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Thread: Atheist Evangelicalism

  1. #1
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    Atheist Evangelicalism

    I hope it's alright to post this here (and, this isn't meant as an attack on Non-Theists at all, I'd like to hear other opinions), but, I've noticed that there seems to have been a rise in aggressive Atheism, like, Richard Dawkins, Christopher Hitchens, and others who seem to be on the attack and want to eliminate all religion. Hitchens also said that he can't respect any religious person, which I guess makes him a sad, lonely man (which may account for his bitterness), or a pathetic one, if his only friends are ones that share his philosophy (IMO, you should never just have friends with people from your circle, e.g. a Christian shouldn't just want to be friends with only Christians, a Pagan with only Pagans, Atheists with Atheists, etc). At first, I didn't agree with Dawkins, on 'The God Delusion', but, I did, at least, respect him, but, he just seems to have become very aggressive, same for some other Atheists (none of which are on this forum, as far as I'm aware, which is a good thing).

    I've noticed that some Atheists just, basically, seem to say exactly the same things as the fundamentalists of Christianity and Islam (along with other religions), e.g. like they think they've got the "true" path, they seem to make fun of those who believe in God(s), or anything spiritual, in short, they just seem mean, and bitter. It makes me wonder if they have any friends who are part of a religion, 'cause the way some of them look upon Theists, or anyone Spiritual, I don't see how they could be friends (I also see religious Fundamentalists the same way, like, how many friends they may have, or if they're truly happy, 'cause, I don't think anyone can really be happy, unless they're just a natural born bully, by insulting, or making fun of others).

    Anyway, I just wanted to get other Non-Theist opinions of what you think of certain Atheists who do seem to the fit the above pattern?, do you think that'll ever change, or, if they're simply a minority (that will hopefully die out, along with other Fundamentalists).

  2. #2
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    Yeah I get -very- tired of that " I'm right, you're wrong" attitude and they use science the way fundie Christians and Muslims use their scripture.

    They twist things around and that doesn't lead to very rational thinking

    So when a fundie atheist tells a Christian " You're wrong, I'm right," I just lol...because they're doing the same thing they accuse Christians of doing.


    Its really silly.

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    I totally disagree Dawkins and Hitchens are nowhere close to being fundamentalist. Have you guys actually read any of there work or heard them speak? The present an alternative to religion and faith. Present that fact that there is no evidence to support the claims of religion.
    I am big fan of there work and have been articles and books by dawkins way before he become like the mainstream face of modern atheism.
    I really appreciate what they do and what others like them do. They present an alternative to mainstream religion and superstitions.And present the crazy idea that if you make claims about something it's a good idea to have some credible evidence.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by David19 View Post
    I've noticed that there seems to have been a rise in aggressive Atheism, like, Richard Dawkins, Christopher Hitchens,
    Aggressive Atheism is pretty damn passive if Dawkins and Hitchens are their representatives. Advocates of Free Speech, the free exchange of ideas, the sciences and other academia, human rights and equality... if only the so called "fundamentalists" of the theist side were so vicious.

    and others who seem to be on the attack and want to eliminate all religion.
    David, there is a difference between the actively trying to eliminate all religion and being happy to see all religion eliminated. They can not and will not take an active role in the elimination of any religious or political ideology, it would violate pretty much everything they stand for.

    But I can understand why the religious and those of religious leanings would "push" Dawkins and Hitchens over that line in their own perceptions. The both say and do things that piss people off.

    Hitchens also said that he can't respect any religious person, which I guess makes him a sad, lonely man (which may account for his bitterness), or a pathetic one, if his only friends are ones that share his philosophy
    Why does that make him a sad, lonely man? There is little logic to your assumption there, do you really think so little of atheists that our little ragtag band of misfits to not possess the strength of character to provide amble social sustenance? Or do you mean there is so few atheists that it would be impossible to have a meaningful community consisting of only atheists?

    There is no single atheistic philosophy, why is that so hard for people to understand? If the world's population were to become atheistic tomorrow, there would still be a cornacopia of philisophies rambling around - just minus the involvement of a diety.


    I've noticed that some Atheists just, basically, seem to say exactly the same things as the fundamentalists of Christianity and Islam (along with other religions), e.g. like they think they've got the "true" path,
    Or like "God hates fags", "Slaughter those that mock Islam"? At best (or worst) they are the carebears of the fundamentalist zone club.

    they seem to make fun of those who believe in God(s) or anything spiritual,
    Why shouldn't they? We can make fun of someone's political ideologies, their choice in clothes, the school they went to, the city they live in, their country. You can make fun of conspiracy theories, wacky inventions, sports, dance moves and so on... why not religion and anything spiritual?


    in short, they just seem mean, and bitter.
    So do their critics.

    It makes me wonder if they have any friends who are part of a religion,
    Yes they do. Just watch a few of their debates, they're often friends with their opponents.

    'cause the way some of them look upon Theists, or anyone Spiritual, I don't see how they could be friends
    Simple, avoid those topics.


    Anyway, I just wanted to get other Non-Theist opinions of what you think of certain Atheists who do seem to the fit the above pattern?, do you think that'll ever change, or, if they're simply a minority (that will hopefully die out, along with other Fundamentalists).
    I wish all fundamentalist were like atheist fundamentalists, we would have advocates of freedom of speech as opposed to prop 8, we would have humanitarian efforts instead of planes crashing into buildings... they may be rude, but you can not compare them to the likes of Phelps and Al-Jahiz.

