I've taken what I've learned from each & mishmash them together to whatever it is I'm doing now.

Oh, it isn't necessarily wrong--cultures and ethnic groups have mixd and matched the minute there was more than one culture! It's just that there needs to be more awareness of what's going on. AND that people belonging to those cultures may or may not care about others borrowing.

Regards,

Maggie

[Myst]

Just a quick interjection - the "anger" over borrowing is not strictly an outsider thing. For example, some people of certain Pagan trads will get annoyed if you say you're using some of their beliefs in yours - for example the Strega who gets angry that you're using their magick or working with their deity in your beliefs. To them you aren't supposed to just muck about with some of their traditions and techniques without having a full and complete understanding of all their beliefs. The same can be said to be true about some NAs and other peoples.

Even imagine how some of us would feel if we found a person casting a love spell because they thought that was "Wiccan". You just wouldn't think they should be mucking about with this stuff because they "obviously" don't have a good understanding of the beliefs and principles involved.

[MystyPines]

Well, I would not feel "angered." Everyone must find their own path, and not all paths fall under specific categories of Strega, Gardnerian, Dianic, etc. We all learn about different paths and may incorporate certain aspects of traditions into our own paths. It seems paths are becoming more eclectic these days and less defined. Not all traditions are along my belief system and as I am finding more and more, we all can't actually give our path a label or a name, but I always felt that everyone must find their own niche.

If a person was casting a love spell, it wouldn't matter what I thought. They are the ones that will answer to the consequences, if negative, or reap the benefits if positive. :D :D

[GoddessofWisdom]

Originally posted by Wildchild
Ok, I guess I should have been more clearer and say that I don't call my bags "Medicine Bags". To me, the purpose of these bags are similar. Whether you call them medicine bags, mojo bags, gris gris, crane bags, relic bags, whatever. I knit mine out of fine silk, lined with silk or cotton, each one made by hand, individually for the person it is intended for. I don't do it because it's cool or neat or the latest trend.

I apologize, I didn't realize that this was a disscussion on the NA Medicine bags. When I replied to this thread, I took it as Medicine Bag = herb bag, magic bag, etc...
:wah:


:P no need to appologize but I will clear something up

I don't "practice" "follow" a particular religion I try to study as many cultures and religious practices as I can get my hands on.
I'm not trying to borrow or steal I just like to provide ppl with the info I absorb

[Lavender]

Ditto! :p

[Mairwen]

Originally posted by MystyPines
I didn't realize that the Native American's would get angry if non-NA people were to use Medicine Bags. .... I never thought following another culture's traditions as offensive. :D :D

That's just it ~ people don't think, they just do. That's what causes problems. And it's not just the medicine bags, it's peace pipes, sweatlodges and other NA traditional things.

Think first.

[Mairwen]

Originally posted by Willow Raven
Just a quick interjection - the "anger" over borrowing is not strictly an outsider thing. ....... To them you aren't supposed to just muck about with some of their traditions and techniques without having a full and complete understanding of all their beliefs. The same can be said to be true about some NAs and other peoples.

I know the Cherokee get very upset over this "borrowing" nonsense.

[Mairwen]

Originally posted by GoddessofWisdom
I don't "practice" "follow" a particular religion I try to study as many cultures and religious practices as I can get my hands on.


Could you clarify what you mean here? This statement could very well fuel grave misunderstanding left as-is. Thanks!

[Myst]

Originally posted by MystyPines
Well, I would not feel "angered." Everyone must find their own path, and not all paths fall under specific categories of Strega, Gardnerian, Dianic, etc.

You might feel differently if you were Strega, Gardnerian, or Dianic.

And I imagine if it was someone you knew or were close to you'd do something to discourage them from doing love spells. And personally, if a guy did a love spell on me and told me oh Wiccans do that I wouldn't just "feel that people must find their own way".

[Danustouch]

What if you are part Native American, but consider yourself Wiccan? I mean..I have some Native American Blood, but it's a couple generations removed. So if I use a traditional medicine bag, smudge my circle with sage, and hang a dream catcher in my window, because I am aknowledging that part of my bloodline, would I be seen as Mocking them? Simply because I am not "Registered" as a member of a specific tribe? Because...I am part Native American.

