Should Paganism be treated as a phase in the begining?

[kittiepoetrygod]

I've noticed among several of my friends, who, upon finding out about my religion, decided, hey, cool, i'll be Pagan now ... and 2 months down the road are all, "Pagans are the devil's children." The point is, that for many, it is a phase, especially amoung teens and young adults. However, for about 25%, IMO, it isn't, and they get very angry when people assume they are going through a phase.

So, do you think it should be assumed that it is a phase? That is might be? That it should be assumed it isn't a phase? Questions, comments, opinions.

[clef0628]

It could be a phase for some. If someone was doughting their own faith they could turn to paganism for a time and then after that time of dought return to their other religion. They may also find that in this time that paganism is not for them and move on. I would think that a lot of people go into paganism as a phase when they are start trying to figure out what they truly believe in if they find it to their liking they move out of the phase to become a true believer. I believe this would happen more with paganism because unlike most other religions, most of its followers are not born into it, and must go though a period were they turn a side what was taught to them and must find their own path. However, others believe from the start do not go though this "phase". I remenber when I first started turning to paganism it was more of a phase for me then, after sometime a turned back to Christainity because, I still was worried about paganism being evil. But, that phase did not last long, as I found my heart calling me back to paganism.

[Danustouch]

Personally, I think all of life is a phase. We are always entering new phases in life. I'm Pagan, have been for a while now, but...who knows what i'll believe in 20 years? I'd like to say I'll be a pagan all of my life, but the whole point of life is to learn and to grow. So if I learn something new, find a new path to follow, then i believe it's healthy, and good. But as for assuming that anyone is in a phase...I don't think it's wise to make assumptions about anyones path.

[Myst]

How is a phase treated any differently? Do you mean if people assume it's a phase they treat it as just something that will pass? I agree with Danu, life is phases, and they may always pass. I know a few people who I think are "just in a phase", but then, if it's part of their personal growth who is anyone to stop them, ya know?

[MistOfTheSea86]

OF course, I see all your points. Being a young Pagan myself. there are many times when I feel that I am disobeying god's rule etc. etc. But then I hear the goddess telling me to stop listening to all that rubbish. The goddess is in me and has been my whole life:) She will not let me turn away from her... When I was little I tried, but I knew what my true calling was... I just didnt know what to call it... Then I heard of paganism and i finally understood what my heart had been yearning for for all these years. And now I am happy:)

[kittiepoetrygod]

What i meant was, do you think when talking to New Pagans, one should assume that in a month or two, they won't be?

[Myst]

Why would you assume that of anyone?

So no I'd say I'd never assume that.

[kittiepoetrygod]

I would because that is my expierance with most.

[Danustouch]

well..i wouldnt make assumptions about anyones path or beliefs. For every two or three people who will move on to other paths...there will be another one, who is genuine in their belief. Anyway..i'm reminded of the old addage..."you know what assuming does".......(need I say more?) That's why I try not to assume:) I don't think it's good to try to prejudge people, at all, just based on their age, or newness to the path. They may very sincerely believe that they are pagan, at the time they say it. So to say it is a "phase" would be belittling them. Sure..it may change, further down the line. People Grow, People Change..we're not meant to stay stagnant in life, but to constantly expand. However, it doesn't mean that at the time they are claiming to be pagan, that it is not as sincere, heartfelt, and TRUE to them, as anything else. The truth is....all that matters, is NOW...the given moment. Holding onto the past, does no good, and neither does making assumptions about ones future. We are, what we are, at the present.."Moment". So...I still do not think that making assumptions or presumptions about a persons belief, it's depth, its validity, it's sincerity, is a good thing. I think it makes one VERY judgemental to do that. Come back, in 20 years, and tell us if YOU are the same person you were , today. I'll bet you you won't be. If you are, I think you've missed a lot of living. Yet..you'd probably resent it if people said.."see..you weren't a REAL this or that, you were just going through a phase.".