    Our ignorance is not so vast as our failure to use what we know. ~ M. King Hubbert

  5. #5
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    I'm not familiar with Dawkins and Hitchens, so I can't comment on them in particular. However, there are extremists in every group and Atheists are no exception. One doesn't have to believe in anything spiritual to be so adamant about that belief (or disbelief if you prefer) to proselytize and show intolerance. But I think were in agreement that its important to individualize people and not lump them together for good or ill.

    I wrote an article on this subject back in October Fundamentalist Atheists
    Αλεξανδρα Δοροθια βωνδ
    http://helleneste.wordpress.com/
    http://www.hellenion.org

    I begin to sing of Pallas Athene, the glorious goddess, bright-eyed, inventive, unbending of heart, pure virgin, saviour of cities, courageous, Tritogeneia. From his awful head wise Zeus himself bare her arrayed in warlike arms of flashing gold, and awe seized all the gods as they gazed. But Athena sprang quickly from the immortal head and stood before Zeus who holds the aegis, shaking a sharp spear: great Olympus began to reel horribly at the might of the bright-eyed goddess, and earth round about cried fearfully, and the sea was moved and tossed with dark waves, while foam burst forth suddenly: the bright Son of Hyperion stopped his swift-footed horses a long while, until the maiden Pallas Athene had stripped the heavenly armour from her immortal shoulders. And wise Zeus was glad. And so hail to you, daughter of Zeus who holds the aegis!
    - THE HOMERIC HYMNS - XXVIII. TO ATHENA

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    David, not to be a butt, but you're using evangelical in the wrong way again.

    Atheists cannot be evangelists because they do not believe in the Four Gospels or evangelical history as religious truth. They do not adhere to the Gospel, and they do not want to attempt to bring anyone to Christianity.

    Wrong paradigm.

    The correct work would be Fundamentalist, and possibly proselytizing - to convert people to one's opinion.

    Sorry, it's just a pet peeve of mine.
    "The very powerful and the very stupid have one thing in common:
    instead of altering their views to fit the facts, they alter the facts to fit their views,
    which can be very uncomfortable if you happen to be one of the facts that need altering."


  7. #7
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    You cannot be an "Evangelistic" Atheist, or a "fundamentalist" Atheist.

    As Twinkle already explained the "Evangelistic" part, let me explain the other one.
    To be a fundamentalist means you follow a certain set of ideas and principles strictly. And either all Atheists are Atheistic fundamentalists or there is no way you can put the two together.

    Atheism means ONE thing and one effin' thing only.
    THE LACK OF BELIEF IN GOD/A GOD/DEITIES.
    All this is just like saying there are Fundamentalist or Evangelistic "lack-of-belief-in-fairies".

    There are Atheists who believe in spirits, atheists who believe in fairies, atheists who believe in unicorns, atheists who are witches, atheists who only believe in what science can tell them is the most likely explanation, atheists who believe we ARE in the MATRIX, they all just happen to have a lack of belief in Deities.

    What you are talking about is people who are very HARD in their DISBELIEF in DEITIES and the fact that they find it extremely hard to respect people who, in their view, worship an imaginary friend.
    Just like people who are very HARD in their BELIEF in a DEITY will point fingers and rant and rave, threaten and screech.

    The people you mention aren't disruptive, violent and are for free speech and freedom of religion even though they would love to live in a world without religion.

    I have a hard time respecting certain levels of religiosity as well, and thus the people on said levels.

    The rise of more "outspoken and aggressive" atheists most likely has something to do with the fact that coming out of the "skeptic" closet is getting more and more accepted, but there is still that common view that it doesn't matter which God or Goddess you believe in as long as you believe in one, because nothing is quite as bad as believing in no God at all.
    Last edited by Aeon Flux; May 11th, 2010 at 10:13 AM.
    Previously known as Njorun Alma


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    To me, there's a difference between atheists and Atheists. I feel as though this article is about Atheists, and about those who organize to spread doubt, and (let's face it) to outwit faith. I'm not being paranoid. There've been Atheist clubs at both of my universities. And they're not pushy, usually. But they can be just as rude as any unreasonable believers. I thought that was the point of this thread: to see why Atheists display the same traits they condemn religion for.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Infinite Grey View Post
    I wish all fundamentalist were like atheist fundamentalists, we would have advocates of freedom of speech as opposed to prop 8, we would have humanitarian efforts instead of planes crashing into buildings... they may be rude, but you can not compare them to the likes of Phelps and Al-Jahiz.
    You have a point there, then again I've mentioned before the "I'm right, you're wrong" attitude of anyone...be it atheist, Christian, Muslim or pagan is enough for other people to walk away and not listen to their ideas.

    I can respect the views of others but I do expect it in return.

  10. #10
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    I'm in agreement with Iggy on this issue.

    "Atheist Evangelicalism" is probably a bad term more so because it just doesn't exist, so I'm going to assume that is means extremism.

    Huge advocates for Atheism Hitchens, Dawkins, Hawking.. etc Have only ever contributed good to the world. Their opinions about religions and religious people are only a small spectrum of their work. And what about it, they are entitled to feel the way they do and the evidence they provide to back up their claims is solid.

    The reality about these advocates is that they contribute to world freedoms and humanitarian efforts. If a few sensitive religious folks get their toes stepped on in sight of that goal so be it.

    My fiancee describes me as a militant atheist especially when it comes to my field of study and science related fields. To me the evidence speaks for itself, and holding on to mythology and fairytale only hinders the collective. I'd much rather be subjected to militant atheism, over religion any day.

    Atheism is not synonymous with anything but a lack of belief, so it seems the issue here isn't with Atheism but seems more directed at groups like
    Pearlists...





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