I do have problems with people who consider themselves "lakota" shaman, when they don't have a drop of lakota in them (while I revere the Lakota culture, and have learned alot from their wisdom, I wouldn't in a million years dare to call myself a lakota shaman, nor try and run a sweat lodge, or induce a vision quest for others). And I do get upset when people who have absolutely NO idea what the symbols truly mean, borrow them. But...I think there was another thread on this topic, when a person sincerely feels called to that culture, and studies it in depth, understands and appreciates the symbol that they are using, and...like me, has some Native American blood IN them, I really don't see anything to get upset about. Because I don't see it as a Mockery. I think people who hang them without following ANY of the religious beliefs, who don't do the research, who don't appreciate the culture, who don't HONOR the culture in any way, should NOT use the religious practices OF that culture because they "think its' cool". Just my opinion.

[Mairwen]

Originally posted by Danustouch
What if you are part Native American, but consider yourself Wiccan? I mean..I have some Native American Blood, but it's a couple generations removed. So if I use a traditional medicine bag, smudge my circle with sage, and hang a dream catcher in my window, because I am aknowledging that part of my bloodline, would I be seen as Mocking them?

Did anybody teach you about those things? That's what I'm talking about. Using them without the proper teachings is disrespectful. I'm a weeeeeeee bit Cherokee, but I don't go around using their teachings in my practice, even though I know a Chief very well, just because of that. I know better. I know that I wasn't taught to use those things ~ therefore, I have no way of knowing the proper respect for them. I acknowledge who and what I am ~ and with that comes responsibility. Taking from others that which we haven't been taught to use or respect isn't being responsible. And yes, just because you pick something up and use it for yourself, even if that is your bloodline, if you don't have the teachings, that is considered mockery.


when a person sincerely feels called to that culture, and studies it in depth, understands and appreciates the symbol that they are using, and...like me, has some Native American blood IN them, I really don't see anything to get upset about.

Are they studying with a teacher?


Because I don't see it as a Mockery.

Just because you see it that way doesn't mean that others do, as well.

[SageMoon]

I was recently at a Pow Wow and they were giving out Medicine Bags. Would they do this if they were affended. They even had a card that told the history of the medicine bags and how you could make your own. Don't take this wrong its just a statement not trying to contradict anyone. I guess I'm confused now :confused: :nonono:
Sage Moon:)

[Myst]

Originally posted by SageMoon
I was recently at a Pow Wow and they were giving out Medicine Bags. Would they do this if they were affended. They even had a card that told the history of the medicine bags and how you could make your own. Don't take this wrong its just a statement not trying to contradict anyone. I guess I'm confused now :confused: :nonono:
Sage Moon:)

First this is one powwow with one group. Too many people make the mistake of thinking that these Natives are just a bunch of redskins. Well would you call everyone else from the U.S. to Norway "the un-Natives" or "those white guys"? No. Each tribe and group is completely different. In no way shape or form does any represent them all. Period. So to assume that because at one powwow in one tribe they did that therefore all NA's feel that way is erroneous :) (not saying you feel that way, just clarifying it because some people don't know that)

Second I don't know where you attended but in the first place it was obviously a public powwow so obviously they had no problem with the public seeing some of their rituals.

Third they were probably doing so to make money so I imagine that was more important to them then keeping their beliefs sacred. Again that in no way reflects the beliefs of any other NA outside of that tribe.

[Maggie]

Originally posted by Willow Raven


First this is one powwow with one group. Too many people make the mistake of thinking that these Natives are just a bunch of redskins. Well would you call everyone else from the U.S. to Norway "the un-Natives" or "those white guys"? No. Each tribe and group is completely different. In no way shape or form does any represent them all. Period. So to assume that because at one powwow in one tribe they did that therefore all NA's feel that way is erroneous :) (not saying you feel that way, just clarifying it because some people don't know that)

Second I don't know where you attended but in the first place it was obviously a public powwow so obviously they had no problem with the public seeing some of their rituals.

Third they were probably doing so to make money so I imagine that was more important to them then keeping their beliefs sacred. Again that in no way reflects the beliefs of any other NA outside of that tribe.


This last paragraph does not reflect the very good points you made in your first two. Assuming that this group was so crass as believe that making money "was more important to them than keeping their beliefs sacred" is a big leap when you weren't there. It's also pretty insulting to jump to that conclusion.