Also..try to be aware, that to paint the world in generalizations, makes it very boring. Just because your experiences with "Most" that you've met, has given you one opinion, don't assume it's the same everywhere, and with every person. It may just be your circle of experience...a small handful of people that you've encountered. They certainly don't represent all pagans, or even a majority. Actually, since many pagans choose the path later in life, I'd say, it's NOT just a phase for most. It's a heartfelt, sincere choice that they've made.

[Twilight Garden]

My mother always said, "To assume is to make an a$$ of u and me." I try to never assume anything, esspecially about someone's religion or beliefs. I tend to be supportive of where they are at the time. If they stick with it or not doesn't really effect me. I never feel as though it was wasted time if someone doesn't stick with a particular religion. I also don't think of it as a phase, I think of it as a learning experience. It's their own journey.

[Mythrel]

I still call myself pagan, but for the most part, I'd say I am not. I started down the ways of paganism when I met my teacher. I had always be interested since I can remember but never knew where to begin. I still worship the Goddess but for the most part I work with energies. So in a way, I might be considered a Taoist. Who knows...I am happy and have my faith so I am not really all that concerned with a title...
Mythrel

[kittiepoetrygod]

I've been misinterpreted ... what mI meant was, if someone came up to me and said, hey, i'm Pagan now, should I 1) Be like, oo, coll! lets celbrate the full moon next week, and then Samhain ... and tomarrow, lets goto barnes and noble and .... ect. ect. or 2) O, thats cool. And not make any long term plans.

[Danustouch]

how about another option...

"Oh Cool! Let me know if you'd like to get together and talk about it sometime. Maybe if we get to know eachother better, we could celebrate together".

[pinguino]

Is it a phase?
Defentaly for some, especailly for young people looking for ways to rebel. I remember doing just about anything to piss off my parents when I was 15 or so.

I don't think that anyone intrested in paganism labels themselves pagan overnight. After A LOT of reseach into the subject those who are truly intrested find themselves slowly becomming pagan.

In short it's a process of an intrest being sparked, then education, then education leads to question, which in turn leads to wonder then perhaps practice.

[Swanspirit]

you can respond as GENUINELY as you feel ..... and not base your responses on someone elses words or actions......or any assumptions you might make about them......
this is what the inner path is about ......
being TRUE to who YOU ARE has more to do with being a "pagan" IMO ...... than any tool, ritual, sabbat, tatoo, or book you read ..... how anyone else views you or what anyone else thinks of you ........ it isnt a popularity contest ...........
and besides ..... if you cant be your genuine self with real responses .... then you lose something far greater than being able to say the "right thing " at the "right moment" which is a false concept......you lose the true YOU .......
Love and Light
Swannie

[pinguino]

Originally posted by Swanspirit
being TRUE to who YOU ARE has more to do with being a "pagan"

I'm down with that...... The crux of what I was driving at is, finding out who you really are--- not trying to fool yourself. Ask yourself what do I ACTUALLY belive and then what does that mean. This is where philosphy comes in and it all get rather complicated. ;)

[kittiepoetrygod]

Originally posted by pinguino


I don't think that anyone intrested in paganism labels themselves pagan overnight.

Are you in highschool? Maybe the reason i have some of my opinions is becuase I have to deal with people that say, "Charmed is cool! I'm wiccan now!" on a daily basis. So i've very biased. But anyhoo, I agree with the third option, Danu. Its the best, i think. ANd the one that i would pick. I was just going for the extremes, but you hit the nail on the head.

BTW, the local coven worships Danu as the Goddess of the Ever-Flowing River. Is that accurate?

[Twilight Garden]

Maybe the reason i have some of my opinions is becuase I have to deal with people that say, "Charmed is cool! I'm wiccan now!" on a daily basis.I do understand that problem. But if those people think "Charmed is cool!" and then turn to Wicca for a bit of time, they at the very least, get some knowledge of that craft. They may not continue in the path or even approve of it. BUT, Who knows if much later down the road they do remember some of what they learned and maybe even seek further or (good enough for me) have a tolerance for it that may otherwise not be there.

[Danustouch]

Well Kittie...imo, there are two scenarios that can happen, when a person takes an interest in Wicca/witchcraft/paganism, due to watching television such as "Charmed".

