Open letter to pagans

[Taurwen]

(The following is a mix of things I've heard here, and the letter made from Dr. Robert A Morey. I know I didn't actually come up with some of the ideas myself, so the copywrite goes to whoever these certain parts were made by)

Dear practicioners of the various Pagan faiths,

The reason I'm writing this letter is that I used to be one of you, I know the practices of paganism first hand when I walked down the road, and now I'm working on the side of Christ. The reason I converted is because there were several things I felt weren't "right" with paganism. Some things didn't make sense to me; almost like a spiritual loophole in the path.

Now, I know that you will disagree with some of my conclusions
because we have traveled different paths. All I ask is that you have an open mind and give serious attention to the things I bring up. Remember, an unexamined faith is a worthless one:

1: Evocation

You all know about evocation, bringing an entity (usually a pagan god) into your presence. Now, let's remember something very important here: in every pantheon of pagan gods, there's always one which created the world and the universe. For example, in norse paganism it was Odin; in hinduism it's Brahma; in greek mythology it was Zeus...

No one can look at the sun for more than a few seconds without burning their eyes. Yet you say it's possible to bring a god who (according to myth) created billions of stars, into your presence right infront of you? Doesn't something about that seem, hmm, incorrect?

2: Magick does no good for people

Most pagans/wiccans/occultists know about Aleister Crowley (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aleister_Crowley). He was one of the large magick practicioners of the western world. He even wrote a book named "Magick" that was almost 1000 pages long. Yeah, he was pretty obsessed with it, so much that he got the title "The wickedest man alive".

...And this man died penniless, addicted to heroine, in a boarding home.

Have you ever taken a look at India? What a mess their country is in! India still has the world’s largest number of poor people in a single country. Of its nearly 1 billion inhabitants, an estimated 350-400 million are below the poverty line. More than 40 per cent of the population is illiterate (source (http://www.indiaonestop.com/povertyindia.htm)). They've been praising demons, calling them gods, and bowing to statues that they made. They're just clay and stone! Your "gods" didn't give you those statues either, you made them yourself.

After all the talk about the "power" that people can get from magic, I have never known a more powerless group of people. I recall being on a website called mysticwicks, where many people were talking about their money troubles, asking others for everything down to kid's clothing, basically struggling to make it. They put their faith in their 'gods' and they come out even worse off.

3. Protecting themselves

Pagans and wiccans constantly need to cast circles, to shield themselves and wear charms in order to protect themselves. Why do they need to do all these things? I thought their "gods" were powerful enough. Apparently not, if they have to go around spreading salt and visualizing shields around them.

For that matter, what do you believe you're doing if you walk around spreading salt on your floors, or chalking out a circle on the ground, or circling your altar three times while chanting? You're not doing anything special by doing those things. Putting salt around me won't protect me. It's just salt. It's not going to stop anything.

4. To christo-pagans, and christo-wiccans:

The Word says that the forces that cause magick and pagan power is really the devil and his demons.

Christo-wiccans and Christo-pagans do many things which God sees as an abomination. Not only, you know, the fact that they're breaking the Lord's first commandment (Thou shalt have no other gods before me.), but also:


Diviners Deu_18:14;
Enchanters Deu_18:10; Jer_27:9;
Witches Exo_22:18; Deu_18:10;
Charmers Deu_18:11;
Wizards Deu_18:11; 1Sa_28:3;
Consulters of familiar spirits Deu_18:11;
Magicians Gen_41:8; Dan_4:7;
Astrologers Isa_47:13; Dan_4:7;
Sorcerers Jer_27:9; Act_13:6; Act_13:8;
Necromancers Deu_18:11;
Soothsayers Isa_2:6; Dan_2:27;
False prophets Jer_14:14; Eze_13:3; Eze_13:6;
Enchantments Exo_7:11; Num_24:1;
Sorcery Isa_47:12; Act_8:11;
Observing times 2Ki_21:6;
Observing heavenly bodies Isa_37:13;
Raising the dead 1Sa_28:11; 1Sa_28:12;
Inspecting the inside of beasts Eze_21:21;
The flight of arrows Eze_21:21; Eze_21:22;
Cups Gen_44:2; Gen_44:5;
Rods Hos_4:12;
Dreams Jer_29:8; Zec_10:2;
Connected with idolatry 2Ch_33:5; 2Ch_33:6;
Consulted (diviners) in difficulties Dan_2:2; Dan_4:6; Dan_4:7;
Used mysterious words and gestures Isa_8:19;
A system of fraud Eze_13:6; Eze_13:7; Jer_29:8;

Forbade to the Israelites the practice of Lev_19:26; Deu_18:10; Deu_18:11;
Forbade seeking to Lev_19:31; Deu_18:14;
Punished with death those who used Exo_22:18; Lev_20:27;
Punished those who sought to Lev_20:6;

...yet people still go about those things, calling themselves Christo-pagans and Christo-wiccans. "You cannot drink the cup of the Lord and the cup of demons; you cannot partake of the table of the Lord and the table of demons" - I Corinthians 10:14-22

----
I'll finish with the words of Dr. Robert A Morey:

The Lord Jesus Christ has broken the power of magic and has
brought life, love and immortality to light through the Gospel.
Jesus is Victor!