Regards,

Maggie

[Danustouch]

I do know some NA's do not think of it as mockery, or having their culture stolen. They see it as educating people about their culture, for two reasons. So that A)predjudice can be conquered, and B)so that the mistakes of the past are never again repeated.

I've even heard it said, by one tribal member, that part of the reason HE makes handcrafted NA items, and sells them to non NA's...is because if people WANT the items, they will get them..no matter where. He would rather preserve his culture in truth, by making and selling these items with AUTHENTICITY, then to have a NON NA put THEIR spin on how these items are made, and pass it off as NA made.

[Myst]

Originally posted by Maggie
This last paragraph does not reflect the very good points you made in your first two. Assuming that this group was so crass as believe that making money "was more important to them than keeping their beliefs sacred" is a big leap when you weren't there. It's also pretty insulting to jump to that conclusion.


Were they allowing public into their powwow? Yes. Then obviously they don't mind the public seeing their beliefs during that powwow, correct? Obviously hiding their ritual means nothing to them since they aren't doing that. Obviously since they're selling something money means something. Thus hiding means nothing and money means something, therefore money is more important then hiding, correct? I wasn't referring to ALL their beliefs, but the ones involved in a powwow - if they felt their beliefs and rituals in the powwow were so sacred that they absolutely had to be hidden regardless of what money they'd get they'd not be allowing the public in or selling the public stuff at the powwow now would they?

There maybe the wording is clarified for you?

[Maggie]

Originally posted by Willow Raven


Were they allowing public into their powwow? Yes. Then obviously they don't mind the public seeing their beliefs during that powwow, correct? Obviously hiding their ritual means nothing to them since they aren't doing that. Obviously since they're selling something money means something. Thus hiding means nothing and money means something, therefore money is more important then hiding, correct? I wasn't referring to ALL their beliefs, but the ones involved in a powwow - if they felt their beliefs and rituals in the powwow were so sacred that they absolutely had to be hidden regardless of what money they'd get they'd not be allowing the public in or selling the public stuff at the powwow now would they?

There maybe the wording is clarified for you?

Nope. "Third they were probably doing so to make money so I imagine that was more important to them then keeping their beliefs sacred" sounds pretty unambiguous as it stands. What you said here is that the people doing it sold their sacred beliefs for money. If that's not what you meant that's not what you should have said.

As to pow wows--the public dances etc are not secret and parts have always been open to community--that doesn't mean the whole thing is or that there aren't more pieces to those dances that are done in private later.

Actually, a pow wow can be more like culture festival than anything else.............

Maggie

[Myst]

Originally posted by Maggie
Nope. "Third they were probably doing so to make money so I imagine that was more important to them then keeping their beliefs sacred" sounds pretty unambiguous as it stands. What you said here is that the people doing it sold their sacred beliefs for money. If that's not what you meant that's not what you should have said.

*shrugs* Sorry if I worded it in such a way as to be misinterpreted as it was. Now you know my real meaning.

And yes I know some powwows don't have rituals available to the public and are just cultural festivals. However, I was under the impression that since we're in a thread about how rituals and practices of some NA's are sometimes not wanted to be shared with the public by those NA's then we were discussing a powwow that had the rituals open to the public. If it was just a cultural festival then why are we discussing it as an indication that some NA's don't mind sharing their rituals and practices with the public in the first place?

[SageMoon]

Just want to clarify something , The pow-wow was that of the Redhawks and it was an intertribal Pow Wow . They charged NOTHING for the medicine bags and it was a very small Pow Wow on a small farm. Money didn't seem the purpose, as someone else said it was more to educate the public in my area. Didn't mean to cause a arguement. I was just sharing with you my experience.
Sage Moon;)

[Myst]

Originally posted by SageMoon
Didn't mean to cause a arguement. I was just sharing with you my experience.

Thanks Sage, don't worry about it :)

[phoenixsong]

Mairwen, you seem to feel really strongly about this whole issue? Why is that?

And going back to the 'teacher' bit you mentioned, a teacher isn't always needed or best. I've just read Starhawk's brilliant book The Spiral Dance and she's a self taught Wiccan as are a huge number of witches today. Is there such a huge difference between learning Wicca or Paganism by yourself and learning about a culture that you are linked to by blood, by yourself?