Either A)that will be a STARTING point for them, get them interested, and they will start wanting to learn more. So they'll eventually start picking up books on it, and start researching it. Then, they may grow in knowledge and in faith, and realize all the intricacies of the path, and become valued members of that path. OR B)They will find themselves interested, pick up some books, realize that Paganism/Wicca/Witchcraft isn't quite as glamourous as television portrays, and decide it's not for them. Either way, I try not to worry so much about what THEY are doing, I try to concentrate on what I'm doing. If those people who are drawn to the craft from the television versions of it, are portraying a "Negative" image of our faith, then we should just continue to live our lives, and try to portray a "Positive" image of our Faith :) In other words, they'll either learn and grow, or move on. Which should be just fine to us. That is what life is about, learning, growing, and moving on. And we should never wish that anyone would stay stagnant.

I'm sure it is frustrating when you think you are meeting a potential "likeminded" individual, only to discover that for them, it may not last. But...to each his own. Live and let live. All you can do, is be yourself. You'll eventually draw likeminded individuals to you:)

As for the Danu thing...i've heard that she has some association with the River Shannon, in Ireland. But I haven't personally heard the term you've used. I suppose that she could be a Goddess of whatever she wishes to:) She is the Patron Goddess of Ireland, the Mother Goddess, and the guardian of Magick. Her children are the Tuatha De Danaan in Irish Mythology (the fae folk), who retreated underground after the Milesian invasion.

[Myst]

In its simplest form, my opinion and experience is that when you assume anything of anyone you are shutting yourself off from the possibility that they'll do something totally different. If you assume people are just going to be "in a phase" then you aren't taking the time to learn about them - they might really be a soulmate and you're missing out.

Other then that, take Danus post and add a big check for me coz I agree totally with what she said.

[Danustouch]

And I agree with you willow :)

[talamh]

i think the best way is to be receptive and supportive.. and let it grow. If a person really is pagan, it's usually pretty obvious over the long haul. And if they're not.. well.. maybe they think they are at the time they say it...

But i would be very careful about doing ritual with a new person.... so much better to get to know someone's energy first.....

A good way to explore is to talk about what books people have read and what their opinion is of different authors and traditions.

And to trust one's elf (oneself)... Extensive research has proven conclusively that elves are seldom mistaken. :)

bb talamh

[pinguino]

Originally posted by kittiepoetrygod


Are you in highschool? Maybe the reason i have some of my opinions is becuase I have to deal with people that say, "Charmed is cool! I'm wiccan now!" on a daily basis.

No. I'm not in H/S. These are the exact people I would figure are going through a phase.

Why do you HAVE to deal with these afore mentioned people? DOes it bother you that they say this?

My beliefs are just that-- MY beliefs. If anyone else asks and is will to have a intelligent discussion on them I welcome it. As for those who feel the need to flaunt their beliefs..... iI could care less--- They look as if they need the attention. *shruggs*

[Myst]

Originally posted by talamh anEiac
But i would be very careful about doing ritual with a new person.... so much better to get to know someone's energy first.....

Whether they may be relatively new or "going through a phase" or not I agree, one should be very careful with doing a ritual or other magickal work with a new person.

[Danustouch]

Yep...that's why getting together a few times, etc, maybe a study group? would be a good idea :) or..you could do other..."pagany" things..not pertaining to magick. Go on Hikes together, for instance, or go to a psychic fair, or go to a pagan store, etc, etc, etc. That would leave time to discuss, and get to know eachother :)

[lucidfire]

Well perhaps the reason it is so often a phase, is because there's not enough positive representation of it as a way of life; people that become pagan all of a sudden, do it because they're "upset" with their religion, when they just may have had bad experiences. I may have thought bad about Christians at some point, but then I learned that those people I thought were bad weren't really true Christians, and that the Christian faith is as misunderstood today as many others. I don't think it's bad, I think it's just easy to misinterpret, and has been so redefined (?!) that people can't see through the smoke anymore.

I definately agree with what Danu said though :sunny: :wave:
(great handle by the way!)