The occult has nothing to offer that compares with the love
of Jesus. Turn to Him in repentance. Renounce your witchcraft
and the works of the devil. Burn your magic books and mash your
altars. Turn or burn. Repent or perish! Jesus is the answer.
John 3:36.

[Aidron]

Are you... attempting to convert us? :eyebrow:

[Garden of Eden]

I rememer having seen this letter somewhere else... but it was accompanied by a rather bitter and condesending commentary from a pagan in response to his words. The Pagan's response annoyed me almost as much as the original letter; because she was accusing him of being intolerant, and then attacking the Christian faith with equal disdain. I'll try and dig the webpage out. I read a rather poignant letter from a Christian on the fabulous Pagan Orphans Yahoo group . It revolved around tolerance and used scripture to support the idea that all religions should be tolerated. I'm rather of the opinion that if some (not all, I don't dare stereotype) Christians stopped spreading their message for a moment and actually read it themselves, they might get a bit of a shock. :)

[Pandoras]

I only draw one conclusion from a letter such as this: the author was never Pagan. He/she is either simply lying or just thought he/she was Pagan (but never really understood it).

[Pure Ahimsa]

I really hate it when people like that address a few Pagan beliefs, and tell me I am wrong as a Pagan, when I even dont follow that particular Pagan belief.

[John_Mischief]

1: Evocation

You all know about evocation, bringing an entity (usually a pagan god) into your presence. Now, let's remember something very important here: in every pantheon of pagan gods, there's always one which created the world and the universe. For example, in norse paganism it was Odin; in hinduism it's Brahma; in greek mythology it was Zeus...

I'm an Irish Recon - no creation story, so this doesn't apply to me. Secondly, I think most people think of their various and respective creation stories as metapors, or believe that their gods created the area they're from only.


No one can look at the sun for more than a few seconds without burning their eyes. Yet you say it's possible to bring a god who (according to myth) created billions of stars, into your presence right infront of you? Doesn't something about that seem, hmm, incorrect?

It's the SPIRIT of the God, not an actual embodiment of the god,also in a lot of myths the gods take on other forms so that they don't burn people up. In addition, not all gods created stuff like stars and suns - mine didn't.


2: Magick does no good for people

Most pagans/wiccans/occultists know about Aleister Crowley. He was one of the large magick practicioners of the western world. He even wrote a book named "Magick" that was almost 1000 pages long. Yeah, he was pretty obsessed with it, so much that he got the title "The wickedest man alive".

...And this man died penniless, addicted to heroine, in a boarding home.

The kind of magic he was doing wasn't exactly your average witchery - he didn't care to much about helping people spells, he was more into the demon summoning type stuff, I do believe.

Also, magic has helped me a lot. It can't do everything, but if you use it right it's a very very helpful aid.


Have you ever taken a look at India? What a mess their country is in! India still has the world’s largest number of poor people in a single country. Of its nearly 1 billion inhabitants, an estimated 350-400 million are below the poverty line. More than 40 per cent of the population is illiterate (source). They've been praising demons, calling them gods, and bowing to statues that they made. They're just clay and stone! Your "gods" didn't give you those statues either, you made them yourself.

Have you taken a look at Africa? MANY of them are Christian; and that is even a direct cause of some of their troubles - as birth control is forbidden and aids is spread.


After all the talk about the "power" that people can get from magic, I have never known a more powerless group of people. I recall being on a website called mysticwicks, where many people were talking about their money troubles, asking others for everything down to kid's clothing, basically struggling to make it. They put their faith in their 'gods' and they come out even worse off.

Not everyone here believes in magic or gods. The Gods can't do everything - and neither can the christian god as seen by all the badly off christians.


3. Protecting themselves

Pagans and wiccans constantly need to cast circles, to shield themselves and wear charms in order to protect themselves. Why do they need to do all these things? I thought their "gods" were powerful enough. Apparently not, if they have to go around spreading salt and visualizing shields around them.

For that matter, what do you believe you're doing if you walk around spreading salt on your floors, or chalking out a circle on the ground, or circling your altar three times while chanting? You're not doing anything special by doing those things. Putting salt around me won't protect me. It's just salt. It's not going to stop anything.

I don't do that, so this doesn't apply to me either. In the cases of those who do however - some are atheists, and some I would imagine don't want to trouble their gods.

I don't know much about christo-wiccans/pagans, so I won't address that.

[Karma Chameleon]

Why are you posting this? You posted another "letter" a short while ago. What exactly is it that you are trying to accomplish?

[mol]

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