(don't flame me!)

[Danustouch]

I think that some people feel very strongly that having a "teacher" is a very important thing. And I can see their points as to why that is a benefit. However, personally, I let the Universe be my teacher..and to let myself be the judge of whatever information I'm given. I have faith in my own discernment, and wisdom. I think some of us work better under the tuteledge of others, and some of us work best, independently. I am one of the people, who learns best on my own.

I don't think either way is less valid than the other. As with most things in Witchcraft/paganism/wicca, it's all about what works best for you. That's just my opinion, though.

[Joy]

I hope you don't mind me coming in here and giving my two cents worth.
I think our intent is what is important when doing any kind of spiritual work. I happen to be a mutt also, and I do take from all spiritual practices that work for me and mix and match them according to what makes sense to me. This has worked very well for me for many years and will continue to work for me in the future. If someone gets angry with me because of what they percieve as disrespect, that is their problem and not mine. In my mind I am not answering to those people, I am answering to spirit. Everything I do, I do with respect for spirit, myself and others. If what I do is contrued as disrespectful, it doesn't make it true. In reality, they would be the disrespectful one IMHO. I have the right to worship in whatever way I see fit, as do you and everyone esle in the world.

Hope I haven't crossed any lines here, or made anyone angry with me.

[reanna]

welcome to mystic wicks Joy! PLeased to meet ya!! :wave::wave:

[Da Witch]

Originally posted by Mairwen


Could you clarify what you mean here? This statement could very well fuel grave misunderstanding left as-is. Thanks!


I study religion I do not practice it.

[magicbabs]

WEll - I was taught that a medicine bag is sacred.....and it can be shared openly with non-NA (God...Godess I love that term====HA!).

Been training for over 6 years now on a certain path.....and my teachers say that is is like a mojo/amulet/etc...... Hey ..it is all in the way you look at it. It is for protection/luck and whatever you want to carry.

Pow wows in The South are basically dance circles where there are competitions. They are for card holding NA's - but they ALWAYS welcome the Non-NA"S in for a dance. And they welcome
and honor the veterans of any war. Pretty cool - love the fry bread - try it with chilli - will make you want 2 or three....

Now - Butterfly dancing is cool. SAw that one out west....very cool.....There is a very neat man named Jimmy that does a hoop dance - man that one is awesome. He ends up with over 20 hoops he dances in and out of...

Stomp dancing is interesting.

Oh yes back to the bag ----
I have made medicine bags for individuals and for sale. I don't usually sell them without knowing a little something about the person. Then...I make it a certain color with beading or bone. The people that get my bags say they have nice energy.

Oh man, I forgot my point....oh well, must not have been that important....

[Joy]

Originally posted by reanna
welcome to mystic wicks Joy! PLeased to meet ya!! :wave::wave:

Ah, thanks...I am glad I have found this place. There is so much stuff to learn here.
Love those little waving smiles...lol

[Flar's Freyja]

Guilty - I didn't check the thread to see if this is already in here but I do like this site and this info:

Medicine Bags

Good JuJu
Medicine Bags are very special to make and use. They carry specific vibrations according to your need or desire. The purposes of their use is as varied as whatever the need is! They can be used for healing,...for adding something/energy/vibration to your life. They can be used for protection,...to enhance your lovable nature,....you name it and I will bet you can make a medicine bag for it!!!!Medicine bags,...the one's I am referring to here are to be worn about the neck. However,...you can make some that you can put into your pocket!

The Makings
You can also make medicine bags out of different materials as well. However,...I would suggest that you make any medicine bag out of natural materials. Leather is a good material,...however,...remember that all things carry energy with them,...so if you want to pack around with you the energy of a cow,...that's fine. Or you might consider the leather from deer or elk as a better vibration for you. Wool cloth insulates the energies of the contents of your bag. That means the energies stay inside the bag itself. So if you had a medicine bag for healing purposes,...well the energies would not be dispersed. Silk, Cotton cloth or a medicine bag that is crocheted from cotton thread is wonderful. These can be hand washed and they allow the energies to do their thing. Beaded bags that are made with glass beads are also fine.

Colors
Now if you have decided to make one for yourself of cotton fabric or thread (or yarn for that matter!), you need to consider the use of the colors. Again,...colors are also vibration,...so careful consideration is required to make sure that you are balancing and harmonizing the bag and it's contents. You can consider colors as a focus,...or you can disregard them altogether and just use your favorite colors. Your personal favorite colors will work just fine. We aren't designing a space rocket here and I always like to keep things simple. lol :)

Purple- Spiritual energies
Indigo-visionary
Turqoiuse-communication skills
Green-healing/growth
Pink-love/gentleness
Yellow-mental energies
Orange-friendliness/warmth/will
Red-energy/passion
The material you use to put this bag around your neck should also be made of natural fiber. Such as leather or silk, cotton, or beaded.

Bag Items
Now if you have a particular purpose in mind,...such as healing,...you would need to have some herbal knowledge,...so you can add a pinch of the special herb into your bag. You should also have some knowledge of stones so you can add the right one that carries the right vibration,...such as Peridot or amazonite. (Stone page lists some of the stones I use).

I personally like to balance a medicine bag,...you need something of the element of air,...water,...earth and fire. The nice thing about quartz crystals is that they are all of these qualities in themselves. You can take a small quartz crystal and send to it the thought form of that which you desire or are working on. Such as the example of health,...you would see yourself as healthy and whole while you are holding a cleansed crystal in your hand. Affirm also into the crystal, 'perfect health'. You could put in your bag a little feather (air element),...a sea shell (water element), a piece of wood or herb or stone (for earth element) and the use of a quartz crystal (for the fire element)You can add some things that are personal to you as well. If you have a favorite animal totem or helper,...and some gift of that animal has blessed your life,...you could add that to the bag and request of this blessed animal to help you in the purpose of this bag. This might be an animal tooth or claw, or feather, or fur. Or whatever you have been given. Some fetish that you have or a charm that you love,...you can pack this as well.

A thought
I know this is alot to think about to make a medicine bag,...but it is well worth it to prepare and plan this for yourself. After you have gathered all the items that you want to use for the contents of your bag,...you might want to do a simple ritual or prayer to bless all the contents. You don't need to be afraid of the word ritual,...it is meant to bless!!!! lol

The Blessings
Lay out the items you plan on using. Look at each one and ask yourself if this is in line with your main purpose. Listen to yourself. Take your time. You want to have nothing but positive feelings about everything involved in this. Your bag,...the items within the bag and the purpose for the bag. If anything feels out of balance or harmony,...use something else and then ask the same question of yourself.

Now to the blessing! This is a little witchy,...just remember,...you can do it any way that suits you! You can make this as simple or as complicated as you like. I mean if you want to do a full out blessing ritual-go for it. But for here I will keep it simple,...which is what I , well you know how I like things! lol So I will relate to you what I would do and you can adjust it to suit yourself!

I would get a white candle,...some cedar-wood or sandlewood incense,...a little glass or bowl of water and some salt. I would put all the contents into the bag (hopefully you have the bag and the necklace part of the bag all done-you want to bless the whole thing!).I would surround myself in white light and ask the blessings of my guides, guardians, angels or whatever. Then I would lite the candle and incense. I would take a deep breath, release it, relax and think only of the grandest blessing for the purpose of my medicine bag. I would take the bag and pass it over in the air and ask for the blessing of the air, then I would pass it over the candle flame and incense smoke and ask for the blessing of fire and air. I would sprinkle a drop or two of water and ask for the blessing of water. Then I would sprinkle some salt on it. I would say it like this:'This special bag for the purpose of (whatever) is blessed by air, fire, water and earth. Then I would hold it up over my head and bless it through the spirit of white light.Then I would thank the guides,...the elements,...I would feel the emotion of gratitude and proudly wear my new medicine bag. Don't forget to snuff out the candle flame respectfully afterwards!!!

Not So Witchy
Okay,...that's a simple ritual. If you want it even simpler,...take your bag with you somewhere where you will not be disturbed. Quiet yourself and pray that your bag will be blessed by your belief in God or whatever. Stay there until you feel the blessing has taken affect. Can't get much simpler than that can I? lol :)

Do only that which feels right and good to you! Don't ever forget that!!!

http://emeraldrune.tripod.com/medicinebag.html

[Lavender]

Guilty - I didn't check the thread to see if this is already in here but I do like this site and this info:

Heh! Nope, your info's all new. Most of this thread was an interesting discussion on stealing from other cultures. :D

[Witchy Cowgirl]

Yes, it has been a very interesting discussion and I wish I had gotten in on it before now!

I made a medicine bag for my husband before a particular business trip. And yes, it was a medicine bag - he's Creek/Seminole and as his granddaddy would say, "he's a card totin' Indun!" which means he is registered and has an enrollment number. And yes, they can say Indun cause they are NA's.

The medicine bag I made was for protection as his trip was taking him to D.C. Just before he was to fly out the sniper was caught and I was so thankful.

[Matt]

My grand father is a naitive well we live in canada so i can't say naitive american but any way im watered down im pure....scottish he adopted my mother who was scottish and my father was scottish but who cares just establishing backround so he was teaching me about things like these and i asked about medicine bags well anyway we went out and made one and i wore it every where well then school started back up and i was in class first day of school and the teacher asked me what that smell was and i said ida know she pulled my medicine bag out and opened it and said go to the office il be there in a minute! they thought i had marijuana on me! it was so imbarrasing so i called my grandfather and he came in and ranted and raved about my cultural rights and now they let me wear it in school

>:^) true story

[LilacMoon0]

Might i weigh in? First I want to say that these are IMHO and are NOT dirrected to any particular post or fellow MWer.

I am a 50% *to quote WC * "Card Totin' Indun" and 25% German and 25% Irish.
Any who.... I only wanted to add that in my experience... the offense comes from people...non Natives.... taking what is considered "cool" without an understanding of its historical or spiritual meaning.. A Medicine bag for instance, is a very intense personal thing.. woven from tradition and heritage... Perhaps its not so much the making of the bag or the wearing of the bag that offends but the proclamation that comes along with it. Its the same in many cultures.... often people are so hungry for a path and to belong to something greater that they grasp onto physical objects without understanding the meaning behind them.
Having lived on the Cherokee Res and the Comanche Res... I have been to many open and closed Pow Wows and Dances.... I must say .. what it shown to the outsiders is often show and used for money... the real stuff is after the public has gone or at the private ones.

I am rambling.. forgive the intrusion.

[Old Witch]

Having gone to my first Pow Wow just a month ago, I can say it really was an eye opener.....and a good experience for me...I'm half Cherokee myself........but not on any roll...

[Witchy Cowgirl]

Yes LilacMoon - I agree with you. Offense is taken in the folks who make a medicine bag and then go around waving it in the air hollering, "OHHHH look what I got - a Indian bag - ain't it cool - and look theres some kinda grass and a rock inside!" I don't think offense is taken when folks use and medicine bag and actually know what they are talking about. But in all actually you can't have one without the other. There will always be spiritual people who borrow from other paths - and I don't see any harm in that. But for every one of those it seems there's 3 more who borrow because "it's kweel".

Oh, I just welcomed you on your introduction thread - but I wanna welcome you here as well. Trust me, your not intruding! Feel free to jump in on any discussion you find interesting. We love it!

[LilacMoon0]

Feel free to jump in on any discussion you find interesting. We love it!

Thanks.... I am glad to be here and am in amazement at the wisdom and sincerity that I have read in the posts...

Funny thing.... I have a bag myself.. but out of respect and in honesty to my lack of training.... I don't call it a medicine bag but rather.. My Bag of Tricks.. lol!

[dreamweaver]

About fourty years ago My first teacher I had on my quest to learn shamanism was a native fellow from southern Ontario.About two years after I started with him he presented me with my first medicine bag.I had never attended any of the sacred meetings he attended and never asked questions about anything he deemed sacred.When he gave me the bag I asked him if it was not a part of his sacred beliefs and his words were Yes they are considered sacred but we are one and it will become sacred to you.I never asked about them again and they did become part of me.

Fourty years later I still have never found a religion or path to follow that I feel comfortable with but shamanism has become a tremendous part of my life and without him I would never have gotten as far as I have.I owe both him and his people alot and I will honor them as long as I live

The name I use was given to me back then as well and I am very proud to carry it today

[Sgeir]

Hey all. Just wanted to jump into this discussion, though I don't have any knowledge of American Indian beliefs specifically, as I come from half a world away :)
Its a difficult issue, though, how far "cultural borrowing" (or theft, depending on how you look at it) is right or not. Part of the trouble is that it has always happened - Gods and beliefs from many different cultures merged in the ancient world, in Egypt, and certainly in Rome, and even in Christianity. Evidently the ancients didn't feel it was stealing anothers' culture to do so. That precedent leads people today to do the same thing with American Indians (is that the right term, btw?), aborigines, and other minority groups with a cohesive culture. They take whatever has meaning to themselves, to their own world-view, no matter where it originated, and incorporate it into their private mythology.
On the one hand its possible to say that its valid to do so - that beliefs cannot and should not really be regulated by race or blood, that they can be universal and have meaning outside your ancestry. On the other I can well imagine how irritating it might be to see people appropriate your beliefs, use them out of context, and use them to be seen as "cool" or to gain some sort of power from them.

In the end I believe that it is valid to take beliefs and ideas from other cultures, that doing so enriches us all. But I do think that it is possible to do so without denigrating those cultures, without laughing at them, without patronising them. I think I agree with Witchy Cowgirl that if you borrow, knowing what whatever it is (like medicine bags) means within that culture, and do so with proper intent, then there is nothing particularly wrong with it. The damage comes if you take things from other cultures for the purpose of looking cool, or in order to claim ancient wisdom, as a means of gaining authority, respect and power for which you have not worked, and simply as an end in themselves.

[SkepticalNDN]

:grrrrr: :grrrrr:
Not seeing anything to get upset about is part of closet racism. It’s part of the Colonizer’s mentality.

You are merely appealing to your White skin privilege. You align yourself with the mindset of the society you claim to rebel against. White Privilege is never being offended by anything. White privilege is never seeing the offense in the offensive things you do

Thinking that you can eclectically adopt whatever sacred concept or practice that appeals to you, without permission, and without much knowledge of its history and background comes from a colonizing mentality. If you’re truly interested in a new morality you will discard the old morality of the past. If, as white Europeans you feel you have a right to APPROPRIATE Native traditions, you are no different than the other Christian, heterosexual, male, (insert dominant group) of thieves.

Claiming Native American traditions while living your life as a privileged White European IS INSULTING and it is CORRUPT!

You can't buy Native American spirituality. You can't learn about it. You can't find book, 'shaman, or web page that is legitimate. Anything you could buy or have access to is fake and contributes to the destruction of real Native spiritual practices.

The "but I've got blood" argument is specious.

Indigenous people don't think this way. You are told about spiritual things when you can demonstrate that you are entitled to know about them. If you don't know how to demonstrate that you are entitled, then you are NOT ENTITLED. The idea that having "blood" entitles you to anything is a racist concept devised by the government to deny Indigenous people equal rights.

What can you do?

Have the integity to create your OWN spiritual practices

Do not read books that corrupts our ways

Do not remain silent when others drop names of fake medicine men

Don’t call yourself a “two spirt”

Confront and educate those who do

Stop being lazy and “construct” a better terms for your beliefs that don't appropriate Native culture

Don’t buy books about Native Spirituality, how to conduct sweat lodges, Native American astrology, tarot cards etc.

Speak up when someone talks about buying these things or ceremonies - have the courage to confront them

Read more about the Native perspective – don’t go looking for the "good Indians" who agree with you

Read more about your White Privilege

Don’t buy dream catchers

Don’t buy sage, cedar sweat grass and don’t use it

Don’t use tobacco

Don’t carry use or buy medicine bags

Get rid of your own 'colonialist' mindset and educate others about theirs.

If you really want to be a pagan, you can't retain the old colonizing mindset that your intitled to steal from the Indians.

You have no idea how deeply offensive the pagan community is to real NDNZ.

[AstralMoth]

Don’t buy books about Native Spirituality, how to conduct sweat lodges, Native American astrology, tarot cards etc.
Although you have raised a valid point, the Tarot reference above makes abosultely no sense. Its not a Native American thing at all.
And tabbaco I smoke because im addicted, not out of any desire to rape your culture, thats like me telling you not to use cars because a white man invented them ( which i wont do because thats just dumb ).

[9-2-2]

Okay, am I the only person here who has a problem with this??

I don't understand just going in and using something because it's cool and useful. If it's sacred to a particular tribe, leave it alone.

People say the ancients did it ~ so that's supposed to make all this borrowing and such "okay". No. They did so after they were adopted into each other's tribes ~ or took over tribes. If then.

That's just anal, and mildly racist. With all due respect to those downtrodden folks, "medicine bags" did not originate with them. Charms and amulets come from all over the world, man. Hell, if I threw some feathers and rocks into a leather baggy and charged it, the only people in these parts who'd get pissed would be the Christians. It would be no different if I put a poker chip and rabbit's foot in a Ziplock, and used it for increased luck.

If you haven't noticed, mages from all over the world blend, take, steal, share, give, and hoard knowledge for spiritual growth. If they didn't, there would be no Wiccans, Ceremonialists, Chaotes, Thelemites, shamans, etc.

Spiritual growth comes by expanding your awareness and horizons, not by being a separatist stodgepot.

[TheTempestuous1]

That's just it ~ people don't think, they just do. That's what causes problems. And it's not just the medicine bags, it's peace pipes, sweatlodges and other NA traditional things.

Think first.

Honestly, who really gives a shit if they are offended? If I find something meaningful to my spiritual path I am going to use it. Just because someone else started it doesn't mean I can't adapt it for my use. If its meaningful to you, its not mucking around. Its really no ones business what I or anyone else uses in their spiritual path. So my honest feeling? F their offense. It's their choice to be territorial or offended. My choice would be to use whatever works for me.

[9-2-2]

Honestly, who really gives a shit if they are offended? If I find something meaningful to my spiritual path I am going to use it. Just because someone else started it doesn't mean I can't adapt it for my use. If its meaningful to you, its not mucking around. Its really no ones business what I or anyone else uses in their spiritual path. So my honest feeling? F their offense. It's their choice to be territorial or offended. My choice would be to use whatever works for me.

I'm certainly not concerned about what they choose to be offensive. I learned that someone used one of my poems in ritual... I didn't get my panties in a knot. People use techniques from Vietnamese and Chinese systems, both races being a part of my blood. They don't even pay homage to those cultures, but I don't care. I don't go around stomping on anyone's face unless I have a good reason.

I think years ago the Lakota declared some kind of social or cultural "war" on the non-Lakota for using their practices in ritual. Sorry, but I don't have to be a card-carrier to do a medicine wheel or whatnot, much like a Wiccan doesn't have to be a Ceremonialist to do an LBRP... or how about this one, guys... YOU DON'T HAVE TO BE MEXICAN TO DO A RODEO, and you don't have to be Chinese to eat Chinese food.

[Nighthawk]

Well, I look at this thread with a ton of curiousity and wishing to understand. Most of this is so old, none of the people are still here. I see like 5 still members. It is not good to 'rip off'. However, sometimes you can 'share' I will not explain this because each person knows in their heart why they are going to do something. If something is done with respect, it is much better than to do something without caring. I thank all who posted in this thread, necause I learned much.

[amethyst_faerie]

I can understand why some native americans would be offended with non-natives using their practices. White people invaded their country, stole their land and treated them as 'savages', so naturally they're going to object when they suddenly start using some of their rituals and sacred objects - they probably see it as a debasement of their religion.
The point is, what the white 'forefathers' of America did to the natives was wrong, but we must all learn to live in harmony. If every culture kept to itself - no-one practiced, owned, wore or consumed anything out of their own culture, the world would be a very boring place. I don't know how native americans can say whites are 'stealing' their dreamcatchers or whatever, when part of their belief system is that the earth does not belong to anyone, it is something to be respected and lived on in harmony with ALL creatures. NOT just people in your culture.

[9-2-2]

I know how the past sucked.
But it never ceases to amuse me when others become so distracted from spiritual evolution by useless social insanities of who's doing what with who's toolrey. o_O

There's a black woman at work who collects Chinese regalia. The Chinese were used as slaves during the Civil War (though not to the extent the Africans were used), and I am part Chinese.
But I'm not about to jump her bones because she didn't pop out of an Asian, and she claims the culture for her own.

But the culture still belongs to me, too. The native culture still belongs to the natives. Just because someone dips their fingers into the honey pot doesn't mean the honey pot is gone.

The honey pot is infinite, and only goes away when we make it go away. :flowers:

[amethyst_faerie]

Ooh, nice honey pot metapor!